Breaking Bad

[Emcee77]

I think I may be in agreement with Buster as the top 2 shows go of all time. The Wire and BB (and other shows) are so different though, it's hard to compare and contrast and make lists.

Whereas I know what I loved about the Wire (the authenticity, the wholeness of different institutions' role, the backdrop of overall urban decay, etc.), I'm still not exactly sure what I loved about BB-- but I know I loved the sh!t out of it.

I think the finale was, ultimately, what sealed the deal for me though. Walt went out on his own terms-- what he stated he wanted from the beginning in episode 1 when he received his diagnosis. And he saved Jesse-- his biggest success and failure as a teacher.

But I can't quite put my finger on the other aspects of the show I loved. Maybe one was that the entire series, for the most part, was in real time? The incredible likability of Walt and Jesse...and the empathy I could feel towards and for them?

I think the Wire is the clear GOAT. Breaking Bad and the Sopranos fight for second place, imho.

There was a time somewhere in the middle of Breaking Bad where I was tempted to stop watching. I would say, "so, this series used to be about a guy 'breaking bad,' i.e. a good guy going bad; now it's about a guy who is just bad. There are lots of shows about that. Who cares anymore." Boy am I glad I kept watching. Just when you think Walt can't get any worse, he does. And yet he never breaks all the way -- or he does, but you always see the scraps of humanity that he clings to. Just a great, great show. There has maybe never been a show so exciting in terms of plot that also raises such fascinating insights into good and evil and such fascinating questions about good and evil people as contrasted with good and evil acts, including when and whether they can really be contrasted.

Uh-may-zing show.

 

[Emcee77]

The word my brother and I use to describe Breaking Bad is gangster. Vince Gilligan really eases you into this downward spiral of morality and in doing so just keeps upping the bar. Just when you think it can't get more gangster, boom, bar raised. The final scenes of each respective season finale come immediately to mind. Walt blowing up Tuco's drug den. Jessie shooting Gale in the face. Walt letting Jane die (darkest moment in my opinion). DING! DING DING! DING! DING! And of course..

So gangster.

Yes, totally. Part of the joy of watching the show comes from seeing a milquetoast become a complete BADASS. Just when you think he has reached the limit of his badass potential, he does something even more badass (I use "badass" kind of the way you use "gangster").

I mean, he gradually tangles with ever more sophisticated levels of the criminal underworld, and at various points you think, "ok, this is it. Walt has finally met his match. He is up against someone smarter, tougher, and more devious than he." And each time, Walt beats the odds until he is Tony Montana -- complete with the tragic downfall.

 

[ozzman]

I'm just wrapping up season 2 of the wire, and while good, it's no breaking bad.

 

[zelezo vlk]

I'm just wrapping up season 2 of the wire, and while good, it's no breaking bad.

 

[tussin]

I know most, if not all of you, will disagree with me here. Breaking Bad is a top 5 show, but Mad Men is better.

 

[Buster Bluth]

I'm just wrapping up season 2 of the wire, and while good, it's no breaking bad.

Seasons 3 and 4 are the best seasons ever done on TV.

The depth of the realism is what makes The Wire the GOAT, one doesn't get the full appreciation for that until late in the series.

 

[Emcee77]

I know most, if not all of you, will disagree with me here. Breaking Bad is a top 5 show, but Mad Men is better.

I wouldn't necessarily argue with that. Ultimately I think Breaking Bad edges it out, but it's right up there.

 

[zelezo vlk]

I know most, if not all of you, will disagree with me here. Breaking Bad is a top 5 show, but Mad Men is better.

I just never got into Mad Men. I watched plenty of episodes, but never felt the desire or need to continue watching.

Seasons 3 and 4 are the best seasons ever done on TV.

The depth of the realism is what makes The Wire the GOAT, one doesn't get the full appreciation for that until late in the series.

Damn straight. Season 3 blew my mind. I didn't realize how good a tv show could be until then. But season 4 broke my heart. The realism was a double-edged sword in my case.

 

[ozzman]

Seasons 3 and 4 are the best seasons ever done on TV.

The depth of the realism is what makes The Wire the GOAT, one doesn't get the full appreciation for that until late in the series.

Can't wait. I'll finish up 2 tonight and start 3 tomorrow. (the only benefit of having an hour long train ride commute from the far burbs is catching up on old shows on the kindle.)

