COVID-19

[irishnd31]

I'm really curious If the people will push for a serious mental health agenda that comes directly from this chaos.
I'll be the first to admit I have had a rough few years and suicide has been an option.
My blood brother (we were adopted after 12 years of foster care) killed himself at 17 because of bullying and I honestly believe I exist because he did that.
Also I can't leave my kids like that.

Damn sorry about your brother my friend. Glad you made it through the dark times.

 

[NDdomer2]

As the U.S. and Canada share so many similarities, I am interested in knowing how governments will define "essential service(s)".

I had a discussion with a few individuals over the weekend and this might be a very tough one to define in light of current pandemic. Medical, Utilities, Food production and Distribution obviously but what additional goods and services?

We concluded that there could be several essential services.

Any thoughts?

Cheers and Go Irish!!

The executive order Indiana Governor signed today linked to this website for defining essential services.

The CDC also has a page.

 

[Greenore]

The executive order Indiana Governor signed today linked to this website for defining essential services.

The CDC also has a page.

Thanks for the link. I also saw they had a definition on the FOX News site.

FWIW, I am an employer and have been scratching my head for the past ten days. If I remember, I'll share the story and my challenges when the worst is behind us.

Be safe and be responsible.

Cheers and Go Irish!!

 

[irishff1014]

I'm really curious If the people will push for a serious mental health agenda that comes directly from this chaos.
I'll be the first to admit I have had a rough few years and suicide has been an option.
My blood brother (we were adopted after 12 years of foster care) killed himself at 17 because of bullying and I honestly believe I exist because he did that.
Also I can't leave my kids like that.

I am glad to see you made it through that and hopefully stronger. Man just remember reach out to someone I promise someone is willing to listen.

 

[irishtrooper]

Thanks for the link. I also saw they had a definition on the FOX News site.

FWIW, I am an employer and have been scratching my head for the past ten days. If I remember, I'll share the story and my challenges when the worst is behind us.

Be safe and be responsible.

Cheers and Go Irish!!

New York State has a link as well if you wish to compare

https://esd.ny.gov/guidance-executive-order-2026

 

[Legacy]

So how is the above scenario really any different then what is happening in metropolitan areas? Aren't urban areas concerned about hospital space and don't they have uninsured? Also given how this virus is spread I would think living in an urban environment makes one more likely to contract this virus versus living in a rural area.

Specialized services and personnel, tertiary hospitals, bed capacity and availability including ICUs as well as Trauma 1 facilities are located in metropolitan areas. With a healthcare system built for different levels of care, patients are transported to higher levels based on needed services based on acceptance and bed availability. While metropolitan areas are being hit first by the pandemic and the surge is expected to overwhelm them first, as they become overcrowded and the pandemic spreads to rural areas subsequently, that system may well break down both healthwise and financially as most rural hospitals are just getting by now. Much too depends on patient characteristics as well as number of staff and expertise - comorbid conditions, insurance and whether they can afford their medications and get regular provider visits, nutrition, age. In their words,

Coronavirus Threatens The Lives Of Rural Hospitals Already Stretched To Breaking Point

The American Hospital Association responded Thursday by asking Congress for $100 billion for all hospitals to offset coronavirus costs, citing rural hospitals’ inability to withstand huge losses for long.

“If we’re not able to address the short-term cash needs of rural hospitals, we’re going to see hundreds of rural hospitals close before this crisis ends,” warned Alan Morgan, the head of the National Rural Health Association, which represents 21,000 health care providers and hospitals. “This is not hyperbole.”

Wyoming is the least populated state in the Union:
Wyoming's rural hospitals prepare for coronavirus

Excerpt:

“That would be a significant stretch for us, and if everybody else in our surrounding areas, i.e. Campbell County (Health) in Gillette or Wyoming Medical Center … if they’re stressed as well, it could — potentially — could be very difficult for all of us,” she said.

In Lusk, Nelson said almost any number of coronavirus patients needing hospitalization would require him to transfer patients to larger facilities.

“Honestly, what I would say is we are prepared to deal with the situation, but to be able to handle all of those patients, we’re going to have to be working with Wyoming Medical Center, with Cheyenne and all that,” he said. “I only have five beds, and I have to control who comes into those beds. If I have five patients with confirmed coronavirus, right now I’ve got 15 people in here. I’m putting them at risk.”

