Who do you want to replace Brian Kelly?

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

FWIW, Wiltfong believes that hiring Vince Marrow to replace Booker is a no brainer and that he is an elite recruiter and great coach.

Is there any reason to believe ND is interested in him or is Wiltfong just speculating?

 

[IrishLion]

FWIW, Wiltfong believes that hiring Vince Marrow to replace Booker is a no brainer and that he is an elite recruiter and great coach.

Is there any reason to believe ND is interested in him or is Wiltfong just speculating?

I posted this in another place, but Marrow is a tremendous recruiter, particularly when it comes to Ohio. UK isn't stealing guys that OSU wants, but they ARE stealing guys that OSU would normally keep on a leash in case they needed a filler late in the cycle. He's been a thorn in their sides for a few years now in terms of taking away their backup plans. He's a legend among UK fans.

There's probably something to it if Wiltfong is posting it, but it makes sense either way when you consider everything together. You'd be adding a great recruiter with experience in the state of Ohio that can also coach your TE's (though TE's aren't asked to do much at UK, so that's sort of a question mark).

 

[BoredIrish]

So now that booker is out... Do they hire from the outside?

Booker and Sanford were both decent recruiters. While I like Jeff Quinn, I'm not sure what he does to fill the recruiting gap left by their departures.

I think BK has to bring in some new blood with strong recruiting potential. I would actually like to see Denbrock shift over to TE's and hire a young Autry Denson - Tee Martin type to coach WR's and QB's. I think those are the two positions where you need a flashy young type of guy who can relate with their position players.

 

[PANDFAN]

Booker and Sanford were both decent recruiters. While I like Jeff Quinn, I'm not sure what he does to fill the recruiting gap left by their departures.

I think BK has to bring in some new blood with strong recruiting potential. I would actually like to see Denbrock shift over to TE's and hire a young Autry Denson - Tee Martin type to coach WR's and QB's. I think those are the two positions where you need a flashy young type of guy who can relate with their position players.

denbrock is one of the main reason we get in the door w/ half of these cali kids....his position has been as consistent as they come

 

[Cackalacky]

I posted this in another place, but Marrow is a tremendous recruiter, particularly when it comes to Ohio. UK isn't stealing guys that OSU wants, but they ARE stealing guys that OSU would normally keep on a leash in case they needed a filler late in the cycle. He's been a thorn in their sides for a few years now in terms of taking away their backup plans. He's a legend among UK fans.

There's probably something to it if Wiltfong is posting it, but it makes sense either way when you consider everything together. You'd be adding a great recruiter with experience in the state of Ohio that can also coach your TE's (though TE's aren't asked to do much at UK, so that's sort of a question mark).

They arent asked to do much here either. Lol

 

[Luckylucci]

You are talking about statistics and recruiting rankings while I am talking about football players--example---what was Chris Zorich's recruiting ranking. I think he was a 3 star guy if memory serves me correctly. Very glad to hear the good news that we smoked Duke N C State VT and Navy in recruiting as they football played us into losses. Off hand after watching those games I'd say the were better and tougher both mentally and physically. This reaction to the truth is just my point. Actually I'm not sure Zoro was even a 3 star guy.

If you don't trust the recruiting rankings fine, then we have substantially more NFL players than those teams do. Anyway you slice it, we have better players, it's just a fact. We aren't losing those games because of talent.

 

[Shamrock Theories]

loool

 

[BeauBenken]

Is there any reason to believe ND is interested in him or is Wiltfong just speculating?

I think Wiltfong is just pointing out who a great addition would be. And he's right. But it seems like Quinn is more likely to be coaching TEs next year rather than Marrow. And that'd be fine. But good lord would Marrow be a dream.

 

[Blaise]

If I'm reading correctly, Grinch has only been a DC for 2015 and 2016. He was a safeties coach before that.

Some Seahawks, some Husky, lots of Missouri — here’s what WSU DC Alex Grinch’s ‘Speed D’ was built on | The Seattle Times

Yeah but his instantly made WSU defense credible last year and this year they got better...

Read this story.. It talks about him wanting a speed D.. Him trying to model his defenses off the Seahawks.. He preaches the type of defense that people on this site has been crying for

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Some Seahawks, some Husky, lots of Missouri — here’s what WSU DC Alex Grinch’s ‘Speed D’ was built on | The Seattle Times

Yeah but his instantly made WSU defense credible last year and this year they got better...

Read this story.. It talks about him wanting a speed D.. Him trying to model his defenses off the Seahawks.. He preaches the type of defense that people on this site has been crying for

The Seahawks basically run a modified Tampa 2 do they not?

EDIT: No, I'm not going to read the article while at work.

 

[BobbyMac]

True because everyone knows BK is a Duncan Donuts guy and the press will be circling DD like turkey buzzards.

