Silly Season '13 (Coaching Changes)

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

If PSU gets Franklin that's a really good hire right? I always thought he was a much better get than Golden or Munchak.

In a vacuum I agree.

On the other hand, O'Brien's comments off the record give me some pause. Franklin is a PA guy but has no connections to PSU. It seems there is a stronger possibility for conflict with the Paterno die hards who will be more likely to question Franklin than a PSU guy.

I also think that Franklin is a climber and will be quite willing to walk away if he gets another good opportunity and gets tired of fighting the Paterno faction.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

i was checking to see who franklin was following...damn following a vandy cheerleader...hmmmmm

I can foresee the next PSU scandal.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Boom. IMO, this is the right hire, not Golden, regardless of the fact that he isn't a Penn State guy. He is going to kill it in recruiting Penn State and the mid-Atlantic in general.

Totally agree on it being the right hire. Best they could do (and better than I thought they could do). But I'm not as big on the mid-Atlantic talent as you are, and not as optimistic about what they can accomplish with it. Maybe you know better than me, being from the area, or maybe you are overestimating it because it's your part of the country. Time will tell, I guess. I don't see Penn State in the same class as Michigan or OSU. Their ceiling is closer Iowa or Wisconsin (who is perennially overrated) and maybe Michigan State (although I don't see them ever having as good of a year as MSU did this year, barring a miracle).

 

[irishog77]

Franklin can't talk trash when his team can't possibly play in a bowl game...nor be an also-ran in an also-ran (at best) conference.

Of course, he can wait in the wings for 2, 3 years then run his mouth off probably like we've never seen him do, when they do actually, you know, make a bowl...but I doubt he'd stick around long enough to do that anyway.

This would be a dumb hire for PSU if what they really want is a "lifer" there. Dude will be out the door for another better job before PSU even knows what hit them.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Would be a great hire. Will partner a coach that I think is a tier 1 guy with a program that I'm not sure about. But if he can recruit at Vandy, he can recruit at PSU.

 

[NDohio]

I wonder if he will still vote for all SEC teams in the coaches poll?

 

[Irish#1]

Maybe the die-hard JoePa folks will give Franklin a little more leeway after seeing them run off a good coach. Probably not, but you never know.

Just heard a comment by Red McCombs. He says Strong is only qualified to be a coach and maybe a coordinator, but he's not HC material.

 

[IrishLax]

Totally agree on it being the right hire. Best they could do (and better than I thought they could do). But I'm not as big on the mid-Atlantic talent as you are, and not as optimistic about what they can accomplish with it. Maybe you know better than me, being from the area, or maybe you are overestimating it because it's your part of the country. Time will tell, I guess. I don't see Penn State in the same class as Michigan or OSU. Their ceiling is closer Iowa or Wisconsin (who is perennially overrated) and maybe Michigan State (although I don't see them ever having as good of a year as MSU did this year, barring a miracle).

Maybe I'm overvaluing the talent they will have access to, and obviously they'll have to fight ACC, SEC, and Big Ten teams for it. I think the proof is in the pudding with mid-Atlantic talent (if you include Virginia in the mid-Atlantic and no the "south", which may be a stretch depending on who you talk to). For years and years Virginia Tech scooped up underrated talent from Virginia, MD, DC and PA, and won 10 games easily in a competitive ACC. Then people started paying attention to these kids, and Virginia Tech had to start fighting national powers for them (and losing some battles), and Tech has gone downhill while the talent has gone elsewhere.

Looking at this year's mid-Atlantic talent, if you constructed a class strictly from NY, NJ, PA, MD, VA, and DC, per 247 Composite you would have the:
#2 (Peppers)
#4 (Hand)
#6 (Brown)
#8 (Blanding)
#24 (Tabor)
#25 (Prince)
#61 (Nelson)
#84 (Holmes)
#89 (Holley)
#103 (Nnandi)
#108 (Aniebonam)
#112 (Henry)
#124 (Blacknall)
#125 (Kamara)
#135 (Trumbetti)
#144 (Henderson)
#176 (Bookser)
#179 (Godwin)
#188 (Brown)
#197 (Moss)
#198 (Nicholson)
#206 (Gesicki)
#207 (Dickerson)
#212 (Cosentino)
#221 (Payne)

So that's an entire 25 man class of 5-star and 4-star players in the mid-Atlantic, and they wouldn't even need to go into Ohio or Michigan or the south. The only "local" teams they'd have to compete with for those guys are Rutgers, Maryland, Pitt, Virginia, and Virginia Tech. Not exactly going toe-to-toe with Saban or trying to grab a guy from Sumlin's/Strong's backyard. There is a #1 class worth of talent in their backyard and the local teams they have to compete with for it are all varying degrees of "meh."

