Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

[TheTurningPoint]

Couple of points.

1. This isn't directed at anyone specific, but I dont think fans understand just how hard winning is in college football, let alone a place like Notre Dame. These kids and coaches bust their ass each week. No team under Kelly has quit. Last year against USC, one player quit, but the rest of team gave effort.

2. The UVA wasn't half as bad as some are making it out to be. It's hard to match the intensity from week one against Texas in primetime the following week when you get a 3:30 game at Virginia. The kids came out with a fire under their ass. Forced 2 3 and outs and took an early lead. It's human nature to cruise after it happened the next week. Can Kelly do a better job at motivating? Sure, but it happens to every team.

3. I dont think there is a better coach in the country to lead Note Dame than Brian Kelly. He gets Notre Dame to its core and represents the University like he should. No coach can put up with the bullshit, stress and consistent pressure of Notre Dame for 15 years in todays world. I mean, just look at the fanbase right now. They want Kelly fired and are writing off the season because they lost their starting QB and almost lost on the road. Ohio State won a National Title with their 3rd string QB. Not saying ND is going to do that, but its not near as bad as some are making it out to be.

4. Gary Patterson would never be able to win at Notre Dame. He's a damn good coach, but he also gets the kids with not great academics and juco's. I am not saying it makes him any less of a coach, but he would have to do a complete 180 in his recruiting and how to build a program. People bitch about Brian Kelly passing too much...what are they going to do when Patterson goes Air Raid-5wide and goes 3 and out four times in a game?

5. Kelly does his best work guys he trusts in. He trust this team and the team trusts him. That goes a long way. What coach in American could have done more with the hand BK has been dealt? Urban Meyer and Nick Saban would have walked out the door when Golson was suspended or when they were told, "hey we are going suspend 4 starters on your team for academics, but we can't make it official until half way into the season". Hell, they probably would have walked out the door when admission told them they couldnt accept a 5-star that wanted to come.

It's not a job like any other in the country. There arent many made for the job...see Weis, Willingham Davie, etc...There is a reason Urban took the Florida job years ago. There is a reason Stoops didnt want to rebuild the program in 2005 and 2009.

 

[Redbar]

The same people that want to keep the schedule at or MORE difficult than the level we have now are the same people that aren't questioning BKs abilities.

I would bet lots of money that if we looked at thread we have on the Optimal Scheduling Model, the same people who yell and scream about criticisms are the same people who don't want to dumb down the schedule.

I definitely appreciate that we play a lot of rivalry and big games. I understand why the University chooses to go this route vs playing a bunch of cupcakes and FCS schools. However, I have no problem with people raising their concerns about CBK and his record thus far.

Couple of points.

1. This isn't directed at anyone specific, but I dont think fans understand just how hard winning is in college football, let alone a place like Notre Dame. These kids and coaches bust their ass each week. No team under Kelly has quit. Last year against USC, one player quit, but the rest of team gave effort.

2. The UVA wasn't half as bad as some are making it out to be. It's hard to match the intensity from week one against Texas in primetime the following week when you get a 3:30 game at Virginia. The kids came out with a fire under their ass. Forced 2 3 and outs and took an early lead. It's human nature to cruise after it happened the next week. Can Kelly do a better job at motivating? Sure, but it happens to every team.

3. I dont think there is a better coach in the country to lead Note Dame than Brian Kelly. He gets Notre Dame to its core and represents the University like he should. No coach can put up with the bullshit, stress and consistent pressure of Notre Dame for 15 years in todays world. I mean, just look at the fanbase right now. They want Kelly fired and are writing off the season because they lost their starting QB and almost lost on the road. Ohio State won a National Title with their 3rd string QB. Not saying ND is going to do that, but its not near as bad as some are making it out to be.

4. Gary Patterson would never be able to win at Notre Dame. He's a damn good coach, but he also gets the kids with not great academics and juco's. I am not saying it makes him any less of a coach, but he would have to do a complete 180 in his recruiting and how to build a program. People bitch about Brian Kelly passing too much...what are they going to do when Patterson goes Air Raid-5wide and goes 3 and out four times in a game?

5. Kelly does his best work guys he trusts in. He trust this team and the team trusts him. That goes a long way. What coach in American could have done more with the hand BK has been dealt? Urban Meyer and Nick Saban would have walked out the door when Golson was suspended or when they were told, "hey we are going suspend 4 starters on your team for academics, but we can't make it official until half way into the season". Hell, they probably would have walked out the door when admission told them they couldnt accept a 5-star that wanted to come.

