2012 5Ys

Whiskeyjack

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It's looking more likely that we'll end the 2012 class by taking Standifer and maybe one more mystery recruit, which would allow us to take 6-7 5Ys for 2012. Most of us assumed that we'd only take 3-4 until recently, so I figured this subject probably deserves more serious consideration now.

We have 13 seniors with another year of eligibility: Goodman, Walker, Cave, M. Golic, Clelland, KLM, Hafis Williams, Cwynar, Newman, Posluszny, McDonald, McCarthy, and Slaughter. The three 5Y "mortal locks" haven't changed, and the reasons they'll be returning should be obvious to everyone; but of the remaining 10, who's coming back?

Goodman- His reported return seems much more credible now. He'll bring us up to 11/12 at WR for 2012, and will provide some veteran leadership on a very young unit. He also has the athleticism to be a serious playmaker; he's an early dark-horse favorite to win the "Jonas Gray" award for player who comes out of nowhere during his last year of eligibility.

M. Golic- Very likely coming back, and for good reason. Golic's presence will give us 14 OL for 2012, which is the absolute minimum I would consider an acceptable number. At the very least, he'll provide the same kind of versatile depth that Andrew Nuss did in 2011, and he may even start at ROG.

Clelland- With both Cave and M. Golic getting 5Ys, there's not much reason to bring Clelland back. Poor guy just could never stay healthy.

H. Williams, Newman & Cwynar- Their chances of returning suddenly seem much better. I think the staff will want a 5Y at DT; Cwynar would have obviously been the first choice, but since he's not coming back, it'll either be Williams or Newman. Newman is a locker room favorite and was a highly rated recruit, but he's never been able to crack the two deep. Williams, on the other hand, has provided quality depth and seen the field intermittently over the last two seasons. Williams' experience likely makes him the favorite.

Posluszny & McDonald- I don't see either of these guys coming back. Te'o, Fox, and Calabrese have locked down the ILB spots for the last two seasons, and that's unlikely to change in 2012. There's also some serious talent waiting for PT behind them; since we were overloaded at ILB in 2011 (9/8), it makes sense to let them both go.

McCarthy- The wildcard. I have no idea if the staff thinks he can start at FS, but if he can, it would improve our DB situation tremendously. Here's hoping he channels his older brother and breaks out in his final year.
 
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NDhoosier

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I say Goodman - only because it seems Kelly has already offered him.

However, after that, I see KLM, Cave, and Slaughter as my only "big needs." Cwynar was a big necessity, but we all know by now that he is moving on with his life, or so the "people" say. Golic Jr. would provide depth, but I would only take him if there are no '12 recruits to take his schollie.

KLM, Cave, and Slaughter are basically locks though and "must-haves" in my opinion.
 

IrishLax

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You're probably looking at Goodman, Golic, Ragone, McCarthy assuming we land 1 more guy and assuming reports of Cwynar being done playing are true (which is sad... the guy is a warrior... but I think he's a bit tired of getting beat up and was getting an MRI done today and might need more surgery). If we land 2 or 3 more guys I'm not sure what happens with McCarthy/Ragone or what priorities the staff has.
 

TheSunIsRising

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You're probably looking at Goodman, Golic, Ragone, McCarthy assuming we land 1 more guy and assuming reports of Cwynar being done playing are true (which is sad... the guy is a warrior... but I think he's a bit tired of getting beat up and was getting an MRI done today and might need more surgery). If we land 2 or 3 more guys I'm not sure what happens with McCarthy/Ragone or what priorities the staff has.

Very good point on Ragone; many have forgotten the fact that he may receive a 6th year. Another warrior who has been beset by injuries
 

Irish2015

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I'm pretty sure I saw that ragone already accepted a sixth year at Kansas.
 

IrishLax

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Did not think that was official. I saw a couple days ago he was considering it.

EDIT: I can't find any links remotely close to saying Ragone to Kansas for his 6th year is official. any help?