You might be right that they'll have trouble truly capitalizing on the talent that is there and they might not be able to get over the hump, but I think once sanctions are up that they'll be very competitive in a relatively weak Big Ten. I guess we'll have to wait and see what Franklin can do.

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>From sources close to the situation, <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23PennState&src=hash">#PennState</a> has yet to offer anyone the job. Reports about an offer are inaccurate.</p>— Bruce Feldman (@BFeldmanCBS) <a href="https://twitter.com/BFeldmanCBS/statuses/420616267909697537">January 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[tussin]

Maybe I'm overvaluing the talent they will have access to, and obviously they'll have to fight ACC, SEC, and Big Ten teams for it. I think the proof is in the pudding with mid-Atlantic talent (if you include Virginia in the mid-Atlantic and no the "south", which may be a stretch depending on who you talk to). For years and years Virginia Tech scooped up underrated talent from Virginia, MD, DC and PA, and won 10 games easily in a competitive ACC. Then people started paying attention to these kids, and Virginia Tech had to start fighting national powers for them (and losing some battles), and Tech has gone downhill while the talent has gone elsewhere.

Looking at this year's mid-Atlantic talent, if you constructed a class strictly from NY, NJ, PA, MD, VA, and DC, per 247 Composite you would have the:
#2 (Peppers)
#4 (Hand)
#6 (Brown)
#8 (Blanding)
#24 (Tabor)
#25 (Prince)
#61 (Nelson)
#84 (Holmes)
#89 (Holley)
#103 (Nnandi)
#108 (Aniebonam)
#112 (Henry)
#124 (Blacknall)
#125 (Kamara)
#135 (Trumbetti)
#144 (Henderson)
#176 (Bookser)
#179 (Godwin)
#188 (Brown)
#197 (Moss)
#198 (Nicholson)
#206 (Gesicki)
#207 (Dickerson)
#212 (Cosentino)
#221 (Payne)

So that's an entire 25 man class of 5-star and 4-star players in the mid-Atlantic, and they wouldn't even need to go into Ohio or Michigan or the south. The only "local" teams they'd have to compete with for those guys are Rutgers, Maryland, Pitt, Virginia, and Virginia Tech. Not exactly going toe-to-toe with Saban or trying to grab a guy from Sumlin's/Strong's backyard. There is a #1 class worth of talent in their backyard and the local teams they have to compete with for it are all varying degrees of "meh."

You might be right that they'll have trouble truly capitalizing on the talent that is there and they might not be able to get over the hump, but I think once sanctions are up that they'll be very competitive in a relatively weak Big Ten. I guess we'll have to wait and see what Franklin can do.

They have a recent history of recruiting that region well, and that was with a senior citizen at the helm. I think there's a strong chance that an energized Franklin will do very well in recruiting.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>From sources close to the situation, <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23PennState&src=hash">#PennState</a> has yet to offer anyone the job. Reports about an offer are inaccurate.</p>— Bruce Feldman (@BFeldmanCBS) <a href="https://twitter.com/BFeldmanCBS/statuses/420616267909697537">January 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I pray Franklin doesn't end up at PSU. If he does though, I can't see it being a long stay in Unhappy Valley.

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>A Penn State commit told me Vanderbilt coaches followed them on twitter "in case" James Franklin takes the job.</p>— Tom VanHaaren (@TomVH) <a href="https://twitter.com/TomVH/statuses/420603528776646656">January 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>And now Vandy coordinators are following Louisville commits. This is funny. <a href="http://t.co/5nRT3nWx7e">http://t.co/5nRT3nWx7e</a></p>— Luke Stampini (@LukeStampini) <a href="https://twitter.com/LukeStampini/statuses/420604483786129408">January 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

Soon Strong and Franklin will learn that the PSU fanbase and the Texas boosters are poison and take different jobs within 4 years.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Lax: (not quoting because your post is big and you know what you said)

