Sept 9 | Georgia

[IrishSteelhead]

Sept 9 | Georgia

After Chubb, whose better than Adams and Dexter?



Not saying I disagree, but it's not beyond debate.

Michel has had 2400 yards in 3 seasons, with a 5.5 YPC.

Dexter has had 281 yards in 2 seasons, with a 4.7 YPC

*Both have been behind someone else, and as of right now, Michel has done more IMO, with an extra season under his belt though of course. The argument of Adams vs Michel is far more compelling.


(Adams has had 1768 yards in 2 seasons, with a 6.4 YPC)

 

[Crazy Balki]

Michel has had 2400 yards in 3 seasons, with a 5.5 YPC.

Dexter has had 281 yards in 2 seasons, with a 4.7 YPC

*Both have been behind someone else, and as of right now, Michel has done more IMO, with an extra season under his belt though of course. The argument of Adams vs Michel is far more compelling.


(Adams has had 1768 yards in 2 seasons, with a 6.4 YPC)

First, there is no comparison between Adams and Michel. Adams is very clearly the better back. Honestly, I'd take Adams over Chubb too. When Adams was healthy, he simply did it all. He had quality speed, power, vision and was a willing blocker.

As for Dexter v. Michel, they weren't in the same situation. Michel was essentially the #2 back from the get-go, since Gurley went down in 2014. Then, he started most of 2015 after Chubb got hurt, and had to tote the load to accommodate for a banged up Chubb last year. Dexter has been the #3 back for pretty much all of his ND career so far. He was behind Prosise and Adams for most of the year in 2015, and behind Folston and Adams in 2016. So Michel has had way more opportunity to get reps than Dexter.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Georgia has 10 starters coming back from a good defense. And Eason, a 5 star, with 1 year experience better than Wimbush, 4 star with no experience?

Bias doesn't get any stronger than that.

Honestly, I think the whole experienced QB argument gets a little overblown. Yes, Eason has starting experience, but Wimbush has been in the system for 2 full seasons now. Just because Eason has experience, doesn't necessarily mean it was productive. I'd rather a freshman QB not be rushed into the starting role, as you can't really take time to let him absorb the playbook and hone his technique while he's worrying about reading and reacting to what Opponent A is going to throw at him this week. Wimbush has had 2 years to observe and absorb knowledge and hone his craft. So while Eason is more "experienced", I'd argue that Wimbush is more developed. I've seen far too many redshirt QB's come in their first season as a starter and outplay several QB's with more experience than them. That's just my perspective on it.

I actually looked this up, but since the start of the BCS era, 16 1st year quarterbacks have played in the title game or playoff game. Those were Tee Martin (Tenn), Michael Vick (VT), Craig Krenzel (O$U), Matt Flynn (LSU), Todd Boeckman (O$U), Greg McElroy (Bama), Cam Newton (Auburn), Darron Thomas (Oregon), AJ McCarron (Bama), Everett Golson (us), Jameis Winstson (F$U), Blake Sims (Bama), Cardale Jones (O$U), Jake Coker (Bama) and DeShaun Watson (Clemson).

 

[Crazy Balki]

And I'll just say this about Georgia's defense. Returning 10 of 11 starters is definitely nothing to scoff at, and they sported a really good defensive ranking, but we need to remember who they did that against.

A lot of the offenses that Georgia played last year were downright abysmal...like REALLY bad. South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Florida and UL Lafayette all ranked 107th or worse in scoring offense (also let's not forget FCS Nicholls St). Georgia Tech was a lower half offense at 70th in scoring. Then there's another few I'd like to point out; Missouri ranked 48th and Auburn ranked 49th. Missouri's ranking is very heavily skewed because of their disproportionate scoring affairs against Delaware St, Eastern Michigan and Middle Tennessee. Against SEC competition, their output ranged from middling to horrific. Auburn had an okay 49th offensive ranking, but I have to point out that they were without leading rusher and offensive frontrunner Kameron Pettway for the Georgia game, which severely limited their rushing attack (in tandem with an already abysmal passing attack). So that effectively puts them from 49th scoring to probably somewhere in the 90-120th range. The three teams that had better than average offenses were UNC, Tennessee and Ole Miss. UNC was admittedly a quality game from UGA, but Tennessee put up some really nice numbers in the win and Ole Miss absolutely torched that defense.

