Quarterback Controversy 2016

[BleedBlueGold]

I think Kizer takes the reigns and we see Malik as the "off the bench spark" during moments of games, be it goal line/red zone/offense stalling.

 

[Booslum31]

I support Kizer, as he is The Prototype.

He's also got nearly a full season of being "the guy" under his belt, which I think is a huge advantage.

However, I have 0% gripe if I'm wrong and Zaire starts.

Agree. However this turns out I just hope we have "the guy" and it's not a distraction all year long. Competition is a good thing...indecision is not.

 

[Wingman Ray]

I think Kizer takes the reigns and we see Malik as the "off the bench spark" during moments of games, be it goal line/red zone/offense stalling.

I think it will be a mix up style play. I think you will see a lot more of Malik when ND is playing teams with good pass defense and ND needs the run game to win.

That said, I think Kizer is the better complete qb for the system. Running is great but if you cant make the tough throws, your offense stalls.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

I just hope there isn't a committee for the sake of having a committee. If one guy is hot, leave him in.

 

[NDVirginia19]

I think it will be a mix up style play. I think you will see a lot more of Malik when ND is playing teams with good pass defense and ND needs the run game to win.

That said, I think Kizer is the better complete qb for the system. Running is great but if you cant make the tough throws, your offense stalls.

There can only be one captain Jack Sparrow

 

[NDdomer2]

If they can find an awesome balance between kizer last year nd some of the offense malik provided during the LSU game we could really roll some teams.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

If they can find an awesome balance between kizer last year nd some of the offense malik provided during the day game we could really roll some teams.

I'm honestly expecting more ND vs LSU. Kizer and the offense will have no problem between the 20s. Malik may need to come in to prevent settling for FGs. Idk. It's hard to say. Some of it is also bad play calling and having the wrong personnel in.

 

[NDVirginia19]

I've always been in the 1 QB camp. Kizer wasn't great in the redzone last year but he was a RS Freshman. That's expected, and the blame doesn't exactly lie entirely on him, as much as it does with the coaching staff. Also our WRs 1 and 2 were not exactly Red Zone studs. If we throw ESB Boykin and Aliz'e more into the mix in the red zone I think we'll see an improvement

 

[koonja]

One QB, please. Only wildly successful dual-QB set up I can remember is Tebow/Leak. And Tebow was goalline, period, so they knew their roles. And was best friends with Jesus so of course they had good luck.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I've always been in the 1 QB camp. Kizer wasn't great in the redzone last year but he was a RS Freshman. That's expected, and the blame doesn't exactly lie entirely on him, as much as it does with the coaching staff. Also our WRs 1 and 2 were not exactly Red Zone studs. If we throw ESB Boykin and Aliz'e more into the mix in the red zone I think we'll see an improvement

IIRC, RZ (and goal line, specifically), were awful because of a combination of things, like you said, not just on the QB. I really hope they can stick with one QB and work out these issues in the RZ and GL because it's maddening to be that bad consistently, season after season. Typically, I'm in the "run the damn ball" camp. But like you said, ND has some talented weapons that are the "go up and get it" types.

 

[Ndaccountant]

I honestly think who wins comes down to how confident we are in the WR's. It is no secret that Fuller was the key in the offense last year. His ability to force teams to play over the top opened up so much for the offense.

The question for me will be whether the coaching staff believes Kizer/WR's/OL are good enough collectively to take full advantage of his skill set throwing which will open up the running game. Or whether they look at Folston/Adams/Zaire/OL's ability to generate such a distinct running game advantage that the passing game thrives. If it were my bet to make, I bet on the RB's and OL before I bet on the WR's. But that is just me. Either way, I think the offense will thrive, it's just a matter of what do you want your identity to be when you run up against the strong defenses like a Clemson or Ohio State.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I honestly think who wins comes down to how confident we are in the WR's. It is no secret that Fuller was the key in the offense last year. His ability to force teams to play over the top opened up so much for the offense.

The question for me will be whether the coaching staff believes Kizer/WR's/OL are good enough collectively to take full advantage of his skill set throwing which will open up the running game. Or whether they look at Folston/Adams/Zaire/OL's ability to generate such a distinct running game advantage that the passing game thrives. If it were my bet to make, I bet on the RB's and OL before I bet on the WR's. But that is just me. Either way, I think the offense will thrive, it's just a matter of what do you want your identity to be when you run up against the strong defenses like a Clemson or Ohio State.

All day for me too. Lean on your big uglies.

 

[NDVirginia19]

Biggest thing for our RedZone running game By Far is the addition (or retention) of Luatua. Guy was unreal on pulling blocks on Red zone runs last year

 

[gkIrish]

Kizer proved he can be the guy over the course of basically an entire season.

Malik (through no fault of his own) has not.

Give me the sure thing every time.

 

[BobbyMac]

Kizer has good year, goes pro, #3 or #4 QB drafted..

Malik graduates this December and is at Florida, Clemson or LSU in '17. Enrolls in Jan if ND plays in a Dec bowl.

Wimbush starts in '17 & '18.

Crystal ball gets foggy after that.

