NHL Thread

[IrishSteelhead]

Today's game would have been way different if Crow didn't stand on his head again in the 2nd during all those PPs. He withstood a barrage.

 

[chicago51]

I typically have no beef with NHL coaches but I can't stand former Cannucks and current Ranger coach Alain Vigneault. I don't have any reason for it either. Guy to me just looks evil. One reason I'm pulling so hard for the Flyers who didn't look the best today.

I'm not sure why I am like this.

For a guy who makes random post I realize this is pretty random even for me.

 

[KPENN]

I typically have no beef with NHL coaches but I can't stand former Cannucks and current Ranger coach Alain Vigneault. I don't have any reason for it either. Guy to me just looks evil. One reason I'm pulling so hard for the Flyers who didn't look the best today.

I'm not sure why I am like this.

For a guy who makes random post I realize this is pretty random even for me.

Honestly as sad as it is, that was probably the best game they played all series.

 

[chicago51]

Any idea why Chris Versteeg was a scratch by Coach Q for the game earlier today?

 

[Emcee77]

Any idea why Chris Versteeg was a scratch by Coach Q for the game earlier today?

I don't know but I liked the move. Versteeg wasn't producing much and Nordstrom looked pretty good when he came back up to the big club late in the season. He made me realize why we let Pirri go, anyway. Well, him and Teravainen.

But Q didn't play Nordstrom too much yesterday. Why dress a guy you aren't gonna use? Nor did he play Bollig much for that matter.

Q likes to do that from time to time, go with fewer guys rather than risk a bad shift from someone he doesn't totally trust ... last year in the playoffs there were long stretches where Leddy barely played and we basically went with 5 D-men.

But why Nordstrom and Bollig over Morin, that's my question. Morin looked great in that late season stretch where we had guys hurt and were resting others. I thought he played his way into some playoff ice-time. Not sure why Q doesn't agree.

 

[Emcee77]

That Blues/Hawks series was great to watch, but I felt bad for Miller. Crawford was magnificent throughout the series and Miller was not. Like any American hockey fan I am a huge Ryan Miller fan (he almost single-handedly won the silver medal for us in Vancouver, who can forget that) and, even though I was rooting for the Hawks, I wanted to see him play better.

 

[ACamp1900]

Miller deserves a nice long playoff run... and honestly so does St Louis.

Hope it works out for both next year.

 

[STLDomer]

Miller deserves a nice long playoff run... and honestly so does St Louis.

Hope it works out for both next year.

Said it before the Miller trade, right after the trade and still now: The Blues need a true playmaking or scoring center. And there sits Paul Stasny the home town kid in FA this summer. We should be able to pay him a good amount when we unload some guys so hopefully that and the log jam at C for them (MacKinnon won't play RW his whole career and neither him Stasny or Duchene are a third line player) can get him away from the Avs.

 

[Emcee77]

Said it before the Miller trade, right after the trade and still now: The Blues need a true playmaking or scoring center. And there sits Paul Stasny the home town kid in FA this summer. We should be able to pay him a good amount when we unload some guys so hopefully that and the log jam at C for them (MacKinnon won't play RW his whole career and neither him Stasny or Duchene are a third line player) can get him away from the Avs.

Man, it almost makes too much sense. I would love to see it work out that way.

 

[chicago51]

A

I don't know but I liked the move. Versteeg wasn't producing much and Nordstrom looked pretty good when he came back up to the big club late in the season. He made me realize why we let Pirri go, anyway. Well, him and Teravainen.

But Q didn't play Nordstrom too much yesterday. Why dress a guy you aren't gonna use? Nor did he play Bollig much for that matter.

Q likes to do that from time to time, go with fewer guys rather than risk a bad shift from someone he doesn't totally trust ... last year in the playoffs there were long stretches where Leddy barely played and we basically went with 5 D-men.

But why Nordstrom and Bollig over Morin, that's my question. Morin looked great in that late season stretch where we had guys hurt and were resting others. I thought he played his way into some playoff ice-time. Not sure why Q doesn't agree.

Yea I'm not crtisizing the scratch or any of Q's moves.

