2016 Presidential Horse Race

[phgreek]

Snapshot from the streets of Philly outside of the DNC

Is it bad I couldn't find the "punchline" part of the picture on first pass? Is it bad that even then, events and her attitude make it...fit?

I did laugh, but I'm worried.

 

[woolybug25]

I don't personally care.

I do, however, think there is a chunk of Independent voters out there who think that portions of the media are much tougher on the GOP than on the Dems (the Clinton email leaks are helping this), and immediately dismiss a left-leaning liberal going on a political rant. Even if it's just for comedic purposes, it can be seen as more "proof" that the media is stacking the deck for Hillary.

Trump's numbers noticeably went up after Oliver's Drumpf rant. I don't think that was a coincidence.

You honestly think his numbers went up after Oliver's segment? Those two things are not remotely connected, imo.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Not looking to excuse ignorance of international affairs, but you'd have found a similarly insular focus on domestic issues in previous empires. Just comes with the territory of being the global hegemon. Imperial citizens don't care much about what's happening in the provinces.

The disappearance of objective journalism is a product of our increasing political polarization. Since there's no such thing as a view from nowhere, the only way journalism can appear unbiased is if it comes from "the middle"-- that common ground shared by all citizens. The American middle has not held, so there's no more objective journalism.

People in power utilizing mass media to dumb down a society, thus making it easier to stay in power and control them. Instead of journos holding those in power accountable and bringing real, educational news to the table, we're seeing them in cahoots with said powers that be, working for them to further their agenda (just so they can keep their source). That's how I see it anyways.

 

[phgreek]

Why isn't he being beaten up over his brother not being an American and thus not voting? Doesn't Trump know his statement is inaccurate! Doesn't he know non-Americans don't get to vote in our election! How is this not front page news!

...Wellll, not exactly, they are represented with fake SSNs, dead people, and the like.

Still funny as hell even if technically incorrect. Barry's bro kicked him in the nuts. I thought it was hilarious...which means soon Buster will be out with a Snopes deal telling me it was made up...oh well.

 

[connor_in]

WHAT bias!? ’60 Minutes’ didn’t think this clip of Hillary’s #DNCleak email denial was worth airing – twitchy.com

 

[Buster Bluth]

Kerry: Air conditioners as big a threat as ISIS | Fox News

That headline reflects the state of journalism in this country.

But regardless, is global warming a larger existential threat to our nation and way of life? Absolutely. Are you four times more likely to die from a furniture mishap than a terrorist attack? I believe so.

 

[irishfan]

You honestly think his numbers went up after Oliver's segment? Those two things are not remotely connected, imo.

IMO there are an awful lot of things the left has done this political season that have riled up the 30% of the country that would vote Dem no matter what while serving to annoy the rest of the country. Protests or the left trying early on trying to push the Hitler narrative are probably the best example, but I think the media reference I made earlier is true for a lot of people. The Drumpf segment itself might not have have been a cause for his numbers going up (although they did go up right after), but I think the portions of the media that are left-leaning have done more to help Trump than hurt him.

To add on to this, the worst thing that the left did was try and portray every single Trump supporter as a dumb redneck early on. Not only did it make every Trump supporter instantly more engaged, but it made anyone who agreed with any of Trump's policies (and I know he doesn't say any specifics at all) question the media. I agree with Trump regarding the TPP, NATO, illegal immigration, and trade deals in general. I have a bachelor's and a master's degree (not bragging--they were both average schools, just trying to prove a point). I don't think of myself as a dumb redneck. I wasn't for Trump early on by any means, but I still always preferred him over Hillary, and the "dumb redneck" portrayal early on made me much more suspicious of the media than I had been before. And I know that that's true of many other Republicans-turned-Trump voters.

 

[phgreek]

Bernie was just booed by his supporters when he said "we must elect Hillary Clinton"....too funny.

The response was Luke warm to his statement regarding defeating Donald Trump.

Keeps trying to say it in different ways...same thing.

Everything else he said, the place roared...

 

[wizards8507]

https://medium.com/@WorldOfStu/bail...oth-trump-and-hillary-63c9d42f5cf2#.x010a5f5f

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">RT <a href="https://twitter.com/sarafeed">@sarafeed</a>: The election bailout plan to save us from Trump &amp; Hillary: <a href="https://t.co/pNToQoES4Y">https://t.co/pNToQoES4Y</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/bailout2016?src=hash">#bailout2016</a> <a href="https://t.co/WyQo94iMdb">pic.twitter.com/WyQo94iMdb</a></p>— STU BURGUIERE (@WorldOfStu) <a href="https://twitter.com/WorldOfStu/status/757625284858372096">July 25, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[NorthDakota]

This fall is going to be a lot of fun. The media was going to have trouble attacking Donald no matter what, now it's going to basically be impossible.

