Who do you want to replace Brian Kelly?

ulukinatme

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My biggest gripe with BK is his body language. He looks mentally checked out before kickoff each game, and has aged worse than Bill Clinton did as president during his tenure here. Now is the time to stop being such a cantankerous sourpuss and positively light a fire. The players need to be excited to make plays, not scared to make mistakes

Well, there's a reason even the best ND coaches often don't last and end up retiring (If they're not fired). You often burn out quickly at this job. I said something similar last year, and people said "No, it's just been 6 years, normal aging." I think the last several seasons have taken their toll. There's few jobs in college football with more demands and more ridiculous expectations.

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Irish Insanity

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When you annually lose to teams like Northeestern, Duke, USF, and Tulsa I'd expect you to age hard and fast.
 

ScooterIrish

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Eighteen years as a HC prior to ND.
Three head coaching stops prior to ND.
Two Division II National Championships.
Two undefeated regular seasons.

Yeah, I'd say that's a better resume than Herman has to date.

Not saying that Herman isn't a good coach, but there are many examples of coaches who appear to be the next up and coming coaching genius only to crash and burn on a bigger stage.

Personally, I think the two DII NCs and 65 years of experiences Kelly refers to each press conference couldn't be any more overrated. His big game and effectiveness at the highest level wasn't better than Herman IMO. Of course I think Kelly has hit his ceiling and should move on so I'm probably biased.
 

Irish Insanity

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Personally, I think the two DII NCs and 65 years of experiences Kelly refers to each press conference couldn't be any more overrated. His big game and effectiveness at the highest level wasn't better than Herman IMO. Of course I think Kelly has hit his ceiling and should move on so I'm probably biased.
It's like 5 :star: athletes coming into D1 schools. Your stars mean nothing until you show you can produce the same at the next level. Or great CFB players being drafted high and not meeting expectations. I wouldn't call BK the JFF of college coaching, but he hasn't lived up to the hype.
 

BGIF

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Don't crucify me, and maybe it's been brought up before, by why is Shaw's name not thrown around? Or is it?

Shaw's been bad mouthed on this board since he took over at Stanford. The principle knock is he won with Harbaugh's players. Apparently Shaw has found a way to circumvent the NCAA's 5 years to play 4 requirement as he's still winning in his 6th season. Must be Harbaugh's players.

Shaw's winning percentage of .803 is the best of any coach at Stanford that was there for more than 3 seasons.

Sometime in 2018 he'll passs Pop Warner's 96 Most Wins for a Stanford Coach. Shaw has 71 wins now. (Shaw has won more games in a shorter span than Warner in part as his teams play 13.6 games/season where Warner's play 10.7)

His worse season at Stanford was 8-5, Kelly's typical season.

And unlike Herman and most, if not all, other prospective head coach names floated here, Shaw has demonstrated he can win with similar academic requirements to ND.

Most of Herman's player wouldn't get their resumes reviewed by ND's Admission Staff.

About a dozen and a half of Herman's 2016 Houston Roster are JUCO's and college transfers.

Who ever the head coach prospects are for ND that have to win with student athletes that have to be able to both get into ND and then Stay eligible.
 

arrowryan

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PJ Fleck? Or is he still not "seasoned" enough for the Notre Dame job yet? He's definitely an up and coming coach and he's good friends with Sanford so I could see Sanford staying if Fleck actually got the job.
 

Irish#1

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As good as the ND job is, it's not for everyone and the fact is that it's a Univerity that actually cares about education is a big turn off for many despite what most coaches say publicly.

I remember hearing maybe 5 years ago about how disadvantaged ND and Stanford are when it comes getting top talent as in Top 300 talent. It was said in most years about half of those 300 top prospect could get admitted to those schools and in some years it's as bad as only being able to get about a third of the Top 300.

So from the get go they are already at a disadvantage, then of those prospects there plenty who just aren't fits because of the systen that ND runs, because of location, culture etc. etc..

What I'm getting at is that it is significantly harder at ND because the pool of talent is vastly smaller, let alone location/weather, Alumni pressure and history.

There is a reason why Urban chose UF over ND years ago. If he won at ND like the way he did at UF and tOSU he would've been an even bigger legend but he knew that was unlikely to happen in South Bend because he knew how much harder it would be to get truly elite talent regularly because of the restrictions of actually having to recruit student athletes rather than athlete students.