Coach Q has earned the benefit of the doubt and then some. The man could bench Toews and I while I would scratch my head, I give him my trust at least initially.

I was curious what the reasoning is in that brillant hockey mind of his for some of his decissions. I assume with Versteeg it was because of lack of production but I was curious if anyone heard details I may have missed.

 

[blueNDgold44]

What the hell Columbus

 

[gkIrish]

Fleury....

 

[KPENN]

Not a huge fan of him but i love Patrick Roy's strategy with pulling the goalie early.

 

[chicago51]

Not a huge fan of him but i love Patrick Roy's strategy with pulling the goalie early.

I change my mind on this everytime I think about it. I do agree it does not matter if you lose by one goal or 5. If more teams did this it would be interesting to the sabermetrics stats over the long haul.

It did get me thinking down by 1, with 10 min to go, you are on the PP, do you pull the goalie that early to get a two man advantage?

 

[KPENN]

I change my mind on this everytime I think about it. I do agree it does not matter if you lose by one goal or 5. If more teams did this it would be interesting to the sabermetrics stats over the long haul.

It did get me thinking down by 1, with 10 min to go, you are on the PP, do you pull the goalie that early to get a two man advantage?

Well here's my line of thinking, at even strength it would be like a powerplay except for the other team can't ice the puck. I think you should pull with 2 minutes left, gives you some time to pass around and work the puck, treat it like a legit powerplay.

 

[GO IRISH!!!]

Kings showing a lot of heart forcing game 7. Staples Center was as loud as I have heard it since the Cup run in '12. Doughty was playing out of his mind last night and Williams is just having a monster season - he has 2 Gordie Howe Hat Tricks in the series.

Also, Quick is getting back to his old self! GO KINGS GO!!!

 

[aubeirish]

Yea, the refs really blew that game last night. That 2nd goal by the kings was not a good goal. Good news for hockey fans, though, game 7 should be awesome.

 

[chicago51]

Wild forced a game 7 too. Hawks' fans seem to want the Wild because the Avs beat the Blackhawks 4 out 5 times this regular season. I say go Avs in game 7. I say bring on the bully because when bullies play with fire they are gonna get burned. I'm not afraid of the Avalanche.

 

[arrowryan]

So I'm pretty new to the NHL and just hockey in general. Going to Notre Dame hockey games actually got me interested in the NHL and Blackhawks. So I have a question for you Blackhawks fans and the for those of you that follow the NHL pretty closely. I see that the Blackhawks play the winner of the Avalanche vs. Wild series; who would give the Blackhawks the most trouble out of those two teams?

 

[#1rish]

So I'm pretty new to the NHL and just hockey in general. Going to Notre Dame hockey games actually got me interested in the NHL and Blackhawks. So I have a question for you Blackhawks fans and the for those of you that follow the NHL pretty closely. I see that the Blackhawks play the winner of the Avalanche vs. Wild series; who would give the Blackhawks the most trouble out of those two teams?

Most likely the Avalanche. A posted mentioned above that they beat the Hawks a number of times over the regular season. They are missing a huge piece of their offensive D though in Tyson Barrie (guy who was knocked out of the playoffs by a Wild cheapshot). Avs are arguably the fastest team in the playoffs right now and could be more dangerous when Duchene is at 100%. I honestly didn't think the Avs-Wild series would go 7 games, but that's playoff hockey. IMO if the Hawks faced the Wild in the second round, they could easily win it in 4-5. Beating St. Louis was no joke.

 

[Kingbish01]

Looks like Malkin has woken up....Everyone is in trouble when Crosby does! Those two clicking on the same line...smh..All we need is Flower to relax.

 

[Emcee77]

So I'm pretty new to the NHL and just hockey in general. Going to Notre Dame hockey games actually got me interested in the NHL and Blackhawks. So I have a question for you Blackhawks fans and the for those of you that follow the NHL pretty closely. I see that the Blackhawks play the winner of the Avalanche vs. Wild series; who would give the Blackhawks the most trouble out of those two teams?