It's not a job like any other in the country. There arent many made for the job...see Weis, Willingham Davie, etc...There is a reason Urban took the Florida job years ago. There is a reason Stoops didnt want to rebuild the program in 2005 and 2009.

I also agree with what TP is saying, I think CBK gets Notre Dame through and through and has done a very good job at restoring the program. I don't think that anything that has transpired so far this season should cause anyone to be upset with the job he is doing. BUT, I also think that in his role as an in game coach he lets his personality/stubborness/ego cloud some of his decisions about play calling and game strategy. I think BVG is the defensive version of CBK. So I do believe there is room to criticize aspects of his tenure and this forum is the right place for fans to voice their thoughts.

I am not ready to say that Coach can't evolve and, as someone said in a previous post, "get out of his own way". He has shown me the ability to self scout, or evaluate himself and I have seen areas where he made real improvements.

In the end, I do think CBK is the right man for this job, I do think he has been a good steward of the program, I do think he has balanced the most important mandates of the University- fielding a tough competitive football team that is comprised of accountable gentleman away from it. I just want him to continue to evaluate some of the aspects of himself that can at times make it harder for the team to win on Saturday.

 

[dad4aa]

Couple of points.

1. This isn't directed at anyone specific, but I dont think fans understand just how hard winning is in college football, let alone a place like Notre Dame. These kids and coaches bust their ass each week. No team under Kelly has quit. Last year against USC, one player quit, but the rest of team gave effort.

2. The UVA wasn't half as bad as some are making it out to be. It's hard to match the intensity from week one against Texas in primetime the following week when you get a 3:30 game at Virginia. The kids came out with a fire under their ass. Forced 2 3 and outs and took an early lead. It's human nature to cruise after it happened the next week. Can Kelly do a better job at motivating? Sure, but it happens to every team.

3. I dont think there is a better coach in the country to lead Note Dame than Brian Kelly. He gets Notre Dame to its core and represents the University like he should. No coach can put up with the bullshit, stress and consistent pressure of Notre Dame for 15 years in todays world. I mean, just look at the fanbase right now. They want Kelly fired and are writing off the season because they lost their starting QB and almost lost on the road. Ohio State won a National Title with their 3rd string QB. Not saying ND is going to do that, but its not near as bad as some are making it out to be.

4. Gary Patterson would never be able to win at Notre Dame. He's a damn good coach, but he also gets the kids with not great academics and juco's. I am not saying it makes him any less of a coach, but he would have to do a complete 180 in his recruiting and how to build a program. People bitch about Brian Kelly passing too much...what are they going to do when Patterson goes Air Raid-5wide and goes 3 and out four times in a game?

5. Kelly does his best work guys he trusts in. He trust this team and the team trusts him. That goes a long way. What coach in American could have done more with the hand BK has been dealt? Urban Meyer and Nick Saban would have walked out the door when Golson was suspended or when they were told, "hey we are going suspend 4 starters on your team for academics, but we can't make it official until half way into the season". Hell, they probably would have walked out the door when admission told them they couldnt accept a 5-star that wanted to come.

It's not a job like any other in the country. There arent many made for the job...see Weis, Willingham Davie, etc...There is a reason Urban took the Florida job years ago. There is a reason Stoops didnt want to rebuild the program in 2005 and 2009.

A voice of reason. Thank you!!

 

[gkIrish]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

 

[NDohio]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

It is year five of the BK era, but I really think the first two years he was a bit overwhelmed on the recruiting side. He came in with a plan to recruit a certain type of player and it pretty much blew up in his face. I feel like he has made vast improvements in figuring our what kids will make it at ND and what kids will not. He is still gonna take chances on a few and there will be flame-outs because of it, but I think he has dialed that in. The last three classes seem to have more high level guys that get ND.

I also believe that this past off season was huge - I love the new coaching staff and I do believe that was a result of BK looking inward at some of his weaknesses. Does he still have some areas to improve? Yes, but I disagree with the your statement that he hasn't made strides toward being a better coach.

I get the frustration and wanting to be a championship level team now(I still believe this season will be better than you do), but I do believe BK is building us to become just that.

 

[IrishLion]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

Gk, sorry if I missed it (there is a lot in this thread I didn't want to sift through), but who would you see as viable candidates to replace BK?

 

[Ndaccountant]

At first I thought it was some typo's in some posts, but I guess not.....this is BK's sixth season, not his fifth.

 

[dublinirish]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

sounds like you think BK would be a better AD than a head coach?

 

[Irish#1]

I hope we wax GT by 30+ so this thread will die or at least go into a closet to hide.

