2024-2025 ND Basketball Thread

[Huntr]

You think a recruiting class is a good reason to keep a HC who is terrible?

I think avoiding putting yourself in a deeper hole is a good reason.

 

[slick7410]

On Shrewsberry - not out on him yet (in fact, no judgement at all until midway next year). Sure, some teams can rebuild quickly in the current landscape, not this one.

His rebuild is attempting to fix:
His Incoming roster (3)
Zona - can't start for Fordham
JR Kon. - meh
Tony Sanders - can't play anywhere.
A roster of 3, that wouldn't be a top 3 on a Indiana high school contender.

Apathetic fanbase (with good reason). No portal/NIL momentum (upside to transferring there is none, mediocre history, school support average, conference downward cycle).

What he needed to be good at; recruiting of high school players (would say yes), development (intense pressure starts next year, not enough this year), and building up the reputation as a destination (no progress).

This year sucks and he could flame out in spectacular fashion, but I don't know how you tell yet.

 

[notredomer23]

I still have pretty high hopes for Shrews while also being able to acknowledge that this season is *at best* a disappointment. I watched nearly every game last year because there was at least a lot of hope and they were scrappy. I can't stomach this team.

If they aren't eaten up in the portal and can actually make a couple good portal additions added with a great recruiting class, this season can quickly be forgotten and forgiven. I just worry about the ability to retain Burton. He's going to get some HUGE offers.

 

[ab2cmiller]

You think a recruiting class is a good reason to keep a HC who is terrible?

A great recruiting class will always buy a coach an extra year at a minimum. Not sure if it's really applicable this year anyhow since there's no way that ND was going to fire him even if he had a mediocre class.

 

[notredomer23]

What's crazy, look at these losses:

Elon- ND led with 4:22 left
Rutgers- ND led in OT
Creighton- 1 possession game with 24 seconds left
UNC- ND led by 3 with 1:12 left
NCSU- ND led til the final possession
Syracuse- tie game with 5 minutes left
Miami- tie game with 3:40 left
FSU- down 1 with 2 minutes left
VT- led by 2 under 4 minutes

That's 9 games where if they were just marginally better they win the majority of those and have 16 or 17 wins right now. Ultimately it falls on Shrews for not getting better players in the portal and coaching better, but I don't think this team is nearly as far away as it feels. Especially in this weakened ACC.

 

[MacIrish75]

I’m just bummed. I enjoy following all ND sports, but I’d say outside of football, MCBB is the one I’m most passionate about. I wish we were better at baseball, and I’ve really enjoyed getting into college hockey and lacrosse, but man the Men’s program has just been so disappointing since those runs we made in the mid 2010s.

I’m not giving up on Shrews or the guys, but for me to feel confident going forward I’d love to see a positive response after last night and maybe win a couple and compete in the ACC tourney.

 

[BabyIrish]

The whole notion of getting better portal players doesn't make sense to me. The main job of a coach is to improve the play of the team. That hasn't happened this year. That's why people are frustrated and wondering if Shrews is the man for the job. The only player you can say that has improved this year as opposed to last year is Tae Davis. And as another poster pointed out, the ACC has only had one ranked team for most of the year. The team should have better results plain and simple.

 

[MacIrish75]

The whole notion of getting better portal players doesn't make sense to me. The main job of a coach is to improve the play of the team. That hasn't happened this year. That's why people are frustrated and wondering if Shrews is the man for the job. The only player you can say that has improved this year as opposed to last year is Tae Davis. And as another poster pointed out, the ACC has only had one ranked team for most of the year. The team should have better results plain and simple.

Brey really did the program a disservice on his way out. I think they need to get better at identifying talent in the portal. Here’s an example:

You’ve got a guy like Elijah Malone at NAIA Grace who is a semi local kid from LaGrange County. He’s currently averaging nearly 18 min and 8/5 for Colorado and he could be a great depth piece for us as a 6’11 center. Ryan Owens should have his finger on the pulse of every kid who played AAU in the Midwest with his ties, but we ended up only with Allocco. Sure, go for the home run transfers, but ultimately you’ve got to fill a roster with guys who can play and compete outside of just 2-3 guys.

Hopefully the portal can add us some key pieces next year so that even Shrews junior can be more of a role player and less of a guy we are depending upon to play 30 minutes, because that’s beyond his ceiling.

