2020-21 NFL Season

Rogue219

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Big Ben has officially hung it up.

4466956_web1_ptr-PickettWeb-103121.jpg


Yinz make it so.
 

ab2cmiller

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Would’ve taken some balls for the referee to call it, but that was a fumble by Mixon right before the kick. Tripped over his own player tossed down the ball. Never was touched by a Chief.
 

IrishLax

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Would’ve taken some balls for the referee to call it, but that was a fumble by Mixon right before the kick. Tripped over his own player tossed down the ball. Never was touched by a Chief.

Edit: There are basically two things in play.

1. 55 for the Chiefs and the player he jump cuts past both make some contact. Then he starts stumbling and goes down. Open to interpretation, but I don’t see how that would overturned.

2. There is a difference between what happened — play blown dead, he pops up with the ball and then throws it behind him — and a reviewable fumble. Clear recovery does not matter. Clear recovery would matter *if he was fumbling or the ball was otherwise loose before the play was blown dead*… but what happened was that he was whistled down, still had full possession, got up after the play was over, and then put the ball down. There is no way to unwind that because the ball is clearly in his possession while they are blowing the whistle and telling him that the play is over.
 
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irishog77

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He’s not going to get many opportunities like that. Possibly a career killer if the Rams lose this game.

I thought the same thing watching live. I audibly groaned. On replay though, that was a really tough catch, as he had no real way of locating the ball. Of course a lot of that depends on the expectation, practice, and execution of the play. I guess point being, maybe McVay isn't that upset with him.

But speaking of dropped passes. Jaquiski Tartt. Oh my, poor guy.
 

BrownerandFry

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I just bought 2 nosebleed 50 yard line tickets for the Rams vs Niners when they first became Available. $1800!!!! Prices are out of control
Well, first it was a voluntary choice. You made it. Live with it.

Second, it is Econ 101, The "appropriate" price is what the market says it is.

Putin also thinks prices are out of control.

'Merica, Dude. Free market. Houses, game tickets, Bitcoins.
 

Rogue219

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We put together a list of the GOAT by position last night at our Super Bowl party. Those who composed the roster were all in their forties. I think it holds up minus maybe not having Jim Brown and Alan Page on the list. None of us were really old enough to see him play.

QB Tom Brady
RB Walter Payton
RB Barry Sanders
WR Jerry Rice
WR Randy Moss
TE Tony Gonzalez
OT Anthony Munoz
OT Willie Roaf
OG Bruce Matthews
OG Randall McDaniel
C Dermontti Dawson

DE Reggie White
DE Bruce Smith
DT Aaron Donald
DT John Randle
ILB Ray Lewis
ILB Mike Singletary
OLB Lawrence Taylor
OLB Derrick Brooks
CB Rod Woodson
CB Deion Sanders
S Ronnie Lott
S Ed Reed
K Morten Andersen
P Shane Lechler
KR/PR Devin Hester
 

NorthDakota

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We put together a list of the GOAT by position last night at our Super Bowl party. Those who composed the roster were all in their forties. I think it holds up minus maybe not having Jim Brown and Alan Page on the list. None of us were really old enough to see him play.

QB Tom Brady
RB Walter Payton
RB Barry Sanders
WR Jerry Rice
WR Randy Moss
TE Tony Gonzalez
OT Anthony Munoz
OT Willie Roaf
OG Bruce Matthews
OG Randall McDaniel
C Dermontti Dawson

DE Reggie White
DE Bruce Smith
DT Aaron Donald
DT John Randle
ILB Ray Lewis
ILB Mike Singletary
OLB Lawrence Taylor
OLB Derrick Brooks
CB Rod Woodson
CB Deion Sanders
S Ronnie Lott
S Ed Reed
K Morten Andersen
P Shane Lechler
KR/PR Devin Hester
Tell me you and your friends were born in the 70's without telling me you and your friends are born in the 70's.
 

Irish#1

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We put together a list of the GOAT by position last night at our Super Bowl party. Those who composed the roster were all in their forties. I think it holds up minus maybe not having Jim Brown and Alan Page on the list. None of us were really old enough to see him play.