I just don't see a Tom Herman coming to ND because of what I said above and even more so when huge jobs like LSU and USC could soon have an opening.

Not as true as when Meyer was being lured. Restrictions are still tough, but not as bad. BK has proven you can bring top kids in. That along with the upgrades shows other coaches that ND is serious about fielding a top team.
 

Irish#1

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If we are just talking DC with BK staying next year I say hire Todd Grantham for DC.
I just can't imagine BK getting fired after just signing a long term deal. I think BK is Jack's man and there would have to major things go wrong to fire BK. If it happens that BK does get fired I think TG as HC and Mike Sannford as OC would be a good tandem.

Turner Gill
 

BleedBlueGold

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Aranda or bust. Top available DC. Has ND connections.

Make it happen. #PrayerThread
 

wizards8507

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How much would it cost to get Bill Belichick? Half serious I guess.
It's not a matter of dollars. All it would take would be for Roger Goodell to get canned by the NFL owners and then hired as the President of the NCAA. Belichick would jump to college in about 30 seconds just to piss in Goodell's corn flakes.
 

Irish Insanity

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PJ Fleck? Or is he still not "seasoned" enough for the Notre Dame job yet? He's definitely an up and coming coach and he's good friends with Sanford so I could see Sanford staying if Fleck actually got the job.
From my understanding he's staying put for a few years
 

BGIF

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Not as true as when Meyer was being lured. Restrictions are still tough, but not as bad. BK has proven you can bring top kids in. That along with the upgrades shows other coaches that ND is serious about fielding a top team.

Not so. I've tracked grades and test scores from the Holtz era to Kelly. Willingham had a very talented recruit with an 800 SAT who starred on the field and got an ND degree in 4 years. That was the lowest I was aware of. There were a number of sub 900.

After ND's one time Prop 48 experience President Malloy put the kibosh on it happening again. Not because the student-athletes couldn't maintain eligibility and graduate but because during their freshman year they were essentially locked in study hall when not in class. They were not allowed to practice with the team nor participate is other activities. They put real meaning into the term "full-time student". Monk felt that wasn't fair to the students and that the Prop 48 students were missing out on the full ND experience that was designed to transform HS students into well rounded adults. It was also noted that the Prop 48's were pariahs among many of their classmates because of special treatment and isolation.

During the Holtz era, Lou and Cerrato clashed regularly with Admissions. In '95 Holtz tried to force two recruits passed Admissions. Admissions said NO! and although they sent in LOI's were NEVER admitted academically to ND.

Davie didn't rock the boat and challenge Admissions. Willingham was much the same. BUT both still had some recruits with low test scores/GPAs.

Weis for all his faults understood the antagonistic relationship between Holtz/Admissions and ND's curriculum. Weis met with Admissions personnel to get an better understanding of how Admissions made their determinations and what they looked for on a transcript (core courses/GPA). When his staff went into HS for recruiting they knew what core courses kids needed to get into ND (it was more than the NCAA minimum). They focused on encouraging HS underclassmen to take the ND required classes earlier in their HS years rather than wait until their senior year and try to cram them in.

I probably knew about Meyer's recruitment by ND before most. Early that fall, Urban had offered an ND grad a position on his Utah staff. The young man seriously looked into it but ended up during him down. A month or two later, the same young man got a call from Meyer noting, "I know you some concerns and weren't excited about moving to Salt Lake City. How would you like to go home ... to South Bend?" Shortly thereafter Fr Jenkins flew to Utah. In the interim, between the job offer and the ND plane landing in Utah the UF President, Urban's former boss at Utah, preempted ND's offer. Urban took the ND interview but the die was cast. Meyer knew from his history at ND that the request for a half dozen academic exceptions a year was a deal breaker before he made it. He tactfully made the demand as a facing saving reason for both sides mutually not reaching an agreement.
 

greyhammer90

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Dumb question but who is the "young" up and comer DC out there? Most of the D coordinators I'm seeing recommended here are fairly experienced guys. Who is the "Sanford of DCs" right now? A young guy who isn't ready to be a head coach but is putting together great defenses for his lower-tier team.
 

IrishLax

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Discussion is a bit premature as you have to assume Kelly keeps his job at least another year.

Then, looking ahead another season, keep an eye on Chip Kelly. He's going to be through year two of four in San Francisco and if he tanks two years in a row he's not keeping that job AND he's not staying in the NFL, as much as he hates CFB. Expect him to basically pull a Saban.
 

