Investigation Results

Whiskeyjack

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DD may reconsider after getting his draft grade....my guess 6-7 th rd with all things considered...

I thought the NFL was only giving out four grades now: 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th or lower (otherwise known as "Stay in school, dipsh!t")

If he comes back (which I doubt) he will have major competition tp for receptions. If golson does not improve in reading progressions, I could be wrong as he may just stare down dd and throw to him 80% of the time like he is doing with fuller.

Our WRs are a diverse group with a lot of upside, but Fuller is the only one who is flashing the sort of potential that DD has. If he comes back and works hard, I have little doubt that he'll start.
 

HoosierMP33

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My .02 worth is this....

I am so dang proud of these kids....We will never know the whole story as to what happened when and who did or didn't do what....but I will say that I am very proud with how these kids handled a very difficult and frustrating investigation and hearing process....

Although this is just a minor bruise for the ND program, I am so glad that, as someone else pointed out, that with BK as our coach, we have been able to handle the absence of these talented kids very well...that is a testament to the way BK is building this program, how the staff is keeping the team focused on the task at hand, and especially to the players for stepping up and answering the challenges this process has brought them....regardless of how we finish the second half of the season, they have already been better then any of the talking heads predicted (minus Holtz, of course LOL)...

I look forward to seeing those of the "Frozen Five" who choose to return, bounce back next year like Golson has this year...This season, this team, is very special...but now 2015 is really setting up to be a monster year as well for the Irish; especially with a favorable schedule (on paper and a year away anyways)....These guys will have a chip on their shoulder and a point to prove....

I would have really like to have seen DD come back and finish what he started here....He has worked his butt off and has developed into a helluva WR and would have had a big year in 2015 had he chosen to return (Hell, this season would have been HUGE for him!)...but I can respect his choice and wish him all the best and am curious to see how he develops at the next level...

Kudos to the "Frozen Five" for handling this situation the best they could, the University for maintaining its integrity (you don't see FSU worrying about theirs!), and the team and coaching staff for answering all the challenges and unknowns that this situation brought them...

Lastly, the one negative I will say...this process has to be reviewed at some point in the very near future...the process itself is antiquated and really is a distraction...and the players (students) deserve a speedy hearing/investigation process so as not to cost them lost semesters in a state of limbo....there has to be a better way to do this process....I don't have the answer as to what that is, but I know there has to be a better one that can be implemented; and the sooner it is, the better it will be for ALL ND students.
 

RDU Irish

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I fail to see how all three announced are not receiving the same punishment? They are all sitting out with the option of returning in the Summer. The status of the current semester seems unknown.

The other two may not have eligibility, Moore is a graduate student and Hardy would need to apply for a 5th year, might be the one most screwed over by this process if he is unable to come back on scholarship and would need to pay his own way to finish (assuming that would be an option).
 

calvegas04

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Lol anyone see Sports center on the left hand side where they show up coming stories it says "Phillip Daniels Done at ND"
 

PANDFAN

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Regarding the suspended five players, multiple sources told Irish Illustrated that they received two semester bans.</p>— Irish Illustrated (@NDatRivals) <a href="https://twitter.com/NDatRivals/status/522076061949890560">October 14, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

RDU Irish

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For the record, I hope DD comes back and gets his degree. Football success or not, it would say great things about him to overcome all this and walk away with his diploma versus walking away. As for football, he surely has more to gain than anyone coming back and playing. He is a late round pick or free agent right now and could very well play himself into the top 3 rounds, even a first rounder if he the top WR on a National Championship team. Endorsement value of that versus a college dropout could be more than his paycheck.
 

IrishLion

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So, if it's a two-semester ban, and they aren't letting the kids finish the fall semester, but they they can return NEXT fall semester, that means the current semester is being counted as time served, right?
 

Whiskeyjack

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So, if it's a two-semester ban, and they aren't letting the kids finish the fall semester, but they they can return NEXT fall semester, that means the current semester is being counted as time served, right?

Yes. And as football players, they're eligible to return for the 2015 summer session.
 

wizards8507

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I fail to see how all three announced are not receiving the same punishment?
Initial interpretation of DD and PD's tweets was that DD was done for good while the other players were done for now, with the option to come back. We didn't know (until PD's most recent tweet) whether DD was kicked out by ND permanently or whether he got the same punishment as everyone else but electing not to return.
 

RDU Irish

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Initial interpretation of DD and PD's tweets was that DD was done for good while the other players were done for now, with the option to come back. We didn't know (until PD's most recent tweet) whether DD was kicked out by ND permanently or whether he got the same punishment as everyone else but electing not to return.

I guess I have never presumed anything coming from Phillip Daniels twitter account was fully thought out and accurate.
 