 

[RDU Irish]

I see plenty of avenues for this team to make the playoff. Once you are in the playoff, it is a completely new ballgame - you have a month to prep and get healthy. You have the whole season to establish your go-to guys. And you typically have an awesome stage for your players to make a case for NFL teams.

We have more NFL talent on this team than we have had for 20 years. Not just guys sneaking into the 6th round or hoping to make a team. Difference makers, first and second round picks. That is what championship level teams are made of. If you can't see that we are as close as we have been in 20 years and better than we were 3 years ago, well I just can't help you there.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I, typically, thoroughly enjoy your posts, TP. But I'd like to comment on this one in particular because I feel your "job" is to pump pro-ND propaganda often (and you do a phenomenal job at it, btw). Sometimes, however, this leads to potent green koolaid.

1. This isn't directed at anyone specific, but I dont think fans understand just how hard winning is in college football, let alone a place like Notre Dame. These kids and coaches bust their ass each week. No team under Kelly has quit. Last year against USC, one player quit, but the rest of team gave effort.

I agree that ND prides itself in doing things a certain way, and in a lot of ways it handicaps the football program from competing on a yearly basis with football factories. It is hard to win at ND consistently. I don't disagree. But at what point do the excuses stop? "No team under Kelly has quit." What does that have to do with being a championship contender on the regular? That's grasping at straws to me, personally.

2. The UVA wasn't half as bad as some are making it out to be. It's hard to match the intensity from week one against Texas in primetime the following week when you get a 3:30 game at Virginia. The kids came out with a fire under their ass. Forced 2 3 and outs and took an early lead. It's human nature to cruise after it happened the next week. Can Kelly do a better job at motivating? Sure, but it happens to every team.

More excuses. ND has a reputation for playing down to lesser teams. That's exactly what happened this past weekend. ND didn't put their foot on UVA's throats once they got them down early. The defense, yet again, let an average QB look great. People are tired of this. For every hyped game that the ND players get up for, there's a Purdue letdown. Enough with the excuses. Championship teams stomp lesser teams more often than not. I'm tired of it being a 50/50 toss up which ND will come out to play.

3. I dont think there is a better coach in the country to lead Note Dame than Brian Kelly. He gets Notre Dame to its core and represents the University like he should. No coach can put up with the bullshit, stress and consistent pressure of Notre Dame for 15 years in todays world. I mean, just look at the fanbase right now. They want Kelly fired and are writing off the season because they lost their starting QB and almost lost on the road. Ohio State won a National Title with their 3rd string QB. Not saying ND is going to do that, but its not near as bad as some are making it out to be.

I haven't read one post or heard one person say they want BK fired after Saturday's game. And yes, people are down right now because 1) It took a last minute TD to beat a less talented UVA team 2) Five season ending injuries already, Four of which are starters and 3) The hopes for this season with such a deep and talented team was a Playoff spot and people are seeing it as a less likely scenario now. BK has done a phenomenal job at ND. I do not want him fired. But I don't consider him an elite coach.

4. Gary Patterson would never be able to win at Notre Dame. He's a damn good coach, but he also gets the kids with not great academics and juco's. I am not saying it makes him any less of a coach, but he would have to do a complete 180 in his recruiting and how to build a program. People bitch about Brian Kelly passing too much...what are they going to do when Patterson goes Air Raid-5wide and goes 3 and out four times in a game?

I'm neither here nor there on this one. I'll cross the potential new ND coach bridge if/when we get to it.

5. Kelly does his best work guys he trusts in. He trust this team and the team trusts him. That goes a long way. What coach in American could have done more with the hand BK has been dealt? Urban Meyer and Nick Saban would have walked out the door when Golson was suspended or when they were told, "hey we are going suspend 4 starters on your team for academics, but we can't make it official until half way into the season". Hell, they probably would have walked out the door when admission told them they couldnt accept a 5-star that wanted to come.

BK knew what he was getting himself into. He embraced it. And has done a wonderful job. I still think there's room for improvement though.

It's not a job like any other in the country. There arent many made for the job...see Weis, Willingham Davie, etc...There is a reason Urban took the Florida job years ago. There is a reason Stoops didnt want to rebuild the program in 2005 and 2009.

This is true, but I just feel like you're saying the same stuff over and over at this point. There is a formula for winning at ND. It just hasn't been realized yet.

 

[Irish Insanity]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

Great post.

 

[gkIrish]

Gk, sorry if I missed it (there is a lot in this thread I didn't want to sift through), but who would you see as viable candidates to replace BK?

I need some time on that because I want to put the proper research into it and come up with a viable list. I think I said at the beginning of the thread that I would try and get a list in the next couple of weeks.

Again, not calling for a firing, but depending on how the season ends up I may indeed want that.

