Rumored Violations

[ulukinatme]

Notre Dame would have the shittiest philosophy, theology, engineering, and every other type of department in the country if they only recruited and retained faculty members who were hardcore ND football fans.

I'm not saying that faculty members have to be hardcore ND football fans, but I would hope that the faculty was at least tolerant and accepting of football considering how it's helped keep the university going and thriving for so long. It's like looking a gift horse in the mouth. Without football, Notre Dame might have shut down by now, or it would be some crummy Midwest school that no one outside the region has heard of. Instead, football helps bring in lots of money in the form of ticket sales, merchandise, and donations.

 

[tussin]

...so what's all your personal best guesses as to when and how this all ends?

It's at the point where I have accepted the team for what it is without these players. If any are reinstated, it's just a bonus for me. Just want it all to be over and this thread to die.

 

[wizards8507]

I'm not saying that faculty members have to be hardcore ND football fans, but I would hope that the faculty was at least tolerant and accepting of football considering how it's helped keep the university going and thriving for so long.

The vast majority of faculty members I encountered were exactly as you'd like them to be. The anti-football crowd is a small faction at most.

 

[Rack Em]

Are you part of the Econ Department, Rack Em? If so, you may know my brother. He is an Asst. Director in the MBA program.

Negatory. I just drink their booze on the reg in exchange for all the B+'s I got in their classes.

So you're saying they understand the relationship between a successful football program and the success of the school is mutually beneficial? And to think I hated Econ in college.

Yeah isn't that weird? Hmm realizing that football can help drive the mission is very difficult in academia.

 

[CarrollVermin]

At what point does Kelly say fuck it and just address this as a mishandling on the part of the University? Serious question. Same for the parents...at what point do they break and give an interview to blast the university? Just wondering...

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

They're not on the honesty committee. They're the "accusing" party in the hearings, as it's their class where the potential violation occurred.

EDIT: googled it up... It's in VII.C ... basically, they have to find a time that works for everyone, and point 6 in that section says the accuser can request rescheduling. The Honor Code // Undergraduate Academic Code of Honor // University of Notre Dame committees

If hearings were getting scheduled and repeatedly rescheduled, wouldn't the players know about it? I haven't read through the rules and procedures but wouldn't they be notified of set hearings and reschedulings?

If that has been going on, it seems likely one or more would be complaining about it openly.

 

[Domina Nostra]

At what point does Kelly say fuck it and just address this as a mishandling on the part of the University? Serious question. Same for the parents...at what point do they break and give an interview to blast the university? Just wondering...

Kelly: Never. Terrible for recruiting and might actually work against you in the process. You do your yelling behind the scenes.

Parents: Never, unless you you are completely sure your kid is innocent. If you think he is innocent, as PD apparently does, you try to figure out what will be most beneficial to the kid. At some point that could mean complaining in public. But if you are wrong, I think you make your kid look a lot worse.

Personally, 95% of the reason I was outraged is that it was the strong rumor was that KR, and possibly one or two others were actually innocent. If they are, ND has dropped the ball, no doubt. But if they did actually cheat in some kind of organized or open fashion, I think ND should handle these things faster, but I am not in the camp that some great injustice is being done (despite all the legit arguments others have made to the contrary).

 

[Old Man Mike]

When I was at ND back in the pleistocene era, none of my profs, except two, cared about football one way or the other. {those two were apparently fans}. Profs almost never care about things which don't interfere with their jobs. I hung around with Chemistry, Physics, Engineering types, and it was rare to have football players in the classroom. The one in my chemistry cohort was treated exactly like everybody else. {we had one complete a$shole of a chem-prof, but he was prejudiced of ANYONE who was a physical specimen, having nothing to do with football players --- guy was a pencil-necked weasel with a Napoleonic Complex.}

Nowadays, who knows? Not I. I can only say that at WMU the same attitudes of the staff were true.

 

[koonja]

Hard to blame Captain Jack and Jenkins without knowing what's going on. But they owe the accused/BK a timeline at the very least. "It's a complex issue that we hope to have a decision for by ______" is not breaking any laws and might save them some flak.

 

[Domina Nostra]

This is why ND fans should support the Economics department. They hold weekly tailgates in the same spot. The professors they bring in are expected to be Catholic, personable, and actually like ND. Unfortunately, those types are few and far between on campus. One of the many reasons why I'm proud I was an Econ major.

/Shameless plug

There are a few departments that meet that description. Law is another.

 

[IrishLax]

If hearings were getting scheduled and repeatedly rescheduled, wouldn't the players know about it? I haven't read through the rules and procedures but wouldn't they be notified of set hearings and reschedulings?

If that has been going on, it seems likely one or more would be complaining about it openly.

Yup. Huge hole in the "we know nothing" thing... unless this is all behind the scenes "hey, let's do hearings this Thursday..." and then they always have a conflict. Who knows.

 

[CarrollVermin]

Yup. Huge hole in the "we know nothing" thing... unless this is all behind the scenes "hey, let's do hearings this Thursday..." and then they always have a conflict. Who knows.

What I don't understand is that this is a standing university committee, no? If so, then they have repeated, scheduled times to meet. IF that is the case, then there really is no excuse as to this taking this long. There have been at least three opportunities to bring the committee together. If there is an issue with one of the members, then they should move forward without them.

 

[wizards8507]

What I don't understand is that this is a standing university committee, no?

