[NBA] vBook: Warriors at Cavaliers

[Irish#1]

I respect your opinion, but Kobe was so close to Jordan I'll take Jordan 2.0 over Lescuse all day.

Lebron fans will get their stats and conference championships. My Kobe crew will get a psochopathic competitiveness, and championships.

"If you want to have fun, play with Lebron. If you want to win, play with Kobe".

~ Larry Legend.

Your hard on for Kobe is embarrassing. I wouldn't rank him higher than James, but I will agree that he was more competitive.

LeBron = GOAT. He has earned the right to go wherever he wants. Just hope he doesn't do a one hour special on ESPN to announce. I'll root for him regardless of where he goes...with the exception of the Warriors.

I'm not sold yet. Especially after game 4. He was getting rid of the ball as quick as he could. The last half of the third quarter until he was pulled, it sure looked more like "going through the motions" as opposed to trying to will his team to a win. Others amy agree or disagree, but that's what it looked like to me.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

I'm not sold yet. Especially after game 4. He was getting rid of the ball as quick as he could. The last half of the third quarter until he was pulled, it sure looked more like "going through the motions" as opposed to trying to will his team to a win. Others amy agree or disagree, but that's what it looked like to me.

This is where the injury debacle comes into play:

Someone must have told him that would exonerate everything, but the fact of the matter is NOBODY expects a guy who is already validated to work his ass off in a game that was already over, to prolong a series that was already over.

There is nothing to gain IMO from a monster 4th quarter that ends the game down 7-10 instead of 20-25. Only the media psychos like SAS and Skip are bashing his perceived lack of effort to raise awareness of themselves.

The injury angle really annoyed me, because I was finally starting to warm up to Lebron the person (I respect Lebron the player), then he pulls this crap......He either surrounds himself with the biggest dolts ever, or is just this tone deaf.

 

[greyhammer90]

This is where the injury debacle comes into play:

Someone must have told him that would exonerate everything, but the fact of the matter is NOBODY expects a guy who is already validated to work his ass off in a game that was already over, to prolong a series that was already over.

There is nothing to gain IMO from a monster 4th quarter that ends the game down 7-10 instead of 20-25. Only the media psychos like SAS and Skip are bashing his perceived lack of effort to raise awareness of themselves.

The injury angle really annoyed me, because I was finally starting to warm up to Lebron the person (I respect Lebron the player), then he pulls this crap......He either surrounds himself with the biggest dolts ever, or is just this tone deaf.

Or he was actually injured and didn't feel like not wearing a cast after the series to avoid pissing off the set of NBA fans who would call him a faker regardless.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

[NBA] vBook: Warriors at Cavaliers

Or he was actually injured and didn't feel like not wearing a cast after the series to avoid pissing off the set of NBA fans who would call him a faker regardless.

The point is it didnt need to be brought up. Lebron has been an indestructible cyborg for almost 20 years, of course people are going to question an injury that coincidentally is brought to light after a season ending loss.

The dude gave everything he had, it wasnt enough. No shame there IMO.

 

[greyhammer90]

The point is it didnt need to be brought up. Lebron has been an indestructible cyborg for almost 20 years, of course people are going to question an injury that coincidentally is brought to light after a season ending loss.

He was wearing a cast after the game, it was asked why, he told them and said that he didn't wear it in public during the series because he didn't want the Warriors to guard him to go to that side all series. It's such a weird thing to create this excuse narrative out of. The way your saying it he should've worn it all series despite it giving the Warriors an advantage or he should've not worn the cast after because it would make you personally not feel like he's making excuses?

 

[IrishSteelhead]

He was wearing a cast after the game, it was asked why, he told them and said that he didn't wear it in public during the series because he didn't want the Warriors to guard him to go to that side all series. It's such a weird thing to create this excuse narrative out of. The way your saying it he should've worn it all series despite it giving the Warriors an advantage or he should've not worn the cast after because it would make you personally not feel like he's making excuses?

My take stands. Watch the former players who are now analysts take, and both sides are presented. I accept people have your take too, and respectfully agree to disagree.

 

[greyhammer90]

My take stands. Watch the former players who are now analysts take, and both sides are presented. I accept people have your take too, and respectfully agree to disagree.

Oh it's always respectful. I just have a hard time with people wanting to pick everything the man does to death. As an aside, I also hate old players commentary. They're almost always overly critical of current players, overly complimentary of their generation, and love talking shit about how much better their decisions were. See Charles Barkley, who acts like superteams are terrible and talks about the competitive spirit of the 90s but conveniently leaves out when he joined Olajuwon and Drexler in Houston in one of the most blatant ring chases ever.

