Top 10 players to watch moving forward

[Sherm Sticky]

How could it take 19 posts before someone thought of linemen?

Thank you Ironman, and Domina Nostra, Walter White, Son of Kenmare.


You all just saw a Championship Game with one Championship OLine.

How many of ND OLs would start for Alabama?

Don't embarass yourself with a response, people. Cave was good but he was no Barrett Jones. On a bad foot Jones was still able to engage LBs on the second level. Bama's OL consistently gets blockers to the second level. Their RBs have holes at the LOS AND downfield routinely where we hope for a crease somewhere for Wood to slither through and maybe a receiver can throw a block.

You guys are arguing about the flash not about who makes the flash possible. Who sets the table?

By the way who is ND's starting center next year? Forget the wishing and hoping (and praying for medical recovery) who is the guy that has SHOWN he's the heir apparent?

NOBODY.

How many minutes of PT will ND's starting center have?


It's essential that ND have at least 3 guys leap forward on the OLine.

I'm aware 5 start and how many return in '13. I'm also aware that while ND's OLine Corps has been depleted through injury, death, and transfer, we were extremely fortunate in the health of the starting 5 last year.

Yep no one could have started on Bama's oline this year.

Honestly, on the current roster maybe Stanley could in the future.

I mean Fluker and kouandjio were the best linemen in their respective classes. when was the last time ND got an elite lineman like that? Sam Young?

 

[koonja]

Notre Dame football: Players who need to step up for Notre Dame in 2013 - chicagotribune.com

 

[AllGoldEverything]

I'll be watching Troy Niklas, hoping he can step into a Tyler Eifert role over time. Also like previously said I am excited about the RB competition with Bryant/Carlisle/Mahone/GA3 etc.

Linebacker postition will be interesting as well with Councell, Ishaq and Grace.

 

[irishff1014]

I'll be watching Troy Niklas, hoping he can step into a Tyler Eifert role over time. Also like previously said I am excited about the RB competition with Bryant/Carlisle/Mahone/GA3 etc.

Linebacker postition will be interesting as well with Councell, Ishaq and Grace.

Niklas might be good but i doubt he will be even close to Eifert.

 

[EddytoNow]

We have to replace three of our biggest leaders on defense. Even though he has been a force in the middle already, I expect Louis Nix to step up as a leader and replace Kap as the leader of the D line, Shembo, Fox, Calabreze, or Spond needs to be the voice of our linebacking crew, and Bennett Jackson or Jamoris Slaughter (if he comes back) needs to become the leader of our young defensive back crew.

Our young players are talented and they're going to be very good, but for next year the upper-class men have to step up and be leaders like Teo, Motta, and Lewis-Moore did this year.

 

[NDhoosier]

I'll be watching Troy Niklas, hoping he can step into a Tyler Eifert role over time. Also like previously said I am excited about the RB competition with Bryant/Carlisle/Mahone/GA3 etc.

Linebacker postition will be interesting as well with Councell, Ishaq and Grace.

Niklas is not the same type of TE as Eifert. I think Koyack will be asked to take over the Eifert role. Niklas is more of a blocking TE that will be used as a receiving option on Play-Action passes.

 

[EifertPower]

Niklas might be good but i doubt he will be even close to Eifert.

We probably said that 3 years about Eifert and Rudolph. Tight End U will be just fine at the Tight End spot. Don't sleep on Alex Welch either. Koyack was a complete disappointment this year.

 

[irishff1014]

We probably said that 3 years about Eifert and Rudolph. Tight End U will be just fine at the Tight End spot. Don't sleep on Alex Welch either. Koyack was a complete disappointment this year.

I think Troy will be good But he is not Eifert. Eifert was flat out a man beast.

 

[NDhoosier]

We probably said that 3 years about Eifert and Rudolph. Tight End U will be just fine at the Tight End spot. Don't sleep on Alex Welch either. Koyack was a complete disappointment this year.

What exactly did you see from Koyack this year? I didnt see anything from him except for the first game. Ya his blocking is weak, but so was Eifert's the previous year. Koyack is the same type of TE as Eifert, Koyack did not see the field all that much other than to block, and even that was rare. You are harping on Koyack too quickly here.

 

[ChiRish]

I love seeing how players progress from year to year. It shows how great the coaching staff is, and how driven the players are. Seems like we've seen a lot of improvement year to year from the guys on this team as opposed to years past.

I do think that regarding the TE position, Koyack is positioned to be the man in the passing game. We haven't seen much because we had Niklas in for blocking so often. If Niklas can take a jump in the passing game, and as many have alluded to his good hands, he should be able to, it'll allow ND to still be versatile with TE's. Gives multiple formation and personnel possibilities.