No.

 

[CarrollVermin]

No.

What the hell? Seriously? That is different from some other universities then. We have a standing one that meets every week. There are various points of discussion, but they stay busy weekly.

 

[wizards8507]

What the hell? Seriously? That is different from some other universities then. We have a standing one that meets every week. There are various points of discussion, but they stay busy weekly.

Notre Dame has an HONOR committee that meets however often (irrelevant). They don't do case-by-case discipline. They're more big picture, set policy type stuff. They have nothing to do with all of this. There is one HONOR committee for the entire university.

That's different from the HONESTY committees. There are many throughout the University, as it's left to the discretion of each college dean (Arts and Letters, Science, Business, Architecture, Engineering) to establish a committee either for the college (not university) as a whole or for each department within the college. These committees meet on an ad hoc basis when cases come up.

 

[Classic Irish]

The vast majority of faculty members I encountered were exactly as you'd like them to be. The anti-football crowd is a small faction at most.

This. I recall seeing some of my professors either heading to the stadium before kickoff or actually seeing them in the stands.

 

[johnnycando]

Holy fuck.

Can these POS people please shit or get off the mother fucking pot!

Now I feel better...

 

[dshans]

Now I feel better...

But for how long?

 

[johnnycando]

But for how long?

My relief lasts as long as an adolescent boys fascination with his pecker.

 

[NDohio]

No news is good news ...

 

[gmnysdad]

My relief lasts as long as an adolescent boys fascination with his pecker.

That can sometime be a very long tome


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[ACamp1900]

I'm with cando... at this point... they needed to move things along or at least give the players a status update... something.

 

[ND NYC]

big news afoot?

 

[Bogtrotter07]

There are a few departments that meet that description. Law is another.

Tailgated twice with the chair of that fine department. Originally struck up a conversation, because he was giving a campus tour in natty attire, and thirty five minutes later he was getting dirty all geared out. We talked, he bought the beer. I would call him a fine man even if he hadn't plied me with libations, twice!

Here is my deal. I have a plan. If there isn't any resolution, I am boycotting ND. Oh, I will still watch the games, but no more gear or tickets until someone convinces me that the path of action the administration has chosen is the best for everyone. If any of the stupid reasons people have brought up are in fact true ND and UA are going to get emails like, "Last year I spent $453 on Notre Dame gear for Christmas presents; this year Santa says, "NO!" If I am wrong, I will publically apologize and go out and buy double the gear I would have otherwise.

I think a mass fan boycott is fast becoming a pregnant idea!

 

[GATTACA!]

big news afoot?

?

 

[Bogtrotter07]

?

Another dick joke.

I still like my idea of an organized fan boycott!

 

[Irish8248]

Another dick joke.

I still like my idea of an organized fan boycott!

Whoa

 

[Rocknes Ghost]

Kelly: Never. Terrible for recruiting and might actually work against you in the process. You do your yelling behind the scenes.

Parents: Never, unless you you are completely sure your kid is innocent. If you think he is innocent, as PD apparently does, you try to figure out what will be most beneficial to the kid. At some point that could mean complaining in public. But if you are wrong, I think you make your kid look a lot worse.

Personally, 95% of the reason I was outraged is that it was the strong rumor was that KR, and possibly one or two others were actually innocent. If they are, ND has dropped the ball, no doubt. But if they did actually cheat in some kind of organized or open fashion, I think ND should handle these things faster, but I am not in the camp that some great injustice is being done (despite all the legit arguments others have made to the contrary).

Couldn't this also be used against the team if Kelly doesn't say something at some point here? Ex.- "Do you really want to play for a coach who won't stick up for you to the administration if someone is dragging their feet?"

I'm in the dark like everyone else, but at this point this would have to turn out to be a very complex and bad situation for me to have any understanding of the delays. There are people who can get things done at the university. If a professor needs to reschedule once, fine (although it should have been near to the original date). It is not acceptable though to keep delaying while the story continues to get publicity on Espn, USA Today, etc. The university president should be rallying the appropriate people to get things done as needed (not influence, but bring resolution). Going by the honor code timeline guidelines is one thing, but it has to be within reason. This has reached the point of beig unreasonable IMO. Especially if Kelly and the players truly do not know the timeline for resolution.

In summary- I'm pissed.

 

[johnnycando]

Couldn't this also be used against the team if Kelly doesn't say something at some point here? Ex.- "Do you really want to play for a coach who won't stick up for you to the administration if someone is dragging their feet?"

I'm in the dark like everyone else, but at this point this would have to turn out to be a very complex and bad situation for me to have any understanding of the delays. There are people who can get things done at the university. If a professor needs to reschedule once, fine (although it should have been near to the original date). It is not acceptable though to keep delaying while the story continues to get publicity on Espn, USA Today, etc. The university president should be rallying the appropriate people to get things done as needed (not influence, but bring resolution). Going by the honor code timeline guidelines is one thing, but it has to be within reason. This has reached the point of beig unreasonable IMO. Especially if Kelly and the players truly do not know the timeline for resolution.

In summary- I'm pissed.

Definitely could be a great negative recruiting tactic.

Great.

 

[Irish#1]

At what point does Kelly say fuck it and just address this as a mishandling on the part of the University? Serious question. Same for the parents...at what point do they break and give an interview to blast the university? Just wondering...

And put himself in hot water?