Healthcare

[NorthDakota]

Does it matter? Regardless of what they put together, there will still be an army of MAGA folks like you sprinkling powdered sugar on every turd Trump lays.

Sorry that I'm dedicated to Making America Great Again....

 

[woolybug25]

Sorry that I'm dedicated to Making America Great Again....

You don't even know what that means.

 

[RDU Irish]

"US life expectancy just declined for the 1st time in a quarter century:

For the first time in more than two decades, life expectancy for Americans declined last year — a troubling development linked to a panoply of worsening health problems in the United States.

Rising fatalities from heart disease and stroke, diabetes, drug overdoses, accidents and other conditions caused the lower life expectancy revealed in a report released Thursday by the National Center for Health Statistics. In all, death rates rose for eight of the top 10 leading causes of death.

A year ago, research by Case and Angus Deaton, also an economist at Princeton, brought worldwide attention to the unexpected jump in mortality rates among white middle-aged Americans. That trend was blamed on what are sometimes called diseases of despair: overdoses, alcoholism and suicide. The new report raises the possibility that major illnesses may be eroding prospects for an even wider group of Americans.

But you're probably right. The American poor don't really understand how good they have it."

People take less and less accountability for their own health - relying on modern medicine to "fix" what they break. Calling drug and alcohol abuse and suicide out for hurting life expectancy is pretty funny to me. Those happen to be things totally within your control. Seeing a widening of the bell curve skew the average south due to some being completely irresponsible while 80, 90 and 100 year old age groups are the fastest growing part of the population is some serious selective observance of the data.

Throw an obesity chart next to that life expectancy chart and you will see the uphill battle modern medicine has been winning impressively.

And I find the cartoon ironic after I point out areas of innovation worth pursuing to improve cost and quality of care. How is that snarking again?

 

[RDU Irish]

1) This "bill" will transform more than Bruce Jenner by the time it leaves the Senate.

2) All they are doing is polishing a turd anyway. I am struggling to see what core issues they are addressing with significant difference from the original Obamination of the ACA.

3) Rs are pretty much just taking an enormous chunky turd left by Dems and hanging it around their neck. How they don't have a free market principled solution on the shelf ready to run is just embarrassing - and only reinforces the fact they don't really believe any of that jazz to begin with.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

People take less and less accountability for their own health - relying on modern medicine to "fix" what they break. Calling drug and alcohol abuse and suicide out for hurting life expectancy is pretty funny to me. Those happen to be things totally within your control. Seeing a widening of the bell curve skew the average south due to some being completely irresponsible while 80, 90 and 100 year old age groups are the fastest growing part of the population is some serious selective observance of the data.

Throw an obesity chart next to that life expectancy chart and you will see the uphill battle modern medicine has been winning impressively.

It's the result of some complex factors-- economic (i.e. the increasing precarity of employment for those in the lower class) and social (divorce, increasing social atomization, etc.) factors combine to result in deteriorating health outcomes.

We lose far more soldiers to suicide than we do in combat. Would it be fair to say that data is irrelevant in assessing the overall health of our armed services, because suicide isn't completely involuntary? Or would it be more accurate to say that's a stunning indictment of our government's failure to adequately care for our servicemen? Because that's the exact same logic you're applying to the data showing how desperate the American poor have become.

 

[ClausentoTate]

I don't see a single thing in this bill that would lower premiums for anyone but the healthiest applicants. In fact, the healthy young people can literally opt out without a penalty... The entire point is that everyone pays their share, healthy or not. That's how insurance works. Jesus christ this is going to kill people.

 

[NorthDakota]

I don't see a single thing in this bill that would lower premiums for anyone but the healthiest applicants. In fact, the healthy young people can literally opt out without a penalty... The entire point is that everyone pays their share, healthy or not. That's how insurance works. Jesus christ this is going to kill people.

Why should healthy people paying less be bad? Why should i buy insurance if i don't want it?

Fatties and chronically ill should pay more. Also, your being dramatic.

 

[ClausentoTate]

Why should healthy people paying less be bad? Why should i buy insurance if i don't want it?

Fatties and chronically ill should pay more. Also, your being dramatic.

To be blunt, morality. We are talking pennies a day for everyone vs life crippling amounts for those less fortunate. My family with T1D legit doesnt know what is going to happen for them.

