What defense are we running?

[chicago51]

Okay I haven't got a straight answer I on this. I think largely because nobody is completely sure (or I haven't been paying attention).

What defense are we running 3-4 or 4-3?

If we are running a 3-4 are we still running the classic 3-4 with two gap D-linemen or are we going to a one gap version of the 3-4?

If we are running a 4-3 are we running more of the classic 4-3 or an over or under 4-3 fronts which play more like 3-4 anyway?

Anyone have any idea?

 

[rocket66]

BK has stated many times it's going to depend on the opponent. I think the reason it's so cloudy is because BK's system has always been a 3-4 and BVG prefers a 4-3, so they're coming to a middle ground.

 

[TheTurningPoint]

Both. Different principles than last year for both too.

 

[Rocket89]

The defense is multiple, meaning we use both 30 and 40 fronts regularly, and it is also hybrid in the sense that we will mix 1-gapping and 2-gapping on the same play out of both fronts.

In the past we leaned on 30 fronts as our 'base' defense but we've always used 40 fronts and I expect us to continue to use both with the 40 front becoming more prominent under Brian VanGorder. Check out One Foot Down tomorrow for a more detailed explanation.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

3-2 zone, hands up!

 

[woolybug25]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

 

[Old Man Mike]

This ain't gonna be Black/White Either/Or stuff. We, and especially Kelly, found out vs Alabama that you couldn't be "fixed-in-space" without exceptional film scouting being able to nudge you around with just the right angles and timing to make you look incompetent despite having All-American personnel.

This is also Kelly's not-overly-disguised "hint" that Van Gorder was needed to "get the defense to the next level", even while praising Bobby-the-D for his accomplishments. Kelly had it rammed down his throat that even with some of the best players in the country, you could not [as Barrett Jones said] "be simple".

I am absolutely entranced with the possibility that I'll see our defense roll out schemes where you find it hard to tell what-the-heck we were doing until after the ball is snapped. And that especially concerns where the outside linebackers, safeties and even corners are going to be. As to projected details, someone like Turning Point will know more, but by secretive plan, even guys like the TP group will have to guess if Van Gorder is to pull off his "now you see me; now you don't" schemes.

So...
Attack the Heathen! Acquire the Sacred Oblate Spheroid! Hand it to the Batterers and the Flyers, and reside always in the Proper Eden Zone!!

We will achieve the glorious Camelot, leaving the knavish heathens [especially Michigan] only what the Camels themselves leave behind.

... too much excitement... now for another nap.....

 

[Luckylucci]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

This cracked me up, I can hear Mike Mayock saying that followed by boy they sure are quicker than fast.

 

[GATTACA!]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

1-8-2

No half measures.

 

[Huntr]

Based on offers and Loy's CB list, I think we're putting a DT every 5 feet on the field. Like a 700-0-0

 

[chicago51]

The defense is multiple, meaning we use both 30 and 40 fronts regularly, and it is also hybrid in the sense that we will mix 1-gapping and 2-gapping on the same play out of both fronts.

In the past we leaned on 30 fronts as our 'base' defense but we've always used 40 fronts and I expect use to continue to use both with the 40 front becoming more prominent under Brian VanGorder. Check out One Foot Down tomorrow for a more detailed explanation.

Why is some article on the new defense coming out tomorrow?

 

[OCIrish]

Why is some article on the new defense coming out tomorrow?

Because some people still cannot figure out we're running a defense with 11 starters on it?????

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

Perfect. I actually lol'd on a conference call.

 

[IrishBlood81]

Whatever defense it is...I do hope they are running.

 

[Rocket89]

Why is some article on the new defense coming out tomorrow?

Yup. I'll try to remember to link it in this thread.

 

[Rack Em]

Whatever defense it is...I do hope they are running.

I hope it's better than the defense our men's bball team is purporting to play right now.

 

[Emcee77]

The defense is multiple, meaning we use both 30 and 40 fronts regularly, and it is also hybrid in the sense that we will mix 1-gapping and 2-gapping on the same play out of both fronts.

In the past we leaned on 30 fronts as our 'base' defense but we've always used 40 fronts and I expect use to continue to use both with the 40 front becoming more prominent under Brian VanGorder. Check out One Foot Down tomorrow for a more detailed explanation.

Nice, I'll look forward to your piece! Thanks.

This issue is kind of puzzling at this point.

Kelly has addressed the defensive system directly in at least two recent pressers (pre-bowl game and pre-spring practice) and both times he said, clear as day, that the system will be and remain multiple, with a mix of 3- and 4-man fronts. So part of me has always been very impatient with those who keep insisting that we are moving to a four front ...