 

[Irish#1]

He was wearing a cast after the game, it was asked why, he told them and said that he didn't wear it in public during the series because he didn't want the Warriors to guard him to go to that side all series. It's such a weird thing to create this excuse narrative out of. The way your saying it he should've worn it all series despite it giving the Warriors an advantage or he should've not worn the cast after because it would make you personally not feel like he's making excuses?

The biggest point which is what turned me off and has a lot of people questioning him, is he had to get it put on right after the game instead of waiting until after the PC. I could understand his reasoning about keeping it quiet (being guarded, game plan, etc.) until after the series, but needing to get the cast right after the game? Looking to protect his image which there is no need to. He's too good of a player to do that.

 

[NDRock]

Agree. NOBODY expected the Cavs to win, so I dont see the need for this whole injury angle. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, and assuming he really did have an injury, the general consensus among the pro announcers was still to just leave it be, and walk away without publicizing it.

Yeah, obviously there was no reason he had to have the cast on at the PC. I'm sure he was just trying to control the narrative. Will be an interesting choice for him this Summer. I don't really see a clear destination for him that will guarantee he can win a championship next year.

I feel like KD gets very little credit for these past two titles. To me, no way GS wins the last two years without him. A case could be made that they got lucky in 2015 with Kyrie and Love both getting hurt (still went 6 games). He's the difference in them winning one, maybe two titles and them having a chance at 5 or 6. Thought he was awesome again.

I think Lebron is the best in this era. Trying to compare him to Jordan isn't always easy. I do think that if those two were on the same team, Jordan would be the Alpha dog and Lebron would play the over qualified Scottie Pippen role. That's just how they were/are wired. Either way, I've enjoyed watching both of their careers.

 

[NorthDakota]

King James has been insane. Dont love the complaining or occasional diva stuff but such is life. When he's gone it'll be a sad day.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Probably doesnt mean anything, but will get people talking:

Lebrons son is playing at a Los Angeles high school next year.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Probably doesnt mean anything, but will get people talking:

Lebrons son is playing at a Los Angeles high school next year.

Chino Hills?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[NDRock]

Probably doesnt mean anything, but will get people talking:

Lebrons son is playing at a Los Angeles high school next year.

I think the Lakers are the most likely destination with Paul George coming as well.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

I think the Lakers are the most likely destination with Paul George coming as well.

I don't think Paul George is terribly valuable. He tightens up in crunch time. He'll put up good numbers through the regular season but I don't think you want him taking big shots.

I put all my money on Lebron going to the 76ers because they have the cap space, they have a hell of a Center and another tall guard. Put Lebron, Simmons and George on the floor at the same time and find some aggressive rebounding guards and three point shooters and you'd have a hell of a team.

They would be tough defensively and their length would cause major issues. All of them can score with Simmons needing to increase his quality shots. They might be able to attract a couple ring chasers near the end of their careers.

Simmons would need to learn to play off the ball so they could rotate who brings it up the floor. Lebron has shown a proclivity for driving/working in space but he needs to continue evolving his game and this would be a great opportunity for him to develop his post up game (much to the delight of any 3 point shooters on the floor)

 

[greyhammer90]

I don't think Paul George is terribly valuable. He tightens up in crunch time. He'll put up good numbers through the regular season but I don't think you want him taking big shots.

I put all my money on Lebron going to the 76ers because they have the cap space, they have a hell of a Center and another tall guard. Put Lebron, Simmons and George on the floor at the same time and find some aggressive rebounding guards and three point shooters and you'd have a hell of a team.

They would be tough defensively and their length would cause major issues. All of them can score with Simmons needing to increase his quality shots. They might be able to attract a couple ring chasers near the end of their careers.

Simmons would need to learn to play off the ball so they could rotate who brings it up the floor. Lebron has shown a proclivity for driving/working in space but he needs to continue evolving his game and this would be a great opportunity for him to develop his post up game (much to the delight of any 3 point shooters on the floor)

James has reportedly said he'd like to become more of an off-ball player who gets to his spot and shoots or dishes from there. I think he's feeling his age a lot more than he used to. I do think he would be amazing with Simmons because Simmons has great court vision and the sheer gravity of Lebron being on the floor acting as a PF would open up a lot of lanes to pass or drive.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

James has reportedly said he'd like to become more of an off-ball player who gets to his spot and shoots or dishes from there. I think he's feeling his age a lot more than he used to. I do think he would be amazing with Simmons because Simmons has great court vision and the sheer gravity of Lebron being on the floor acting as a PF would open up a lot of lanes to pass or drive.

Yep, exactly. Simmons has the vision needed and Lebron can be a dominant off-ball player 75% of the time. Occasionally, let him drive the offense when he's up to it but don't make him work so hard very every point. He can turn around/fade on the baseline for 20/night. Nobody can block unless they come from behind.

