Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

[phork]

The bottom line is we know where the ceiling is with Kelly. Saying there is no one better for the job is crazy. Much like Harbaugh Kelly usually beats the teams he should, which is most of the schedule, but cannot win the big games and has some closer than we'd like games against inferior competition. I'm not saying ND should bomb everyone on the schedule but the Michigan game, being an outlier or not, should not ever happen. Playing USC close in the state that program is in, should never happen. Close games against mediocre Virginia teams shouldn't happen. (Yes I am aware that ND beat Virginia by 15, but it was closer than that score indicated.)

Still don't have a viable run game. Still can't really stop the run against good teams.

We have 2 tough games next year. Wisky & Clemson. I expect to beat Wisky and well Clemson is Clemson. Should be a minimum 10 win season. Anything less then Kelly needs to go. Any 2019 Michigans then a re-evaluation is needed.

The goal should be 10 wins at the least. Once every 5 years or so go undefeated. Frankly I have no hope that given the current climate of college football that ND can ever win a NC.

 

[Irish#1]

Kelly has done a great job in self evaluating the program, admitting his shortcomings and finding ways to improve it. I think he is now at the point where he in tinkering and making the final subtle changes to keep the program in the NC discussion and top ten on a regular basis.

 

[irishff1014]

The bottom line is we know where the ceiling is with Kelly. Saying there is no one better for the job is crazy. Much like Harbaugh Kelly usually beats the teams he should, which is most of the schedule, but cannot win the big games and has some closer than we'd like games against inferior competition. I'm not saying ND should bomb everyone on the schedule but the Michigan game, being an outlier or not, should not ever happen. Playing USC close in the state that program is in, should never happen. Close games against mediocre Virginia teams shouldn't happen. (Yes I am aware that ND beat Virginia by 15, but it was closer than that score indicated.)

Still don't have a viable run game. Still can't really stop the run against good teams.

We have 2 tough games next year. Wisky & Clemson. I expect to beat Wisky and well Clemson is Clemson. Should be a minimum 10 win season. Anything less then Kelly needs to go. Any 2019 Michigans then a re-evaluation is needed.

The goal should be 10 wins at the least. Once every 5 years or so go undefeated. Frankly I have no hope that given the current climate of college football that ND can ever win a NC.

So what you are saying is you want exactly what has happened the last 3 years?
2017- 11-2
2018- 12-1
2019- 11-2

You just don’t want the blow out loss that happened is what you are trying to say.

2017 1 point loss to Georgia. Beat LSU in the bowl game. The Miami game you are referring too.

2018 undefeated season. Only loss was to the insane good Clemson team that smoked Alabama 44-16.

2019 very good tough game in Athens that we lost too. People talked about how surprised they were we could play with them. Then comes the Michigan game which you are referring too. Then when finish out the season with out a loss. Then we beat a good Iowa State team that competed with all the top big12 teams that everyone said was better then us. Oh yeah and we held them from scoring a touchdown down.

We all asked for this exactly outcome. We all wanted double digit wins. We got it.

Am I saying Kelly is perfect absolutely not. Is preparation the problem, is it the guys not executing the plays, is it we got out coached, it’s all of this combined.

 

[stlnd01]

The bottom line is we know where the ceiling is with Kelly. Saying there is no one better for the job is crazy. Much like Harbaugh Kelly usually beats the teams he should, which is most of the schedule, but cannot win the big games and has some closer than we'd like games against inferior competition. I'm not saying ND should bomb everyone on the schedule but the Michigan game, being an outlier or not, should not ever happen. Playing USC close in the state that program is in, should never happen. Close games against mediocre Virginia teams shouldn't happen. (Yes I am aware that ND beat Virginia by 15, but it was closer than that score indicated.)

Still don't have a viable run game. Still can't really stop the run against good teams.

We have 2 tough games next year. Wisky & Clemson. I expect to beat Wisky and well Clemson is Clemson. Should be a minimum 10 win season. Anything less then Kelly needs to go. Any 2019 Michigans then a re-evaluation is needed.

The goal should be 10 wins at the least. Once every 5 years or so go undefeated. Frankly I have no hope that given the current climate of college football that ND can ever win a NC.

We have won ten games in four of the last five seasons. We went undefeated in one of the last five seasons. Agree it is very, very hard for us to win a national championship with college football in its current state. Sounds like we're all on the same page.

 

[Irish#1]

The goal should be 10 wins at the least. Once every 5 years or so go undefeated.

We have won ten games in four of the last five seasons. We went undefeated in one of the last five seasons. Agree it is very, very hard for us to win a national championship with college football in its current state. Sounds like we're all on the same page.

