Oct 26 | Michigan

[stlnd01]

I really like Tariq Bracy, but the staff seems to have been moving on from him.

Also Crawford looked bad out there last night. Looked rusty, which is expected since he was out 4 weeks.


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They passed so little I didn't much notice but did Bracy not play last night?
Moving on from him would seem to be mistake as it's quite possible he'll be our only returning CB with real experience next year.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

They passed so little I didn't much notice but did Bracy not play last night?

Moving on from him would seem to be mistake as it's quite possible he'll be our only returning CB with real experience next year.

I only saw him play at the end of the game in garbage time. Vaughn got the start yesterday.


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[Luckylucci]

I think Finke needs less reps as there are other guys that have higher upsides but even he has been open quite a bit the last two weeks and Book can’t get him the ball. He’s getting separation on those crossing routes that are suppose to be the easy options for Book.

 

[irishff1014]

I am so fucking tired of watching Chris Finke and Ian Book play football.

BK will never be a great coach for many reasons, but one of them is he loves guys with low ceilings just because they're reliable.

There's no fucking reason Phil shouldn't be starting after being proven Book can't do anything against any average or above defense.

Finke is pointless.

BK is to loyal at times. Finke doesn’t belong on the field at ND.

 

[T Town Tommy]

remember me posting this week about what is up with the OL and how ND gets SO much OL talent but cant produce?

The inability to complete a forward pass isn’t the OL’s problem. They gave Book time to execute but he didn’t. Once that happens, the Michigan defense pinned their ears back and crashed down on the LOS and basically took away any gaps that may have been there. Not going to say that the OL had a good game. They did not. But they were far from the problem last night.

 

[ulukinatme]

There's no fucking reason Phil shouldn't be starting after being proven Book can't do anything against any average or above defense.

What has Phil proven, that he can't beat Book out in practice?
Maybe it's a big conspiracy and BK is just holding Phil back.

 

[IrishLax]

What has Phil proven, that he can't beat Book out in practice?
Maybe it's a big conspiracy and BK is just holding Phil back.

It's not about what Phil has proven. It's about how we have a 10+ game sample size that shows that Book is a low ceiling QB and that he is not the answer. You don't know what you've got until you give the next guy a shot.

 

[NDRock]

You have to give Phil a chance. I'm not that confidant he'll play great but at this point it's the best option.

 

[nd_fan]

It's not about what Phil has proven. It's about how we have a 10+ game sample size that shows that Book is a low ceiling QB and that he is not the answer. You don't know what you've got until you give the next guy a shot.

True true. Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and came in after the starting QB for New England got hurt. No one knew who he was until he stepped forward that day. The rest is all history.

 

[IrishLax]

True true. Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and came in after the starting QB for New England got hurt. No one knew who he was until he stepped forward that day. The rest is all history.

Yup. Same thing applies to Kirk Cousins in Washington, Kurt Warner in St. Louis, etc. You don't know what you've got until you have them out there trying to make real plays in real game situations.

 

[NDMontana]

Didn't Purdue blow out OSU a couple of years back? Wisconsin blow out Michigan a couple of weeks ago? See the difference here? It's college football, it happens. Is this just a perfect storm or a referendum on the season? I guess we will find out moving forward.

OSU was not that good in ‘18: they also squeaked by Maryland and Nebraska. And Michigan is it a good team this year: beating ND certainly did not prove that. We will indeed see what happens. Hopefully they can bounce back from losing to a better team—which happens—but being beat down like that and giving up, if they ever tried....well....that is a different story.

No matter what the deal is with Book, last night was as poor an effort as I have seen from an ND team since the abysmal down hill slide after the 2014 FSU game.

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Yup. Same thing applies to Kirk Cousins in Washington, Kurt Warner in St. Louis, etc. You don't know what you've got until you have them out there trying to make real plays in real game situations.

Gamers. Maybe Phil is just a f****** gamer. Let's hope.

 

[ulukinatme]

It's not about what Phil has proven. It's about how we have a 10+ game sample size that shows that Book is a low ceiling QB and that he is not the answer. You don't know what you've got until you give the next guy a shot.

