Rumored Violations

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RDU Irish

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Golson didn't have sex (at least in relation to the "scandal") so administration wasn't completely bent out of shape about it.

So is it fair to say at this point the headline is essentially "Scorned lover won't quit until she has screwed the entire team"
 
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koonja

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Jack - Some of this investigation is complicated by the fact that some involved aren't on campus yet. AKA, this is going to drag on until school starts. That sucks and is huge.

Also 'literally thousands of emails' have been read.
 
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NDdomer2

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Jack on mike and mike. Did not rule out players returning. Athletic department has no involvement at all.

He was also on nbcsn last night. Mentioned they are having interviews with on Friday with players. Only has spoke to KVR at this point.
 
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koonja

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Doesn't sound like ANY of the 3 are back or cleared. So that guy on DD is wrong IMO.

Good news - Jack is super confident ND had no involvement in this at all, and it was all done at an individual level.
 
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Domina Nostra

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I'm really struggling with how I feel about this whole ordeal. On the one had, I love ND because of what the University stands for and how they always try to do what is right. On the other, in situations like this one, I feel like they're going completely overboard. The ND Circus has come to town and they're here to stay.

LAX has already done a great job pointing things out to which I agree completely so I'll spare you those feelings. One thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is why they feel to make this a huge deal? With Golson, it was an open and shut case. He cheated, he got kicked out, end of story. There is literally zero reason for ND to go into full investigation mode and try to bring down the entire football program based on four kids allegedly cheating. If they cheated, suspend/expel them, case closed. I don't understand the circus this is becoming. I don't understand ND wanting to vacate wins. I don't understand why they felt the need to hold a press conference about it. The whole thing just doesn't add up.


1) we know the University will treat academic issues of high-profile players relatively quietly from Golson and DD.

2) However, cheating involving multiple players--perhaps over the course of years--creates the strong impression that your school is corrupt and full of crap--UNC style. If they think their is evidence of systemic cheating, they aren't going to treat it like isolated incidents (like with Golson)

3) Cheating by yourself is also different than cheating using the people the school provides to help you.

4) The press runs absolutely wild with ND stories, and would be talking about a cover-up for years if there was any hint of one.

Also, even if it is widespread, cheating is a big deal to Universities. Underage drinking is illegal, but drinking is accepted as fine once you are of sufficient age to be responsible with it. When you are old enough is a matter of debate and people wisely don't pretend that the arbitrary number (21) represents anything moral. On the other hand, cheating is never fine morally.

Cheating is a problem that cuts right to the heart of a university: providing society with well-educated, reliable citizens. Underage drinking gets treated much more seriously at the liquor store than at the field where the kids get caught drinking. ND can't treat academic integrity like just one more rule because its a school.

ND can't treat football players like regular students because they haven't entered a multi-party agreement with tons of other schools that involves millions of dollars that it premised on their holding certain students to certain standards with their normal students. In other words, ND is actively holding out its student athletes as meeting their academic requirements. When UNC beats my team, and it turns out none of their kids ever went to class, its pretty annoying.

Also, why would employers care about cheating if it is such a widespread issue and everyone did it? The fact is, even if it is widespread, it undermines the person's reliability. Also, lots of people do things they regret and then stop doing them. Saying 80% of people have cheated in some form at some point is not the same as saying 80% of the people are cheating all the time. And most people assume that kids who get caught cheating did it more than once. You usually don't get caught the first and only time.

Long story short… do I think the 4 players are awful human beings who need to be treated as such? No. Do I think it makes sense that often lax universities crack down on cheating really hard, despite its prevalence? Yes. Do I think it makes sense to be a little tougher on athletes since they are making your school millions of dollars, yes? Do I think ND looks like an ass since no other schools are doing this… a little. I also hope the investigation gives the students the benefit of the doubt at every turn--innocent until proven guilty. That may be hard to do if their is a "co-conspirator" involved.
 
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koonja

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Usually when they interview someone on a hot topic, that person is interviewed a couple of time throughout the day.

Look for captain Jack on The Herd. Colin's a punk, so that one could be interesting.
 

connor_in

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Oh so two players werent reinstated to resume football activities yet? Shocking.

TP asking obviously sarcastic question then placing it in sarcasm font

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/EzVxsYzXI_Y" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

ulukinatme

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Jack on mike and mike. Did not rule out players returning. Athletic department has no involvement at all.

He was also on nbcsn last night. Mentioned they are having interviews with on Friday with players. Only has spoke to KVR at this point.

Doesn't sound like ANY of the 3 are back or cleared. So that guy on DD is wrong IMO.

Good news - Jack is super confident ND had no involvement in this at all, and it was all done at an individual level.

Yeah, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say don't believe anything that guy on DD says at this point. If he claimed 3 were coming back today, but we were vacating wins....and Jack is saying that they haven't talked to anyone but KVR and the University isn't at fault, that seems to contradict everything that DD guy is saying.
 

Irish Insanity

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Doesn't sound like ANY of the 3 are back or cleared. So that guy on DD is wrong IMO.

Good news - Jack is super confident ND had no involvement in this at all, and it was all done at an individual level.

Yo, I see what your saying. But even if internally they cleared them, the investigation is still ongoing and he isn't gonna announce it on a Mike and Mike interview.
 

ulukinatme

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Yo, I see what your saying. But even if internally they cleared them, the investigation is still ongoing and he isn't gonna announce it on a Mike and Mike interview.