“I have concerns about the employees, the health care providers,” said Eric Boley, who heads the state’s hospital association. “They’re going to be under a huge, tremendous strain.”

Each state's health system and population characteristics may be different:
In rural Iowa, hospitals face a starker reality when trying to stem coronavirus spread

In Iowa, 1.27 million residents, or 40% of the population, were deemed to be living in rural areas in 2019, according to the USDA. They are being served by 58 hospitals and 190 clinics, according to the Health Resources and Services Administration. Most of them don't have intensive care unit beds, which are best equipped to deal with serious illnesses such as COVID-19.

“They’re prepared to a certain point,” said Oscar Alleyne, chief of programs for the National Association of County and City Health Officials. “I think they are in a very precarious state in their ability to sustain the line as this disease progresses. If you have one or two cases in a county, you’ll probably be OK. What is the plan for you when you find it becomes widespread?”

Coronavirus hits rural Kansas, Missouri towns. Many don’t have a single hospital bed

After decades of declining population, many parts of Kansas and Missouri are left with few or no hospitals to treat patients suffering from COVID-19.

Eleven of Kansas’ 105 counties have no hospital at all, according to a data analysis released Friday by Kaiser Health News. The picture is even more grim in Missouri, where 44 of the state’s 114 counties are without a hospital.

And more than half the counties in both states have no ICU beds, the analysis found.

The article also gives the example of Mankato,

the county seat of Jewell County, which has the highest percentage of elderly residents in Kansas: Nearly 30 percent of its 2,850 residents are age 65 or older. The median age is 53, compared to 38 in Johnson County (suburban KC).

Coronavirus affects the elderly particularly hard. The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reports that 80% of Americans who have died from COVID-19 have been age 65 or older.

Though isolated from large urban areas — the nearest city of any size, Hastings, Nebraska (population about 25,000) is more than an hour’s drive to the north — Jewell County residents are taking the threat seriously.

Locals understand the challenge that they’re facing. With 25 beds, Jewell County Hospital is preparing for the worst.

But it will be hobbled in the fight.

Only six of its 25 beds are available for treating acute patients at any one time. The rest are occupied by people in need of long-term care.

There are no doctors on staff day to day. They both commute regularly from a town 30 minutes away. And there is only one ventilator, a recent cast-off from the emergency services agency that hospital staff are only now learning how to use.

“We definitely have limited resources,” nurse practitioner Dawn Steinman said. “But we’re trying to be very proactive.”

These small hospitals are interconnected with larger metropolitan hospitals across the region.

The large hospitals should be ready to assist the smaller ones with triaging patients, KDHE said in a 2009 report outlining plans for a public health emergency. While cities can expect an influx of patients from outlying areas, the plan also calls for an export of less critically ill patients to smaller hospitals. It says that big hospitals must use the same set of clinical criteria for patients coming in from smaller communities when rationing care during a crisis to prevent “geographic disparity.”

KDHE on Wednesday said hospitals reported that there were 168 ventilators available across the state, with hundreds more currently in use. Well over half of those that are available are located in Kansas City and south-central Kansas, which includes Wichita.

Iowa rural hospitals may be better off in the long run since the state expanded Medicaid and have only 4.7 percent of Iowans uninsured. Kansas has 12.3% uninsured adult non-elderly with Medicaid expansion rejected in the last legislative session. Western and central Kansas counties are more rural and have uninsurance rates up to 27%. (Link) Wyoming recently rejected Medicaid expansion. 12% of Wyoming residents lack health insurance and the poverty rate in rural Wyoming is 11.2%, compared with 9.5% in urban areas of the state.

 

[Greenore]

New York State has a link as well if you wish to compare

https://esd.ny.gov/guidance-executive-order-2026

Thanks IrishTrooper. Really appreciate the link.

Under the NY guidelines my businesses clearly qualify as essential services. I did not get that feeling reading the Indiana definition.

We have a great crew of guys and gals. Engineers, techs, programmers, machinists, millwrights, welders, draftsmen , QC and administrators. My primary concern is doing the right thing for them and their families. Lots of younger guys with kids and there is blood on the streets.