 

[aubeirish]

Personally, I refuse to throw the towel like some of guys are doing. We are 2-0, this team still has a lot of talent and Kizer looks very promising. Maybe I'm delusional, but I just refuse to let down just because we got a little adversity. If anything , this should make us stronger.

 

[ThePiombino]

I need some time on that because I want to put the proper research into it and come up with a viable list. I think I said at the beginning of the thread that I would try and get a list in the next couple of weeks.

Again, not calling for a firing, but depending on how the season ends up I may indeed want that.

You've been saying that since you started this thread 4 days ago. Time to put up or shut up.

 

[woolybug25]

While an admirable trait, there are plenty of coaches out there who get their kids to work hard and not give up. I don't think that makes Kelly unique in any way. It certainly doesn't mean he is doing a good job.

How many of them have to keep kids engaged with the schedule of an ND student? Let's not act like keeping kids in engaged in the Notre Dame environment is equal to other programs. It's a much harder job.

IMO, in year five of BKs tenure, the team should be much closer to winning a championship. Ohio St. won with their 3rd QB. Obviously we have had poor injury luck but I'm done making excuses.

We are a top 10 team and went to the title game in year 3 of his tenure. How much "closer to a championship" can we get without actually winning it?

I REALLY LIKE what BK has done to move the program forward in terms of getting a training table, helping make changes to our stadium, and generally be a great representative of the university. No complaints there. I just think he is a stubborn coach who refuses to make the necessary changes on the field to win more games.

This is easy to say because it hasn't all worked out like we hoped. But Saban is stubborn, Meyer is stubborn. All good coaches have things they wont sacrifice. But let's not act like BK isn't willing to self evaluate. If he wasn't, then I can't explain the Sanford hire. That was completely out of his comfort zone and exactly what you are calling for.

The whole thing about trusting certain players disturbs me. Tells me that he won't play the guys that give him the best chance to win (i.e. Morgan). I also don't think he likes to delegate authority, which leads to really poor in-game decisions. If he is calling the plays, he won't listen to the advice of others. If he isn't calling the plays, he overrules decisions. I've heard that straight from a player's mouth. There's a reason you never see him standing near assistants on the sideline unless he is scolding them. Just a few more things to think about.

I think there is more to the Morgan thing than simply BK liking Schmidt. That's just my opinion. BK plays young guys on the regular, Morgan's situation is not the norm.

 

[tko]

I need some time on that because I want to put the proper research into it and come up with a viable list. I think I said at the beginning of the thread that I would try and get a list in the next couple of weeks.

Again, not calling for a firing, but depending on how the season ends up I may indeed want that.

Put the Oikos down and throw out some names!!!!

 

[gkIrish]

You've been saying that since you started this thread 4 days ago. Time to put up or shut up.

LOL I said this the first day. I work 12 hours + per day and don't have time to research properly to meet your deadlines. Stop getting your panties in a bunch. If you want a real list, I need time. I don't even have time to post in this thread but I do because I'm taking ownership of my comments.

I'll give you a list in the next couple of weeks. Going to put some real effort and research into realistic candidates who we could take a look at. As I said in the OP, I don't believe in the concept that you don't fire someone because you fear there is no better option. That's what Virginia Tech and Georgia have been doing for a decade plus and how many championships have they combined to win?

 

[gkIrish]

How many of them have to keep kids engaged with the schedule of an ND student? Let's not act like keeping kids in engaged in the Notre Dame environment is equal to other programs. It's a much harder job.

Well he hasn't exactly succeeded at keeping kids academically qualified....

We are a top 10 team and went to the title game in year 3 of his tenure. How much "closer to a championship" can we get without actually winning it?

Other than 2012, we have finished in the top 25 once, at #20. Being a top 10 ranked team at some point in the season doesn't mean we were a top 10 team that season.

This is easy to say because it hasn't all worked out like we hoped. But Saban is stubborn, Meyer is stubborn. All good coaches have things they wont sacrifice. But let's not act like BK isn't willing to self evaluate. If he wasn't, then I can't explain the Sanford hire. That was completely out of his comfort zone and exactly what you are calling for.

We'll see how much authority he gives to Sanford. There have already been rumblings that they aren't seeing eye to eye.

 

[TDHeysus]

gk - once you do your research, please let Jack Swarbrick know your findings, I'm sure he will find it useful

 

[koonja]

Well he hasn't exactly succeeded at keeping kids academically qualified....



Other than 2012, we have finished in the top 25 once, at #20. Being a top 10 ranked team at some point in the season doesn't mean we were a top 10 team that season.