As noted by STL, I'd say we're right on track. Heck looks like that NC should be here in 2-3 years.

 

[IrishLax]

We have won ten games in four of the last five seasons. We went undefeated in one of the last five seasons. Agree it is very, very hard for us to win a national championship with college football in its current state. Sounds like we're all on the same page.

The weirdest part of that post was complaining about run defense when by advanced stats and vanilla stats that hasn't been an issue any of the last three seasons. This year, ND's overall defense is currently #8 in FEI and likely to finish top 5ish after that Iowa State game.

It seems like that post just took all the awful crap that happened in the Michigan game and extrapolated it as a narrative for the current state of ND football.

 

[NDIrish88]

Read this. If this was the difference then WTF BK.https://www.ndinsider.com/recruitin...cle_6eef15ae-7f01-5030-b9f5-65aa6b1f2a3d.html

 

[Cali_domer]

Read this. If this was the difference then WTF BK.https://www.ndinsider.com/recruitin...cle_6eef15ae-7f01-5030-b9f5-65aa6b1f2a3d.html

Yep, I posted in the General thread. Pathetic

 

[Luckylucci]

After a kid has signed his LOI to another school I'm not sure what we expect them to say. To take these kids at their word seems a little much for me. What do you expect McMillan to say? In the end I was very close to flipping to a different school but my mom wouldn't let me leave the west coast. Or Lathan Ransom to say, when it came down to it, Columbus and Austin are dope cities and South Bend isn't. It's like DaShawn Hand spurning UM for Bama and saying it's because of academics. Yea, sure it was.

I feel confident in saying that BK could do more. However, I also feel confident in saying this narrative is getting overblown.

 

[EddytoNow]

Read this. If this was the difference then WTF BK.https://www.ndinsider.com/recruitin...cle_6eef15ae-7f01-5030-b9f5-65aa6b1f2a3d.html

If true, then Brian Kelly needs to become more personally involved in recruitment.

However, if these two recruits expected to be coddled during the recruitment process, that could easily reflect an attitude problem on the player's part. If a sense of entitlement is the real problem, it could lead to an early transfer after discovering their time on the field is dependent upon their on field work and not their 247 ranking.

 

[Cali_domer]

After a kid has signed his LOI to another school I'm not sure what we expect them to say. To take these kids at their word seems a little much for me. What do you expect McMillan to say? In the end I was very close to flipping to a different school but my mom wouldn't let me leave the west coast. Or Lathan Ransom to say, when it came down to it, Columbus and Austin are dope cities and South Bend isn't. It's like DaShawn Hand spurning UM for Bama and saying it's because of academics. Yea, sure it was.

I feel confident in saying that BK could do more. However, I also feel confident in saying this narrative is getting overblown.

Of course you do. What does the recruits have to gain by lying? Things like this have been said about BK since he has been here. But as usual (some) people do not trust those who were directly involved.

 

[BeauBenken]

After a kid has signed his LOI to another school I'm not sure what we expect them to say. To take these kids at their word seems a little much for me. What do you expect McMillan to say? In the end I was very close to flipping to a different school but my mom wouldn't let me leave the west coast. Or Lathan Ransom to say, when it came down to it, Columbus and Austin are dope cities and South Bend isn't. It's like DaShawn Hand spurning UM for Bama and saying it's because of academics. Yea, sure it was.

I feel confident in saying that BK could do more. However, I also feel confident in saying this narrative is getting overblown.

I would agree. I can only imagine that the questions asked to these kids were specifically along the lines of finding out how much Kelly was directly involved in their recruitment and turning it into a dig piece.

I think Kelly should be a bit more active in recruiting, but I really doubt Kelly not texting with a kid is all it would have taken for him to end up here. And Ransom only mentions Day calling and texting him after his position coach left. They knew if they wanted to keep him Day had to personally pull out all the stops because he likely didn't have a relationship with the other coaches either.

How hard would it be for a kid to just say like, "hey, my parents would love to talk with Coach Kelly"? I doubt Kelly would just tell them to fuck off.

 

[IrishLax]

lol Jalen McMillan is a Fresno kid who was a Jimmy Lake fan. I don't know what you guys expect. He is not going to text Kelly about "girls"... I mean this with 100% sincerity, if you want a guy to compete head-to-head with pressure recruiting you need to fire at least half the staff including the head coach. I don't think those kinds of kids usually end up being successful at ND tho.