I guess we will see which way Alberta goes soon enough.

Cheers and Go Irish

 

[SonofOahu]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">US CDC admitted some <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/COVID19?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#COVID19</a> patients were misdiagnosed as flu during 2019 flu season. 34 million infected & 20000 died. If <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/COVID19?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#COVID19</a> began last September, & US has been lack of testing ability, how many would have been infected? US should find out when patient zero appeared.</p>— Lijian Zhao 赵立坚 (@zlj517) <a href="https://twitter.com/zlj517/status/1241723635964039168?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 22, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is why people shouldn't be as offended as they are about Trump calling it the "Chinese virus." China is out here spreading unchecked propaganda that the United States is responsible for the virus.

I don't know if that's what that message is supposed to be saying, though. COVID-19 almost certainly spread throughout the world months before it was actually recognized. Yes, China suppressed the early reports of a new strain, but I'm going to venture a guess that they had little idea what they were initially dealing with. Cov-19 mimics colds and flus, because it's a cold. To paraphrase the old saying: when you hear hoof beats, think horses not zebras.

I have no idea what the context of that tweet was, though.

 

[SonofOahu]

How funny is it that "liquor stores" are essential?

I love this country at times.

Liquor stores, bodegas, corner stores, gas stations, etc. are sometimes the only sources of food, drinks, or household items, in a low-income neighborhood. If you close them, how is someone in the 'hood supposed to get a needed item?

There's an area close to the town I work in that is dirt poor. The grocery stores close at about 10 or 11p. The nearest Wal-Mart is about 10 miles away, which isn't far in real distance. But, if you have to travel via bus, late at night with a feverish kid, that kind of sucks.

 

[SonofOahu]

I've been thinking of rural America and the hospitals that serve them recently.
Rural areas, which tend to have older and more at-risk populations, have special challenges when it comes to testing, access to healthcare, shortages of providers, nurses, RTs, vents, supplies like the n95s. They rely on being able to transfer pts that are more complicated, will be in the hospital for any length of time, may require procedures or equipment above a certain level.

Hospital administrators within their systems have been preparing and know that geograhic distances is no assurance they will escape the pandemic. Rural hospitals have been closing in many communities and some have been on the verge of it prior to this. Few have ICU beds. They too are no longer doing what elective procedures they usually perform - a revenue stream. Some are in states that never expanded Medicaid which provides some reimbursement and will leave states footing the bill. You can bet they have had discussions with regional hospitals in towns of 25,000 or more and know the impact a surge in tiertiary hospitals will impact all. Many residents are uninsured but may have chronic diseases that will complicate their care. With staff shortages, the impact when some get Covid 19 and those exposed who need to self-quaranteen will be significant.

I would love to hear from someone that knows more about this topic. Where I live in Cali, the population has grown tremendously since I was a kid in the 80's yet I can only think of two new hospitals. Why is that? Whether a pandemic or a natural event, it seems like the infrastructure would be overrun, but no one ever prepared for something everyone believed could happen.

It most likely has to do with California's regulations pertaining to their Certificate of Need (CON) program. Long story short, the states that require CONs have utilization rules attached to their facilities. In Hawaii, the governing body is called SHPDA (State Health Planning and Development Agency). To attain an acute-care facility CON in Hawaii and build a new hospital, the hospitals in your desired service area (let's say Oahu county) have to show an average utilization rate of about 75%. If the hospitals aren't that full, then there is no justification for building a new facility.

Why do they do that? So that you don't waste resources and build/buy stuff that won't be utilized. A state like Texas doesn't require CONs and it's the literal Wild Wild West at times. Things get built and burnt down with frequency.

The result is a much more economical and efficient system regarding costs, resources, and waste. The downside is you don't have the slack to pick up a huge and sudden influx of patients. That's why our system cannot absorb a pandemic. It was never meant to.

 

[NDohio]

As the U.S. and Canada share so many similarities, I am interested in knowing how governments will define "essential service(s)".

I had a discussion with a few individuals over the weekend and this might be a very tough one to define in light of current pandemic. Medical, Utilities, Food production and Distribution obviously but what additional goods and services?

We concluded that there could be several essential services.

Any thoughts?

Cheers and Go Irish!!