Even if they are cleared internally, I'm not going to believe anything at this point unless it comes from Savy Jack or Jenkins.
 

#1rish

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As much as a thorough investigation is important, this needs to be settled one way or the other very soon, like the middle of this week. Can't have this crap hanging over the team's head come Rice.
 

dublinirish

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did jack say if the investigation was still ongoing come the Rice game then the 4 would be able to play?
 

wizards8507

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That's the thing. Apparently the Academics side doesn't give a F, and they'll take as much time as they need. They don't give two shits about expediting the process in interestes of the players or the team.

Maybe our next coach can be a pastor and the players can study at half time. I'm losing it on this one.

There's no expediting to be done if this involves non-athlete students. Move-in isn't until the 24th and I can't imagine any version of a "proper investigation" that doesn't require AT LEAST speaking to the girl.
 
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koonja

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There's no expediting to be done if this involves non-athlete students. Move-in isn't until the 24th and I can't imagine any version of a "proper investigation" that doesn't require AT LEAST speaking to the girl.

Call her. Skype her out. Fly to visit her. Hire someone to wack her. Send Carlos's people. Damn it do something.

This is Notre Dame football and the season's two fucking weeks away. Around the clock, pedal to the metal.
 

NDohio

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There's no expediting to be done if this involves non-athlete students. Move-in isn't until the 24th and I can't imagine any version of a "proper investigation" that doesn't require AT LEAST speaking to the girl.

So, a little confused here. Isn't she a team manager? Wouldn't she already be on campus then? Or, was she a team manager and isn't currently?
 

Irish Insanity

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That's the thing. Apparently the Academics side doesn't give a F, and they'll take as much time as they need. They don't give two shits about expediting the process in interestes of the players or the team.

Maybe our next coach can be a pastor and the players can study at half time. I'm losing it on this one.

Maybe the administration can look in to turning the play book into lessons for class and problems to solve to gel academics and football





So, a little confused here. Isn't she a team manager? Wouldn't she already be on campus then? Or, was she a team manager and isn't currently?

Possibly she graduated?
 

ulukinatme

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Savy Jack and Jenkins are the clowns that brought this circus to town!

That's not my point, and personally I think you have it all wrong. My point was that it's not worth trusting any rumors at this time because ultimately the truth (Or the version of the truth) that we get is only going to come from Jack and Jenkins.

While ND has shot themselves in the foot over this, I think the intention was to get out in front of the story before it got an more out of hand with news outlets. The problem is they've already mentioned "vacating wins" which was probably a bad idea because it puts us in a bad position from the get go. It probably would have been better if they mentioned no punishments to start with, and just said that an investigation was going on. The story was going to air regardless whether Jack and Jenkins have the press conference, but mentioning possible punishments before the investigation was complete was just a dumb move as it can back us into a corner. If you're going to blame anyone for the circus at this point, I would blame the players that put us in that circumstance, don't shoot the messengers...not till all the facts are out anyway.

There's no expediting to be done if this involves non-athlete students. Move-in isn't until the 24th and I can't imagine any version of a "proper investigation" that doesn't require AT LEAST speaking to the girl.

I'm under the impression she graduated in the spring of this year, unless she's going back to campus for graduate course work or something.
 

gkIrish

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The female in question has graduated. 95% sure 2012 is the year under investigation.
 

Sherm Sticky

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The female in question has graduated. 95% sure 2012 is the year under investigation.
That's what seems strange to me. Why would a senior girl get involved with a freshman for sex? ie KVR. Also, KVR was in his first semester, 101 classes and needed someone to write papers for him?
 

BGIF

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Savy Jack and Jenkins are the clowns that brought this circus to town!

Wrong. Student stupidity brought this on.

Jenkins primary interest is the student body.

You don't have to connect the dots just read his short to the point press release.


Should we chastise a professor for doing his job?

Or the Compliance Officer for doing his?

Or General Counsel Staff for doing theirs?

Or Jenkins acting like a real President and showing leaderships?


Many of the same people here that excoriated OSU President Gee when at the Golden Pants/Tatoo Press Conference whined that HE was lucky Tressel didn't fire him.

Now those same Irish fans who screamed "Integrity" and "Accountability"then and who sound like weaseling SEC fans.

ND notified the NCAA as they are required. Kind of hard for Jenkins to speak of INTEGRITY as a mission statement for the students if he doesn't set the example.
 
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koonja

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That's what seems strange to me. Why would a senior girl get involved with a freshman for sex? ie KVR. Also, KVR was in his first semester, 101 classes and needed someone to write papers for him?

He's on the bod sqaud. Squad gets what squad wants
 

RDU Irish

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That's what seems strange to me. Why would a senior girl get involved with a freshman for sex? ie KVR. Also, KVR was in his first semester, 101 classes and needed someone to write papers for him?

Nobody NEEDED the papers, they were just necessary to consummate the part of the deal they actually DID WANT.
 

RDU Irish

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How ever will she make it in corporate America? Oh, wait. She'll be just fine.
 

dublinirish

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That's what seems strange to me. Why would a senior girl get involved with a freshman for sex? ie KVR. Also, KVR was in his first semester, 101 classes and needed someone to write papers for him?

Of a Film, Theatre and TV studies degree and all, it can't be that hard can it? :/
 
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