What they desperately need, in addition to a JJ Reddick, is another PG/SG. Kemba Walker is one of the first names off the top of my head. They could probably find a trade for KW or a player of that caliber to serve as a rotating PG/SG.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I don't think Paul George is terribly valuable. He tightens up in crunch time. He'll put up good numbers through the regular season but I don't think you want him taking big shots.

I put all my money on Lebron going to the 76ers because they have the cap space, they have a hell of a Center and another tall guard. Put Lebron, Simmons and George on the floor at the same time and find some aggressive rebounding guards and three point shooters and you'd have a hell of a team.

They would be tough defensively and their length would cause major issues. All of them can score with Simmons needing to increase his quality shots. They might be able to attract a couple ring chasers near the end of their careers.

Simmons would need to learn to play off the ball so they could rotate who brings it up the floor. Lebron has shown a proclivity for driving/working in space but he needs to continue evolving his game and this would be a great opportunity for him to develop his post up game (much to the delight of any 3 point shooters on the floor)

I agree that this is a likely situation, and I guarantee that Phili will make a push to meet with him, but I don't know how much I love the thought of them landing LBJ. They have such a solid young core, and I don't know why you would limit their development by putting a cog like Lebron, who's going to need to get his on a nightly basis, into the lineup. Just feel like it will slow/hamper their development as a core in the long run.

I would head to LA if I'm Lebron. Already has a place, he would be welcomed with open arms, and they have the cap for him to recruit another big FA if he pleases.

 

[koonja]

Yep, exactly. Simmons has the vision needed and Lebron can be a dominant off-ball player 75% of the time. Occasionally, let him drive the offense when he's up to it but don't make him work so hard very every point. He can turn around/fade on the baseline for 20/night. Nobody can block unless they come from behind.

What they desperately need, in addition to a JJ Reddick, is another PG/SG. Kemba Walker is one of the first names off the top of my head. They could probably find a trade for KW or a player of that caliber to serve as a rotating PG/SG.

They did draft that soft Fultz #1 overall, who's supposed to be exactly what they need. I'm all aboard the Fultz-is-a-bust wagon. And it's not because he wasn't good as a rookie, it's because he was having the time of his life sitting on the bench during the playoffs. No one had a bigger smile, or laughed more on their bench. I don't want a #1 overall to be happy to sit the bench, period. I don't care if he's not good enough to crack the rotation, I want him to think he should be playing, and be bothered that he's not.

What a terrible pick for them, my goodness.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

I agree that this is a likely situation, and I guarantee that Phili will make a push to meet with him, but I don't know how much I love the thought of them landing LBJ. They have such a solid young core, and I don't know why you would limit their development by putting a cog like Lebron, who's going to need to get his on a nightly basis, into the lineup. Just feel like it will slow/hamper their development as a core in the long run.

I would head to LA if I'm Lebron. Already has a place, he would be welcomed with open arms, and they have the cap for him to recruit another big FA if he pleases.

To the first bolded point: why would it limit their development? They were in the playoffs this year but they are clearly missing a piece or two to really compete. They have young talent and they need to grow in FA now. I don't ascribe to the zero sum game in basketball. If Lebron is getting his, it won't be to the detriment of others. Just like if Curry is getting his shots, there wont' be enough to go around to Thompson and Durant.

It simply isn't true and now is the time for Lebron to transform his game. He can still go to the rack with a full head of steam on occasion but he needs to be diversifying his game for longevity's sake. And that Philly team can compete right now.

To the 2nd bolded point, what does that even mean? Do you think he can seriously challenge the Warriors with the current Lakers cast plus one more FA? Which FA will work with Lebron so synergistically? He needs to join a competitive team unless the Lakers are willing to keep Ingram and ship off everyone else to bring in 3+ big names.

I'm not saying he won't go to LA but I think it's the wrong move for him. The West is already a battleground. The East has contenders but no heavyweights yet.

The Celtics will be challenging if both injured stars return to form. And what better matchups than the 76ers vs. the Celtics in the Eastern Conference finals and the Rockets/Warriors trading punches. That'll turn my hype meter up to 15, this year it was more like 3.5. Even during those game 7s in the conference finals, I felt like I already knew the outcome.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

To the first bolded point: why would it limit their development? They were in the playoffs this year but they are clearly missing a piece or two to really compete. They have young talent and they need to grow in FA now. I don't ascribe to the zero sum game in basketball. If Lebron is getting his, it won't be to the detriment of others. Just like if Curry is getting his shots, there wont' be enough to go around to Thompson and Durant.

It simply isn't true and now is the time for Lebron to transform his game. He can still go to the rack with a full head of steam on occasion but he needs to be diversifying his game for longevity's sake. And that Philly team can compete right now.

The 76ers have young talent to spare, and have a pair of first-round picks coming up in this year's draft. They don't need to overspend for LBJ, first of all, in order to compete. They are set up to compete in the Eastern Conference for the next 10 years without paying top dollar for LBJ. I would be more worried about re-signing their current players when their rookie deals are up than acting desperate to win this upcoming season.