Book may not be the answer, but what if Phil isn't either? Do you risk losing a game to Virginia Tech just to find out that answer? People were clamoring for Andrew Hendrix thinking he's gotta be better than Rees, only to find out he's actually worse and there's a reason he's 2nd on the depth chart. I'm not saying Phil is that guy, but we still have to consider the recruiting classes and try to salvage a 10-2 respectable season. I think we should work Phil in, but not completely bench Book until we have more answers.

 

[NDRock]

Book may not be the answer, but what if Phil isn't either? Do you risk losing a game to Virginia Tech just to find out that answer? People were clamoring for Andrew Hendrix thinking he's gotta be better than Rees, only to find out he's actually worse and there's a reason he's 2nd on the depth chart. I'm not saying Phil is that guy, but we still have to consider the recruiting classes and try to salvage a 10-2 respectable season. I think we should work Phil in, but not completely bench Book until we have more answers.

I don’t think we can get to 10-2 with Book playing like that. He looks done, absolutely no confidence. One of the worst performances I’ve seen from a ND QB. Give Phil the bulk of the reps and let him start, if it’s a train wreck bring Book back in.

 

[Irish#1]

I am in favor of getting Phil a lot of reps, but this game wasn't on Book as much as it was the coaching staff and getting this team prepared, especially mentally. I thought after the U0M game Kelly had them over that, but I sure was wrong.

 

[Wingman Ray]

I would love to hear BKs excuses for this crapping the bed game.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I am in favor of getting Phil a lot of reps, but this game wasn't on Book as much as it was the coaching staff and getting this team prepared, especially mentally. I thought after the U0M game Kelly had them over that, but I sure was wrong.

EDIT: The below came off testier than I meant. And I agree that this is more on the coaches than any single player or unit.

What more does Book have to do to make people see that he has peaked? He has plateaued, and his ceiling isn't getting any higher. We gain nothing by trying to fix Book, instead of trying to mature and advance Phil's skill set.

What do we have to lose switching to the youngster with more talent and more potential? This season is over. Our main objective of post-season play is over. This is about the program now. How do we get better as a program by continuing to find excuses for Book's shi* play? I don't understand.

 

[EvilleIrish]

Not to keep piling on...but I had a conversation on Sunday with a good friend who is a big UM fan and he told me didn't even know the RB who went off was even on the team.

 

[Irishize]

I would love to hear BKs excuses for this crapping the bed game.

That’s the sad thing. BK responded to a question about fixing things that that would imply something is broken and he doesn’t feel that’s the case.

This program is much better than it was before BK arrived but it still has a systemic problem b/c they cannot prove that they can win a big game on the road on a semi-consistent basis. And not just win...they can’t compete. Miami & Michigan are hardly foes that instill fear in the opposition.

 

[Irish#1]

EDIT: The below came off testier than I meant. And I agree that this is more on the coaches than any single player or unit.

What more does Book have to do to make people see that he has peaked? He has plateaued, and his ceiling isn't getting any higher. We gain nothing by trying to fix Book, instead of trying to mature and advance Phil's skill set.

What do we have to lose switching to the youngster with more talent and more potential? This season is over. Our main objective of post-season play is over. This is about the program now. How do we get better as a program by continuing to find excuses for Book's shi* play? I don't understand.

No problem, we need to see what Phil has. I would say to the bolded that we still have a shot at a pretty good season 10-2 which would help in recruiting more than a 9-3 or 8-4 record.

 

[Irishize]

EDIT: The below came off testier than I meant. And I agree that this is more on the coaches than any single player or unit.

What more does Book have to do to make people see that he has peaked? He has plateaued, and his ceiling isn't getting any higher. We gain nothing by trying to fix Book, instead of trying to mature and advance Phil's skill set.

What do we have to lose switching to the youngster with more talent and more potential? This season is over. Our main objective of post-season play is over. This is about the program now. How do we get better as a program by continuing to find excuses for Book's shi* play? I don't understand.

Trying to parse through what the beat writers report about PJ through the limited access they have to coaches & practice, the staff still doesn’t think PJ possesses enough competency in their system to hand over the reigns. I don’t think the kid is dumb but did he come from such a basic HS scheme that he’s struggling picking up Long’s playbook or is this all on the coaches or both?

I tend to point to the coaches based on all the fresh/soph skill players that have to wait 2 years to see the field b/c they’re either too small (not durable) &/or haven’t grasped the system yet. Meanwhile, I see multiple programs starting true freshman b/c they’re the best player period. I know we have Kyle Hamilton but he sounded like a no-brainer. But the excuses about Lenzy, Jurkovec, Houston Griffith, Shayne Simon, etc? What’s the deal?

