Auburn's Tainted Title

[ozzman]

Btw, that was a 7-2 So Cal team that went to the Rose Bowl that year.

7-2 rose bowl team, big deal. Look at all those ranked teams on Bama's schedule that year.

 

[ulukinatme]

I think theres one thing we can agree on....Michigan holds the mostest titles at 457 as they count each and every poll as a separate championship going back to the 1800s. They also add one for every time one of their grandmas said "You're the best, sweetheart."

 

[GATTACA!]

In 1966, the overwhelming majority of poll voters voted against Bama due to the segregation issue. Instead of voting for the best team that year - and it really wasn't much of a debate - they voted to crown ND the national champion and Mich State second due to that one reason. That's why ND won the '66 title.

Again, if the Irish nation brings up '73 - which I feel they were the champions that year - then you can't argue that the '66 title is legit based on why the voters voted the way they did.

Time to move on from this one.

:banghead2

 

[IrishLion]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en data-scribe-reduced-action-queue="><p>Go on and claim 2 of those 3 titles, Auburn: <a href="http://t.co/WUk70xctsd">http://t.co/WUk70xctsd</a> And Notre Dame ain't cut out for the SEC: <a href="http://t.co/0E5Pue1acA">pic.twitter.com/0E5Pue1acA</a></p>— SB Nation CFB (@SBNationCFB) <a href="https://twitter.com/SBNationCFB/statuses/429297781811843072">January 31, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[johnnycando]

Don't think so. ND and MSU started 1 and 2 I believe and finished unbeaten till they played each other. I am sure the voters would have loved for one of them to win their game outright but when that didn't happen, it lead to many in the national media to vote against Bama due to the civil rights movement and segregation. If, at the end of the day, that brought about the change for the good then I am perfectly fine with it.

I mean I'm sure Bear would have beaten a Parseghian team.


Bwahahaha.

 

[palinurus]

I know you are joking, but just to provide a little more context: USC started 6-0 in 1966, got up to #5 in the AP poll, before tailing off with late loses to good teams -- Miam UCLA ND and Purdue. But when ND beat them 51-0, they were still considered pretty good, so it probably helped ND in the final AP ranking.

 

[Rocket 94]

In 1966, the overwhelming majority of poll voters voted against Bama due to the segregation issue. Instead of voting for the best team that year - and it really wasn't much of a debate - they voted to crown ND the national champion and Mich State second due to that one reason. That's why ND won the '66 title.

Again, if the Irish nation brings up '73 - which I feel they were the champions that year - then you can't argue that the '66 title is legit based on why the voters voted the way they did.

Time to move on from this one.

The 1966 ND team was one of the best of all time. They allowed 38 points the whole season and was their best defensive team ever. Alabama had a fine team as well but to say they were better than ND in 1966 is just wrong.

How can Alabama claims writers were against them when they won the title in 1965 and 64 as well? Does not make any sense.

 

[ACamp1900]

And it's ironic that Irish fans would debate the '73 title but want to forget '66. Seems it is more talking out of both sides of the mouth.

ND finished atop most polls both seasons... end. point.

 

[woolybug25]

The 1966 ND team was one of the best of all time. They allowed 38 points the whole season and was their best defensive team ever. Alabama had a fine team as well but to say they were better than ND in 1966 is just wrong.

How can Alabama claims writers were against them when they won the title in 1965 and 64 as well? Does not make any sense.

What's even funnier is that they feel like the writers were against them.... for being blatanly rascist. The same school that had to have federal intervention in order to simply admit black students three years prior.

I've always been intrigued by this... their team is filled with a majority of black (mostly southern) young men. I find it strange that not one of them remembers learning about Gov Wallace's showdown with Kennedy about integration. The school stood almost as a symbol of southern resistence to integration in schools. Now... young black men flock to the program. The same program that didn't accept their first black player until 1971.

 

[ACamp1900]

Again, 66 in Bama's case has many more similarities to ND's case in 93... ND had Bowden not having won a title held against them... but here is the thing, ND has a GREAT case for a title that year... but still doesn't claim it, because they didn't get the polls... and they sure as hell don’t write indigent books about it while claiming other titles that aren’t their either.

 

[palinurus]

Don't want to pick on Bama only, though; segregation was a fact at many many southern schools at the time. (I know you know this and are making a separate point.) But worth noting that ND didn't get its first black player until the 1952. Interesting read on this (not to hijack).

Edmonds was the first African-American to earn a monogram at Notre Dame - ESPN

A sorry part of our history, and glad we've worked through it more quickly than most other nations.

 

[johnnycando]

Typical troll job: takes a jab, rowls up the crowd, rolls out and heads the Bama forums with the link.

Something along the line,"look at these idiots."

They crown him king there...

 

[chubler]

I think it's pretty cut and dry that Bama claiming the '73 title is ludicrous. Only a single poll had them ranked #1, and they didn't take into account the fact that ND beat 'Bama because they voted beforehand, and additionally this result caused them to change when they voted. There's just not a reasonable way to contest that one.

However, if Tommy really wanted a title ND claims that's similar to '66, the '47 ND-Michigan title controversy would be a perfect case study. ND voted #1 at end of regular season, doesn't play in a bowl game. Michigan goes to the Rose Bowl and beats USC by a wider margin than ND does, Detroit sportswriters agitate for and eventually get the only re-vote in AP history, which awards the title to Michigan, even though both teams finish undefeated.