BleedBlueGold

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Lol anyone see Sports center on the left hand side where they show up coming stories it says "Phillip Daniels Done at ND"

Yup. World Wide Leader in screw ups.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Oh ok. <a href="http://t.co/Z9olBArF2R">pic.twitter.com/Z9olBArF2R</a></p>— Kyle O'Connor (@oconnorkyle) <a href="https://twitter.com/oconnorkyle/status/522081025543782400">October 14, 2014</a></blockquote>
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connor_in

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I thought the NFL was only giving out four grades now: 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th or lower (otherwise known as "Stay in school, dipsh!t")



Our WRs are a diverse group with a lot of upside, but Fuller is the only one who is flashing the sort of potential that DD has. If he comes back and works hard, I have little doubt that he'll start.

This was part of the concern about DD even coming into this year though. Not that he would start, but that he seemed to have all the potential, but he didn't seem to apply himself all the time. He had a tendency to disappear/not work hard enough.
 

BigIrish

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A two semester ban but ND is giving them the option to count this semester as one of them? That sounds downright gracious. I thought the administration was evil though, no?
 

Jerry

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This was part of the concern about DD even coming into this year though. Not that he would start, but that he seemed to have all the potential, but he didn't seem to apply himself all the time. He had a tendency to disappear/not work hard enough.

He was banged up a few times last year. I think that had something to do with it.
 

IrishJayhawk

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My .02 worth is this....

I am so dang proud of these kids....We will never know the whole story as to what happened when and who did or didn't do what....but I will say that I am very proud with how these kids handled a very difficult and frustrating investigation and hearing process....

Although this is just a minor bruise for the ND program, I am so glad that, as someone else pointed out, that with BK as our coach, we have been able to handle the absence of these talented kids very well...that is a testament to the way BK is building this program, how the staff is keeping the team focused on the task at hand, and especially to the players for stepping up and answering the challenges this process has brought them....regardless of how we finish the second half of the season, they have already been better then any of the talking heads predicted (minus Holtz, of course LOL)...

I look forward to seeing those of the "Frozen Five" who choose to return, bounce back next year like Golson has this year...This season, this team, is very special...but now 2015 is really setting up to be a monster year as well for the Irish; especially with a favorable schedule (on paper and a year away anyways)....These guys will have a chip on their shoulder and a point to prove....

I would have really like to have seen DD come back and finish what he started here....He has worked his butt off and has developed into a helluva WR and would have had a big year in 2015 had he chosen to return (Hell, this season would have been HUGE for him!)...but I can respect his choice and wish him all the best and am curious to see how he develops at the next level...

Kudos to the "Frozen Five" for handling this situation the best they could, the University for maintaining its integrity (you don't see FSU worrying about theirs!), and the team and coaching staff for answering all the challenges and unknowns that this situation brought them...

Lastly, the one negative I will say...this process has to be reviewed at some point in the very near future...the process itself is antiquated and really is a distraction...and the players (students) deserve a speedy hearing/investigation process so as not to cost them lost semesters in a state of limbo....there has to be a better way to do this process....I don't have the answer as to what that is, but I know there has to be a better one that can be implemented; and the sooner it is, the better it will be for ALL ND students.

Having a hard time with this sentiment. Whether the investigation was handled well or not, if we are to believe the results, these students did something to deserve a full year ban. This wasn't a situation they were thrust into. They made decisions that caused them to be implicated.

That said, maybe we can't believe the results. KVR certainly believes in his innocence.

Either way, I certainly hope for their return and wish them the best moving forward, as I do/did for Golson.
 

Whiskeyjack

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Another one of suspended ND players, Kendall Moore announces he's also done for the season & out at Notre Dame. He already has his degree.</p>— Bruce Feldman (@BruceFeldmanCFB) <a href="https://twitter.com/BruceFeldmanCFB/status/522137869658648576">October 14, 2014</a></blockquote>
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Whiskeyjack

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The SBT's Eric Hanson just published this:

There are still some moving parts in play Shaun Williams isn’t entirely sure he understands, but he finally has the solace that his dream, his son Ishaq’s dream, remains in play.

Even if the Notre Dame senior defensive end won’t play another down of football until the fall of 2015.

“My focus throughout this process has always been about Ishaq and getting his Notre Dame degree,” Williams said in a phone conversation Tuesday afternoon. “They don’t hand those out to everybody.

“That has long-term implications. They talk about it being a 40-year decision to come to Notre Dame. I believe that. And Ishaq will be back to get his. And I hope when he does, he has a chance to clear his name.”

Williams, projected to be a starting defensive end for the Irish this season, was one of five players held out of team meetings, practices and games since August during an academic fraud investigation.

Starting junior cornerback KeiVarae Russell and starting senior wide receiver DaVaris Daniels along with reserve linebacker Kendall Moore and backup safety Eilar Hardy were the others. Only Moore will have exhausted his eligibility and redshirt options and announced Tuesday that he is leaving.

Notre Dame head coach Brian Kelly acknowledged earlier Tuesday that the two players he had spoken directly with recently were Russell and Williams, and that both were done for this season and that both were expected back in 2015.

DaVaris Daniels’ father, Phillip Daniels, posted on his Twitter account Tuesday morning: “Finally after 4 months my son got an answer! He is done at Notre Dame and will weigh his options for the future! #HeIsNDNoMore.”
Phillip Daniels later tweeted that there was an option for DaVaris to return to ND in 2015.

