Irish Insanity
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Any shot we can pull Kiffin from Bama to HC?
Who do you want to replace Brian Kelly?
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NDRock
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That may be the only thing that makes me quit being a fan of ND.
phgreek
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Me too...
...All the big names that folks want...THEY AREN'T COMING TO COACH AT ND! This program was fortunate to get Kelly while he was trending...ie he was a credible hire outside the big names who showed he could build a winning program...
Brian Kelly is a smart guy. So is Brian VanGorder. I presume they sought to do something to make ND's defense effective...and it was effective when he had talent...but he showed no ability to develop the next tier of talent or keep a steady flow of difference makers...and that was his undoing. BVG clearly belongs in the NFL, where someone hands you talent that is largely developed.
Brian Kelly is still the guy. He has a brand, and it works on the recruiting trail...you know if you come play in Brian Kelly's offense, you will be utilized well, and developed so long as you hold up your end.
He needs a DC that has an identity, can develop talent, recruit / sell his program...
The question is...how far will Notre Dame allow him to go to live down his VanGorder mistake, and their generational mistakes...because you have to ask yourself why...coach, after coach, after coach, struggles to get a D Coordinator at ND. Time to stop fucking around.
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NDgradstudent
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It's year seven and we just suffered our most humiliating defeat in two decades. ND fans really do have battered spouse syndrome. As long as that's the case, it's the Scrubbing Bubbles bowl for us.
stlnd01
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I realize he wore out his welcome eventually, but Diaco was pretty good.
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Then why is Notre Dame rated in the top 10 most desirable jobs by every single poll of coaches, etc. done in recent memory?
I truly don't understand where the idea comes from that no one would be interested in this job and we can't get a top 10 coach when there is mountains of evidence that people want the job. Since Charlie Weis proved you can recruit here and Kelly got to a championship game and the admin has taken steps forward in compensation, this is about as good of a job as it gets in CFB... with a few exceptions.
Every year there are shocking coaching moves, you can't predict who will and who won't answer the phone when you call. You can't predict who is unhappy with their administration or is looking for something new. If you know Kelly can't get it done (which we don't) and you settle with him for fear of the unknown, that is how you end up with a failure of a program.
I think your floor getting a new coach is Dan Mullen. And every year or two there is going to be an ascendant coach in the AAC or MAC who might be the right guy, like Urban was at MWC Utah or Patterson at MWC TCU. You just have to be looking a ready to pull the trigger, not afraid that PJ Fleck or whoever is going to be worse than mediocrity.
phgreek
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...Yes Brian Kelly and Charlie Weis showed you can recruit at ND...But it is a tougher gig than the big name guys already have...so yea, up and comer or an over-achiever from a middlin big 5 team is what you can get right now. To be clear, Les Miles isn't coming, Cackies isn't coming to ND, Shaw isn't coming to ND, Urban isn't coming to ND, Saban isn't coming to ND, Dantonio isn't coming to ND, Stoops isn't coming to ND, Herman is not coming to ND. I don't think Kelly has reached a point where a gamble is required here...so if you can't replace him with a PROVEN better coach...IMHO a gamble on some small school or mid level over achiever is worth it.
I don't think Brian Kelly has run out his clock just yet...
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It's not tougher than TCU, Washington, Houston, etc. It's not. There is no evidence to support that it is. There is no evidence to support that those jobs are more desirable, and they don't pay as well. Just because Tom Herman is successful at Houston and might like LSU or USC more doesn't mean his current job is better. I agree Shaw, etc. are extremely unlikely but Patterson, for example, has never been offered a gig like Notre Dame. We have no clue if he'd take the job or not.
You can list the names and say "they aren't coming" but you don't know. I don't have a know, either. That's the point... we don't know until we try. Did you think Bronco Mendenhall would leave BYU for UVA? Or Gary Andersen go from Wisconsin to Oregon State? Every year there are crazy moves.
But we're at least a year away from really having this discussion in earnest, unless the wheels totally come off.
arndtjc
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Who do you want to replace Kelly and BVG?
Who do you want to replace Kelly and BVG?
Anyone in this thread who wants Bo Pelini as DC, please watch Melvin Gordon and 7-5 Wisconsin run for 500+ yards, and 70 points in the Big Ten Championship game in '12. This was a recurring theme during the Bo years, and part of the ultimate reason he was canned.