So it'll be intriguing, because Georgia has quality numbers, but they haven't played a team with the level of offensive talent that ND possesses. I'd say they haven't since Bama rolled them in 2015.

 

[greyhammer90]

Honestly, I'd take Adams over Chubb too.

All credibility was lost right here.

 

[IrishLax]

And I'll just say this about Georgia's defense. Returning 10 of 11 starters is definitely nothing to scoff at, and they sported a really good defensive ranking, but we need to remember who they did that against.

A lot of the offenses that Georgia played last year were downright abysmal...like REALLY bad. South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Florida and UL Lafayette all ranked 107th or worse in scoring offense (also let's not forget FCS Nicholls St). Georgia Tech was a lower half offense at 70th in scoring. Then there's another few I'd like to point out; Missouri ranked 48th and Auburn ranked 49th. Missouri's ranking is very heavily skewed because of their disproportionate scoring affairs against Delaware St, Eastern Michigan and Middle Tennessee. Against SEC competition, their output ranged from middling to horrific. Auburn had an okay 49th offensive ranking, but I have to point out that they were without leading rusher and offensive frontrunner Kameron Pettway for the Georgia game, which severely limited their rushing attack (in tandem with an already abysmal passing attack). So that effectively puts them from 49th scoring to probably somewhere in the 90-120th range. The three teams that had better than average offenses were UNC, Tennessee and Ole Miss. UNC was admittedly a quality game from UGA, but Tennessee put up some really nice numbers in the win and Ole Miss absolutely torched that defense.

So it'll be intriguing, because Georgia has quality numbers, but they haven't played a team with the level of offensive talent that ND possesses. I'd say they haven't since Bama rolled them in 2015.

To expand on this, Georgia finishes in the mid-30s on defense in terms of advanced stats. Given Kirby Smart's pedigree and the returning talent, there is reason to believe this could be a top 10 unit... but I'll believe it when I see it. Same goes for their anemic offense which should have a great running game but there is no evidence that their OL or QB will be better... if they are, then they also have the ability to be extremely good.

To me, they look a lot like Notre Dame's '09 team where on paper there are studs everywhere and tons of returning talent. But as we've seen it's possible to have elite players all over the field and still have a team that cohesively doesn't function because of some weak links.

 

[dwshade]

All credibility was lost right here.

I'd take Adams too. Especially if it's the Chubb I saw late last season when he had 40 yards against Vandy, 20 yards against Florida and 80 yards against GA. Tech.

 

[Crazy Balki]

All credibility was lost right here.

Uh, just to be clear, we're talking about JOSH Adams, right? If you claim that there's no credible argument for Adams > Chubb, then you may have been watching the wrong Adams.

 

[Blaise]

Uh, just to be clear, we're talking about JOSH Adams, right? If you claim that there's no credible argument for Adams > Chubb, then you may have been watching the wrong Adams.

Except Chubb rushed for 1500 yards as a Freshman, 1100 last year, and in two years Adams hasn't hit the 1000 mark once...

Chubb has proven to be a workhorse, rushing the ball over 200 times twice, while Adams hasn't proven he can handle the load...

Finally, Chubb scored more Td's has a Frosh than Adams did in his two years combined

 

[zelezo vlk]

Ehh, Chubb of last year wasn't the Chubb of '14 and '15. If he's not fully recovered from his injury this year, it's not a stretch to say that Adams is the better back. Chubb didn't declare for the NFL because his tape last year was nothing compared to his Freshman and Sophomore years. But Adams needs to be healthy as well for him to compete

 

[Irish#1]

And I'll just say this about Georgia's defense. Returning 10 of 11 starters is definitely nothing to scoff at, and they sported a really good defensive ranking, but we need to remember who they did that against.