I don't have cable so I won't get bombed with ads and ND is red so the radio won't have much going on, we basically already chose our governor and our rep and senator up for reelection are shoe ins so the radio shouldn't be too bad either.

Tough to get tired of it when I get to choose if I'm listening/watching.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

People in power utilizing mass media to dumb down a society, thus making it easier to stay in power and control them. Instead of journos holding those in power accountable and bringing real, educational news to the table, we're seeing them in cahoots with said powers that be, working for them to further their agenda (just so they can keep their source). That's how I see it anyways.

When do you think the media was not used to push various elite agendas? People almost always identify the post-WWII period as the "golden age of journalism", which is not coincidentally the only period in our history that featured a consolidating culture, strong upward mobility, and relatively low economic inequality.

Those factors produced something like a true American consensus on a whole host of issues, which is what allowed for an apparently objective media; as long as the news was reported according to that consensus, it seemed fair and balanced. The American consensus no longer exists, so neither does objective journalism.

 

[IrishLax]

Man... absolutely massive protests in Philly. Cut to one very articulate Bernie supporter who said:
1. Doesn't care who Bernie endorsed because Bernie also said to vote their conscience... and in good conscience, can't vote for either candidate.
2. That the Democrats are still trying to say how unified they are relative to Republicans and that it's obviously a lie whether or not the media wants to report on it.
3. It's not about Bernie, it's about people and the message and they're going to keep pushing forward.

Don't disagree with a thing he said.

 

[phgreek]

Man... absolutely massive protests in Philly. Cut to one very articulate Bernie supporter who said:
1. Doesn't care who Bernie endorsed because Bernie also said to vote their conscience... and in good conscience, can't vote for either candidate.
2. That the Democrats are still trying to say how unified they are relative to Republicans and that it's obviously a lie whether or not the media wants to report on it.
3. It's not about Bernie, it's about people and the message and they're going to keep pushing forward.

Don't disagree with a thing he said.

My kids had his speech on the TV in the other room...and based on responses to Bernie, they were blowing up when he recounted the policy/platform changes they brought with their movement. They blew up when he talked about DWS leaving. They did not really say much when he said, in multiple ways, they had to beat Trump...it was luke warm at best. They Booed when he said they had to support Hillary. So what I heard seems to coincide with what that guy they interviewed had to say.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Probably not a coincidence that populism comes roaring back right as social media takes off.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Clinton - Washington Wire - WSJ

This is rich.

 

[phgreek]

Clinton Foundation Corruption Should Be Next for the FBI | Observer

Don't know the source very well so posting here as the basis for my question

... is all of this shit really going on? I know there is a referral from congress to FBI,IRS,FTC to investigate the Clinton foundation...but I didn't know a bunch of politicians were in hot water.

 

[gkIrish]

https://medium.com/@WorldOfStu/bail...oth-trump-and-hillary-63c9d42f5cf2#.x010a5f5f

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">RT <a href="https://twitter.com/sarafeed">@sarafeed</a>: The election bailout plan to save us from Trump &amp; Hillary: <a href="https://t.co/pNToQoES4Y">https://t.co/pNToQoES4Y</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/bailout2016?src=hash">#bailout2016</a> <a href="https://t.co/WyQo94iMdb">pic.twitter.com/WyQo94iMdb</a></p>— STU BURGUIERE (@WorldOfStu) <a href="https://twitter.com/WorldOfStu/status/757625284858372096">July 25, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I like it. The problem is will the House actually vote for the 3rd party guy as opposed to Hillary. Almost all the Republicans would have to vote for 3rd guy.

 

[Bishop2b5]

"Seeking to avoid a televised display of disunity, Bernie Sanders on Monday urged supporters to line up behind Democrat Hillary Clinton." - AP

Well, I mean as long as Bernie doesn't sell out...

 

[BleedBlueGold]

"Seeking to avoid a televised display of disunity, Bernie Sanders on Monday urged supporters to line up behind Democrat Hillary Clinton." - AP

Well, I mean as long as Bernie doesn't sell out...

Lesser of two evils --> Bernie hates Trump.

Also, the Dems are agreeing to change their platform to become more progressive. If Bernie didn't back their candidate, then a lot of his work in the primaries could be undone. Imo, he's just toeing the party line in order to continue his message and his agenda.