 

[Henges24]

The whole notion of getting better portal players doesn't make sense to me. The main job of a coach is to improve the play of the team.

I do agree, but this team is soooo young. You need to bring in experience which you can tell this team lacks in the final possessions. I’ve seen development from the main three (Burton,Kebba,Davis) and Lil Shrews has seemed to disappear, besides the first 5 mins of yesterday’s game. They’re still lacking pieces.

Next year is a huge test for Shrewsberry & they better hang onto their seats to pay Burton big money for him to even fathom staying at ND.

 

[irishandy]

I like this rant by coach Shrews- he acknowledged that he put this team in this predicament and he is asking for Notre Dame fans over opposing fans. It reminds me of Bob Davie walking out to a sea of red when ND played Nebraska.

I would give him until year 4- the team was bare when he got here. I think he can recruit 10x better than Brey we need to see development.

I like the incoming class, but that guarantees nothing. Haralson will be a 1 and done, but the rest of the class can turn this program around.

If you build it they will come; coach Shrews is building.

 

[ndfanatic78]

I dont get the hate for Shrews. Everyone knew the second Brey left it was going to take 3 - 4 years. Go listen to any talking head with a pulse after Brey left. The roster was absolutely atrocious. ND is not a basketball destination school. Yet after 2 years the fans are already turning on him. You think ND will get anyone with a pulse to replace him if they fire him after year 2 with the condition the team he took over was in? This team has no upper class leadership. You cant just say transfer portal /NIL era rebuild in 1 year and have it happen. That doesn't make sense at all. I get the frustration with the year, but come on calling for his head will set the school back even further and guess what, everyone will transfer, the amazing class ND has coming in next year will fall apart, and ND will have to start all over again with an even lesser talented coach. Next year there should be marked improvement and if not that is when there should be discussion about replacement, but even then it should be tempered expectations. This team is young, very young. Even getting upper classmen talent from the portal won't make that big of a difference. ND is just a totally different animal than almost any other school. The leadership needs to come from those that have been there for 3+ years and excel in that culture. Thats my 2 cents.

 

[BabyIrish]

I dont get the hate for Shrews. Everyone knew the second Brey left it was going to take 3 - 4 years. Go listen to any talking head with a pulse after Brey left. The roster was absolutely atrocious. ND is not a basketball destination school. Yet after 2 years the fans are already turning on him. You think ND will get anyone with a pulse to replace him if they fire him after year 2 with the condition the team he took over was in? This team has no upper class leadership. You cant just say transfer portal /NIL era rebuild in 1 year and have it happen. That doesn't make sense at all. I get the frustration with the year, but come on calling for his head will set the school back even further and guess what, everyone will transfer, the amazing class ND has coming in next year will fall apart, and ND will have to start all over again with an even lesser talented coach. Next year there should be marked improvement and if not that is when there should be discussion about replacement, but even then it should be tempered expectations. This team is young, very young. Even getting upper classmen talent from the portal won't make that big of a difference. ND is just a totally different animal than almost any other school. The leadership needs to come from those that have been there for 3+ years and excel in that culture. Thats my 2 cents.

Excuses. The team isn’t very young. Sure they’ve got sophomores and juniors but they got experience now. And the team hasn’t gotten better. They’ve regressed. I certainly think he should be given more time but the play of this team this year is very concerning. You can’t tell me that the team is better than they were last year factoring in the conference is weaker this year than it was last year. The whole team needs to figure it out. And the coach needs to man up and stop playing his son so much. He’s terrible.

 

[ndfanatic78]

Excuses. The team isn’t very young. Sure they’ve got sophomores and juniors but they got experience now. And the team hasn’t gotten better. They’ve regressed. I certainly think he should be given more time but the play of this team this year is very concerning. You can’t tell me that the team is better than they were last year factoring in the conference is weaker this year than it was last year. The whole team needs to figure it out. And the coach needs to man up and stop playing his son so much. He’s terrible.

Fuck excuses, it’s reality. Who’s better on the team than his son right now. There’s just not any good talent minus a couple guys. He’s playing what he has. Yes they have regressed. Life’s a bitch it happens.

 

[BabyIrish]

Fuck excuses, it’s reality. Who’s better on the team than his son right now. There’s just not any good talent minus a couple guys. He’s playing what he has. Yes they have regressed. Life’s a bitch it happens.