We are a servicing company for material handling equipment (forklifts, dock equipment, aerial equipment, etc) and we are considered essential.

My wife and I own a screen printing company in Frisco, Texas. With all the talk in the news and about the need for supplies and support for workers on the front line and the at risk population, we decided to offer tee shirts for sale with the proceeds going to the Center for Disaster Philanthropy's fund to support the efforts against COVID-19.
https://disasterphilanthropy.org/cdp-fund/cdp-covid-19-response-fund/


We thought it would be a fun way to help do our part. Feel free to buy a shirt or three and share with anybody else you know. Here is the online link. Shirts will be printed and mailed to your shipping address provided.

https://friscosportscares.itemorder.com/

This is awesome...well done.

 

[Irish#1]

Given we are deemed an essential supplier, we will be business as usual, or at least as close as possible. At the moment we are at 90% of projected sales for the month. If we maintain that, we will be in good shape until things bounce back.

Owner reiterated that work from home is on a case by case basis and the employee will need a good reason to work from home. More than likely they will be denied IMO. He did say if they want to take the time off using vacation time, they can. Also said if you have anything health related to stay at home.

He and his son got into something of a heated debate in our meeting. They disagree on how this should be handled which made it a little uncomfortable for the rest of us.

 

[Irish YJ]

More data suggesting this is bat or pangolin related (potentially wet market) instead of lab related.

https://www.foxnews.com/science/the-coronavirus-did-not-escape-from-a-lab-heres-how-we-know

 

[Irish#1]

More data suggesting this is bat or pangolin related (potentially wet market) instead of lab related.

https://www.foxnews.com/science/the-coronavirus-did-not-escape-from-a-lab-heres-how-we-know

China already told us our military is to blame. lol

 

[Irish#1]

Heard on Clay Travis this morning. Nashville police reporting a 40% increase in domestic violence related calls since people have been told to stay at home.

 

[Irish YJ]

China already told us our military is to blame. lol

They changed their minds. Now it started in September in Washington per one of the Chinese Communication Ministers.... I guess Washington has a huge Chinese Horseshoe Bat and pangolin problem...

Knowing what we know about the spread factors and the molecular backbone, that's not even a good lie. They need to upgrade their Communications Minister to someone who's more skilled at spinning better conspiracy theories. Maybe they'll hire Fusion GPS

 

[Rack Em]

Heard on Clay Travis this morning. Nashville police reporting a 40% increase in domestic violence related calls since people have been told to stay at home.

Insert distasteful joke about the women in my neighborhood here.

 

[Irish YJ]

Olympics officially postponed for at least a year

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/tokyo-olympics-postponed-coronavirus

 

[irishff1014]

Summer Olympics have been postponed til 2021

 

[koonja]

Heard on Clay Travis this morning. Nashville police reporting a 40% increase in domestic violence related calls since people have been told to stay at home.

More unintended consequences that at the end of the day, need to be included in the calculation that weighs the pros/cons of this.

That list of unintended consequences is going to be on steroids. Mark my words.

 

[IrishLax]

I don't know if that's what that message is supposed to be saying, though. COVID-19 almost certainly spread throughout the world months before it was actually recognized. Yes, China suppressed the early reports of a new strain, but I'm going to venture a guess that they had little idea what they were initially dealing with. Cov-19 mimics colds and flus, because it's a cold. To paraphrase the old saying: when you hear hoof beats, think horses not zebras.

I have no idea what the context of that tweet was, though.

He actually has a number of Tweets claiming the United States is where it originated and that we're responsible for it. A bunch of tweets like this:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Rt: I really think COVID-19 has been here in America for awhile. Do you guys remember how sick everyone was during the holidays/early January? And how everyone was saying they had the “flu” and the flu shot “didn’t work”? <a href="https://t.co/VNkKh6wwKN">https://t.co/VNkKh6wwKN</a></p>— Lijian Zhao 赵立坚 (@zlj517) <a href="https://twitter.com/zlj517/status/1241611441586700288?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 22, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is on top of Chinese news stations claiming it came from the United States. This is a concerted disinformation effort by the CCP. They're trying to deflect blame because their inaction + cover ups at the onset of the outbreak in Wuhan are directly responsible for the lack of containment and ultimately this global pandemic.