 

[irishfan]

My kids had his speech on the TV in the other room...and based on responses to Bernie, they were blowing up when he recounted the policy/platform changes they brought with their movement. They blew up when he talked about DWS leaving. They did not really say much when he said, in multiple ways, they had to beat Trump...it was luke warm at best. They Booed when he said they had to support Hillary. So what I heard seems to coincide with what that guy they interviewed had to say.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Bernie Sanders: We have to defeat Donald Trump and we have to elect Clinton and Kaine <a href="https://t.co/aezIyyZAOE">https://t.co/aezIyyZAOE</a> <a href="https://t.co/55ckVZaVnw">https://t.co/55ckVZaVnw</a></p>— CNN Politics (@CNNPolitics) <a href="https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/757630045322084356">July 25, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Here is that portion.

 

[Wild Bill]

Lesser of two evils --> Bernie hates Trump.

Also, the Dems are agreeing to change their platform to become more progressive. If Bernie didn't back their candidate, then a lot of his work in the primaries could be undone. Imo, he's just toeing the party line in order to continue his message and his agenda.

Hillary is more concerned with winning votes than the platform. I think she has to move to the center to take the rust belt swing states and that's what I expect her to do on issues like the environment, immigration, and safety both domestic and foreign.

 

[wizards8507]

Hillary is more concerned with winning votes than the platform. I think she has to move to the center to take the rust belt swing states and that's what I expect her to do on issues like the environment, immigration, and safety both domestic and foreign.

It's also important to note that Hillary is not a true believer in progressive policies. She uses all the leftist lines about global warming, racist cops, and the rich "paying their fair share," but she doesn't believe those things. She'll not just move to the center for the election, but she'll likely govern that way as well.

 

[gkIrish]

Is it too early to add a poll to this thread? I was thinking of the following options:

1) Hillary Clinton
2) Donald Trump
3) Gary Johnson
4) Other 3rd Party Candidate
5) Not Voting/Abstaining
6) Undecided

I was also thinking of making it a public vote. If someone isn't comfortable with their vote being public they can just not vote...

We can do a new poll a week or 2 away from the election but I am curious where things stand right now.

 

[gkIrish]

Is it too early to add a poll to this thread? I was thinking of the following options:

1) Hillary Clinton
2) Donald Trump
3) Gary Johnson
4) Other 3rd Party Candidate
5) Not Voting/Abstaining
6) Undecided

I was also thinking of making it a public vote. If someone isn't comfortable with their vote being public they can just not vote...

We can do a new poll a week or 2 away from the election but I am curious where things stand right now.

Alternatively I can take the "Undecided" Option away and just make the vote about what you would do if the election were today.

 

[wizards8507]

Is it too early to add a poll to this thread? I was thinking of the following options:

1) Hillary Clinton
2) Donald Trump
3) Gary Johnson
4) Other 3rd Party Candidate
5) Not Voting/Abstaining
6) Undecided

I was also thinking of making it a public vote. If someone isn't comfortable with their vote being public they can just not vote...

We can do a new poll a week or 2 away from the election but I am curious where things stand right now.

Add Jill Stein, Green Party. A lot of Bernie people like her.

Might also be interesting to let people change their vote if the poll tool allows that.

 

[Bishop2b5]

The problem is that there is no viable 3rd party option at this point. Like it or not, it's going to be Trump or Hillary. A vote for anyone else may be a nice protest vote, but will simply help Chewbacca or Darth.

 

[IrishLax]

The problem is that there is no viable 3rd party option at this point. Like it or not, it's going to be Trump or Hillary. A vote for anyone else may be a nice protest vote, but will simply help Chewbacca or Darth.

This all gets very voter's paradoxy though because your individual vote doesn't matter, at all. If it mattered... as in, there was any chance that your individual vote could possibly impact the result of the election... then there would be a logical case for making a binary pick.

But as it stands there's no reason not to 3rd party protest vote, which is why I'll be doing just that and won't have to live with the shame of supporting either of these candidates.

 

[gkIrish]

This all gets very voter's paradoxy though because your individual vote doesn't matter, at all. If it mattered... as in, there was any chance that your individual vote could possibly impact the result of the election... then there would be a logical case for making a binary pick.

But as it stands there's no reason not to 3rd party protest vote, which is why I'll be doing just that and won't have to live with the shame of supporting either of these candidates.

My vote arguably matters (Ohio) but as of today I am going to submit an abstain ballot. I can't vote for either of these people in good conscience.

 

[IrishLax]

My vote arguably matters (Ohio) but as of today I am going to submit an abstain ballot. I can't vote for either of these people in good conscience.

But even in a battleground state, voter's paradox says that due to the sheer number of voters your single vote can't possibly have an effect on the outcome.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Serious question, not trying to sound like a dickhead:

Has anyone ever felt their vote truly mattered in an election? I've never voted, but also have only lived in Illinois, Arizona, and Indiana, where your vote TRULY doesn't matter.