So you admit they have regressed. And that's not concerning to you?

 

[Rockin’Irish]

I like this rant by coach Shrews- he acknowledged that he put this team in this predicament and he is asking for Notre Dame fans over opposing fans. It reminds me of Bob Davie walking out to a sea of red when ND played Nebraska.

I would give him until year 4- the team was bare when he got here. I think he can recruit 10x better than Brey we need to see development.

I like the incoming class, but that guarantees nothing. Haralson will be a 1 and done, but the rest of the class can turn this program around.

If you build it they will come; coach Shrews is building.

Hundred percent agree. I was expecting to see a modest improvement this season as compared to last but that does not look like it will come to pass. He’s got to get them playing better by next season, another campaign like 2024-2025 will be the end for MS. The cupboard was exceptionally bare when Shrewsberry took over the program but I feel 3 years is enough time to see some decent improvement. I have been very disappointed with the transfers that have come in this season, must do better on that front to support the younger guys.

 

[ndfanatic78]

So you admit they have regressed. And that's not concerning to you?

I’m sayin there is a myriad of reasons for a sophomore slump. I would not be concerned until the team shows regression again next year. Though again I do agree that it was painful to watch this year but I am not giving up on him yet. Everything up to this year has been pointing to him being a hell of a coach.

 

[Henges24]

Anyone catch Garrett Sundra’s vertical? Dude couldn’t jump over a mouse.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I liked it up until he hit the mic.

I agree, that gave me serious BK post-USC loss vibes.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I don't think I'm personally on the fire Shrews wagon yet, but I'm warming up to the idea. There is no doubt that Brey left the cupboard completely and utterly bare, and we all knew this would be a rebuild. But to the point that others have made, there has been literally ZERO improvement since the day he took over, and that's troubling.

I think the only reason I'm even remotely hesitant to fire him is the incoming recruiting class, which is elite. I'd like to see what he can do with these guys. But it's a short leash.

 

[stpeteirish]

I do agree that it’s probably premature to fire him after the second year, but the points made above are very valid points. The only thing I can point to in regards to identity with this team is that they do fight and don’t quit. They bring the effort. But after that, nothing. The offense is atrocious. The defense isn’t tough or organized. The team most of the time looks lost on the court. That’s to be expected in year 1. It’s concerning in year 2.

It will be interesting how the incoming freshman look next year, but if we lose Burton and Davis in the offseason then it’s basically back to square/year one.

And losing guys like Burton and Davis has to be considered a possibility. Not sure there are too many good programs that would give them the freedom to dribble drive on every possession like they have now, however.

 

[BabyIrish]

I’m sayin there is a myriad of reasons for a sophomore slump. I would not be concerned until the team shows regression again next year. Though again I do agree that it was painful to watch this year but I am not giving up on him yet. Everything up to this year has been pointing to him being a hell of a coach.

But the problem isn’t just his son playing poorly. I mean I get a sophomore slump for one player isn’t necessarily on the coach. But the reality is the team is playing worse than it did last year and doing it in a weaker conference. Again I’m not saying he should be fired. But there are very valid concerns on whether he is going to turn this around when the team hasn’t seemed to improve this year.

 

[sfk324]

I don't think I'm personally on the fire Shrews wagon yet, but I'm warming up to the idea. There is no doubt that Brey left the cupboard completely and utterly bare, and we all knew this would be a rebuild. But to the point that others have made, there has been literally ZERO improvement since the day he took over, and that's troubling.

I think the only reason I'm even remotely hesitant to fire him is the incoming recruiting class, which is elite. I'd like to see what he can do with these guys. But it's a short leash.

I keep seeing this and I understand it, but this isn't entirely a Brey issue, it's the nature of college basketball now. If they fire Shrews, the cupboard will be bare for the next guy, too. The type of MBB players you need to compete and win in a major conference aren't sticking around through a coaching change at a place like ND if they think there are greener pastures available.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I keep seeing this and I understand it, but this isn't entirely a Brey issue, it's the nature of college basketball now. If they fire Shrews, the cupboard will be bare for the next guy, too. The type of MBB players you need to compete and win in a major conference aren't sticking around through a coaching change at a place like ND if they think there are greener pastures available.