EDIT 2: ~4 days ago is when they said he was considering a move to Kansas. I see nothing since then saying he made the move.
 

Emcee77

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Totally agree with Whiskey's analysis. There are the three we already knew, meaning Slaughter, Cave and KLM, plus Goodman, plus Hafis (since we didn't get the Armsteads) but probably not Newman. Maybe McCarthy, but like everyone I have no idea what he can actually do. That goes for all of our safeties really, other than Motta, Slaughter and Collinsworth. It will be interesting to see how things shake out with Hardy and the four guys coming in.

Deion Walker's career is such a shame. My brother played basketball against him in high school and my brother said Walker played like a complete p**** because he was afraid of reinjuring his knee. No need for all that caution as it turned out ... that knee never came around. It makes me worry about Hardy and Roberson.

EDIT: left out Golic by accident. Glad we can bring him back.
 
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phgreek

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Did not think that was official. I saw a couple days ago he was considering it.

EDIT: I can't find any links remotely close to saying Ragone to Kansas for his 6th year is official. any help?

EDIT 2: ~4 days ago is when they said he was considering a move to Kansas. I see nothing since then saying he made the move.

not official, likely not credible...but someone making the call...you know how stuff like this gets legs...could be one cause of folks thinking this is over...

NOTRE DAME GO IRISH BLOG -- www.NDGOIRISH.com -- A NOTRE DAME BLOG: Will Kansas Change Its Colors to Blue & Gold?
 

buirish

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Anyone think Joe Schmidt, last years preferred walk-on from Mater Dei, might have earned the last scholarship? I could have sworn he earned an away game trip with his work on the scout team D. Just curious.
Go Irish
 

Whiskeyjack

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I forgot to "show my work" in the original post. As most should know by now, the "magic number" is 26 this year. We currently have 18 commits (counting Badger); Standifer would make 19, and mystery recruit would make 20. Thus, 26- 19/20 = 6 or 7 5Ys.

That will make the "magic number" 21 or 22 for 2013. We'll probably bring back 4 5Ys, which will allow us to take 17-18 freshman next cycle. That's a small number compared to the over-signing football factories, but it's not much smaller than ND's "ideal" recruiting situation, where we take ~20 recruits and ~5 5Ys each year.

As far as who's getting asked back, we can probably add the two formerly marginal seniors-- Goodman and Golic-- as very likely now, which leaves room for 1-2 more. My money's on Hafis and McCarthy, but if we can only take one, I have no idea who the staff prefers.

DT depth will be very interesting to watch next year. Cwynar isn't returning, Stockton has thus far been a total bust, and Springmann is an unknown. One could make a strong argument for Hafis' return.

FS is arguably more problematic though. There's no obvious replacement for Harrison anywhere on the roster. I've long thought that Slaughter would be forced to start at FS unless Hardy bounces back from his injury amazingly well or Collinsworth comes out of nowhere. This is where McCarthy could become one of our most important 5Ys. If (and this is a big "if"), the staff thinks he might be able to step in and start, that would allow Slaughter to remain at SS/ Nickelback, and Hardy would have more time to get acclimated to the position. Hell, even if McCarthy only plays FS on passing downs, that would free up Slaughter to play his natural position more often.

The only thing with McCarthy though is he willing to give up his third round pick he was projected at. If he has an ok or bad year it drops him.

McCarthy got a 3rd round grade!? I think you might be confusing him with his older brother Kyle.
 
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irishff1014

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I forgot to "show my work" in the original post. As most should know by now, the "magic number" is 26 this year. We currently have 18 commits (counting Badger); Standifer would make 19, and mystery recruit would make 20. Thus, 26- 19/20 = 6 or 7 5Ys.

That will make the "magic number" 21 or 22 for 2013. We'll probably bring back 4 5Ys, which will allow us to take 17-18 freshman next cycle. That's a small number compared to the over-signing football factories, but it's not much smaller than ND's "ideal" recruiting situation, where we take ~20 recruits and ~5 5Ys each year.