 

[Irishize]

No problem, we need to see what Phil has. I would say to the bolded that we still have a shot at a pretty good season 10-2 which would help in recruiting more than a 9-3 or 8-4 record.

10-2 will look good on paper but after the scUM beatdown, it likely leaves ND out of a NY6 bowl as it stands today. That puts us in the Camping World Bowl in Orlando. So even those of us that would be content w/ getting the NY6 bowl monkey off ND’s back will be waiting until next year...again.

 

[MNIrishman]

Not to keep piling on...but I had a conversation on Sunday with a good friend who is a big UM fan and he told me didn't even know the RB who went off was even on the team.

I think you may have some typos here and I'm having trouble understanding your meaning.. Could you please clarify?

 

[EvilleIrish]

I think you may have some typos here and I'm having trouble understanding your meaning.. Could you please clarify?

Haha, I'm assuming you are referring to me having a UM friend? Can't save em all ya know!

 

[T Town Tommy]

Trying to parse through what the beat writers report about PJ through the limited access they have to coaches & practice, the staff still doesn’t think PJ possesses enough competency in their system to hand over the reigns. I don’t think the kid is dumb but did he come from such a basic HS scheme that he’s struggling picking up Long’s playbook or is this all on the coaches or both?

I tend to point to the coaches based on all the fresh/soph skill players that have to wait 2 years to see the field b/c they’re either too small (not durable) &/or haven’t grasped the system yet. Meanwhile, I see multiple programs starting true freshman b/c they’re the best player period. I know we have Kyle Hamilton but he sounded like a no-brainer. But the excuses about Lenzy, Jurkovec, Houston Griffith, Shayne Simon, etc? What’s the deal?

I tend to have a hard time believing that a player can't learn a system in two years. ND's offense isn't any more complex than any other programs and those other programs don't seem to have a problem with young players not only playing, but flourishing in a lot of instances. I do think it takes some time and putting a young player in too early is risky... but two years? I don't buy that.

 

[Wingman Ray]

10-2 will look good on paper but after the scUM beatdown, it likely leaves ND out of a NY6 bowl as it stands today. That puts us in the Camping World Bowl in Orlando. So even those of us that would be content w/ getting the NY6 bowl monkey off ND’s back will be waiting until next year...again.

ND in a NY6 bowl is an easy win for the competition.

 

[RDU Irish]

One redeeming factor from this weekend. My buddy after less than one quarter of the Ann Arbor whore experience said he wasn't going to allow his daughter to apply to UM. No way he wants her associating with such a classless, mouth breathing crowd. And he was just along for the ride, didn't care much about either team good or bad.

 

[ThePiombino]

10-2 will look good on paper but after the scUM beatdown, it likely leaves ND out of a NY6 bowl as it stands today. That puts us in the Camping World Bowl in Orlando. So even those of us that would be content w/ getting the NY6 bowl monkey off ND’s back will be waiting until next year...again.

10-2 ND gets a NY6 bid.

 

[Irishize]

I tend to have a hard time believing that a player can't learn a system in two years. ND's offense isn't any more complex than any other programs and those other programs don't seem to have a problem with young players not only playing, but flourishing in a lot of instances. I do think it takes some time and putting a young player in too early is risky... but two years? I don't buy that.

I don’t either but I don’t think anyone argues that PJ isn’t more talented than Book. So how deficient in the playbook does he have to be to not play him?

 

[irishff1014]

I have finally watched the whole game and some parts twice. One thing that better change in a quick hurry is the tackling. It is awful.

Jalen Elliott has not been very good this season at all. He is missing tackles and looks like he has no clue what to do in coverage. Elliott,Gilman,Pride and Vaugh is a big reason the defense is not as good this year. These 4 have struggled bad.

No need for me to hit on Book even more. We all know he sucked and most of it was his own doing. He isn't very good this year at throwing the ball on the run either.

Their was nothing positive that came from this game for us. The players effort right out of the gate was awful. Coaching was not good. They made a bad effort at adjustments.

I would personally take the C off everyone's jersey because no one deserves to wear it.

It's sad all the offensive knowledge that's on the coaching staff and they couldn't make any adjustments. This is very disheartening to me.