 

[Legacy]

All the horrific details of the GOP's new Obamacare repeal bill: A handy guide (LA Times)

Health care bill 'shameful,' 'harmful,' medical groups say
(Statements from the American Medical Association, the American College of Physicians, the American Cancer Society, AARP, National Education Association, etc)

In Rare Unity, Hospitals, Doctors and Insurers Criticize Health Bill (NY Times)

 

[wizards8507]

To be blunt, morality. We are talking pennies a day for everyone vs life crippling amounts for those less fortunate. My family with T1D legit doesnt know what is going to happen for them.

Does your family with T1D have a job? If so, literally nothing will happen. Literally. Nothing.

 

[Cackalacky]

This House bill isnt going anywhere. The Senate will never approve it as is. They will write their own bill, if they can. This is just a face saving move by House GOP.

 

[Rogue219]

What was the CBO score on this?

There wasn't one?

Hold this beer, too.

 

[Legacy]

This House bill isnt going anywhere. The Senate will never approve it as is. They will write their own bill, if they can. This is just a face saving move by House GOP.

True, this will may well be changed, possibly with major alterations. Once satisfied, the Ruling Party in the Senate may change its rules to allow passage with a simple majority vote. Then, it would go to a Congressional conference committee to reconcile the differences in the Senate bill with the Ruling Party's commitee from the House, since it already passed there by one vote. Trumpcare then becomes the law of the land. As Whiskey, I believe, pointed out, in the end, this is about tax revenue savings from the rich towards appropriating money for other priorities, e.g. military.

The prior version of Trumpcare resulted in a $883 billion tax cut, $274 billion of it going to the richest 2%. $880 billion stripped from Medicaid. That one would have resulted in 24 million fewer insured individuals over the next ten years. Hopefully, the Senate waits until these types of implications can be scored by the CBO in the new bill, which had last minute amendments.

 

[Legacy]

Please excuse the postings twice in a row, but here's a good explanation of the implications of Trumpcare 1.0 from March.

Examining The House Republican ACA Repeal And Replace Legislation (Health Affairs Blog)

The full version of the article is quite complete, but here's the Summary prior to CBO scoring then:

Summing Up
In summary, the legislation’s tax cuts will be very attractive to wealthy Americans and health insurers and providers, who would get a trillion dollars in tax breaks. It could cause consternation for Medicaid recipients and state Medicaid programs, which would see federal funding for Medicaid steadily diminish, potentially thinning out coverage. The legislation could be bad news for recipients of current tax credits who are older, sicker, and poorer, and who live in areas where care is expensive. They may be able to afford low actuarial value coverage with the tax credits the bills would provide them, but they are unlikely then to be able to afford the cost sharing that coverage will impose.

Higher-income younger people, on the other hand, would find coverage much more affordable than it is now under the legislation—the tax credits might fully cover their premiums and leave extra for their health savings accounts. Some insurers could find the state reinsurance money and continuous coverage requirement enough of an incentive to stay in the market, but others may not

Finally, one cannot know without a CBO report how this all works out. But it is hard to see how the bills pay for themselves, and they could result in significant losses in coverage.

 

[Mr. Larson]

Why should healthy people paying less be bad? Why should i buy insurance if i don't want it?

Fatties and chronically ill should pay more. Also, your being dramatic.

Asking for a friend-

Is there a way to mute users while lurking?

Thanks!

 

[Cackalacky]

My illustrious Representative, Mark Sanford just admitted that he didnt read the new verison of the bill at all but he did thumb through it. He is a member of the Freedom caucus though so it doesnt make sense for him to not read it then vote yes when he was against the first bill and voted no.

 

[ACamp1900]

Those pesky congressmen not reading bills they shove down our throats.... it's the move that knows no party lines.

 

[Cackalacky]

Senate GOP rejects House Obamacare bill - POLITICO

 

[Cackalacky]

Those pesky congressmen not reading bills they shove down our throats.... it's the move that knows no party lines.

Absolutely.

 

[MJ12666]

True, this will may well be changed, possibly with major alterations. Once satisfied, the Ruling Party in the Senate may change its rules to allow passage with a simple majority vote. Then, it would go to a Congressional conference committee to reconcile the differences in the Senate bill with the Ruling Party's commitee from the House, since it already passed there by one vote. Trumpcare then becomes the law of the land. As Whiskey, I believe, pointed out, in the end, this is about tax revenue savings from the rich towards appropriating money for other priorities, e.g. military.