 

[Wild Bill]

Malik is a natural leader and it's hard to keep those guys off the field. Kizer is talented enough to keep him at 2 but it's going to be tough. The depth chart, in my opinion favors Malik too. The defense is young and could struggle. Malik's legs and style of play will sustain drives and keep the defense off the field. The offensive line is set to win most battles and the backfield is deep and talented. It'll be tough for anyone to stop this offense if Malik can pick up four yards with his legs whenever he pleases.

 

[NDVirginia19]

Kizer probably is #2 off the board if he improves upon last year. It'd be smart to leave if he does well, he probably doesn't get drafted over Rosen if he waits another year

 

[woolybug25]

Malik is a natural leader and it's hard to keep those guys off the field. Kizer is talented enough to keep him at 2 but it's going to be tough. The depth chart, in my opinion favors Malik too. The defense is young and could struggle. Malik's legs and style of play will sustain drives and keep the defense off the field. The offensive line is set to win most battles and the backfield is deep and talented. It'll be tough for anyone to stop this offense if Malik can pick up four yards with his legs whenever he pleases.

I don't get why everyone thinks there is no debate to Malik being the better leader? Because he is more outgoing? Because he's vocal?

Kizer led his team to a bunch of victories, a bunch of last minute victories where he put the team on his back. When the team thought things were falling apart when Malik went down, he came in and straight up Willie Beamen'd that shit.

Leadership is entirely about whether people follow. Whether people believe in you. Some people do that with Ziare's style, but a ton of great leaders do it Kizer's style as well.

 

[Shamrock Theories]

I don't get why everyone thinks there is no debate to Malik being the better leader? Because he is more outgoing? Because he's vocal?

Um...yes and yes

You can say Kizer leads by example or w.e. (the line we got RE: Jaylon all year) but Malik is a better leader

 

[woolybug25]

Um...yes and yes

You can say Kizer leads by example or w.e. (the line we got RE: Jaylon all year) but Malik is a better leader

I'm guessing you left out my explanation in the quoted because it doesn't fit your narrative?

I've learned time and time again that being loud and vocal has actually very little to do with leadership. It is a tool of leadership, but it isn't a defining trait of a leader. But whatevs.

 

[Wild Bill]

I don't get why everyone thinks there is no debate to Malik being the better leader? Because he is more outgoing? Because he's vocal?

Kizer led his team to a bunch of victories, a bunch of last minute victories where he put the team on his back. When the team thought things were falling apart when Malik went down, he came in and straight up Willie Beamen'd that shit.

Leadership is entirely about whether people follow. Whether people believe in you. Some people do that with Ziare's style, but a ton of great leaders do it Kizer's style as well.

I think it's obvious Kizer has leadership qualities too and a debate as to who is a better leader is fair. I give a slight edge to Malik b/c the staff constantly raves about Malik being a leader and he appeared to have a stronger command of the team and huddle. Kizer was young, though. No doubt he became more and more of a leader as the season went on.

Maybe I favor Malik's leadership b/c he gave us some at the position when we had none.

 

[IrishLax]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

 

[IrishLax]

Also, Wimbush is still CLEARLY the most gifted player of all of them, sooooo......

 

[BobbyMac]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

The word you're looking for is aloof and I can say I got that impression myself and also...

Any brother that listens to country music is gonna have his detractors.

 

[woolybug25]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

 

[Wild Bill]

The word you're looking for is aloof and I can say I got that impression myself and also...

Any brother that listens to country music is gonna have his detractors.

Cultural appropriation is a mother fucker.

 

[koonja]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

Iffff true and to the degree in the above context, give me the warrior that the other 21 want to battle for, not the d bag who has skill.

 

[STLDomer]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

Who you calling cocky?

Not comparing them as football players, but give me Cam Newton, Aaron Rodgers etc every day of the week over the more "genuine" QBs in the NFL. As long as you back it up with your play.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

If the team becomes divided and dysfunctional over the choice for starting QB, they were going 7-5 no matter who trots out there to take snaps IMO.

I highly doubt Kizer over Zaire or vice versa will affect anyone outside of the directly affected parties. Both guys are proven, and more importantly, the guy who chooses is proven.

Other players have one choice no matter the outcome: shut up about it and play.

Unfortunately, us fans aren't held to the same standard. The first sack, fumble, or interception of the year will start a war that makes "Edward or Jacob?" look poignant.

 

[Shamrock Theories]

I'll say what I've heard from "sources" (can't even type that with a straight face)...

Malik Zaire is basically a universally beloved member of the team and perfect teammate, whereas a lot of people view Kizer as "cocky" (and not necessarily in a good way like "confident".) This is almost ironic given how "cocky" some of Zaire's interviews/comments read, but that's what I've heard from multiple people that would know. Basically, everyone feels Zaire is genuine and has amazing leadership qualities... whereas some people just flat out get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer. Take that for whatever it's worth.

Same people have also said the Kizer is unquestionably the the superior QB and if the decision was strictly on arm talent it would be Kizer over Zaire and not very close. So I see lots of ways the QB selection could put divisions in the team or produce less-than-desirable results.

Not surprised at all on those Malik comments.

Since Kelly seems to rub everyone the wrong way too, Kizer will naturally start lol