Them Boston boys love their Double D. (As do I)

I'm excited if/when Elko is the new DC not because of his reputation that he is building but because he's from the ACC. Since ND plays 4-5 ACC teams a year, having the experience that Elko has going up against them each year will make the learning curve for game planning against them much more comfortable and not so steep.

I think that's important for Kelly short term. Plus he's getting above average results from below average talent. That's a better formula than bringing in Grinch who is recruiting fast Cali kids that are over looked by SC, UCLA, Oregon...

Has Quinn ever been a QB coach?

O Line guy primarily... maybe some TE, don't remember that part.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> coach Brian Kelly should make Vince Marrow an absolute priority for his staff. Great TE coach and elite recruiter.</p>— Steve Wiltfong (@SWiltfong247) <a href="https://twitter.com/SWiltfong247/status/808676365964808192">December 13, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I remember Vince when he was a guard at Youngstown... in basketball. He later transferred into the MAC (BG or Toledo) and switched/concentrated on football. He was with even the Bears for a year or two.

He would be a good fit at ND BUT Mark Stoops is his childhood buddy from Cardinal Moody. So it's more than money and a perceived move up. He's moving out of his successful matirx to the GVS All Stars and it's neutered "TEU" designation. A real move up in his position would be to join his other buddy from Youngstown, Tim Beck and the offensive staff at OSU. Hard to believe all those guys AND Bo Pelini were all on the same team.

Who would you guys prefer between Grinch and Elko?

Jimmy Lake.

Long term (which you can't plan on) Grinch. He's putting up good #'s with an offense built to keep him on the field.

All things considered it's Elko. As already noted, he knows half the schedule and he gets good results from below average talent. Seems to be the easiest plug in to do what ND (and Kelly) need. Also his scheme will benefit ND's back end talent with it's multitude of tweeners.

Dude kills the game for UK as a recruiter. He is a legend among their fanbase, and is a thorn in OSU's side when it comes to recruiting their backup-plans away from Ohio.
TE production isn't great at UK, but they are a really weird run-first air-raid.

Kentucky has become a major Tier 2 player for OSU's 'don't-wants' and he's the coordinator. MSU used to own these guys. Dantonio built a program on them. UK has been in on a lot of good guys. They definitely have a plan. They know their demo and they work it. Plus, everyone makes fun of UK Football but, Lexington is easy on the eyes when you're there.

If you're a TE recruit, I would think you could only be more committed with the exodus of Booker. I can't see production at the position being any worse under another coach. 12 receptions all year by a TE! Regardless if BK doesn't utilize the TE in his offense this year, he did at one point.

Production has nothing to do with the TE coach. It's system philosophy. BK hasn't thrown to inline TE's since he was forced to because of the personnel he inherited. Rudolph got a lot of targets with Crist/Rees in '10 and Niklas got a lot of targets with Rees in '13. When he's had an athletic QB, nada.

denbrock is one of the main reason we get in the door w/ half of these cali kids....his position has been as consistent as they come

ND gets in the door because the good players in the LA/OC/IE area expect to get offered by ND. But Denbrock is good. Everyone like him. Denbrock could be a star at any school. He'd get the same respect at OU, UT, Stanford, Bama or Miami. He's that guy.

 

[pkt77242]

Production has nothing to do with the TE coach. It's system philosophy. BK hasn't thrown to inline TE's since he was forced to because of the personnel he inherited. Rudolph got a lot of targets with Crist/Rees in '10 and Niklas got a lot of targets with Rees in '13. When he's had an athletic QB, nada.

Agree that it is system philosophy, though I think the big reason for Rees targeting TE's was lack of arm strength not his lack of athleticism. With stronger armed QBs such as Golson and Kizer the deep outside throws are opened up and Rees just didn't have the arm strength to do it (and you could argue that he struggled with intermediate outside throws as well).

 

[Luckylucci]

Them Boston boys love their Double D. (As do I)




I think that's important for Kelly short term. Plus he's getting above average results from below average talent. That's a better formula than bringing in Grinch who is recruiting fast Cali kids that are over looked by SC, UCLA, Oregon...




O Line guy primarily... maybe some TE, don't remember that part.




I remember Vince when he was a guard at Youngstown... in basketball. He later transferred into the MAC (BG or Toledo) and switched/concentrated on football. He was with even the Bears for a year or two.

He would be a good fit at ND BUT Mark Stoops is his childhood buddy from Cardinal Moody. So it's more than money and a perceived move up. He's moving out of his successful matirx to the GVS All Stars and it's neutered "TEU" designation. A real move up in his position would be to join his other buddy from Youngstown, Tim Beck and the offensive staff at OSU. Hard to believe all those guys AND Bo Pelini were all on the same team.



Jimmy Lake.

Long term (which you can't plan on) Grinch. He's putting up good #'s with an offense built to keep him on the field.

All things considered it's Elko. As already noted, he knows half the schedule and he gets good results from below average talent. Seems to be the easiest plug in to do what ND (and Kelly) need. Also his scheme will benefit ND's back end talent with it's multitude of tweeners.