We'll see how much authority he gives to Sanford. There have already been rumblings that they aren't seeing eye to eye.

I'm pro-BK but I hope not because if Sanford is signing off on play calling like the last game, he's not all he's cracked up to be. Let's hope it's a healthy conflict.

 

[gkIrish]

gk - once you do your research, please let Jack Swarbrick know your findings, I'm sure he will find it useful

Do you guys want a list or not? Apparently I can't please everyone...

Thanks for the thoughtful discussion.

 

[woolybug25]

Well he hasn't exactly succeeded at keeping kids academically qualified....

That's because we are getting a different breed of player than we did in the past. We can't have it both ways... in one hand demanding that our staff find a way to get questionable academics into the school, then hate on them when those kids can't hack it. That's not on the coach.

Other than 2012, we have finished in the top 25 once, at #20. Being a top 10 ranked team at some point in the season doesn't mean we were a top 10 team that season.

Again, in 5 seasons we have gone to the title game, finished ranked twice and are currently a top 10 team. Acting like that isn't good enough is completely ignoring the previous 20 years of history behind that.

We'll see how much authority he gives to Sanford. There have already been rumblings that they aren't seeing eye to eye.

He proactively brought him into the program with the specific purpose of change. Kelly recruited Sanford, not the other way around. Again, we can't act like he is completely unable to objectively look at himself when that is exactly what he did with this hire. Throwing that all away because of "rumblings" (which I don't agree with, the convo on the headseat was confirmed to be Denbrock).

The entire argument is "throwing the baby out with the bathwater".

 

[TDHeysus]

Do you guys want a list or not? Apparently I can't please everyone...

Thanks for the thoughtful discussion.

you missed the point, but ok. we are all (Savvy Jack included) eagerly awaiting your findings

 

[ThePiombino]

Personally, I refuse to throw the towel like some of guys are doing. We are 2-0, this team still has a lot of talent and Kizer looks very promising. Maybe I'm delusional, but I just refuse to let down just because we got a little adversity. If anything , this should make us stronger.

I would love to rally behind this as well, but it seems to me that at the very least the defense fell apart at the seems when Zaire went down last week.

 

[Section20Row27]

This is where I am at with CBK. He has grown the program, and built a solid, competitve foundation. Where I see the need for his continued growth in order to field a championship caliber Team lies in his micro management of the offense (primarily play calling) and his hands off approach to defense. I say this as only a game day observer evaluating his management style and sideline tendencies, and have no insider insight to what is actually happening....

 

[connor_in]

Personally, I refuse to throw the towel like some of guys are doing. We are 2-0, this team still has a lot of talent and Kizer looks very promising. Maybe I'm delusional, but I just refuse to let down just because we got a little adversity. If anything , this should make us stronger.

made me think of this...

 

[Blaise]

Aren't we really talking injuries here? If Zaire was healthy and threw that TD pass... We would be talking what a big time player he is and how excited we are for the season at 2-0...
When Kelly got hired, if you told me in year 5 we would of been to one BCS title game, be in the top 10 and have draft experts predicting that we might have 3-4 first round picks on the roster I would take it... Since it has been over 20 years since ND had a top 10 pick in the draft.. It's nice to have real talent.. Now we just have to stay healthy
I am not interested in hiring a Patterson and waiting another 2-3 years for them to be adjusted to the position and demands

 

[dublinirish]

Aren't we really talking injuries here? If Zaire was healthy and threw that TD pass... We would be talking what a big time player he is and how excited we are for the season at 2-0...
When Kelly got hired, if you told me in year 5 we would of been to one BCS title game, be in the top 10 and have draft experts predicting that we might have 3-4 first round picks on the roster I would take it... Since it has been over 20 years since ND had a top 10 pick in the draft.. It's nice to have real talent.. Now we just have to stay healthy
I am not interested in hiring a Patterson and waiting another 2-3 years for them to be adjusted to the position and demands

the thought of another coach coming to ND and going through the growing pains BK had for 4/5 years just sounds utterly exhausting to me as a fan. Not sure I could manage it :/

 

[Irish Insanity]

Personally, I refuse to throw the towel like some of guys are doing. We are 2-0, this team still has a lot of talent and Kizer looks very promising. Maybe I'm delusional, but I just refuse to let down just because we got a little adversity. If anything , this should make us stronger.

Who's throwing in the towel?
And of you read thru the entire thread, it's not just about this year, but his tenure as a whole.
It's just a discussion/criticism of the program and coach at this point. I don't get people's issue with that.

Is this Kelly's ceiling? 8-9 wins. Mediocrity. One run at the championship on the back of a D littered woth NFL players? Is it just on Kelly?