Sept 23 | Michigan State

[IrishSteelhead]

People think the guy who has proven to be a better coach over the last decade was voted the better coach. Real hot take here.....

 

[nsideirish]

Over the last few years, Dantonio has done more than BK with significantly less talent. Not sure what argument exists for BK being a better overall coach.

 

[CrystalHead]

This game is now kinda scaring me. Dantonio lost most of his high star talent which has poisoned what he is known for, which is winning with less. Now he's back to his 3 star talent and there aren't many coaches out there better then him at getting those guys to compete with just about anybody.

 

[Henges24]

This game is now kinda scaring me. Dantonio lost most of his high star talent which has poisoned what he is known for, which is winning with less. Now he's back to his 3 star talent and there aren't many coaches out there better then him at getting those guys to compete with just about anybody.

This.

I am actually fairly certain we lose this game. If so, BK must go. There is no reason we should lose to them talent-wise. MSU always plays us tough and with the night game I just don't see how ND pulls this one out. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[aaronb]

Over the last few years, Dantonio has done more than BK with significantly less talent. Not sure what argument exists for BK being a better overall coach.

What did BK do at Cincy compared to Dantonio?

 

[BobbyMac]

What did BK do at Cincy compared to Dantonio?

Won more... with Dantonio's players

 

[IrishSteelhead]

What did BK do at Cincy compared to Dantonio?

Valid question. Kelly did far more, but there are arguments to be had there. Dantonio was Cincy's first coach after they made the move to the Big East, which presents a complete overhaul in terms of scheme, talent level, etc.

 

[gkIrish]

Are we actually discussing who the better coach is?

 

[BGIF]

Valid question. Kelly did far more, but there are arguments to be had there. Dantonio was Cincy's first coach after they made the move to the Big East, which presents a complete overhaul in terms of scheme, talent level, etc.

The Big East?

"A complete overhaul in terms of scheme, talent level, etc"

Only in basketball.

 

[aaronb]

Are we actually discussing who the better coach is?

Whos the better coach in your opinion?

 

[NDdomer2]

Maybe let's look at it this way.

There's gonna be some decent programs most likely looking for coaches, with Nebraska being the only (arguable nowadays) great one:

UCLA
Tennessee
Arkansas
Texas A&M
Arizona
Arizona State

*Sure I missed a few.

If these jobs do come open who would they hire if they had to choose between the two?

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

What if Kelly replaced Butch Jones?

Circle of Life?

Inception?

 

[gkIrish]

Whos the better coach in your opinion?

Not Kelly and it's not even close.

 

[irishff1014]

Not Kelly and it's not even close.

If Wiki is right 2004 7-5, 2005 7-4, 2016 8-5= 22-17

In 2005 they lost to Rutgers 44-9, Miami OH 44-16 and their best win was Syracuse 22-16.

So Kelly's 34-6 is much better

 

[aaronb]

Not Kelly and it's not even close.

Disagree

Dantonio is leading the 5th or 6th best program in the Big 10. His success has happened largely during a Hoke/Richrod Michigan era, a year of Luke Fickell and OSU probation, a huge PSU scandal, and a huge Nebraska downturn.

He has benefited from downturns of the titans in that conference. And nobody views MSU as a program on the rise.

Dantonio is a nice, and entirely capable coach. However his inability to recruit would limit him at ND.

This base would turn on him quickly.

 

[STLDomer]

Not Kelly and it's not even close.

A lot closer than you think. If it "wasn't even close" why not hire Dantonio, ride him till retirement and then worry about his replacement when that bridge comes?

Not even close implies either Kelly is a really bad coach or Dantonio is among the elite of the elite.

 

[PerthDomer]

At ND it's entirely possible for a coach to get a #1 recruiting class coming off a 3-9 season. MSU can't recruit vs big programs. It doesn't matter who coaches there to include Saban they dont get elite talent

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Disagree



Dantonio is leading the 5th or 6th best program in the Big 10. His success has happened largely during a Hoke/Richrod Michigan era, a year of Luke Fickell and OSU probation, a huge PSU scandal, and a huge Nebraska downturn.



He has benefited from downturns of the titans in that conference. And nobody views MSU as a program on the rise.



Dantonio is a nice, and entirely capable coach. However his inability to recruit would limit him at ND.



This base would turn on him quickly.

I'll give you that. On the opposite end of the spectrum, BK has had to deal with the rise of usual schedule doormats like Navy and Stanford as tough matchups.

BUT, he has also had the luxury of ND's biggest rival being crippled by probation and or Lane Kiffin for most of his tenure.

 

[koonja]

It's all relative. Do you assume nd is a top 25 program? I do without a doubt. I'm sure you do too.

Who id take over bk.

Saba
Meyer
Harbaugh
Dabo
Jimbo
Shaw
Dantoni
Helton
Peterson
Herman
Patterson
Lincoln Riley (everyone will disagree but I'd take him over bk without heaitation)
Vangundy
Petrino
Dan Mullen (Can actually win big games)

 

[STLDomer]

What about Clay Helton do you like?

 

[koonja]

What about Clay Helton do you like?

That he's better than bk.

 

[koonja]

He's won 8 games, 9 games, 10 games last 3 years. Hell win 10 again this year.

He doesn't blame players. He doesn't blow smoke or make excuses, he just goes to work. He doesn't make shitty hires to his friends to set the team and program Back years.

 

[aaronb]

At ND it's entirely possible for a coach to get a #1 recruiting class coming off a 3-9 season. MSU can't recruit vs big programs. It doesn't matter who coaches there to include Saban they dont get elite talent

Possible...maybe?

When has Dantonio shown the ability to recruit anywhere? We've already seen what moderately successful coaches who can't recruit do in South Bend (Davie, Ty Willingham)

 

[STLDomer]

That he's better than bk.

He's won 8 games, 9 games, 10 games last 3 years. Hell win 10 again this year.

He doesn't blame players. He doesn't blow smoke or make excuses, he just goes to work. He doesn't make shitty hires to his friends to set the team and program Back years.

This was a longer way to say I know nothing about Helton.

 

[koonja]

This was a longer way to say I know nothing about Helton.

It's always funny when you list out 15 names and someone disagrees with 1 and rips it.

I'd take Helton over bk yesterday.

Let's see your list.

 

[STLDomer]

It's always funny when you list out 15 names and someone disagrees with 1 and rips it.

I'd take Helton over bk yesterday.

Let's see your list.

Well anyone can name Saban etc so that doesn't really show any inspired thinking in your post. I also disagree with others in your list but that was the most obvious lack of thought.

Reminder, Kelly won 28 games his first three years.

I'll have a list by Sunday for you. I have decided on HCs I would go after but need some research (novel idea) on a few assistants.

 

[stlnd01]

Reminder, Kelly won 28 games his first three years.

With Weis' players tho.

 

[gkIrish]

A lot closer than you think. If it "wasn't even close" why not hire Dantonio, ride him till retirement and then worry about his replacement when that bridge comes?

Not even close implies either Kelly is a really bad coach or Dantonio is among the elite of the elite.

Not the worst idea. And yes to both.

 

[koonja]

https://twitter.com/max_olson/status/910556160381431809

 

[MacIrish75]

It's all relative. Do you assume nd is a top 25 program? I do without a doubt. I'm sure you do too.

Who id take over bk.

Saba
Meyer
Harbaugh
Dabo
Jimbo
Shaw
Dantoni
Helton
Peterson
Herman
Patterson
Lincoln Riley (everyone will disagree but I'd take him over bk without heaitation)
Vangundy
Petrino
Dan Mullen (Can actually win big games)

The big question here is: Jeff or Stan?