QB Tom Brady
RB Walter Payton - Gayle Sayers
RB Barry Sanders - Jim Brown
WR Jerry Rice
WR Randy Moss - Larry Fitzgerald
TE Tony Gonzalez - John Mackey
OT Anthony Munoz
OT Willie Roaf - Orlando Pace, Forrest Greg, Jackie Slater
OG Bruce Matthews
OG Randall McDaniel - Larry Allen
C Dermontti Dawson - Jim Otto, Dwight Stephenson, Mike Webster

DE Reggie White
DE Bruce Smith
DT Aaron Donald
DT John Randle - Bob Lily, Randy White, Joe Green
ILB Ray Lewis
ILB Mike Singletary - Dick Butkus, Ray Nitchske, Jack Lambert, Willie Lanier, Nick Buoniconti
OLB Lawrence Taylor
OLB Derrick Brooks
CB Rod Woodson
CB Deion Sanders - Darrel Green,, Everson Walls, Lester Hayes
S Ronnie Lott
S Ed Reed - Willie Wood, Jack Tatum
K Morten Andersen
P Shane Lechler - Ray Guy, Pat McAfee
KR/PR Devin Hester
Good list. I guess it depends on what the criteria is, but I threw some names on there that are on par IMO.
 

ulukinatme

Pyne for QB 2022!
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Tom Brady is the Matt Leinart of the NFL, he's always looked superb because he's surrounded by superb talent. He's only played on teams with great defenses and he's had pretty damn good weapons to throw to. I'm NOT saying he's not good in his own right, but it's hard to say he's the best ever when he's always been setup to succeed. Put him in Cleveland and he's another footnote. He's played in an era where the QB is more protected than any previous era, he even had a rule that originated from his play. I'd put him in a Top 5 for sure, but if the game is on the line there's a few others I might put in first...but it would be a short list.
 

Some Irish Bloke

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Tom Brady is the Matt Leinart of the NFL, he's always looked superb because he's surrounded by superb talent. He's only played on teams with great defenses and he's had pretty damn good weapons to throw to. I'm NOT saying he's not good in his own right, but it's hard to say he's the best ever when he's always been setup to succeed. Put him in Cleveland and he's another footnote. He's played in an era where the QB is more protected than any previous era, he even had a rule that originated from his play.
I totally get this sentiment, man. However, the dude just wins, period.

Rodgers has had great defenses and great weapons, Peyton has had great defenses and great weapons, Russell Wilson had the no-fly zone for God's sake...these guys combined don't have as many rings as Brady has on one hand. Just an example. I'm not a huge fan of Brady, but it's hard to deny. No one has ever done what he has.
 

ulukinatme

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I totally get this sentiment, man. However, the dude just wins, period.

Rodgers has had great defenses and great weapons, Peyton has had great defenses and great weapons, Russell Wilson had the no-fly zone for God's sake...these guys combined don't have as many rings as Brady has on one hand. Just an example. I'm not a huge fan of Brady, but it's hard to deny. No one has ever done what he has.
I'm just sayin'....put him in during the 70s and 80s with Montana and I don't think he survives. Rodgers may disagree with you on a number of his defenses too.
 

Irish#1

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I totally get this sentiment, man. However, the dude just wins, period.

Rodgers has had great defenses and great weapons, Peyton has had great defenses and great weapons, Russell Wilson had the no-fly zone for God's sake...these guys combined don't have as many rings as Brady has on one hand. Just an example. I'm not a huge fan of Brady, but it's hard to deny. No one has ever done what he has.
What? The year they won the SB they did, but that was it. Even with Brady's record, I'll take Montana to win the game in the last two minutes.
 

Rogue219

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I take my personal bias about him out of the equation and there is no agenda left. Best to play the position, ever. Playing QB on teams that had top ten defenses doesn't discredit your offensive accomplishments. That's not how football works. It's complimentary. Anyone making an argument that Brady was surrounded by great talent and then in the same breath says "I'll take Joe Montana instead." Well, okay then.

I'm guessing if you took most sixth round draft picks and put them on Cleveland they'd also be footnotes. Most sixth round draft picks aren't even footnotes everywhere. Does Joe Montana become a legend in Detroit? Kind of a weird argument to be made, but I get it. I never cheered for the guy for a single down of his football career, but I see past my fandom here.
 

Some Irish Bloke

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I'm just sayin'....put him in during the 70s and 80s with Montana and I don't think he survives. Rodgers may disagree with you on a number of his defenses too.
They had a top 5 defense in 2011 when they won it and they maintained majority of that core the next couple of years.

This past year he had a top 10 unit that held SF to 6 offensive points. The defense wasn't issue in that game, the ST and, largely, the offense was.
 