 

[Greenore]

More data suggesting this is bat or pangolin related (potentially wet market) instead of lab related.

https://www.foxnews.com/science/the-coronavirus-did-not-escape-from-a-lab-heres-how-we-know

Timing is everything! Glad to see this article.

A good friend of mine and his wife are both PhD's in biochemistry and have worked around the world. His focus is on cancer research while his wife's focus is epidemiology.

He wrote me, virtually verbatim, the contents of the article. I had copied his e-mail, at least twice, to post on the board but figured I was violating our friendship.

No reasonable person would believe that this pandemic did not start in China. The evidence is conclusive.

His final line was (paraphrasing), China needs to bring 500 million people out of the 17th century and into the 21st century. If they had done this earlier, there would be NO Covid-19.

Cheers and Go Irish!!

 

[BeauBenken]

More unintended consequences that at the end of the day, need to be included in the calculation that weighs the pros/cons of this.



That list of unintended consequences is going to be on steroids. Mark my words.

I was also told recently though I cannot currently verify that the daily death toll in New York has dropped significantly due to people having to stay home.

Sent from my SM-J337U using Tapatalk

 

[Irish YJ]

More unintended consequences that at the end of the day, need to be included in the calculation that weighs the pros/cons of this.

That list of unintended consequences is going to be on steroids. Mark my words.

I've seen so many "unintended consequence" type stories lately. There will be huge impacts that many would never ponder.

Story last night on the impact to homeless. Less food available, less $ input from panhandling, etc.. Sad stuff.

And while not a big deal given everything going on, my mother (who feeds birds, squirrels, possums, etc. daily) said the animal population back in her neighborhood is increasing, especially the larger ones. A lot more raccoons, coyotes, and foxes. She loves possums for some reason, and was upset that raccoons ganged up on one and cornered it.... She seeing more coyotes which were somewhat rare before. Guessing they are migrating quickly from the areas that no longer have available food.

 

[Irish YJ]

I was also told recently though I cannot currently verify that the daily death toll in New York has dropped significantly due to people having to stay home.

Sent from my SM-J337U using Tapatalk

Here's a daily updated look at NYC with great data including demographics and charts. Deaths decreased yesterday, cases did not.
https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/downloads/pdf/imm/covid-19-daily-data-summary.pdf

Here's one with a good global view with trending
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Here's a map view that can drill down to county level
https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

 

[notredomer23]

I was also told recently though I cannot currently verify that the daily death toll in New York has dropped significantly due to people having to stay home.

Sent from my SM-J337U using Tapatalk

It will take at least another week or 2 before we see the effect of New York's stay at home orders.

 

[zelezo vlk]

My gramps is now self-quarantined because he was in contact with a guy who's tested positive. This is gonna hit people you know

Thankfully, gramps is in the clear. His contact with the guy is confirmed to have been before he contracted coronavirus. He joins all of us in hoping this fades before the fall so he can get back to South Bend!

 

[Henges24]

Just heard from a co-worker who's family member was in the hospital with the virus. Family member was given the anti-malaria drug last night and he claims he feels 100% better. FM being sent home from hospital tonight/tomorrow morning.

Believe FM is in his 40s - unknown if he has preexisting conditions.

 

[Irish YJ]

Just heard from a co-worker who's family member was in the hospital with the virus. Family member was given the anti-malaria drug last night and he claims he feels 100% better. FM being sent home from hospital tonight/tomorrow morning.

Believe FM is in his 40s - unknown if he has preexisting conditions.

The recovery rate shown on that graph was pretty incredible if true. Sure hope it's the real deal. Many places are now trying it. Glad the FDA didn't hold up things due to the off-label use. Read that some were putting up a huge fight.

 

[Irishize]

They changed their minds. Now it started in September in Washington per one of the Chinese Communication Ministers.... I guess Washington has a huge Chinese Horseshoe Bat and pangolin problem...

Knowing what we know about the spread factors and the molecular backbone, that's not even a good lie. They need to upgrade their Communications Minister to someone who's more skilled at spinning better conspiracy theories. Maybe they'll hire Fusion GPS

I think most fair-minded folks can agree that democratically governed nations do their best to report accurate data in times like a pandemic whereas authoritarian dictatorships like China & Russia can not be taken at face value.