Who do you want to replace Brian Kelly?

[connor_in]

Relax. Until Jack publicly announces BK is the coach next year and/or all the conference championship games and playoff spots are determined anything can happen.

If we are still in the dark in a week then we can panic lol.

 

[gkIrish]

If I looked right since 2012 only 2 teams teams have finished undefeated in the top 25 not including this season. So it is harder than you portray.

I never said it was easy. I said there are plenty of coaches who could have done it considering the schedule and the talent we had. We had a player finish 2nd in the Heisman voting for Pete's sake.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Sorry mods if that was sharing too much. I just didn't want people F5ing for hours waiting for updates on something that didn't exist.

 

[Irish#1]

There was a lot of luck keeping that 2012 team from 9-3, and some very good players on it. We saw what happened when Kelly coached against an elite team, it was over in the 1st quarter.

And It's not 2012 anymore, it's 4-8.

The 2012 team had leaders on the field that refused to lose. I didn't see anyone fit that bill this year.

 

[ulukinatme]

The 2012 team had leaders on the field that refused to lose. I didn't see anyone fit that bill this year.

TBH we've been lacking quite a bit of leadership since 2012, and BK alluded to a leadership problem this year. That's one area Malik would have had an edge over Kizer. I could see Nico being a leader on defense if he starts seeing the field more. Tranquil will likely be a captain next year and might provide good leadership. As good as Jaylon was athletically, and as poor as BVG was for us defensively, I think BVG had some valid points when he called Jaylon out last year and asked if Jaylon made anyone else around him better. You need leaders that hold people accountable, bring the team together and bond so they play can play as a unit.

 

[gkIrish]

Kelly obviously deserves credit for going 12-0 and I was about as big of a BK supporter at that time as you could be.

But here are the team records of the 1st and 2nd place Heisman finishers from 2010-2015:

Derrick Henry (Alabama): 11-1 ; Christian McCaffrey (Stanford): 11-1
Marcus Mariota (Oregon): 11-1 ; Melvin Gordon (Wisconsin): 10-2
Jameis Winston (FSU): 12-0 ; AJ McCarron (Alabama): 11-1
Johnny Manziel (A&M): 10-2 ; Manti Te'o (ND): 12-0
RG III (Baylor): 10-2 ; Andrew Luck (Stanford): 11-1
Cam Newton (Auburn): 12-0 ; Andrew Luck (Stanford): 11-1

Point is, a Heisman caliber player essentially guarantees tons of wins.

 

[wizards8507]

That flight page keeps updating. Originally said 4:40, then 4:45, then 4:50.

 

[ACamp1900]

Point is, a Heisman caliber player essentially guarantees tons of wins.

Eh, I think you could easily spin that as, "Any team that does well has one of their players in the Heisman race"

 

[koonja]

That flight page keeps updating. Originally said 4:40, then 4:45, then 4:50.

#TicToc

 

[zelezo vlk]

That's one reason you need D linemen with motors, to keep the other guys revved up. We better hope that Daelin can provide that. Nyles could help with the linebackers and even Greer, if he can consistently be starting. It's hard to lead from the sideline.

Hopefully Wimbush keeps the foot on the gas pedal.

Edit: Again guys, that's not a real flight.

 

[gkIrish]

Eh, I think you could easily spin that as, "Any team that does well has one of their players in the Heisman race"

I knew someone would say that haha. Every one of those guys was a first rounder besides McCarron and most of them were top 2 picks. I think that tells you how good those players were in college.

 

[Meatloaf]

The flight is a lie

 

[ACamp1900]

I knew someone would say that haha. Every one of those guys was a first rounder besides McCarron and most of them were top 2 picks. I think that tells you how good those players were in college.

And they were in a first round filled with a bunch of other players that were just as good from other schools....

 

[gkIrish]

Eh, I think you could easily spin that as, "Any team that does well has one of their players in the Heisman race"

Also it's no coincidence that we had a 10 win season with Jaylon Smith and Will Fuller as upperclassmen. It's simply not that hard to win 10 games with talent like that. The good coaches are the ones that win 9-10 games with sub par talent.

 

[ACamp1900]

Also it's no coincidence that we had a 10 win season with Jaylon Smith and Will Fuller as upperclassmen. It's simply not that hard to win 10 games with talent like that. The good coaches are the ones that win 9-10 games with sub par talent.

This I agree with.

 

[gkIrish]

And they were in a first round filled with a bunch of other players that were just as good from other schools....

You take Johnny Manziel off of the Aggies that year and they win 8 games at best. No Cam Newton = 9-10 wins. No Jameis and they sure as hell don't go undefeated. That's the point I'm making.

 

[ACamp1900]

You take Johnny Manziel off of the Aggies that year and they win 8 games at best. No Cam Newton = 9-10 wins. No Jameis and they sure as hell don't go undefeated. That's the point I'm making.

Sure, but you could say that about MANY of the first rounders from any team....

You could also plug and play some of the others too though, like Henry... there were probably four RBs on that squad that could have filled in for Henry without much difference. The Heisman isn't just about the player, it's as much of a' most famous player on the best team' award as anything.

 

[irishff1014]

TBH we've been lacking quite a bit of leadership since 2012, and BK alluded to a leadership problem this year. That's one area Malik would have had an edge over Kizer. I could see Nico being a leader on defense if he starts seeing the field more. Tranquil will likely be a captain next year and might provide good leadership. As good as Jaylon was athletically, and as poor as BVG was for us defensively, I think BVG had some valid points when he called Jaylon out last year and asked if Jaylon made anyone else around him better. You need leaders that hold people accountable, bring the team together and bond so they play can play as a unit.

MZ could have been a leader from the side line he choose not too.