Blazers46

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I totally get this sentiment, man. However, the dude just wins, period.

Rodgers has had great defenses and great weapons, Peyton has had great defenses and great weapons, Russell Wilson had the no-fly zone for God's sake...these guys combined don't have as many rings as Brady has on one hand. Just an example. I'm not a huge fan of Brady, but it's hard to deny. No one has ever done what he has.

Brady has had more top 10 defenses than Manning, Brees, and Rodgers combined and by a lot. IN Brady's long career he has had 2-3 years without one. Wilson is nowhere near GOAT status.
 

Blazers46

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They had a top 5 defense in 2011 when they won it and they maintained majority of that core the next couple of years.

This past year he had a top 10 unit that held SF to 6 offensive points. The defense wasn't issue in that game, the ST and, largely, the offense was.

A top 10 defense does not guarantee a SB. It helps a ton. If all you need is a great QB and a top 10 Defense Tom Brady has 18 rings. Give Brees or Manning a top 10 defense 90% of their seasons they have just as many, if not more, rings.
 

ulukinatme

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A top 10 defense does not guarantee a SB. It helps a ton. If all you need is a great QB and a top 10 Defense Tom Brady has 18 rings. Give Brees or Manning a top 10 defense 90% of their seasons they have just as many, if not more, rings.
I had to look it up just now, but it looks like in Brady's 22+ years as a pro there's only been two times his team didn't have a Top 10 defense, 2005 (Pittsburgh SB Champs) and 2011 (Green Bay SB Champs). The other years he often had a Top 5 or even Top defense backing him up. That's an impressive run that any QB would benefit greatly from. During that same period of time since 2000 the Packers have only had a Top 10 defense 5 times. More often than not the Packers' defense has been middle of the road or often in the bottom half. I didn't go back and look at the Colts or New Orleans defenses during that time, but I doubt they come close to what Brady has had in that stretch.

Again, not saying Brady is bad by any means. I'd still put him in my Top 5. It's hard for me to call him the GOAT when he's had every advantage and plays in a very QB friendly era.
 

Blazers46

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I had to look it up just now, but it looks like in Brady's 22+ years as a pro there's only been two times his team didn't have a Top 10 defense, 2005 (Pittsburgh SB Champs) and 2011 (Green Bay SB Champs). The other years he often had a Top 5 or even Top defense backing him up. That's an impressive run that any QB would benefit greatly from. During that same period of time since 2000 the Packers have only had a Top 10 defense 5 times. More often than not the Packers' defense has been middle of the road or often in the bottom half. I didn't go back and look at the Colts or New Orleans defenses during that time, but I doubt they come close to what Brady has had in that stretch.

Again, not saying Brady is bad by any means. I'd still put him in my Top 5. It's hard for me to call him the GOAT when he's had every advantage and plays in a very QB friendly era.

Brees had maybe 4-5 and Manning had a few with Indy and 2-3 with Denver.
 

Blazers46

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I had to look it up just now, but it looks like in Brady's 22+ years as a pro there's only been two times his team didn't have a Top 10 defense, 2005 (Pittsburgh SB Champs) and 2011 (Green Bay SB Champs). The other years he often had a Top 5 or even Top defense backing him up. That's an impressive run that any QB would benefit greatly from. During that same period of time since 2000 the Packers have only had a Top 10 defense 5 times. More often than not the Packers' defense has been middle of the road or often in the bottom half. I didn't go back and look at the Colts or New Orleans defenses during that time, but I doubt they come close to what Brady has had in that stretch.

Again, not saying Brady is bad by any means. I'd still put him in my Top 5. It's hard for me to call him the GOAT when he's had every advantage and plays in a very QB friendly era.
I did find in my anti-Brady research (lol) that only two teams won without a top10 defense since Brady came into the league. The Giants one year but their Defense was great late and the Saints when they played the Colts.
 

Rogue219

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Does New England win all of those Super Bowls with Drew Bledsoe? He retired in 2006. I don't think they come close with Damon Huard or Matt Cassell, that much is for damn sure.

Do they do it with Peyton Manning or Big Ben? I think so. Probably, yeah.

Brady's offensive accomplishments are what they are no matter how the defenses of those New England teams ranked. I am trying to think of which skill people he played with other than Randy Moss and Gronkowski will go to the Hall of Fame, and he had Moss for three years.
 
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