The prior version of Trumpcare resulted in a $883 billion tax cut, $274 billion of it going to the richest 2%. $880 billion stripped from Medicaid. That one would have resulted in 24 million fewer insured individuals over the next ten years. Hopefully, the Senate waits until these types of implications can be scored by the CBO in the new bill, which had last minute amendments.

You understand that they pay roughly 50% of total personal Fed income taxes? As a result any tax reductions will probably impact that group the most. Make sense?

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Senate GOP rejects House Obamacare bill - POLITICO

Amateur hour in the House. Senate didn't take this thing seriously at all, and with good reason.

 

[Cali_domer]

I'm as conservative as they come, this bill is trash. Repeal (I know it's not repealed , repealed) for the sake of repeal is stupid.

 

[Legacy]

You understand that they pay roughly 50% of total personal Fed income taxes? As a result any tax reductions will probably impact that group the most. Make sense?

Of course. And, barring any of the proposed changes to individual income tax rates, approximately 50% of individuals/households do not pay any federal income taxes.

Here's a good explanation of the budgetary guidelines for the Reconciliation process.

Reconciliation 101 (Commitee for a Responsible Federal Budget)

Just a few key takeaways, in my opinion, are that this can be done once a year so it's usually part of an overall appropriations bill, the bill has to be passed by 60 Senators - unless rules are changed, that it can't add to the federal debt at a ten year timeline, unless the bill is limited to a shorter time like 3 or 5 years.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

I'm as conservative as they come, this bill is trash. Repeal (I know it's not repealed , repealed) for the sake of repeal is stupid.

Yup.

 

[ulukinatme]

I don't know what any of them think they're doing. The Dems didn't know what they were doing when the pushed the ACA through, and the Conservatives are clueless about what to do to fix it. Maybe we should just nuke the House from orbit.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

 

[IrishinSyria]

I'm as conservative as they come, this bill is trash. Repeal (I know it's not repealed , repealed) for the sake of repeal is stupid.

The bill the House passed will never become law. It's a purely procedural move designed to kick the ball to the Senate. The GOP's stuck: they know they ran on a promise to repeal and replace and they know that actually rolling back the substantive portions of the ACA would be hugely unpopular. This thing's a live grenade politically and house republicans were stuck holding it after their first attempt to pass something failed catastrophically.

 

[IrishinSyria]

GOP's best move at this point is probably to draw up a law that's basically Obamacare by a different name and hope that satisfies the base.

 

[phgreek]

GOP's best move at this point is probably to draw up a law that's basically Obamacare by a different name and hope that satisfies the base.

So long as they give me a waiver provision to self-insure or utilize a system like Atlas https://atlas.md/wichita/faq/, with a catastrophic plan as a backer, I really don't care anymore....I just don't want to be part of supporting lies and liars. I am positive there was/is market solutions to getting costs down...and that in and of itself extends coverage to some extent.

I totally disagree with the ACA approach...and will never, ever let go of the lies and manipulation used to pass it. Add the fact that 20 Million people are still forced to pay a fine because they can't freakin afford it...and even if they can Millions more can't use it because their deductible is 10K. Oh AAAAND insurance companies can't suppoort it. So wailing "oh my God, 24 million people" in response to the Republican Dimwits is like...REALLY!?!

And Republicans...well, Republicans clearly have shown themselves to have used the ACA idiocy as a political lever, never having seriously planned to replace it, so what we have is critics with the hot potato...great look, even better governance...morons.

Some say they have/had a plan, but now that it is "real" time, some Republicans won't vote for it....Like lacking the courage of your convictions is better than being a disingenuous, unprepared moron.

Just nuts...screw 'em all...every damned one!

 

[ACamp1900]

I totally disagree with the ACA approach...and will never, ever let go of the lies and manipulation used to pass it.

This. I was only a few years or so removed from being a happy liberal, registered democrat when that went down... i guess never say never, but once that went down the way it did the thought of voting democrat for anything, ever again felt like going to Venus and back... and I'm still there, every democrat leader associated with that I have absolutely zero use for.