How good are the DBs going to be this year?

[dales5050]

IIRC, going into last year I remember conversations about IF the light was going to go on for Max Redfield. Now he is listed as a first team AA by Phil Steele.

Redfield comes back to join Luke, Shumate, Tranquill, Farley who all shows flashes of awesome last year. This is before you add Kei'Varae Russell, who I think we call can agree/hope is going to be phenomenal and Avery Sebastian who has plenty of experience in a pass heavy conference. Then you get to young guys like Nick Watkins and Shaun Crawford who some could say are more ready to play than the Russell and Luke were when they got going.

This just feels like a ridiculous combination of talent and experience in the DB position group. Am I just drinking the off season Kool-Aid or does this group have the makings of being extraordinary this season?

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Potential to be Legen-wait for it-dary.

Russell, Luke, Redfield, and Shu will make it difficult on opposing offenses. If the DL can get a push and get to the QB, this defensive backfield could be the best in the country.

 

[dales5050]

Potential to be Legen-wait for it-dary.

Russell, Luke, Redfield, and Shu will make it difficult on opposing offenses. If the DL can get a push and get to the QB, this defensive backfield could be the best in the country.

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--bI96U6hT--/17bgyrsj0o0hzjpg.jpg

 

[Old Man Mike]

health, gentlemen.... although we have perhaps five viable experienced safeties on this team [this counts Matthias], we have only two corners with a lot of "maybes" behind them. Russell and Luke are the keys to our whole defensive team in my view. With, we have two shutdown corners. Without, the opponents might exploit our mediocre pass rush. Either getting Grace, Schmidt, and Smith all on the field at once, or Morgan really stepping up, is also important, but KeiVaree and Cole are the anchors.

 

[GBdomer]

Could be really damn good. I'm not worried about Russell he seemed to work his ass off to get bdck and I will be rooting hard for him. Shumate and Redfield need to pick up where they left off. But they are also the same dudes who were both bencher last year. From all reports it sounds like they are ready to roll. I think it's pretty simple that they will be as good as they want to be. I think Crawford will be a fantastic nickel back I just don't know when. I think Nick Coleman will be a good player. Nick Watkins will be a great 3rd corner. I just don't know what you are getting with Devin Butler this year and moving forward. It has to be a great year for this group and BVG. I also think Todd Lyght is a coaching upgrade in major way. Shaun Crawford actually reminds me a lot of Brandon Boykin

 

[IrishLion]

I feel comfortable with Devin Butler being first man up on the outside, and it seems like that goes against the grain with a lot of other posters. Between posters with questions about him, and others saying he'd be better at safety if he wants to play, I haven't seen things get to that point.

He showed flashes last season that he can get the job done in man coverage in limited opportunities. He's not an all-world option, nor is he close to Luke's level... but Luke is VERY good. Butler is the kind of player that represents pretty great depth, IMO, because he's not just a guy that is going to be living on hopes and prayers if he's thrust into extended action.

 

[connor_in]

I an sure the databases will be fine as long as we have good enough site security.



wait...what? This isn't the tech forum? Never mind...

 

[GrangerIrish24]

Our secondary will thrive if we can get a consistent pass rush.

 

[FLDomer]

Our secondary will thrive if we can get a consistent pass rush.

Big if...I hope we do but have not had a consistent one in yrs! I hope Coach Gilmore works some magic.

 

[arrowryan]

Could be really damn good. I'm not worried about Russell he seemed to work his ass off to get bdck and I will be rooting hard for him. Shumate and Redfield need to pick up where they left off. But they are also the same dudes who were both bencher last year. From all reports it sounds like they are ready to roll. I think it's pretty simple that they will be as good as they want to be. I think Crawford will be a fantastic nickel back I just don't know when. I think Nick Coleman will be a good player. Nick Watkins will be a great 3rd corner. I just don't know what you are getting with Devin Butler this year and moving forward. It has to be a great year for this group and BVG. I also think Todd Lyght is a coaching upgrade in major way. Shaun Crawford actually reminds me a lot of Brandon Boykin

I thought Crawford would've been our starting nickel back if KVR was not allowed back into ND. Since that is not the case, I think Watkins is going to be the starting nickel back which I am perfectly fine with. Having backups like Butler and Crawford is a really good thing. I wouldn't mind seeing Crawford redshirt and slide into the nickel back position next year, but I highly doubt that happens as he will almost certainly be on special teams

 

[GrangerIrish24]

I thought Crawford would've been our starting nickel back if KVR was not allowed back into ND. Since that is not the case, I think Watkins is going to be the starting nickel back which I am perfectly fine with. Having backups like Butler and Crawford is a really good thing. I wouldn't mind seeing Crawford redshirt and slide into the nickel back position next year, but I highly doubt that happens as he will almost certainly be on special teams

I would imagine that Crawford is a guy that will see the field quite a bit.

 

[Old Man Mike]

.... hard to see Matthias not being the starting nickel back.

 

[IrishLion]

.... hard to see Matthias not being the starting nickel back.

Perhaps we'll see Farley as the "base" nickel on early downs, and Crawford could work in as the dime or the "coverage" nickel on 3rd-and-long situations.

 

[ACamp1900]

Our secondary will thrive if we can get a consistent pass rush.

For the most part,... This,...

It's rare to find a secondary that 'excels' behind a weak pass rush. The defense as a whole will prob. live and die on two things, first, health/depth,... second, how the front develops in terms of applying pressure...

 

[GrangerIrish24]

For the most part,... This,...

It's rare to find a secondary that 'excels' behind a weak pass rush. The defense as a whole will prob. live and die on two things, first, health/depth,... second, how the front develops in terms of applying pressure...