 

[TDHeysus]

a friend and I are having this very debate right now; he says The Wire is the best series that has been on TV, whereas I am saying its Breaking Bad. its no surprise that we disagree, we are on opposite sides of the ND vs. USC debate as well, but I digress......

Season 4 of Breaking Bad, especially the last 6 or 7 episodes of season 4 might be the best drama I have ever seen on TV.

I never watched Breaking Bad until it was on Netflix, so I had the benefit of being able to watch them all back to back from Season 1 to Season 5; for me season 4 uber alles

 

[A Pac]

I know most, if not all of you, will disagree with me here. Breaking Bad is a top 5 show, but Mad Men is better.

Not trying to be rude or a dick, but I watched the first two episodes of Mad Men and they were easily the two most boring episodes of television I have ever seen. BB is the greatest show of all time. Nothing comes close.

 

[ACamp1900]

Not trying to be rude or a dick, but I watched the first two episodes of Mad Men and they were easily the two most boring episodes of television I have ever seen. BB is the greatest show of all time. Nothing comes close.

I've tried to get into Mad Men and found it boring also,... it was hard to watch.

 

[Andy in Sactown]

a friend and I are having this very debate right now; he says The Wire is the best series that has been on TV, whereas I am saying its Breaking Bad. its no surprise that we disagree, we are on opposite sides of the ND vs. USC debate as well, but I digress......

Season 4 of Breaking Bad, especially the last 6 or 7 episodes of season 4 might be the best drama I have ever seen on TV.

I never watched Breaking Bad until it was on Netflix, so I had the benefit of being able to watch them all back to back from Season 1 to Season 5; for me season 4 uber alles

My Top 10:
1. Breaking Bad
2. The Wire
3. The Sopranos
4. The West Wing
5. M*A*S*H
6. Cheers
7. ER
8. The X-Files
9. Modern Family
10. Star Trek: The Next Generation

I really struggled with The Wire versus The Sopranos. You could say it came down to the wire, but Walter White is firmly placed atop my list.

 

[zelezo vlk]

My Top 10:
1. Breaking Bad
2. The Wire
3. The Sopranos
4. The West Wing
5. M*A*S*H
6. Cheers
7. ER
8. The X-Files
9. Modern Family
10. Star Trek: The Next Generation

I really struggled with The Wire versus The Sopranos. You could say it came down to the wire, but Walter White is firmly placed atop my list.

Is this a favorite list or best? Because The West Wing at #4 puzzles me.

 

[koonja]

Best non-coms: Breaking Bad, Dexter, Sons of Anarchy, Walking Dead, American Horror Story, Six Feet Under.

Best comedies: South Park, New Girl, Always Sunny, Parks and Rec, Arrested Development.

 

[Kaneyoufeelit]

Not trying to be rude or a dick, but I watched the first two episodes of Mad Men and they were easily the two most boring episodes of television I have ever seen. BB is the greatest show of all time. Nothing comes close.

Not many things are as pointless as arguing about subjective things like this on an Internet message board. With that said, allowing me to take extreme exception to you saying that nothing is close to as good as Breaking Bad. For me, BB is firmly in third place behind The Wire and The Sopranos. Also, although it is a very different show, Seinfeld is in the same ballpark.


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[Andy in Sactown]

Is this a favorite list or best? Because The West Wing at #4 puzzles me.

Aaron Sorkin and his writing staff were really in rare form. I understand political ideology is going to interfere with its perceptions. It's basically a liberal utopia mental masturbation, but since I'm a democrat, I enjoyed the writing. And I could shake-up #4-10 pretty easily. It's really 1-2-3.........and #4 could be located at #50 distance wise from the top 3.

Or maybe 1.....2-3................................................................4, etc. Breaking Bad is numero uno.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Aaron Sorkin and his writing staff were really in rare form. I understand political ideology is going to interfere with its perceptions. It's basically a liberal utopia mental masturbation, but since I'm a democrat, I enjoyed the writing. And I could shake-up #4-10 pretty easily. It's really 1-2-3.........and #4 could be located at #50 distance wise from the top 3.

Or maybe 1.....2-3................................................................4, etc. Breaking Bad is numero uno.

Oh don't get me wrong, I loved The West Wing. I just would not put it on my best top 10 list. Semi-related: have you seen Veep? I loved WW and love Veep much much more.