... but at the same time, it is impossible to ignore the myriad recruits who speak with the ND coaching staff and then tell reporters that the staff told them that we are moving to a 4-3. At first I just assumed that these kids were misunderstanding what the coaches were telling them; I figured the coaches probably said that we are "going to be playing more 4-3" or something like that and the kids misinterpreted that to mean that we are changing to a 4-3 system. And there may be some of that misinterpretation going on ... but it happens so often that I'm starting to wonder if I'm the one who has it wrong.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Handwaving about "multiple defenses" aside, I think we're basically moving to a 4-3 over/under.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Handwaving about "multiple defenses" aside, I think we're basically moving to a 4-3 over/under.

Yep. I agree. Especially since BVG is also coaching the ILBs. They will play a huge role in his defense. And, I think you will see him utilize zone blitz on one side and man on the other at times. The safety will cheat up on perceived run plays and the CBs better grow up fast. They will not have over the top help a lot if BVG gets more aggressive as I suspect.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Yep. I agree. Especially since BVG is also coaching the ILBs. They will play a huge role in his defense. And, I think you will see him utilize zone blitz on one side and man on the other at times. The safety will cheat up on perceived run plays and the CBs better grow up fast. They will not have over the top help a lot if BVG gets more aggressive as I suspect.

Without knowing how our particular athletes will respond to these changes, I'm excited that we may actually make teams work to understand what we are doing. Assuming we don't reTenuta our defensive scheme, I'm very much in favor of changing things up on defense.

 

[Junkhead]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

 

[ulukinatme]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

I knew it 6 months ago...

 

[chicago51]

2-7-2

CATS EVERYWHERE

This is the best of post 2014 so far by far. It is not even close!

Handwaving about "multiple defenses" aside, I think we're basically moving to a 4-3 over/under.

I hope you are right. It plays alot like a 3-4 without the need for 2 gap players at every position. I honestly think this fits our personnel the best. I big fan the Seahawks 4-3 under scheme the way they do they almost have a 3-4 one side and a 4-3 on the other. I think this type of scheme fits ND very well.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

This is the best of post 2014 so far by far. It is not even close!



I hope you are right. It plays alot like a 3-4 without the need for 2 gap players at every position. I honestly think this fits our personnel the best. I big fan the Seahawks 4-3 under scheme the way they do they almost have a 3-4 one side and a 4-3 on the other. I think this type of scheme fits ND very well.

I have to agree. If there is an area that we have difficulty with, it's signing Tuitt's. He was the last 300+ DE that showed up ready to play (his freshman year was average, I know). With the smaller DL and the LB we are capable of bringing in, not to mention our recent propensity to actually sign quality DBs in necessary numbers makes me believe this will be a good move.

 

[WestCoast]

Handwaving about "multiple defenses" aside, I think we're basically moving to a 4-3 over/under.

So you're saying this is the new signal to get that 4-3 o/u alignment set up?

 

[GBdomer]

Hopefully a defense where we call a blitz, play a little more man to man coverage and actually have Jaylon Smith blitzing. Also no 41 on the field.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Scheme Changes discussion, mention of VanGorder and what excels in 3-4 versus 4-3

The LB they are talking about being freed up in a 4-3 makes me think of Jaylon Smith and the DLine personnel descriptions seem to match up the 4-3.

 

[Old Man Mike]

That article's analyst seems to be saying that to run a successful 3-4 base scheme you need both a nose tackle capable of eating at least two blocks in the middle AND a defensive end who requires two player attention as well.

So long Nix and Tuitt, so long 3-4??

 

[ulukinatme]

That article's analyst seems to be saying that to run a successful 3-4 base scheme you need both a nose tackle capable of eating at least two blocks in the middle AND a defensive end who requires two player attention as well.

So long Nix and Tuitt, so long 3-4??

This has been the concern for some time and the reason a lot of us have predicted a departure from the 3-4. It's apparently hard for us to land that elite NT we need to run the defense. Jones can probably pull it off as he grows, but we really don't have anyone with Nix's caliber on roster at the moment. All 3-4 guru's agree that NT is the most important position in that defense, and we just haven't recruited well for it. We also don't have that many DE's that fit the bill of a 3-4 DE either. To be successful in the 3-4 your three DL guys must eat up at least 4 blockers every down and hopefully 5 to allow the LBs to roam free, and I don't think we have the personnel to pull that off every down right now.

I'm sure we'll still see some 3-4 looks this season against certain teams, as BK mentioned, but I would expect even fewer snaps in a 3 man front than we had last year, and we were already dipping down in 3 man fronts as it was (50% of the snaps were in a 4-3 look).

 

[BurningRiver]

I was talking to a defensive player last week who said he and the other players loved the new D-coordinator and his system. He said there was a somewhat significant group of players who didn't really like Diaco that much.