Hopefully Morgan will step up in 17.

 

[gkIrish]

Sure, but you could say that about ANY of the first rounders from any team....

You could also plug and play some of the other too though, like Henry... there were probably four RBs on that squad that could have filled in for Henry without much difference. The Heisman isn't just about the player, it's as much of a' most famous player on the best team' award as anything.

Agree to disagree. I think talent is evident and in college football one player can elevate a team. I don't disagree that any Bama or Wisconsin RB would have been really good those years but it's not like Bama is putting out 2000+ yard backs every year.

 

[ACamp1900]

Agree to disagree. I think talent is evident and in college football one player can elevate a team. I don't disagree that any Bama or Wisconsin RB would have been really good those years but it's not like Bama is putting out 2000+ yard backs every year.

I don't really disagree with this statement on it's face, I guess my point is there are numerous players that ball the feck out in college and elevate their teams to varying degrees but the team to start with is often not that good, and then there are good teams that would be good anyway that just happen to have a stat whore or an actually considerable talent... and that's who wins the Heisman.

 

[irishff1014]

Come on Jack you have made us wait long enough please just tell us what the hell is going on.

 

[NDgradstudent]

Come on Jack you have made us wait long enough please just tell us what the hell is going on.

Why would he make an announcement to tell us Kelly is back next year? Did he make such an announcement last year?

 

[Cali_domer]

Why would he make an announcement to tell us Kelly is back next year? Did he make such an announcement last year?

Only reason he would is because recruiting could be helped.

 

[ulukinatme]

MZ could have been a leader from the side line he choose not too.

Hopefully Morgan will step up in 17.

It's rather hard to be a leader from the sidelines. Have you played sports? It's kind of hard leading from the bench. I imagine it's even harder when you were "the guy" and told it's "your team" after grinding for years to get there, and then that's no longer the case. Lets not forget these are 18-22 year old young men, this is their life.

But hey, I'm sure if you were in his position you would have picked up the pom poms and would have helped the team win 12 games.

 

[Domina Nostra]

It's rather hard to be a leader from the sidelines. Have you played sports? It's kind of hard leading from the bench. I imagine it's even harder when you were "the guy" and told it's "your team" after grinding for years to get there, and then that's no longer the case. Lets not forget these are 18-22 year old young men, this is their life.

But hey, I'm sure if you were in his position you would have picked up the pom poms and would have helped the team win 12 games.

I don't dislike of Zaire on any level.

But there is also something to recognizing what you are good at. Zaire was like the college version of the pro Tim Tebow. He has a skill set that is really great when its working under just the right conditions, but it is obviously limited in some fundamental ways.

Kelly, like most high D1 coaches, prefers a QB who can and does throw first. Zaire didn't want to go to a school, like maybe GA Tech, that would have fit his skill set. Instead, he followed the contemporary trend of athletes to walk around 100% convinced that if they are 100% convinced, all their lofty goals will be realized. It wasn't true for Tebow, and it wasn't true for Zaiere. Both should have tried H-back.

He seems like a good kid, but he didn't end up second string because Kelly favored Kizer. He was second-string because Kelly didn't play favorites.

 

[Cali_domer]

Swarbrick announces Weis to return
Notre Dame AD says foundation is in place
Charlie Weis Dec 3 2008

Oct. 29 2016 Brian Kelly
Swarbrick says he sees no cracks in the foundation, ...

Swarbrick doesn't know much about foundations

 

[irishff1014]

It's rather hard to be a leader from the sidelines. Have you played sports? It's kind of hard leading from the bench. I imagine it's even harder when you were "the guy" and told it's "your team" after grinding for years to get there, and then that's no longer the case. Lets not forget these are 18-22 year old young men, this is their life.

But hey, I'm sure if you were in his position you would have picked up the pom poms and would have helped the team win 12 games.

You are correct it is hard but if everything was easy Everyone would be good.

I did play a lot of sports most which were coached by my father which I had a much higher standard than the rest of the team.

 

[Irishize]

There was a lot of luck keeping that 2012 team from 9-3, and some very good players on it. We saw what happened when Kelly coached against an elite team, it was over in the 1st quarter.

And It's not 2012 anymore, it's 4-8.

Yup. Outside of 2012 (year 3), the win over Sparty in 9/13 is the only impressive win we can point to over his other six years. And that's only impressive in hindsight as Sparty improved w/ first-year starter Conner Cook and ran the table the rest of the way en route to a Rose Bowl win & top 5 finish.

Meanwhile, Pat Narduzzi has recorded two impressive wins in only his second season at Pitt. He has yet to register a head turning W/L record but he beat the B10 East champs who also happen to be their bitter rival and beat Clemson in Death Valley (something a more talented ND couldn't do).

The door to Midwest dominance was open for Kelly but it quickly closed with Wisky & PSU joining tOSU & UM as the programs to beat.

Kelly is a damn good coach...but he's not a great, elite coach. I suspect ND will finish 9-3/8-4 next year & we will hear how ND fans were crazy to want him gone. Then in 2018, when the wheels fall off again we will hear how ND should've known not to keep him after 2016.

 

[Irishize]

I think 4-8 in year 7 is a fireable offense by itself but I personally view his entire resume post-2012 as a massive failure. He could have gone 8-4 this year and I would want him gone.

When you factor in the times he flirted with other teams (Philly NFL in 1/13, SC last season) after "successful" seasons yet demands "buy in" from his players & staff, I agree with you.

 

[irishff1014]

Why would he make an announcement to tell us Kelly is back next year? Did he make such an announcement last year?

I know he said it durning the season. But he needs to come out and say that Brian Kelly is the head football coach so recruits know as well as they can't this new start hired.