Michigan claims the title, back it up by saying they had better margins of victory against common opponents, ND claims the title, we back it up saying they ran up scores, and that no other similar controversy (such as the '66 debacle) has ever gotten a re-vote.

That is the place to argue from for Bama's case for the '66 title, if you're inclined to do so.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Typical troll job: takes a jab, rowls up the crowd, rolls out and heads the Bama forums with the link.

Something along the line,"look at these idiots."

They crown him king there...

Now cando... been pretty open minded out here since joining up. Sometimes we can agree to disagree. Never hurts having a different opinion. One can learn a lot from others when looking at their points of view... even if they are sometimes different.

 

[johnnycando]

Now cando... been pretty open minded out here since joining up. Sometimes we can agree to disagree. Never hurts having a different opinion. One can learn a lot from others when looking at their points of view... even if they are sometimes different.

So you made a point that doesn't make sense, which doesn't equate to a point, then didn't defend it.

That's not open-minded.

 

[IrishLion]

So you made a point that doesn't make sense, which doesn't equate to a point, then didn't defend it.

That's not open-minded.

I think he decided to cut his losses and simply dip out. TTown has been a good member of the board and has managed to debate everyone about everything without getting himself banhammered so far. If he has been trolling, he's doing the most masterful troll job of all time.

 

[T Town Tommy]

So you made a point that doesn't make sense, which doesn't equate to a point, then didn't defend it.

That's not open-minded.

And that's your opinion cando. And I have mine. We can agree to disagree.

 

[ACamp1900]

If he has been trolling, he's doing the most masterful troll job of all time.

... and he is from Alabama, so we can pretty much cross that possiblity off....

 

[IrishLion]

... and he is from Alabama, so we can pretty much cross that possiblity off....

He thinks Bama's 229 claimed titles are all legitimate for crying out loud!

 

[Rocket 94]

Again, 66 in Bama's case has many more similarities to ND's case in 93... ND had Bowden not having won a title held against them... but here is the thing, ND has a GREAT case for a title that year... but still doesn't claim it, because they didn't get the polls... and they sure as hell don’t write indigent books about it while claiming other titles that aren’t their either.

Only thing is Alabama had won titles in 1964 and 1965 so the comparision to Bowden getting his "title" in 1993 doesn't compute. It would be different if Alabama had never won the title prior to 1966 and the writers holding segregation against them. Writers didn't have any such conscience in 1964 or 1965 (or even 1961 for that matter).

Bottom line is ND deserved the title in 1966, they tied in East Lansing after being down 10-0 and beat USC in the last game 51-0 in the coliseum. Nobody else was going to get the title that year.

 

[anarin]

This thread made my head hurt. Time for a drink!

 

[ACamp1900]

Only thing is Alabama had won titles in 1964 and 1965 so the comparision to Bowden getting his "title" in 1993 doesn't compute. It would be different if Alabama had never won the title prior to 1966 and the writers holding segregation against them. Writers didn't have any such conscience in 1964 or 1965 (or even 1961 for that matter).

Bottom line is ND deserved the title in 1966, they tied in East Lansing after being down 10-0 and beat USC in the last game 51-0 in the coliseum. Nobody else was going to get the title that year.

Bama in 66 is not FSU in 93, for this comparsion they are ND in 93. The point is ND and Bama both came close and had arguments in 66 and 93 which makes them a better comparison for TTown's point than 66 and 73, in which BOTH YEARS ND won the title.

 

[Irish#1]

Don't think so. ND and MSU started 1 and 2 I believe and finished unbeaten till they played each other. I am sure the voters would have loved for one of them to win their game outright but when that didn't happen, it lead to many in the national media to vote against Bama due to the civil rights movement and segregation. If, at the end of the day, that brought about the change for the good then I am perfectly fine with it.

It really doesn't matter what the reason was for where they voted Bama. The fact is they weren't voted #1 in '66. If we use your logic then we should claim '93, but we don't.

 

[ACamp1900]

Hold on to your buts ladies and gents... BGIF has now been viewing the thread for 30 plus minutes...

the boom...

it shall be lowered.

 

[tussin]

Notre Dame won the Colley Matrix national championship last year. Give us another banner.

 

[Irish#1]

Bama in 66 is not FSU in 93, for this comparsion they are ND in 93. The point is ND and Bama both came close and had arguments in 66 and 93 which makes them a better comparison for TTown's point than 66 and 73, in which BOTH YEARS ND won the title.

Let's see

` 66 ` 73 ` 93 ` 93
+73 +`93 +`66 +`73
--------------------------
139 166 159 166

Did I get that right?

 

[ACamp1900]

Let's see

` 66 73 93 93
+73 +93 +66 +73
--------------------------
139 166 159 166

Did I get that right?

you forgot the final step

139+166+159+166=fuck alabama/

 

[palinurus]

Hold on to your buts ladies and gents... BGIF has now been viewing the thread for 30 plus minutes...

the boom...

it shall be lowered.

Nobody asked me, but there's no cause here for disciplinary action, imo. It just restricts/chills dialogue, and it's better to shine light on arguments than restrict them.

 

[ACamp1900]

Nobody asked me, but there's no cause here for disciplinary action, imo. It just restricts/chills dialogue, and it's better to shine light on arguments than restrict them.

Ha, I meant usually when BGIF does that he is putting together a long retort... not that anyone would get hit by mods.

 

[palinurus]

Ha, I meant usually when BGIF does that he is putting together a long retort... not that anyone would get hit by mods.

Well, I was just trying to pre-emptively protect you!