Who knows? The Hawks were 1-4 against the Avs and 2-3 against the Wild (with one of the victories coming in a shootout) this season, so you might say both teams will give the Hawks a fair amount of trouble.

But everything is different in the playoffs.

Do you follow baseball? Hockey is kind of like baseball, and unlike basketball, in that the coach has to make important strategic decisions about whom to play before the game starts. The coach can dress 18 skaters and that's it, and, even though only 5 skaters are on the ice at a time you generally need all 18 or almost all of them to play significant minutes because of the high level of energy each player exerts every second he is on the ice -- again, unlike in basketball, where coaches can dress 12 guys but often only use 6 or 7 because a player can physically play the whole game if he has to.

So, you know how in playoff baseball managers will do crazy things with the pitching staff like use starters in relief in a game 6 or game 7? Playoff hockey is kind of like that in the sense that the coach knows there is no tomorrow so he does everything he can to get his absolute best guys out there. During the regular season you are playing for the long haul, you don't want to wear out your best guys, etc., so you might give some younger or more marginal hockey players more ice time at times in the regular season-- just as in baseball, where you might err on the side of caution and pull a stud starter an inning or two early to get a young middle relief guy some work and avoid wearing out the stud. In the playoffs, you gotta win, so there's none of that. In Game 6 of the Blues series, the Hawks basically used 10 forwards instead of the normal 12 in order to keep our best guys on the ice as long as possible. They were tired, but they got the job done.

The Hawks' top guys are as good as anyone in the league, at least imo. There maybe isn't ideal depth, but those top guys can carry us in the playoffs.

The other strategy element of playoff hockey (and here the comparison with baseball disappears) is getting the chemistry of the lines right so as to be as effective as possible against the opponent. Quenneville is a master of this. He changes up his lines frequently, even within a game, to find the right combinations of forwards, and we have some really good, versatile players who make those changes particularly dangerous.

Basically, with the Hawks' top-end talent and playoff experience, I like our chances against either opponent.

 

[#1rish]

IMO what makes the Hawks great are their role players outside of their core (Kane, Toews, Keith, Seabrook). Guys like Saad, Bickell, Shaw grind it out and make plays. Can't believe they were able to pick up Saad in the 2nd round in 2011. He was first-round talent. Not sure why he fell so far.

Hossa needs to step it up though.

 

[arrowryan]

Most likely the Avalanche. A posted mentioned above that they beat the Hawks a number of times over the regular season. They are missing a huge piece of their offensive D though in Tyson Barrie (guy who was knocked out of the playoffs by a Wild cheapshot). Avs are arguably the fastest team in the playoffs right now and could be more dangerous when Duchene is at 100%. I honestly didn't think the Avs-Wild series would go 7 games, but that's playoff hockey. IMO if the Hawks faced the Wild in the second round, they could easily win it in 4-5. Beating St. Louis was no joke.

Who knows? The Hawks were 1-4 against the Avs and 2-3 against the Wild (with one of the victories coming in a shootout) this season, so you might say both teams will give the Hawks a fair amount of trouble.

But everything is different in the playoffs.

Do you follow baseball? Hockey is kind of like baseball, and unlike basketball, in that the coach has to make important strategic decisions about whom to play before the game starts. The coach can dress 18 skaters and that's it, and, even though only 5 skaters are on the ice at a time you generally need all 18 or almost all of them to play significant minutes because of the high level of energy each player exerts every second he is on the ice -- again, unlike in basketball, where coaches can dress 12 guys but often only use 6 or 7 because a player can physically play the whole game if he has to.

So, you know how in playoff baseball managers will do crazy things with the pitching staff like use starters in relief in a game 6 or game 7? Playoff hockey is kind of like that in the sense that the coach knows there is no tomorrow so he does everything he can to get his absolute best guys out there. During the regular season you are playing for the long haul, you don't want to wear out your best guys, etc., so you might give some younger or more marginal hockey players more ice time at times in the regular season-- just as in baseball, where you might err on the side of caution and pull a stud starter an inning or two early to get a young middle relief guy some work and avoid wearing out the stud. In the playoffs, you gotta win, so there's none of that. In Game 6 of the Blues series, the Hawks basically used 10 forwards instead of the normal 12 in order to keep our best guys on the ice as long as possible. They were tired, but they got the job done.