Even if Franklin does exceptionally well recruiting that area and the area continues to produce talent at that level every year, you still aren't going to get every one of the 25 best players from an area that covers all or parts of six states. Some kids will become national recruits and end up at national programs (likely the best of the bunch), some kids will want to be closer to home or bond better with another staff or another school's class, and there will be other factors like position redundancy, etc. So even an exceptional job may only get you 18 or 20 of those 25 kids. It is more than enough to beat Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois and Purdue every year, but will you be able to beat OSU, Wisconsin, MSU, UM and Nebraska consistently? Will you be able to accumulate enough premier talent to go out to California and win a Rose Bowl? I'm not convinced, but anything is possible.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

For fun, I just looked up PSU's recruiting ranking from 2002 to the present on Rivals (that's how far it goes back):

2002 - 21st
2003 - 93rd
2004 - 29th
2005 - 25th
2006 - 6th
2007 - 24th
2008 - 43rd
2009 - 24th
2010 - 12th
2011 - 35th
2012 - 51st
2013 - 34th

I don't know what it means, necessarily, but I was curious.

 

[irishog77]

Lax: (not quoting because your post is big and you know what you said)

Even if Franklin does exceptionally well recruiting that area and the area continues to produce talent at that level every year, you still aren't going to get every one of the 25 best players from an area that covers all or parts of six states. Some kids will become national recruits and end up at national programs (likely the best of the bunch), some kids will want to be closer to home or bond better with another staff or another school's class, and there will be other factors like position redundancy, etc. So even an exceptional job may only get you 18 or 20 of those 25 kids. It is more than enough to beat Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois and Purdue every year, but will you be able to beat OSU, Wisconsin, MSU, UM and Nebraska consistently? Will you be able to accumulate enough premier talent to go out to California and win a Rose Bowl? I'm not convinced, but anything is possible.

Yep.

And we're not hearing anything we don't already know on the PSU recruiting front. Basically every team in the sec, ACC, half the Big XII, tOSU, and all the California and Arizona schools have enough "back yard" talent to hypothetically have top recruiting class in the country, year in and year out. Add onto that the enormous geographic region that PSU can seemingly "lock up," and apply that expansive geographic radius to the other schools mentioned...and their recruiting becomes even better.

And then comes the fact that ND, much of the big 10, the ACC, the sec, the local schools, etc. all already recruit that "region" and I'm going to say there's about 0% ANY coach will come to PSU (especially right now with sanctions and a huge black eye) will come in and lock up that region when it comes to recruiting.

 

[IrishLax]

Lax: (not quoting because your post is big and you know what you said)

Even if Franklin does exceptionally well recruiting that area and the area continues to produce talent at that level every year, you still aren't going to get every one of the 25 best players from an area that covers all or parts of six states. Some kids will become national recruits and end up at national programs (likely the best of the bunch), some kids will want to be closer to home or bond better with another staff or another school's class, and there will be other factors like position redundancy, etc. So even an exceptional job may only get you 18 or 20 of those 25 kids. It is more than enough to beat Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois and Purdue every year, but will you be able to beat OSU, Wisconsin, MSU, UM and Nebraska consistently? Will you be able to accumulate enough premier talent to go out to California and win a Rose Bowl? I'm not convinced, but anything is possible.

Right, that makes sense. I guess what I'm saying is that as a general area there is very little competition for a rather talented pool of recruits. It's a big footprint and PSU probably won't be able to lock it down the way Ohio State can usually put a wall around the state of Ohio, but there is enough "home grown" talent that they have the inside track on that I think they should be able to do quite well in a weaker conference. If Franklin can be a dynamic recruiter post-sanctions and even land half of those guys, ~2 5-star and ~10 4-star players is an awfully good base for a class relative to the Big Ten. Only Ohio State and Michigan really seem to have the ability to land a better class than that.

It's interesting because Florida, for instance, has just an insane amount of quality prospects... at the same time though, they have to split them up amongst 3 schools (FSU, UF, Miami) AND have Alabama right next door. It's so strange to see how Penn State has virtually no "local" competition for anything east of the Appalachian mountains and north of the Mason-Dixon Line... and on top of that, there's basically open season on the entire DC metro area and state of Virginia with how all of the local teams are trending towards dumpster fire.