As far as who's getting asked back, we can probably add the two formerly marginal seniors-- Goodman and Golic-- as very likely now, which leaves room for 1-2 more. My money's on Hafis and McCarthy, but if we can only take one, I have no idea who the staff prefers.

DT depth will be very interesting to watch next year. Cwynar isn't returning, Stockton has thus far been a total bust, and Springmann is an unknown. One could make a strong argument for Hafis' return.

FS is arguably more problematic though. There's no obvious replacement for Harrison anywhere on the roster. I've long thought that Slaughter would be forced to start at FS unless Hardy bounces back from his injury amazingly well or Collinsworth comes out of nowhere. This is where McCarthy could become one of our most important 5Ys. If (and this is a big "if"), the staff thinks he might be able to step in and start, that would allow Slaughter to remain at SS/ Nickelback, and Hardy would have more time to get acclimated to the position. Hell, even if McCarthy only plays FS on passing downs, that would free up Slaughter to play his natural position more often.



McCarthy got a 3rd round grade!? I think you might be confusing him with his older brother Kyle.

You are right thats why i edited my post but you copied it before i edited i see.
 

STLDomer

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with collinsworth hardy baratti,shumate and prosise i dont see us keeping mcCarthy. also odds golic could start at RG?
 

Walter White

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Anyone think Joe Schmidt, last years preferred walk-on from Mater Dei, might have earned the last scholarship? I could have sworn he earned an away game trip with his work on the scout team D. Just curious.
Go Irish

I think this happens before Hafis or Kyle get asked back. I remember hearing something about Schmidt tearing it up last year during practices.
 

Whiskeyjack

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That's a good point. Schmidt traveled with the team several times this season, which speaks volumes for a walk-on. ILB, however, isn't really a need for 2012; we'll be at 7/8 on scholarship without him.
 
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jimmymac

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Joe is definitely a gamer, one of my good friends, and deserves a scholly. Gives me a lot of good info too he's a fan of IE
 

North Buffalo Irish

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That's a good point. Schmidt traveled with the team several times this season, which speaks volumes for a walk-on. ILB, however, isn't really a need for 2012; we'll be at 7/8 on scholarship without him.
1. Te'o (Sr.)
2. Fox (Sr.)
3. Calabrese (Sr.)
4. Moore (Jr.)
5. Grace (So.)
6. Utopo (Jr.)

Am I missing anyone? Does Rabasa play inside or outside? ILB is a weakness even with Te'o returning, and 2013 at ILB looks like 2012 in the defensive backfield.


Joe is definitely a gamer, one of my good friends, and deserves a scholly. Gives me a lot of good info too he's a fan of IE
He's Rees_4_Heisman, isn't he?
 

Whiskeyjack

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1. Te'o (Sr.)
2. Fox (Sr.)
3. Calabrese (Sr.)
4. Moore (Jr.)
5. Grace (So.)
6. Utopo (Jr.)

Am I missing anyone? Does Rabasa play inside or outside?

You left out Rabasa, and he's an ILB.

ILB is a weakness even with Te'o returning

How is ILB a weakness with Te'o returning? We'll have 7/8 ILBs for 2012, so depth isn't a problem, and Te'o/ Fox/ Calabrese have tons of experience. We definitely need to see some improved coverage out of our WILBs, but Fox has the athleticism for it. Fox, in particular, gets a bad rap around here; he didn't win "Defensive Newcomer of the Year" for nothing.

2013 at ILB looks like 2012 in the defensive backfield.

Not even close. Both Fox and Calabrese are eligible for a 5th year. If both return, we'll only need 2 ILBs in the 2013 class to hit ideal depth. More likely, only one gets a 5Y (probably Fox), and we'll take 2-3 ILBs next cycle.
 
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