Williams retains a fifth-year option, because he has not redshirted. The former five-star prospect from Brooklyn, N.Y., remains in South Bend, but Shaun Williams wasn’t sure whether his son would be allowed to finish the semester as part of the conditions moving forward.

A university spokesman confirmed all five players were still enrolled. Another spokesman concurred, but added that status could soon change.

“There’s finality in this, but there are options,” Shaun Williams said. “I’m not sure I understand all of them, but my understanding is that Ishaq can come back in the summer of 2015.”

Ishaq himself took to Twitter Tuesday afternoon with the following tweet: “God will not put you through anything you can't handle. #minorsetback #majorcomeback.”

“It sounds very positive, but he really doesn’t have a choice,” Shaun Williams said. “It’s bigger than Ishaq. There are a lot of kids in Brooklyn that look up to Ishaq and this is about them too.

“It was a tough process to go through —five black boys being paraded as the face of academic dishonesty. You never really embrace something like that, but I’m proud of the way he handled it.

“I’m proud of the decision he made to stay at Notre Dame. I’m happy part of this is finally behind him. Education ain’t free. You pay with it with blood, sweat, tears and injuries —and now this. We’re convinced it’s going to be worth it in the end.”
Later Tuesday, Moore posted the following on his Instagram account:

"Notre Dame has rendered its decision. While it is disappointing, I will respectfully leave my alma mater as a proud May 2014 graduate of the institution that I have respectfully loved and given my best efforts during my college career.

"Regardless of this announced outcome, my personal and ethical integrity remain intact and I have honored my collegiate journey from the beginning straight through to this end and I will take on the next chapters of my life with the same progressive commitment to excellence, hard work and relentless determination toward unlimited success.

"I was raised to excel on every level and I want to thank my parents for their unwavering support and belief in me; their powerful words of love, encouagement and faith helped to sustain me through this process.

"I thank my family, friends and fans for the support. I want to thank Notre Dame for the opportunity and I wish my teammates and the program all of the success in the world."
 

ACamp1900

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Another one of suspended ND players, Kendall Moore announces he's also done for the season & out at Notre Dame. He already has his degree.</p>— Bruce Feldman (@BruceFeldmanCFB) <a href="https://twitter.com/BruceFeldmanCFB/status/522137869658648576">October 14, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is, ... strange? He's being kicked out of school but already successfully completed his degree... I assume he was working on post grad?? I wonder if this will impact his standing as a grad moving forward.
 

Emcee77

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This is, ... strange? He's being kicked out of school but already successfully completed his degree... I assume he was working on post grad?? I wonder if this will impact his standing as a grad moving forward.

Yeah he was a 5th year.
 

NDTH91

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Wow, seems like they're taking it very well. Glad to see that. Interesting that Shaun Williams slipped the race card in there. I hadn't even thought of that.
 

MNIrishman

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Kendall Moore keeping his degree implies there was no impropriety before May 2014. Maybe no vacating wins?
 

Legacy93

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Does not imply that, simply implies they're not taking his degree.

Well.. if it was determined that he had done something academically dishonest in his courses prior to graduating in May, that would directly affect the credits he has regarding his degree and would most likely mean he would lose his degree. If they don't take away a degree, why would they even think about giving up games?
 

irishtrain

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2 items here- don't you just love how espn keeps adding the Irish academic story to the on going mess at Fla state. They seem to have to include it in every development like its even remotely similar. Also notice how on Finebaum Show that no Notre Dame person ever calls in and they keep trying to get a rise out of the Irish fanbase- its really laughable. Paul Finebaum doesn't seem to get the fact that we don't think he's important enough to even respond. I wish someone would call in on his show and challenge him on his hypocritical nature. The deal today was how all of a sudden fsu is dirty and how the sec has been cleaned up by Mike Slive. My favorite saying he uses is 'the commitment to winning football' that the sec provides its coaches. Meaning hey just get 'em in here to win and will take care of the rest. My God college football has gone to hell in a hand basket. I'm so glad I am a fan of Notre Dame.
 
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The vacating wins talk is just so stupid. If the team knew about it and covered it up, then yeah vacate I guess. But no one knew and they were doing it. Is Georgia going to have vacated wins because of Gurley? Every team is probably playing someone ineligible.
 

IrishLax

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The vacating wins talk is just so stupid. If the team knew about it and covered it up, then yeah vacate I guess. But no one knew and they were doing it. Is Georgia going to have vacated wins because of Gurley? Every team is probably playing someone ineligible.

Right. This is 100% right. The gray area is:
1. ND is self-righteous and dumb.
2. The student trainer could technically be considered an athletic department employee.
 

Whiskeyjack

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Well.. if it was determined that he had done something academically dishonest in his courses prior to graduating in May, that would directly affect the credits he has regarding his degree and would most likely mean he would lose his degree. If they don't take away a degree, why would they even think about giving up games?

Revoking an already issued degree is an extreme course of action that schools are very hesitant to take. So I wouldn't read anything into it.
 
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