Kentucky has become a major Tier 2 player for OSU's 'don't-wants' and he's the coordinator. MSU used to own these guys. Dantonio built a program on them. UK has been in on a lot of good guys. They definitely have a plan. They know their demo and they work it. Plus, everyone makes fun of UK Football but, Lexington is easy on the eyes when you're there.




Production has nothing to do with the TE coach. It's system philosophy. BK hasn't thrown to inline TE's since he was forced to because of the personnel he inherited. Rudolph got a lot of targets with Crist/Rees in '10 and Niklas got a lot of targets with Rees in '13. When he's had an athletic QB, nada.




ND gets in the door because the good players in the LA/OC/IE area expect to get offered by ND. But Denbrock is good. Everyone like him. Denbrock could be a star at any school. He'd get the same respect at OU, UT, Stanford, Bama or Miami. He's that guy.

Golson to Eifert in 2012. Those numbers were very respectable.

 

[BobbyMac]

Golson to Eifert in 2012. Those numbers were very respectable.

My point was about Kelly using traditional inline TE's. Obviously, Kelly used Eifert perfectly... he was a match up nightmare in the slot or split wide. I hope AJ brings that back to the scheme next year.

 

[ShamrockOnHelmet]

The Seahawks basically run a modified Tampa 2 do they not?

EDIT: No, I'm not going to read the article while at work.

I watch zero Seahawks games, so could be wrong, but I thought the whole legion of boom thing was a persistent 3 deep zone, man under.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

I watch zero Seahawks games, so could be wrong, but I thought the whole legion of boom thing was a persistent 3 deep zone, man under.

My recollection was that they like to 2 gap with a DE so the safeties don't have any gap assignments in their base D but otherwise are a 1 gap team. So I think we're pretty close here. But my memory isn't what it used to be and I'm just killing time at work.

 

[Classic Irish]

So now that booker is out... Do they hire from the outside?

What's Mark Bavaro doing these days?

 

[GBdomer]

I brought up bringing in Vance Morrow to Wiltfong on twitter and basically trolled the whole UK fanbase. They are still going at it, we have been going on ten hours now. Talk about a bunch of annoying shit heads. They keep telling me how they take ND recruits and UK is headed in a better direction than ND. If someone wants to help me out feel free but I got this one handled for now.

 

[GBdomer]

Grinch isn't a option. Wiltfong backtracking, shocking from that site. They never jump the gun

 

[ShamrockOnHelmet]

My recollection was that they like to 2 gap with a DE so the safeties don't have any gap assignments in their base D but otherwise are a 1 gap team. So I think we're pretty close here. But my memory isn't what it used to be and I'm just killing time at work.

That makes sense, if you have the closed side playing 2 gap and the other playing 1. I have seen the patriots and Texans do that, just not the constant cover 3.

 

[NDShark]

I brought up bringing in Vance Morrow to Wiltfong on twitter and basically trolled the whole UK fanbase. They are still going at it, we have been going on ten hours now. Talk about a bunch of annoying shit heads. They keep telling me how they take ND recruits and UK is headed in a better direction than ND. If someone wants to help me out feel free but I got this one handled for now.

Thanks for the laughs!

 

[GBdomer]

Driskell is hearing Longo will get a demotion and Quinn will be on the staff in some form

IMO what will happen

Call player Kelly, Quinn is the OC, Denbrock AHC and WR coach

Elko brings his DL coach, Gilmore gone, Lyght is let go

Special teams who knows

Longo takes a step down and someone knew and proven outside the program comes in

 

[JT_IRISH]

Press corners please

 

[IrishFanJMercy]

I can see Quinn being the OC he was under Kelly at cinn in 2007 and 08 when they won quite a bit of games

 

[Luckylucci]

Bring back the tempo. Let's let Wimbush loose. Don't shackle him to this idea of perfection, where there is a game inside every play. Call it and haul it!

 

[OCIrish]

Agree that it is system philosophy, though I think the big reason for Rees targeting TE's was lack of arm strength not his lack of athleticism. With stronger armed QBs such as Golson and Kizer the deep outside throws are opened up and Rees just didn't have the arm strength to do it (and you could argue that he struggled with intermediate outside throws as well).

I also feel part of the issue has been the QB play themselves. When I've been frustrated with Kizer this past season, it's been mostly when he's missed wide open WR's, and more often than not, it was the TE running wide open without anyone within 10 sometimes 15 yards of him.

 

[IrishFanJMercy]

Biggest mistake mixer made this year was in situations where he had an open lane to run he decided to hold on to look for an open man and tried to throw or threw it away when he could have gotten 5-8 yards

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I do like me some Dunkin Donuts also. But prefer Tom Hortons!


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[NDdomer2]

That damn mixer and his terrible sacks!

 

[BobbyMac]

I do like me some Dunkin Donuts also. But prefer Tom Hortons!


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You've been PMing with Vancouver too much. Take off hoser.