Simmons is an athletic freak, but he's not known to play off the ball, which is exactly what he would be asked to do more if LBJ came to town. Give him the ball, and he is special. Why would you limit your young budding star by bringing a guy in who has to have the ball in his hands?

Look, this is just my opinion, but they have plenty of cap space right now to keep this core and get better through the draft and signing other veterans. Why waste that flexibility and sell out the future by trying to win immediately in the short term, when they already have a shot to do so and continue to get better down the road? I'd rather see them sign a player like Paul George, who has a 3 point shot as well as the ability to create his own without completely changing the makeup of this young team, and at a fraction of the price for a player who is 5 years younger than LBJ. That is, if Paul George doesn't go to LA with LBJ, which is widely speculated to be a possibility.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

The 76ers have young talent to spare, and have a pair of first-round picks coming up in this year's draft. They don't need to overspend for LBJ, first of all, in order to compete. They are set up to compete in the Eastern Conference for the next 10 years without paying top dollar for LBJ. I would be more worried about re-signing their current players when their rookie deals are up than acting desperate to win this upcoming season.

Simmons is an athletic freak, but he's not known to play off the ball, which is exactly what he would be asked to do more if LBJ came to town. Give him the ball, and he is special. Why would you limit your young budding star by bringing a guy in who has to have the ball in his hands?

Look, this is just my opinion, but they have plenty of cap space right now to keep this core and get better through the draft and signing other veterans. Why waste that flexibility and sell out the future by trying to win immediately in the short term, when they already have a shot to do so and continue to get better down the road? I'd rather see them sign a player like Paul George, who has a 3 point shot as well as the ability to create his own without completely changing the makeup of this young team, and at a fraction of the price for a player who is 5 years younger than LBJ. That is, if Paul George doesn't go to LA with LBJ, which is widely speculated to be a possibility.

Yuck. Paul George is not a great player. He's a good player but he gets the yips in crunch time.

I think the 76ers need another superstar to compete. I don't care if they go after Lebron (although I think that would be his best move unless another franchise is willing to shake the foundation for him). The 76ers would also be incredible with Kawhi Leonard. I think they need another efficient, defensive playmaker who can ISO if needed and who can add 24+ pts/game.

You won't hurt Simmons development by giving him another superstar to play with.

Finally, I'm saying if the 76ers really want to make a run at a championship(s), they need to add in free agency as well as drafting well. They can compete in the East but they'll just be another victim to Golden State/Houston if they don't have the dogs to run with the West.

Two first round picks this year, means on average they'll probably add one key piece between the two. But rookies don't usually perform like Jayson Tatum or Donovan Mitchell so you're probably still 1-2 years away from a title run? Do you feel like waiting to find out if you can do it? Or do you make waves to sign a premier talent who can immediately boost your roster?

If it were the NFL, I'd be agreeing with you 100% but the NBA is drastically different when it comes to challenging as an organization.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

Yuck. Paul George is not a great player. He's a good player but he gets the yips in crunch time.

I think the 76ers need another superstar to compete. I don't care if they go after Lebron (although I think that would be his best move unless another franchise is willing to shake the foundation for him). The 76ers would also be incredible with Kawhi Leonard.

This. I think this would be best case scenario for 76ers if they could piece a trade together for him without giving up either Simmons or Embiid. Or if they are willing to wait one more year and see how things go in free agency in 2019.

Simmons, Embiid and Leonard...that's a scary thought.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

The Sixers already have one of the biggest injury liabilities in the league. I think they would be insane to take on another in Kawhi.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

The Sixers already have one of the biggest injury liabilities in the league. I think they would be insane to take on another in Kawhi.

As legitimate as this concern is, I think the jury is still out on exactly how "hurt" Kawhi was at the end of the season. New place could be all he needs. But that statement in and of itself will be risky for his price tag.

I just hope he doesn't turn into a diva and finds a new home and is content. He's too talented, don't waste it.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

[NBA] vBook: Warriors at Cavaliers

As legitimate as this concern is, I think the jury is still out on exactly how "hurt" Kawhi was at the end of the season. New place could be all he needs. But that statement in and of itself will be risky for his price tag.



I just hope he doesn't turn into a diva and finds a new home and is content. He's too talented, don't waste it.

He might have already reached diva status when the Spurs doctors cleared him to play, and he refused, claiming he had his own doctors, who said otherwise.

It was a weird situation, where nobody other than KL and the Spurs know what really happened.

*It does seems he wants out, and didnt want to jeopardize a payday with any setbacks by playing on a team that wasnt a legitimate title contender anyways. Hes easily a top 5-7 player IMO when healthy, and agree it would be a shame to see him waste it.