 

[irishog77]

Right, that makes sense. I guess what I'm saying is that as a general area there is very little competition for a rather talented pool of recruits. It's a big footprint and PSU probably won't be able to lock it down the way Ohio State can usually put a wall around the state of Ohio, but there is enough "home grown" talent that they have the inside track on that I think they should be able to do quite well in a weaker conference. If Franklin can be a dynamic recruiter post-sanctions and even land half of those guys, ~2 5-star and ~10 4-star players is an awfully good base for a class relative to the Big Ten. Only Ohio State and Michigan really seem to have the ability to land a better class than that.

It's interesting because Florida, for instance, has just an insane amount of quality prospects... at the same time though, they have to split them up amongst 3 schools (FSU, UF, Miami) AND have Alabama right next door. It's so strange to see how Penn State has virtually no "local" competition for anything east of the Appalachian mountains and north of the Mason-Dixon Line... and on top of that, there's basically open season on the entire DC metro area and state of Virginia with how all of the local teams are trending towards dumpster fire.

This is all reasonable.

 

[tussin]

Lax: (not quoting because your post is big and you know what you said)

Even if Franklin does exceptionally well recruiting that area and the area continues to produce talent at that level every year, you still aren't going to get every one of the 25 best players from an area that covers all or parts of six states. Some kids will become national recruits and end up at national programs (likely the best of the bunch), some kids will want to be closer to home or bond better with another staff or another school's class, and there will be other factors like position redundancy, etc. So even an exceptional job may only get you 18 or 20 of those 25 kids. It is more than enough to beat Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois and Purdue every year, but will you be able to beat OSU, Wisconsin, MSU, UM and Nebraska consistently? Will you be able to accumulate enough premier talent to go out to California and win a Rose Bowl? I'm not convinced, but anything is possible.

I don't think Lax was suggesting that PSU will be able to get every single one of those kids. That's impossible and I don't think any class has ever had 20+ kids in the top 200.

However, you would have a really, really, really good program if you can consistently snag 7 or 8 kids from that list, maybe a few 4-stars from other regions nationally, and then fill the rest of your class with 3-star PA / NJ talent.

 

[Cackalacky]

Booster Red McCombs bashes Texas Longhorns for Charlie Strong hire - ESPN
Seems like not all is happy in Austin.

 

[notredomer23]

Booster Red McCombs bashes Texas Longhorns for Charlie Strong hire - ESPN
Seems like not all is happy in Austin.

Lol he says he think they should have hired Gruden. Sounds like he thinks the Texas job is about on par with the New England Patriots.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Booster Red McCombs bashes Texas Longhorns for Charlie Strong hire - ESPN
Seems like not all is happy in Austin.

I liked this bit:

McCombs said he was certain Patterson couldn't go wrong on the hire during an interview with the San Antonio Express-News last week.

"I don't see how they can miss," McCombs told the paper. "They can get anyone they want. They can close their eyes and go 'Eeny-meeny-miny-moe' and end up with someone good."

 

[Cackalacky]

I liked this bit:

Yep. Its almost like he should have been involved in the process.

 

[Ndaccountant]

I though he had HC experience. I was wrong. So 0-2 on the coordinators?

BTW you avatar is f'ing creepy dude....

 

[dwshade]

Sounding more and more like Petrino back to Louisville as Strong's replacement.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

Sounding more and more like Petrino back to Louisville as Strong's replacement.

Keep him away from the Volleyball Dept.

 

[ACamp1900]

I though he had HC experience. I was wrong. So 0-2 on the coordinators?

BTW you avatar is f'ing creepy dude....

That's a picture of me btw............

 

[Cackalacky]

That's a picture of me btw............

Thats probaly not a good look for you then. You should go for more of a:

It says "I am here to play, but I am not gonna take any shit" instead of "I have my finger up this cats but right now."

 

[STLDomer]

Per 247 Narduzzi interviewed for the job but Petrino is expected to be the next Louisville HC

If I was looking for a HC Narduzzi (MSU DC) and Mason (Stanford DC) would be two of my first calls yet they haven't gotten the attention I expected, especially Mason, Narduzzi has at least caught the attention of UCONN and now Louisville. Wonder if Vandy calls up either when Franklin leaves.

 

[IrishLax]

Keep an eye on the Miami Dolphins. Jeff Ireland out, and there were reports of Phillbin on shaky ground... but you think they would've fired him already if they were going to.