Kelly decided after the '11, '12 and '13 classes that aggressive recruiting would fail at Notre Dame. You would land more high star guys, but those guys wouldn't necessarily work out, and then you'd be left with roster holes. Do you want me to go down the list of guys ND "won" for but really lost? So the general premise is to let the kids self-select on whether they're really interested in Notre Dame. The consequence is that they probably miss on guys like Tuitt these days, and Ransom might be an example of one of those guys that would be a good fit at ND but they don't close on. The good news is you get way fewer Aaron Lynch, Tee Shepard, Deontay Greenberry, etc. types. You get way fewer high maintenance players. You get a much better team culture. There is a reason the decommit rate for Notre Dame is so low right now.

That article mentions Kirby Smart and his elite recruiting, but ND doesn't have 20 guys missing a bowl game for various reasons. What that article suggests is that if Kelly only did a little more that it would pay massive dividends for ND... the truth is somewhere in the middle, which is that they're asking for a total paradigm shift in how Notre Dame is run to start getting certain types of players. You do that, and you are also throwing out what has built ND into a consistent winner. If you can promise me Dabo Swinney then I'm willing to roll the dice with that. Otherwise, count your blessings that we don't have a Willie Taggart situation... another HC very involved in recruiting that surprisingly doesn't make the article, along with many other cautionary tales out there.

 

[Cali_domer]

If true, then Brian Kelly needs to become more personally involved in recruitment.

However, if these two recruits expected to be coddled during the recruitment process, that could easily reflect an attitude problem on the player's part. If a sense of entitlement is the real problem, it could lead to an early transfer after discovering their time on the field is dependent upon their on field work and not their 247 ranking.

Would you not want to know the coach you're committing too? I do not think it is "coddling", it is building relationships (which is important in recruiting).

 

[T Town Tommy]

If true, then Brian Kelly needs to become more personally involved in recruitment.

However, if these two recruits expected to be coddled during the recruitment process, that could easily reflect an attitude problem on the player's part. If a sense of entitlement is the real problem, it could lead to an early transfer after discovering their time on the field is dependent upon their on field work and not their 247 ranking.

If the HC isn't communicating with recruits on a consistent basis, what's the recruit going to think? There's a difference in coddling recruits and having a meaningful relationship with them. I don't know if BK is actively involved in recruiting or not, and won't base my judgment of that on two recruits who signed at other schools. But if anything, the other school's listed in the article appears to have very active HC's in recruiting and it appears to provide some solid returns. Maybe that's something BK can take away if he needs improvement in that area.

 

[IrishLax]

Would you not want to know the coach you're committing too? I do not think it is "coddling", it is building relationships (which is important in recruiting).

This is where I think he isn't doing enough, and is legitimate criticism. He arguably should just hand his phone to a staffer and have them text (which is what most of these HCs do) if he doesn't feel like he has the time. But players looking for a "buddy" are usually not a good fit for ND, and "building a relationship" often has unintended bad consequences (see: USC team near-revolt, in no small part because of Helton playing favorites).

Engaged Brian Kelly used to do things like go to Jaylon Smith's basketball game. He doesn't do that now, and there are very real negatives to it.

I just think the narrative that he is phoning it in because he's lazy is a total trope. It's borderline clickbait, and there is a reason only certain journalists push it.

 

[Cali_domer]

If the HC isn't communicating with recruits on a consistent basis, what's the recruit going to think? There's a difference in coddling recruits and having a meaningful relationship with them. I don't know if BK is actively involved in recruiting or not, and won't base my judgment of that on two recruits who signed at other schools. But if anything, the other school's listed in the article appears to have very active HC's in recruiting and it appears to provide some solid returns. Maybe that's something BK can take away if he needs improvement in that area.

It is only year eleven. By year 45 he will have it all figured out.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

Would you not want to know the coach you're committing too? I do not think it is "coddling", it is building relationships (which is important in recruiting).

He literally said "girls" is the reason he's connected to his current coaching staff.

Are we seriously expecting BK to pick up the phone and text a 17 year old, saying "yo, how're things with Stacey? oh, that's too bad. Good news is, we are loaded over here at St. Mary's."

Give me a break. I agree with Lax, maybe he could be a little more involved, but this is two examples of 18 year old kids who chose another school. Meanwhile, we just won 11 games two years in a row, 10 three straight and 4/5, and he is on the way to (knock on wood) potentially signing a top 5 class in '21.

You guys have an axe to grind; enjoy reading your slam piece articles with two 18 year old kids as the main sources.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

lKelly decided after the '11, '12 and '13 classes that aggressive recruiting would fail at Notre Dame. You would land more high star guys, but those guys wouldn't necessarily work out, and then you'd be left with roster holes. Do you want me to go down the list of guys ND "won" for but really lost? So the general premise is to let the kids self-select on whether they're really interested in Notre Dame. The consequence is that they probably miss on guys like Tuitt these days, and Ransom might be an example of one of those guys that would be a good fit at ND but they don't close on. The good news is you get way fewer Aaron Lynch, Tee Shepard, Deontay Greenberry, etc. types. You get way fewer high maintenance players. You get a much better team culture. There is a reason the decommit rate for Notre Dame is so low right now.