Our secondary looked phenomenal in 2012 because we had players who could generate their own pass rush with only a 3 man front.

 

[dublinirish]

For the most part,... This,...

It's rare to find a secondary that 'excels' behind a weak pass rush. The defense as a whole will prob. live and die on two things, first, health/depth,... second, how the front develops in terms of applying pressure...

having good DB's covering can give DLine more time to get to the QB..its a symbiotic relationship really

 

[IrishLion]

having good DB's covering can give DLine more time to get to the QB..its a symbiotic relationship really

That's what I was thinking.

I think this season will be give-and-take between the two units. The d-line will benefit from a few coverage sacks, and I'm hoping that the d-line (or BVG's blitz packages) can help the secondary by forcing some poor, early throws.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I feel comfortable with Devin Butler being first man up on the outside, and it seems like that goes against the grain with a lot of other posters. Between posters with questions about him, and others saying he'd be better at safety if he wants to play, I haven't seen things get to that point.

He showed flashes last season that he can get the job done in man coverage in limited opportunities. He's not an all-world option, nor is he close to Luke's level... but Luke is VERY good. Butler is the kind of player that represents pretty great depth, IMO, because he's not just a guy that is going to be living on hopes and prayers if he's thrust into extended action.

Watkins will be ahead of Butler, no?

Seems natural to move Butler to FS. There is literally no depth there.

 

[ACamp1900]

having good DB's covering can give DLine more time to get to the QB..its a symbiotic relationship really

Definitely true to a point, but I would say it's much easier to hide a weak secondary with a great pass rush/front seven than it is to hide a weak front with a great secondary... I'll put it this way, if I to choose a potential liability between the two, I'd be much more comfortable taking the secondary... Now I'm not saying either is a liability on ND's current squad, I'm just saying for sake of perspective on where my football mind is coming from... basically, while everything is obviously important, football is a game that is won from the inside out for the most part... O line and D front.

 

[GrangerIrish24]

Coverage sacks are always nice, but are harder to come by and not a situation i would my secondary to consistently be in. The only way we stop Clemson or USC this year is by getting in the backfield and disrupting their rhytm.

 

[IrishLion]

Watkins will be ahead of Butler, no?

Seems natural to move Butler to FS. There is literally no depth there.

If Butler sticks at CB and Watkins passes him up, that will be a sign of good things to come from Watkins.

But with Redfield, Shumate, Tranquil, Sebastian and Farley's ability to cross-train, safety should be okay as long as the bodies all stay healthy.

That leaves Russell, Luke, Watkins, Butler and Crawford at CB, in a defense that uses three (and sometimes four) corners consistently throughout the game. If you take Butler out of the CB equation, you're potentially looking at one of the less-heralded freshmen needing to contribute at some point.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

If Butler sticks at CB and Watkins passes him up, that will be a sign of good things to come from Watkins.

But with Redfield, Shumate, Tranquil, Sebastian and Farley's ability to cross-train, safety should be okay as long as the bodies all stay healthy.

That leaves Russell, Luke, Watkins, Butler and Crawford at CB, in a defense that uses three (and sometimes four) corners consistently throughout the game. If you take Butler out of the CB equation, you're potentially looking at one of the less-heralded freshmen needing to contribute at some point.

Maybe i'm mis-remembering, but I thought Nick was all the rage during the spring. Maybe I jumped to conclusions, but I could've sworn it was almost a given that Nick moved up in the depth chart.

 

[Wild Bill]

The schedule favors the secondary this year, IMO.

More than half our schedule is played against teams that either can't throw worth a lick (Texas and BC), prefer running the snot out of the ball (Tech, Navy and Stanford) or don't have the talent to threaten our secondary downfield (UMass, Temple and Wake).

They'll be tested against Clemson, USC and Pitt (they still have Boyd, right)?

I think they'll be fine.

 

[ulukinatme]

Gotta have a pass rush, as others have stated.

On the other hand, now that this thread is created, our DBs are probably jinxed and they'll all come down with leg injuries by Week 4.

 

[IrishinSyria]

IIRC, going into last year I remember conversations about IF the light was going to go on for Max Redfield. Now he is listed as a first team AA by Phil Steele.

Redfield comes back to join Luke, Shumate, Tranquill, Farley who all shows flashes of awesome last year. This is before you add Kei'Varae Russell, who I think we call can agree/hope is going to be phenomenal and Avery Sebastian who has plenty of experience in a pass heavy conference. Then you get to young guys like Nick Watkins and Shaun Crawford who some could say are more ready to play than the Russell and Luke were when they got going.

This just feels like a ridiculous combination of talent and experience in the DB position group. Am I just drinking the off season Kool-Aid or does this group have the makings of being extraordinary this season?

Is the bolded a game changer or something? Like Redfield's always been wicked talented, but he's still very much a wildcard until he shows it on the field. As others have pointed out, depth is a concern. Still, think we have a good unit, and they should be a productive part of a great team.

 

[IrishLion]

I think maybe Redfield's sudden popularity nationally is half based on potential, half prisoner-of-the-moment after a million tackles against mighty LSU, and half based on BK's comments.

 

[TheTurningPoint]

Only go as far as that Dline!

 

[RyCo1983]

I think maybe Redfield's sudden popularity nationally is half based on potential, half prisoner-of-the-moment after a million tackles against mighty LSU, and half based on BK's comments.

That's 3/2!

 

[Irish Insanity]

That's 3/2!

Exactly.
He's
Just
That
Good

 

[Irish2155]

Our secondary will thrive if we can get a consistent pass rush.

And there lies the problem...

Nobody can cover all day.