A lot of the offenses that Georgia played last year were downright abysmal...like REALLY bad. South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Florida and UL Lafayette all ranked 107th or worse in scoring offense (also let's not forget FCS Nicholls St). Georgia Tech was a lower half offense at 70th in scoring. Then there's another few I'd like to point out; Missouri ranked 48th and Auburn ranked 49th. Missouri's ranking is very heavily skewed because of their disproportionate scoring affairs against Delaware St, Eastern Michigan and Middle Tennessee. Against SEC competition, their output ranged from middling to horrific. Auburn had an okay 49th offensive ranking, but I have to point out that they were without leading rusher and offensive frontrunner Kameron Pettway for the Georgia game, which severely limited their rushing attack (in tandem with an already abysmal passing attack). So that effectively puts them from 49th scoring to probably somewhere in the 90-120th range. The three teams that had better than average offenses were UNC, Tennessee and Ole Miss. UNC was admittedly a quality game from UGA, but Tennessee put up some really nice numbers in the win and Ole Miss absolutely torched that defense.

So it'll be intriguing, because Georgia has quality numbers, but they haven't played a team with the level of offensive talent that ND possesses. I'd say they haven't since Bama rolled them in 2015.

Excellent analysis. Reps!

 

[Irish#1]

Except Chubb rushed for 1500 yards as a Freshman, 1100 last year, and in two years Adams hasn't hit the 1000 mark once...

Chubb has proven to be a workhorse, rushing the ball over 200 times twice, while Adams hasn't proven he can handle the load...

Finally, Chubb scored more Td's has a Frosh than Adams did in his two years combined

But your comparing Chubb from a run heavy system to a Adams who plays in a spread type offense. IMO Adams could handle the load and his numbers would be higher if he were playing in a run first offense.

 

[dwshade]

Except Chubb rushed for 1500 yards as a Freshman, 1100 last year, and in two years Adams hasn't hit the 1000 mark once...

Chubb has proven to be a workhorse, rushing the ball over 200 times twice, while Adams hasn't proven he can handle the load...

Finally, Chubb scored more Td's has a Frosh than Adams did in his two years combined

You obviously didn't watch Chubb much last year because he wasn't the same player as he was the previous two years. And the above poster is right, you are talking about two completely different offensive systems.

 

[T Town Tommy]

You obviously didn't watch Chubb much last year because he wasn't the same player as he was the previous two years. And the above poster is right, you are talking about two completely different offensive systems.

Chubb hasn't been the same since his injury. Prior to that he was a tremendous RB. Hopefully he returns to his pre-injury form at some point. And an OL that could actually block someone would help out as well.

 

[dwshade]

Chubb hasn't been the same since his injury. Prior to that he was a tremendous RB. Hopefully he returns to his pre-injury form at some point. And an OL that could actually block someone would help out as well.

Who does Bama need to worry about more this year Auburn or LSU? SEC East is still of no concern.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Who does Bama need to worry about more this year Auburn or LSU? SEC East is still of no concern.

LSU always plays us tough but I think the West comes down to the Iron Bowl.

 

[BobbyMac]

Auburn. LSU next year.

 

[dublinirish]

Auburn does not even want to be in the West anymore lol

 

[Crazy Balki]

Except Chubb rushed for 1500 yards as a Freshman, 1100 last year, and in two years Adams hasn't hit the 1000 mark once...

Chubb has proven to be a workhorse, rushing the ball over 200 times twice, while Adams hasn't proven he can handle the load...

Finally, Chubb scored more Td's has a Frosh than Adams did in his two years combined

But Chubb hasn't proven he can handle the load, since he's been hurt most of his career. Chubb played alot more as a freshman than Josh did and also plays in a more run heavy system. Chubb is going to get more carries by design. Last year, Adams split reps most of the way with Folston. While Chubb had more total yards, Adams averaged nearly 6 ypc compared to Chubb's 5 ypc. I'd take a near full yard avg per carry over total yards any day.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Auburn does not even want to be in the West anymore lol

Can't blame 'em honestly. The East has been a cakewalk for a few years now. Only problem is that Auburn can't seem to beat Georgia despite their mediocrity recently.

 

[IrishLion]

But Chubb hasn't proven he can handle the load, since he's been hurt most of his career. Chubb played alot more as a freshman than Josh did and also plays in a more run heavy system. Chubb is going to get more carries by design. Last year, Adams split reps most of the way with Folston. While Chubb had more total yards, Adams averaged nearly 6 ypc compared to Chubb's 5 ypc. I'd take a near full yard avg per carry over total yards any day.