Really glad I don't have Kelly's job. Imagine adopting strategy A, and it doesn't work out for a number reasons. So you switch to strategy B, and you see a huge improvement: consistent winning, recruit retention and team culture all trending strongly upward. And then an army of f*cking ungrateful armchair HCs start pining for strategy A again, and implying your performance is "unacceptable" because of an 18yos answer to a leading question by a reporter.

Some of you need a reality check.

 

[T Town Tommy]

That article mentions Kirby Smart and his elite recruiting, but ND doesn't have 20 guys missing a bowl game for various reasons. What that article suggests is that if Kelly only did a little more that it would pay massive dividends for ND... the truth is somewhere in the middle, which is that they're asking for a total paradigm shift in how Notre Dame is run to start getting certain types of players. You do that, and you are also throwing out what has built ND into a consistent winner. If you can promise me Dabo Swinney then I'm willing to roll the dice with that. Otherwise, count your blessings that we don't have a Willie Taggart situation... another HC very involved in recruiting that surprisingly doesn't make the article, along with many other cautionary tales out there.

Kirby has sold his soul to the devil in recruiting and has a horrible reputation among his peers. He can negative recruit all he wants, tell recruits what they want to hear, and on and on and then he can see a lot of them stand on the sidelines as you stated. I don't see BK ever doing this, nor should he. Could he improve? Yes. Everyone can. But sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze and that's why we see major P5 programs turning away a kid like Z. Evans. I don't want them at my school and I know ND fans don't want it at theirs.

 

[T Town Tommy]

It is only year eleven. By year 45 he will have it all figured out.

LoL... I am willing to give BK a bit more of a pass on that as the landscape of recruiting has changed dramatically the last 4-5 years. He is doing a pretty solid job with recruiting and if more involvement is needed by him in order to move up the rankings then I am confident he will.

 

[Free Manera]

Really glad I don't have Kelly's job. Imagine adopting strategy A, and it doesn't work out for a number reasons. So you switch to strategy B, and you see a huge improvement: consistent winning, recruit retention and team culture all trending strongly upward. And then an army of f*cking ungrateful armchair HCs start pining for strategy A again, and implying your performance is "unacceptable" because of an 18yos answer to a leading question by a reporter.

Some of you need a reality check.

ND obviously needs to get better at recruiting. The distance between Clemson and ND last year was the same as the distance between ND and Iowa State this year.

If this is the ceiling for Strategy B, then it's time for Strategy C.

 

[Cali_domer]

ND obviously needs to get better at recruiting. The distance between Clemson and ND last year was the same as the distance between ND and Iowa State this year.

If this is the ceiling for Strategy B, then it's time for Strategy C.

Yep, he gets paid well to produce results. Which includes beating teams we are not picked to and texting a recruit. He figured out this year how not to lose to teams he should beat. Which I applaud him for.

 

[greyhammer90]

He figured out this year how not to lose to teams he should beat. Which I applaud him for.

Imagine saying this a year after a 12-0 regular season.

 

[Cali_domer]

Imagine saying this a year after a 12-0 regular season.

Should have said "last" couple of seasons. Which I really do applaud him for. But it is always good for a huge crapping of the bed!

 

[NDdomer2]

maybe we can steal a book from the Weis era and give towels out that say 11-2 isnt good enough.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Get a load of this 'Brian Kelly' character. Doesn't even text with McMillan's second cousin about Fortnite. I mean... what would you say you do here, Brian? Do you even want to be the HC at Notre Dame?

 

[ThePiombino]

Kirby has sold his soul to the devil in recruiting and has a horrible reputation among his peers. He can negative recruit all he wants, tell recruits what they want to hear, and on and on and then he can see a lot of them stand on the sidelines as you stated. I don't see BK ever doing this, nor should he. Could he improve? Yes. Everyone can. But sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze and that's why we see major P5 programs turning away a kid like Z. Evans. I don't want them at my school and I know ND fans don't want it at theirs.

Interested in hearing more about this

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

 

[Cali_domer]

Is his bucket heavy or is his load light?

 

[beryirish]

https://twitter.com/isdupdate/status/1213484387351826433?s=21

Less than an hour before the USC game this fall, #NotreDame HC Brian Kelly used the majority of his remaining time talking with @RoccoSpindler92 & it made a huge impression on the elite 2021 Michigan OL (Premium)