 

[dshans]

I loved West Wing. That The Prez was a Domer helped get me hooked. The story lines and character development took the lead over time.

There was one episode that I find fault with.

When some contrarian wag tried to denigrate ND as part of the Ivy League elite, said wag was firmly corrected. A nice touch.

However, they referred to Dartmouth as a university rather than as the college that it was and is.

A lapse in research or creative license??? It just struck me that they went to the trouble of highlighting one fact while blowing another.

 

[zelezo vlk]

I loved West Wing. That The Prez was a Domer helped get me hooked. The story lines and character development took the lead over time.

There was one episode that I find fault with.

When some contrarian wag tried to denigrate ND as part of the Ivy League elite, said wag was firmly corrected. A nice touch.

However, they referred to Dartmouth as a university rather than as the college that it was and is.

A lapse in research or creative license??? It just struck me that they went to the trouble of highlighting one fact while blowing another.

Dang, can't get the video to work. Anyways, it's the Michigan week reference on WW.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbc2DLPI7OI

 

[tussin]

Not trying to be rude or a dick, but I watched the first two episodes of Mad Men and they were easily the two most boring episodes of television I have ever seen. BB is the greatest show of all time. Nothing comes close.

I'm also not trying to be rude or be a dick, but you simply can't judge Mad Men off of two episodes. It's a completely different experience than BB. You're basically going through the major events of the 50s and 60s from the perspective of a small group of people, all while watching their own personal and professional lives evolve. It's superbly written and really captivating. My favorite part about the show is that it never sacrifices realism for entertainment; every scene and every character is completely plausible.

 

[irishog77]

I initially based Breaking Bad off the very first episode when it initially aired on TV. I didn't like it and moved on.

A couple, 3 years later, the show had gained some steam, but I hadn't been watching...and really had no desire to watch. And honestly, if AMC hadn't reran the series from the beginning, I'm not sure I would have ever watched. But I figured, "well, it's just 6 or 7 hours a week on the DVR...what the hell." I even still had doubts after the first several episodes. But I stuck with it and it was amazing.

I loved the Sopranos. I think something that hurt it, ultimately, was a combination of stringing it out (a couple looong breaks before episodes aired), and the introduction of new characters and/or friends, interests, hobbies, etc. that were a focal point of the show...then weren't even mentioned, in passing, later on.

At first, I didn't like how BB was essentially running the episodes in real time, even as one season would end and another would begin. But, wether purposeful or not, I think it helped tremendously in the likability and "realness" of the show. Obviously not comparing the two media overall, but some of the more successful horror movies of recent times (Scream, Saw, can't think of the name of them, but the ones where they film inside the house and the house is haunted, etc) all have a "realness" or believeability to them because the entire scope of the movie is limited in characters and geography, etc. BB, by keeping the entire scope of the show limited to central characters, kept us from wondering "I wonder whatever happened to so and so from season 2?" BB was pretty much limited to Walt and his immediate circle of family and business associates. And we were able to get closure from pretty much anybody who faded from the show.

For those of you who watched BB from episode 1 until its finale, I have to say, well done! I can't imagine how difficult it must have been to have to wait 10 months or so for the new season to air. I would watch on Sunday and Monday...and had a difficult time waiting only 6 days to see the next episode. The show was definitely intense.

 

[A Pac]

I'm also not trying to be rude or be a dick, but you simply can't judge Mad Men off of two episodes. It's a completely different experience than BB. You're basically going through the major events of the 50s and 60s from the perspective of a small group of people, all while watching their own personal and professional lives evolve. It's superbly written and really captivating. My favorite part about the show is that it never sacrifices realism for entertainment; every scene and every character is completely plausible.

I totally understand that I can't get a good grasp of what the show was about. However, the show had done a terrible job of making the characters interesting. For example, at the end of the second episode, January Jones' character was in that car wreck and I didn't care what happened do Her. My wife and I didn't even want to see if she was ok in episode 3. I'm sure it got better after that, I just didn't feel hooked.

 

[Andy in Sactown]

I totally understand that I can't get a good grasp of what the show was about. However, the show had done a terrible job of making the characters interesting. For example, at the end of the second episode, January Jones' character was in that car wreck and I didn't care what happened do Her. My wife and I didn't even want to see if she was ok in episode 3. I'm sure it got better after that, I just didn't feel hooked.