I get that this is the landscape of CBB, but for most of the powerful programs (Duke, UNC, Kentucky, etc) this has always been the case, it was prevalent long before NIL. One and done classes, recruit, reload, wash/rinse/repeat. However, that's NEVER been the case at ND for MBB. Brey got his elite 8 runs and his better squads through veteran leadership and program guys. That's likely always going to be the case at ND, even with a boost in NIL efforts. This class might be different given the top end talent, but it would still be the outlier, not the norm.

Brey torched this thing, and NDMBB is never going to be a one and done shop like the big boys. Shrews deserves the benefit of 3 years, IMO.

 

[PolishDomer]

I really enjoyed Brey during his time here as he put ND Men's Basketball on the map...they were enjoyable teams to watch for the most part.

Major issue is the last 2-3 years he dialed it in and the roster was almost non-existent. I give Shrewsberry credit for bringing a roster together from literally zero with almost no one remaining.

My 1 issue with his team is their inability to close games in addition to the horrendous turnovers.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

I really enjoyed Brey during his time here as he put ND Men's Basketball on the map...they were enjoyable teams to watch for the most part.

Major issue is the last 2-3 years he dialed it in and the roster was almost non-existent. I give Shrewsberry credit for bringing a roster together from literally zero with almost no one remaining.

My 1 issue with his team is their inability to close games in addition to the horrendous turnovers.

At least last year they were scrappy defensively, but this year their defense is horrible and their offense lacks any semblance of rhythm. It's really tough to watch. They go on very long scoring draughts and settle for horrible jump shots late in the shot clock very frequently.

I agree with others that the most concerning aspect of this team is the lack of year over year improvement, and it really does feel stagnant, if not an outright decline.

 

[Old Man Mike]

I cannot know what he is up against in producing a "good" team, but this team isn't that.

I played a lot of ball and coached some, and I can find "pleasure" in watching lots of different styles of basketball if they are well done.

This team, however, I find unwatchable. I tried, but no.

 

[Hautian Domer]

I like this rant by coach Shrews- he acknowledged that he put this team in this predicament and he is asking for Notre Dame fans over opposing fans. It reminds me of Bob Davie walking out to a sea of red when ND played Nebraska.

I would give him until year 4- the team was bare when he got here. I think he can recruit 10x better than Brey we need to see development.

I like the incoming class, but that guarantees nothing. Haralson will be a 1 and done, but the rest of the class can turn this program around.

If you build it they will come; coach Shrews is building.

I liked it until the very end. I can’t respect a man with a temper of a toddler. How the hell are we, as fans, supposed to express our frustration solely at him and not the players? Leave cardboard cutouts at the Joyce with notes that you suck and not the players?

Coach better. Recruit better. You’re playing in the ACC and not the SEC, and your team is dog shit.

He definitely deserves another year, but his flip out on a perfectly legitimate and easy question is absurd.

 

[BabyIrish]

I liked it until the very end. I can’t respect a man with a temper of a toddler. How the hell are we, as fans, supposed to express our frustration solely at him and not the players? Leave cardboard cutouts at the Joyce with notes that you suck and not the players?

Coach better. Recruit better. You’re playing in the ACC and not the SEC, and your team is dog shit.

He definitely deserves another year, but his flip out on a perfectly legitimate and easy question is absurd.

Bingo,
It was a terrible rant, to go after fans. Is he outside of his mind for fans to come and spend $20 to watch his team lose again and again!? To lose by 15+ against Louisville. If I take my family that's $100 to get in the stadium and then $30-$50 on concessions. I'm NOT sorry to not spend that kind of money to watch a crap product.

 

[MacIrish75]

Bingo,
It was a terrible rant, to go after fans. Is he outside of his mind for fans to come and spend $20 to watch his team lose again and again!? To lose by 15+ against Louisville. If I take my family that's $100 to get in the stadium and then $30-$50 on concessions. I'm NOT sorry to not spend that kind of money to watch a crap product.

Copy and pasting this to send to Jerry Reinsdorf about why I’m not going to White Sox games this season…

 

[JD Irish]

He did a good job in year 1.

For whatever reason, he chose to not improve the roster going into year 2. The transfer players were nowhere close to good enough.

And now in year 2, the remaining players on the roster have not improved. The offensive system is terrible/non-existent, and there is no effort and/or talent on defense and rebounding. This is the result.