Chubb was also coming off of a major knee injury. He hasn't been hurt "most of his career."

In fact, the argument can be made that Adams should have been getting more work last season, and near the end of '15, but he was banged up pretty consistently. He didn't get healthy until late last year, and that's when he started breaking off big runs again.

Chubb will probably be far ahead of where he was last year by the time this game rolls around.

And I'm not saying that I wouldn't take Adams over Chubb. I won't know how I feel on that until both guys get some work in this season.

I'm just saying that you're doing an awful lot of stretching to downplay Chubb, when he is more proven than Adams at this point, and was one of the best in the country before his knee issue. He could get back to that form this year. It really comes down to UGA's OL.

 

[arrowryan]

Didn't Chubb have a similar knee/leg injury as Marcus Lattimore? I remember that is was very ugly looking and wasn't an injury that you just come back from. Nick Chubb might not ever be the same running back that he was his freshman season, unfortunately.

 

[ACamp1900]

Oh boy, they are starting to believe...

 

[Crazy Balki]

Chubb was also coming off of a major knee injury. He hasn't been hurt "most of his career."

In fact, the argument can be made that Adams should have been getting more work last season, and near the end of '15, but he was banged up pretty consistently. He didn't get healthy until late last year, and that's when he started breaking off big runs again.

Chubb will probably be far ahead of where he was last year by the time this game rolls around.

And I'm not saying that I wouldn't take Adams over Chubb. I won't know how I feel on that until both guys get some work in this season.

I'm just saying that you're doing an awful lot of stretching to downplay Chubb, when he is more proven than Adams at this point, and was one of the best in the country before his knee issue. He could get back to that form this year. It really comes down to UGA's OL.

As arrow stated, Chubb suffered a devastating knee injury in 15 and was banged up most of the 2nd half last year. Adams would have likely got more reps had he been healthy going into last season. If Adams is playing like he was in the 2nd half of 16, then yes, I'm taking him over Chubb. Chubb still looks like a good back but has struggled to stay healthy and hasn't looked the same since his sophomore knee injury.

 

[Blaise]

Didn't Chubb have a similar knee/leg injury as Marcus Lattimore? I remember that is was very ugly looking and wasn't an injury that you just come back from. Nick Chubb might not ever be the same running back that he was his freshman season, unfortunately.

Yeah but he still had 1200 total yards and 9 Tds last year on over 200 carries.

Will he ever be the back he was as a Frosh, prob not, but to say Adams could do what Chubb does if he was in the same system might be a stretch... Maybe I am wrong and Adams will become that big play back but I don't see it..

I think Chubb gets drafted this year in the 4th or 5th round... I think Adams has some work to do if he wants to get drafted in fourth round or better

 

[arrowryan]

Yeah but he still had 1200 total yards and 9 Tds last year on over 200 carries.

Will he ever be the back he was as a Frosh, prob not, but to say Adams could do what Chubb does if he was in the same system might be a stretch... Maybe I am wrong and Adams will become that big play back but I don't see it..

I think Chubb gets drafted this year in the 4th or 5th round... I think Adams has some work to do if he wants to get drafted in fourth round or better

Nick Chubb had 66 more carries than Josh Adams in 2016 but only 197 more yards to show for it. I guarantee you if Josh had 66 more carries last season he would've had over 1,200 yards.

The NFL draft? I have no idea when either of these guys get drafted. I do know that some really good college backs go really late in the draft or don't get drafted at all.

 

[Blaise]

Also, If Chubb rushes for 900 yards this year, he will have more career rushing yards than any Notre Dame RB EVER...

 

[dwshade]

Also, If Chubb rushes for 900 yards this year, he will have more career rushing yards than any Notre Dame RB EVER...

So? This isn't about what they've done in the past, it's about the present. And at this point I'll take Adams.

 

[NDohio]

Oh boy, they are starting to believe...

PLAYOFFS BABY!!!!!! WOOOOHOOOOOO!!!!!

 

[koonja]

I also have no idea where they get drafted, but barring an injury, I guarantee you Chubb will be drafted first.

I'll leave IE permanently if they're both healthy, no off the field issues, and Adams goes first. There's no chance scouts will view Adams higher than Chubb if there are no asterisks to attach.

Pin it - I'm not joking.