ACamp1900

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Would ND even consider CK? I kind of doubt it
 

Meatloaf

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Would ND even consider CK? I kind of doubt it

Think Chip would be a horrible fit, honestly. Doesn't like recruiting and from his days in Philly I can tell you he was so uncomfortable having a media spotlight shined on him. He's a he'll of a cfb coach so it could work, but I also think there's a high chance the whole thing could end up being a total shitshow.
 

IrishLax

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Would ND even consider CK? I kind of doubt it

Why? Recruiting violations?

I mean... all of us realize ND is still going to get hit with Frozen Five violations of some sort... so maybe ND doesn't want to bring in a guy with blemishes... but who knows. I don't think he's a probable coach, but I do think he's coaching somewhere in CFB by 2018.
 

IrishBroker

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Wanna win now?

Bring in either Art Briles or Tom Herman.

That's it. Do it.

Just win, baby.
 

greyhammer90

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Wanna win now?

Bring in either Art Briles or Tom Herman.

That's it. Do it.

Just win, baby.

Absolutely not. Just no. The optics would be beyond horrible and even long-time fans (me included) would immediately withdraw support and money.
 

Hammer Of The Gods

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Discussion is a bit premature as you have to assume Kelly keeps his job at least another year.

Then, looking ahead another season, keep an eye on Chip Kelly. He's going to be through year two of four in San Francisco and if he tanks two years in a row he's not keeping that job AND he's not staying in the NFL, as much as he hates CFB. Expect him to basically pull a Saban.

Serious question, because I value your opinion. Do you see a scenario where he gets booted this year? like say losing to Miami, Stanford and USC, or do you think he's pretty safe no matter what?
 

Irish Insanity

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There's no way he turns down the Notre Dame head coaching job to stay at Western Michigan.
I agree, that's just what I've been told. But you'd have to assume if a big program came calling he'd wouldn't have to think twice.
 

greyhammer90

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Serious question, because I value your opinion. Do you see a scenario where he gets booted this year? like say losing to Miami, Stanford and USC, or do you think he's pretty safe no matter what?

I'm not the one with the respectable opinion but: I'd say that barring a 3-9 type season he's safe. 6-6 he has a hot seat next year, like blazing hot. 7-5 he has a warm seat, maybe less warm if we hire a rock star DC. 8-4 a barely warm seat, but that would mean we won 7 games over the next 8. Again in the 8-4 scenario it all depends on what our DC hire is.
 

IrishBroker

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Absolutely not. Just no. The optics would be beyond horrible and even long-time fans (me included) would immediately withdraw support and money.

Then enjoy 9 wins and no titles.

And what do they say about second chances? I mean, aren't we the big moral authority in college football?

There are more than a couple examples of guys in our program getting away with things that we forgave, no?
 

Pops Freshenmeyer

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I'm not the one with the respectable opinion but: I'd say that barring a 3-9 type season he's safe. 6-6 he has a hot seat next year, like blazing hot. 7-5 he has a warm seat, maybe less warm if we hire a rock star DC. 8-4 a barely warm seat, but that would mean we won 7 games over the next 8. Again in the 8-4 scenario it all depends on what our DC hire is.

Kelly just signed an extension less than a year ago. If Swarbrick supported it (which I'm sure he did) then he isn't going to go hat in hand to his bosses asking for many millions of dollars to undo something so soon. It would be tantamount to his own resignation. So if ND made a change it would almost certainly result from a decision taken out of Swarbrick's hands. That sort of thing has happened before but I consider it unlikely.

The only catch here would be the terms of the 6 year deal and if it was, in fact, crafted to move Kelly into retirement before it ended while maintaining the optics of stability that "6 year deal" gives to Kelly and the program in the interim. I don't expect this to be the case but I don't think it's impossible either.
 

IrishBroker

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I'm not the one with the respectable opinion but: I'd say that barring a 3-9 type season he's safe. 6-6 he has a hot seat next year, like blazing hot. 7-5 he has a warm seat, maybe less warm if we hire a rock star DC. 8-4 a barely warm seat, but that would mean we won 7 games over the next 8. Again in the 8-4 scenario it all depends on what our DC hire is.

If he's .500 or below, he's gone, IMO

Especially after getting rid of "the problem" BVG. That was his excuse for the last 4 games, what's it going to be if he doesn't finish well?
 
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