I've seen every episode and I still don't give a shit what she does. Betty Draper isn't very high on the likability scale. Plus January Jones not losing the preggers weight which she carried very badly (neck fat) didn't help.

You at least feel bad for Skyler in Breaking Bad. She went through some shit and then broke a little bad herself. Betty's just a bitch.

 

[Buster Bluth]

I'm also not trying to be rude or be a dick, but you simply can't judge Mad Men off of two episodes. It's a completely different experience than BB. You're basically going through the major events of the 50s and 60s from the perspective of a small group of people, all while watching their own personal and professional lives evolve. It's superbly written and really captivating. My favorite part about the show is that it never sacrifices realism for entertainment; every scene and every character is completely plausible.

One of my best friend's girlfriend has a brother who is a copywriter at a major ad firm. I was hanging out in his office with him and asked him about Mad Men. He said the oldest members of the firm, who were in the business during the time of Mad Men, said it is a practically perfect telling of what it was like.

Today, alcohol's marketshare in the creative stimulants game has been lost to marijuana, shrooms, etc. Basically everyone there smokes weed as often as Don Draper drank...especially during the workday. It was surreal.

Anywho, everyone, Mad Men is awesome once you commit to it.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Not many things are as pointless as arguing about subjective things like this on an Internet message board. With that said, allowing me to take extreme exception to you saying that nothing is close to as good as Breaking Bad. For me, BB is firmly in third place behind The Wire and The Sopranos. Also, although it is a very different show, Seinfeld is in the same ballpark.


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I agree with almost all of this, except that on rewatch The Wire actally dropped from #1 to #2 or maybe #3. At its peaks it is just incredible, but season 5 with the whole serial killer thing was bad on the second viewing. And season 2 was actually better than I remembered but as part of the series it seems like an oddity since it was the only season that was really separate, plot-wise. Fwiw, I also love Mad Men and it is probably #4 for me. Comedies as a genre need to be considered separately, IMO, but Seinfeld is unquestionably the king and it's cousin Curb is second. Then everything else.

 

[Kaneyoufeelit]

One of my best friend's girlfriend has a brother who is a copywriter at a major ad firm. I was hanging out in his office with him and asked him about Mad Men. He said the oldest members of the firm, who were in the business during the time of Mad Men, said it is a practically perfect telling of what it was like.

Today, alcohol's marketshare in the creative stimulants game has been lost to marijuana, shrooms, etc. Basically everyone there smokes weed as often as Don Draper drank...especially during the workday. It was surreal.

Anywho, everyone, Mad Men is awesome once you commit to it.

Very much agree. I need to find a way to watch the first half of season 7 before the spring

 

[Andy in Sactown]

I agree with almost all of this, except that on rewatch The Wire actally dropped from #1 to #2 or maybe #3. At its peaks it is just incredible, but season 5 with the whole serial killer thing was bad on the second viewing. And season 2 was actually better than I remembered but as part of the series it seems like an oddity since it was the only season that was really separate, plot-wise. Fwiw, I also love Mad Men and it is probably #4 for me. Comedies as a genre need to be considered separately, IMO, but Seinfeld is unquestionably the king and it's cousin Curb is second. Then everything else.

Love Larry David. Arrested Development came to mind as well.

 

[tussin]

I totally understand that I can't get a good grasp of what the show was about. However, the show had done a terrible job of making the characters interesting. For example, at the end of the second episode, January Jones' character was in that car wreck and I didn't care what happened do Her. My wife and I didn't even want to see if she was ok in episode 3. I'm sure it got better after that, I just didn't feel hooked.

It's funny because, after watching Mad Men for seven seasons, I care more about what happens to those characters than any show I've ever watched. I'm way (WAY) more invested in the end game for Don, Peggy, Pete, Roger, Joan, and Sally then I was for any character in Breaking Bad (sans Jesse).

IMO, Breaking Bad (which is still a top 5 show in my book) really only had two interesting characters: Jesse and to an extent Walt. Todd had potential, but was introduced too late in the show to really develop as much as the others.

 

[tussin]

Also, of all the great qualities you can list about BB, realness or believability is not one them. The plot is pretty absurd when you take a step back and look at it from a mile high perspective.