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="https://youtu.be/q8R26lY_QYc}"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="https://youtu.be/q8R26lY_QYc}" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Who do you want to replace Kelly and BVG?
Anyone in this thread who wants Bo Pelini as DC, please watch Melvin Gordon and 7-5 Wisconsin run for 500+ yards, and 70 points in the Big Ten Championship game in '12. This was a recurring theme during the Bo years, and part of the ultimate reason he was canned.
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="https://youtu.be/q8R26lY_QYc}"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="https://youtu.be/q8R26lY_QYc}" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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CrystalHead
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I agree to an extent that the clock hasn't ran out on Kelly yet but the midnight hour is quickly approaching. Jack isn't investing 400-500 million in stadium renovations to watch the current product taking the field. IMO there is some pretty serious conversations about the expectations that Jack expects in year 7. This ain't it!
NorthDakota
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Was Bo the DC in addition to HC during his years there??
Blaise
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two decades? C'mon.. I know its a fresh humiliating loss, but the snowball game against Syracuse was brutal, loss after loss in 2007, losing to northwestern two years ago.. We are good for a humiliating loss every other season.. Its in ND's DNA since Holtz left
Blaise
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I wish people would stop with this annoying Les Miles talk.. He ran one of the WORST offenses in the SEC in his tenure with mounds of talent... Jeremy Hill, Odell Beckham Jr, Jarvis Landry, Spencer Ware and that's just recent years... He can't coach offense and without the fertile recruiting grounds of Louisiana he will be a complete fail
irishff1014
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I think Les will be a head coach it just won't be here. He will do a good job at his next stop as long as he does't go to Kentucky or some wheres like that.
Wingman Ray
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I think Dantonio would come in a heartbeat if offered. MSU? Really? He has done wonders with that school but MSU? That has to be around the middle to high bottom of D1 schools to coach for. No way he wouldnt jump for more money and more prestige. Would it be allowed to happen? Not sure if Ive ever heard of a direct rival (not just same conference) coach going to the other school before.
Honestly, I dont have much faith left in BK. As I said before, he won with a team at Cinn in a bad conference that got completely destroyed the first game they played against quality competition. Sound familiar when ND played/plays great teams? Very similar to 2012.
BK recruits because ND has always recruited well. If I was a defensive recruit, ND would be really far down the ladder because ND hasnt been defensively good in years. You can point to 2012 but face it, that team had several NFL draft picks on the defense at the same time. It could have succeeded with a middle school coach calling a base 4-3 defense.
Can only hope Jack put enough scare into BK to properly motivate him. Face it, the NFL isnt calling BK anytime soon at all now so it isnt like he is some hot hand. Hopefully ND will dig deep and get a quality DC.
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And to add to this, Jack is around the program all the time. At the Gug, in the locker room, on the sidelines, etc.. He's watching the body language and comments being made. He's seeing how the team reacts to Kelly. He's taking mental notes. He has a plan and removing BVG was the first step. He'll watch to see not only how the defense responds to the firing, but the entire team. The BVG firing is giving Kelly an opportunity to save his job. Kelly doesn't have to win out, but he needs to field a competitive team that enjoys playing for Kelly. Kelly has show he can adjust. The BVG firing was a loud statement that I'm sure Kelly heard loud and clear.
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Dude, don't short Diaco. Our defense went from a wet paper bag to pretty solid to absolutely legendary in 2012. Sure we had some good players, but so do all great defenses.
Where the staff failed in that regard was recruiting in order to have continued success.
Domina Nostra
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And to be fair to them, did they have an AD at the time that could step in and say, "Hey, don't recruit kids who fit ___________ profile; its a waste of time. They don't fit in at ND."
Kelly's luck on recruiting has been terrible. He lost a cornerstone O-lineman to a freak accident, he lost two blue-chip DTs to UCLA because of a family death and weird issue; he lost a blue chip DE and a blue-chip WR because of behavior issues that probably don't require transfer at home state U.
He got academic suspensions of some key contributors that left the depth questionable, cost us a few games, and took the wind out of ND's momentum again, and again, and again.
None of this happens at any other school that is thinking in terms of NC's. Those schools lose kids, but not to these issues, and they can replace them more easily. So Kelly & co. had to readjust how they recruit, and its harder than other schools, not because of admissions per se, but because they can't afford to swing and miss. This means a lot of cross over recruiting with Stanford, who unfortunately hapeened to hire Jim Harbaugh at the same time they recruited Andrew Luck, and basically jump-started the program to very respectable levels.