I really do think though, that next year we're going to see more of an offense that we're used to and expected from Kelly. I think we'll still run the ball in the fashion we did this year, but I expect that as Golson is more comfortable next year we see the spread offense playcalling that we expected when BK was hired. Neal, Daniels, Chris Brown, Atkinson, Carlisle, and others. When you combine them with guys like Ferguson, Niklas, Bryant, Mahone, Jones, etc. you have the makings of a versatile offense.

 

[irishroo]

Yep no one could have started on Bama's oline this year.

Honestly, on the current roster maybe Stanley could in the future.

I mean Fluker and kouandjio were the best linemen in their respective classes. when was the last time ND got an elite lineman like that? Sam Young?

Zack could have started at LT and Watt would have started at RG. The reason Bama's OL was so good is not because they had an insurmountable physical advantage (although they did have better players than pretty much everyone else), its because they knew how to work together and play off each other's strengths and weaknesses. For example, A. Kounadijo (LT) is an outstanding pass blocker but not as good a run blocker, so LG Chance Warmack, the best run blocker in the country by a long shot, is able to help cover that minor weakness. Barrett Jones is not a physical specimen, but he's arguably the best O Lineman in the country because he is so smart and makes everyone around him better. When I played, coaches emphasized that there were no individual offensive linemen, only the line as a whole. Bama has perfected that philosophy, which is why they're so dominant.

 

[ChiRish]

Zack could have started at LT and Watt would have started at RG. The reason Bama's OL was so good is not because they had an insurmountable physical advantage (although they did have better players than pretty much everyone else), its because they knew how to work together and play off each other's strengths and weaknesses. For example, A. Kounadijo (LT) is an outstanding pass blocker but not as good a run blocker, so LG Chance Warmack, the best run blocker in the country by a long shot, is able to help cover that minor weakness. Barrett Jones is not a physical specimen, but he's arguably the best O Lineman in the country because he is so smart and makes everyone around him better. When I played, coaches emphasized that there were no individual offensive linemen, only the line as a whole. Bama has perfected that philosophy, which is why they're so dominant.

Great post. I would agree in everything you say except that in addition to all of that, the guys on their line are really talented.

Saban really does get the best out of his already uber-talented players. He's an outstanding coach. The players play knowing that if they don't play well for an extended period of time they're going to get chewed out and pushed out of the lineup by someone else talented.

The coaching helps with that teamwork, like you said. Jones bounced up and down the line and was good at each position - that's crazy good. Bama knows that the key to their success is controlling the line of scrimmage and pounding the ball down the defense's throat. They do it quite well.

 

[dwshade]

Feel like he needs to bulk back-up.

Hounshell was RS after having surgery. He'll play a lot next season. Love his motor.

 

[sharksamardzija8345]

10. Ishaq
9. Shumate
8. Greg Bryant
7. Chris Brown
6. Day
5. Koyack
4. Jaylon
3. Redfield
2. Russel
1. Gunner

want to see if Gunner takes the team over or if we're going to see 3 more years of EG.. very, very interested to see how this plays out

 

[Circa]

I wish GAIII could play WR. He has excellent straight line speed, and watching Amari Cooper you see how that can impact a play action passing game. At RB, he doesn't have the agility, or lateral mobility to ever be more than a pitch-outside back at ND, IMO. With the surplus of talent at RB, any chance they flank him out more next year?

I understand of the returning RBs, he's the only one with significant carries (assuming Cierre is gone), but he just doesn't have the cutting/agility to be a good RB, IMO.

Sounds like a plan! I wouldn't think with the way BK bounces guys into positions that elevate their game that this couldn't be something already thought of! I like

 

[stlnd01]

Ten in no particular order:
Jarron Jones (D-Line depth is huge for us)
Shumate (Want to see him become an every-down player)
Grace (Big shoes to fill)
Redfield (Maybe most talented S we've had in years)
Russell (Can he keep growing?)
Stanley (We need big-time O-linemen)
Koyack (Someone's got to replace Eifert's catches)
Neal (Would love to see him catch the ball in space)
Bryant (Might be our #1RB by USC weekend)
GA3 (Really hope he can get to the next level)

 

[stlnd01]

On a related note: Captains for next year?
I'd vote:
Martin
Nix
Bennett Jackson
Maybe a fourth from the offense, but no one jumps to mind except maybe TJ Jones. Or Wood if he comes back. Tommy Rees?

 

[AllGoldEverything]

Forgot about Hounshell, he will provide some good depth next year.

 

[NDFANnSouthWest]

In no order

Grace - See what he learned from Teo.
Councell - Will he play to his potential? I think he will.
Jackson - So Fast....cont to develop on the toughest position on the field.
Shumate - After a year in the weight room. WOW>
J. Jones - Assume will take KLM position. Tough spot.
TJ - Continue his leadership.
Mahone - The forgotten RB. Something tells me he will be a good one.
Z. Martin - Just a big dude that is a great leader.
Nix - Future Captain of the D. Enough said.
Tuitt - Another leader, with some more size after more time in the weight room.