The Hawks' top guys are as good as anyone in the league, at least imo. There maybe isn't ideal depth, but those top guys can carry us in the playoffs.

The other strategy element of playoff hockey (and here the comparison with baseball disappears) is getting the chemistry of the lines right so as to be as effective as possible against the opponent. Quenneville is a master of this. He changes up his lines frequently, even within a game, to find the right combinations of forwards, and we have some really good, versatile players who make those changes particularly dangerous.

Basically, with the Hawks' top-end talent and playoff experience, I like our chances against either opponent.

Thanks guys. This is really my first year paying attention. I watched a little bit last year but it was just the playoffs.

Another question. Why do teams just waste possessions? I'm talking about when a team will get the puck and they just hit the puck down the ice. Is that giving them time to substitute or what?

 

[#1rish]

Thanks guys. This is really my first year paying attention. I watched a little bit last year but it was just the playoffs.

Another question. Why do teams just waste possessions? I'm talking about when a team will get the puck and they just hit the puck down the ice. Is that giving them time to substitute or what?

Usually when a team dumps the puck into the other zone:

1. Line change
2. Killing a penalty
3. Dump and chase (chase puck into the offensive zone and try to get possession and sustain pressure)

Keep in mind, if the team shoots the puck down the ice past the goalline before the center ice line, an icing will be called. A face-off will be held in the team's defensive zone and any player on the ice for the icing is not allowed to change lines (only for the team that just iced the puck) . This rule is negated during a penalty kill.

A little confusing, but you'll get the hang of it.

 

[aubeirish]

As a hockey fan, I would rather see the Hawks play the AVs. Minnesota are traditionally kind of boring to watch. As far as the matchup, I don't think what happened during the season is a big factor for a team like the Hawks. They know how to win in the playoffs. That is enough for me to make them favourite against whoever they play next until the conference final.

 

[Emcee77]

IMO what makes the Hawks great are their role players outside of their core (Kane, Toews, Keith, Seabrook). Guys like Saad, Bickell, Shaw grind it out and make plays. Can't believe they were able to pick up Saad in the 2nd round in 2011. He was first-round talent. Not sure why he fell so far.

Hossa needs to step it up though.

Agreed on that ... but imo there is a big difference between this year's Hawks team and last year's, and it's that this team only really has 9 regular, reliable forwards. Last year, the fourth line of Frolik, Bolland and Kruger had to be the best 4th line of any team in the playoffs. Tons of production out of those guys, including the Stanley Cup winning goal. The only forward in 2013 who was kind of a question mark was Victor Stalberg, who was replaced with Ben Smith occasionally (who is now a regular ... the writing was on the wall). This year, at least so far, guys like Bollig, Versteeg and Handzus have seen less ice time and we've relied on the other forwards more. But in the playoffs, you can do that if you have to. No guts no glory.

 

[Wild Bill]

IMO what makes the Hawks great are their role players outside of their core (Kane, Toews, Keith, Seabrook). Guys like Saad, Bickell, Shaw grind it out and make plays. Can't believe they were able to pick up Saad in the 2nd round in 2011. He was first-round talent. Not sure why he fell so far.

Hossa needs to step it up though.

You have a point with the role players. I'd add Hjalmarsson to that list - underrated player and he brings it every shift. I think Toews is the key, though. His leadership and will to win is off the charts. I wouldn't trade him for any other player in the league, including Crosby. He's not the most talented, but he is, IMO, the most valuable.

Hossa didn't fill up the stat sheet but he played his ass off against STL. Sharp is the guy that needs to step up. He can score in bunches so I hope that cheap goal he scored in game six gets him going.

 

[GO IRISH!!!]

Yea, the refs really blew that game last night. That 2nd goal by the kings was not a good goal. Good news for hockey fans, though, game 7 should be awesome.

The refs didn't make the Sharts fail on an almost 2 minute 5 on 3 in the second. The other three goals were pretty solid as well.

 

[STLDomer]

Final decision on my avatar steelhead and chicago51??