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The whole talk about who won't or wouldn't come to ND is silly. Each year X amount of blue blood jobs come open and Y amount of coaches are available. At that point it becomes musical chairs. Would the average guy take the ND gig over OSU, Bama, A&M? No, BUT there are guys out there who still think fondly of Notre Dame. It would never surprise me if a Bob Stoops type became the HC. It's as much about timing as it is about $ and the perceived notion that ND's administration is overly difficult to work for.
There's lots of old, white Catholic HC's. ND does pretty good in that demo.
There's lots of old, white Catholic HC's. ND does pretty good in that demo.
K
koonja
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I want Trump to replace BK. Let's get trumped up.
Downinthebend
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One of these things is not like the other.
Rack Em
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Beau, you an old, white Catholic dude yet?
Wingman Ray
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I think BK CAN do it but he has to change some things. Will his pride allow him to? Who knows? I think a couple years ago he had swagger because of the NFL rumors. I would say I couldnt imagine a NFL team wanting him after the past couple of years so that should have knocked him down a peg or two.
That article on the new DC was good. I hope he can do something. ND has the talent. You dont have 4 star defensive players and say you have no talent. How many 4 stars does Wisconsin have? They just held MSU to 8 pts and kicked the crap out of their defense. ND has loads of talent, just piss pour coaches. It really makes me wonder because while BVG had the scheme, the position coaches do the daily molding. If these 4 star players now play like 1 and 2 stars, shouldnt just as much blame be on the position coach for daily coaching? I would think the DC is the head contractor but his sub contactors do the work. He just inspects the entire body of work.
That article on the new DC was good. I hope he can do something. ND has the talent. You dont have 4 star defensive players and say you have no talent. How many 4 stars does Wisconsin have? They just held MSU to 8 pts and kicked the crap out of their defense. ND has loads of talent, just piss pour coaches. It really makes me wonder because while BVG had the scheme, the position coaches do the daily molding. If these 4 star players now play like 1 and 2 stars, shouldnt just as much blame be on the position coach for daily coaching? I would think the DC is the head contractor but his sub contactors do the work. He just inspects the entire body of work.
CrystalHead
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Exactly! Jack is a business man first and foremost. If the money making machine of ND Football isn't producing and the alumni investors are getting anxious, I doubt he has a problem of making the tough decision in letting Kelly go. I don't think he is there yet but to reinforce your point, I believe Kelly has a clear understanding of the expectations moving forward.
NorthDakota
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Yeah lol, pretty sure A&M....is exactly the type of place ND would take a coach away from. An also-ran or never-was program.
K
koonja
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Tremendous question. Since 2012, they've only signed 5 total 4-star players, with the highest 4-star being a .93, and the lowest being a .89 (barely a 4-star).
Domina Nostra
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EXACTLY.
In recent coaching searches, Alabama, Florida, USC, Texas, Tennessee, Michigan, Penn State, and others have not gotten their first choice. They were all left publicly scrambling to some degree. But we repeat all of this nonsense over and over.
It all depends on contracts, timing, fit, and a little luck. For example Michigan and Ohio State had excellent timing in their last hires (and Alabama, who was lucky enough to be turned down by Rich Rod, accidentally did as well). between great hires, most of the blue bloods drift a bit.
ND can get a great coach, but being a small, private, Catholic school in the midwest with an epic football legacy, it has some advantages and disadvantages that other schools don't have. No need to deny that, but it cuts in two directions.
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Ndaccountant
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Sorry, but nope. Over the last few years, A&M has dumped an incredible amount of resources into their football program. They have spent their way into relevance.
New Texas A&M Football Complex [Photos] - Business Insider
BoredIrish
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It amazes me how ND fans argue out of both sides of their mouths. Would we be happy with the amount of success Wisconsin has had recently? If they lose to Michigan this week, will anyone care about Wisconsin?
The measuring stick at ND is championships. ND is not currently at a championship level, at least not on defense. In my mind, BK has one more shot to hire a top notch DC who can take this team to a championship level.
If he cant get it done, then you find another HC who possibly could take this team to the top.
Bugzly21
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Not sure if brought up, don't feel like reading back. Irish Illustrated's podcast did bring up Luke Finkle from O$U. I'm not sure Arand (sp?) from LSU will be available. Whoever goes to LSU will definitely keep him on. ND would have to top his $1.3M/yr to get him unless he doesn't like the new HC.