 

[STLDomer]

This will end up being a lot more than 10 guys but...

(in position order expect with Neal at end)

1A) Everett Golson: Can he continue his rapid growth and become a top dual-threat QB in 2013? Or does he regress or flatline allowing Gunner to swoop in?
1B) Gunner Kiel: Can he live up to the 5 status and challenge Everettt for the starting job?
2A) George Atkinson: Is he an every down back?
2B) Amir Carlisle: Will injuries plague his career or does he bounce back and take control of the stable of RBs?
2C) Greg Bryant: Does he live up to the 5 ranking and prevail as most solid every down back?
2D) Will Mahone: Can he provide the power we lacked in 2012?
3) Troy Niklas: Can he countinue the TE lineage?
4) Matt Hegarty: Can he handle taking over for Cave and recover and stabilize a OL likely returning 3 starters
5) Jarron Jones: Can he provide quality depth ala Sheldon Day 2012 and Stephon Tuitt 2011 or even challenge Day for the starting job?
6A) Ben Councell: Can he challenge for PT be it at DOG or ILB?
6B) Ishaq Williams : Can he challenge for PT be it at DE or CAT?
6C) Jaylon Smith: Does he take the team by storm and challenge for the starting job at DOG or does his athleticism force him on the field at any of the LB positions or does he have a 2011 Ishaq Williams esque season?
8A) Elijah Shumate: Can he start at SS?
8B) Max Redfield:Can he come in and challenge to start right away at FS?
9) Austin Collinsworth: Does he live up to the preseason hype and pick up where Motta left off?
10) Davonte Neal: Is he a star just waiting for a chance?

*If the answer to these is "Yes" (accounting for overlap) for the positive side of the questions we will be in damn good shape

 

[Fbolt]

My ramblings


Thx for the post OMM. Very good points on the OL (my #1 position concern) and obviously an area that ND needs improvement. I believe 2013 is the a year that Heistand will show what he can do. He's had this group for a season plus the off-season. What kind of product will he put on the field?

Regarding the Flash positions:

RB-Amir/GAIII/Mahone: Will these guys be an improvment over Riddick/Wood? Can the Freshman break the rotation? The potential is there with these players IMO.

WR-Brown/Neal/Davaris/TE: Can Brown develop into more than a streaking fly route runner (sounds like a Tate question, eh?)? Can Neal develop into a full-timer? Can Davaris take control of the WR group? Can Niklas step up (which is asking a lot from him)? Is it going to be Koyack-Welch? Too much "develop" here.... Overall, I believe that ND is looking at a slight improvement with this group from last year.

Other areas:
ST: How many years do we need to point out this area of concern? It's a key tenet of the game and ND's return game has been nonexistent. That needs to change for next year. I believe that the players are there-the coaches need to make it a priority.

Specific players:
Jarron Jones-excited to see what he can do.
Grace-Is the heir apparent ready to fill in for Teo?
Collingsworth-The next new leader at S?
Ishaq-How long do we have to wait? I've had high hopes for him every year, but am still waiting for him to "take" what is his.

 

[RDU Irish]

So what type of adjustments to the offense might we expect next year given a potential deficiency on the O line? Zone blocking, run vs pass, etc - I am ignorant of the intricacies and which are easier to cover up deficiencies and/or get to a high level of play quicker.

Other than Stanley, I don't know enough about our OL depth chart to appreciate potential. Holtz always said OL was last stop before the bus stop leading me to think you can work your way into an effective college interior lineman. However, how much NFL talent (and what round talent) is needed to become an elite unit?

In the good ole days of coach Moore it seemed every graduating O lineman was drafted. I see no reason we can't return to this expectation of 5th or 6th round draft picks being "below average" for us and freshmen never start.

I would think a six man rotation that all draft in the 2nd - 5th round range should be attainable for us. That would be a mix of juniors to fifth year guys with a periodic sophomore phenom cracking the starting lineup.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Here's another unpopular comment: one can make up for offensive line average-ness in Kelly's offense, if the quarterback can see over the O-Line interior and get rid of the ball in 2-3 seconds. The rush then never gets there.

I'll leave that turdd where it lays.....

 

[RDU Irish]

Someone just made a case for Gunner, that is more lighting a fuse than laying a turd, imo.

 

[phgreek]

Chris Brown...speed, leaping ability.

I know it sounds overly simplistic but Our offense would murder most people if we did just a couple things

1) perfected the read option on the end..
2) install a no huddle receiver read series...featuring a heavier Chris Brown...Press coverage w/ head up or inside...speed out...toast. outside alignment, slant...toast...Off alignment...slant...absolutely unstoppable if EG can execute. But you need a true deep threat and athlete like Chris. I see the ability to do that with a little heavier Chris...and every once in a while, you let him explode off the line and just outrun everyone...

Those two schemes are so freaking frustrating to defend, you can watch defenses deflate, get desperate, and finally totally implode...