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ResLife Hero

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>We graded the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> OL with a C as they enter the bye. Find out the rest of the grades for the offense here - <a href="http://t.co/mUVfFSsIxz">http://t.co/mUVfFSsIxz</a></p>— UHND.com (@uhnd) <a href="https://twitter.com/uhnd/status/512999647414353920">September 19, 2014</a></blockquote>
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Old Man Mike

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The pass-blocking thing is complex. There is no "typical" play to my eyes. But what seems to happen more than most [when there is trouble] is that the opponents speed-rush BOTH DEs creating a container cup so Golson can't take off. Both Stanley and Elmer try to run with these DEs to push them as upfield as possible [i.e. the theory is to get them deeper than Golson] and have Everett step up and deliver. What then often happens to screw up the plan is: 1). the interior three OLine don't stone the DTs and the space in front of Everett gets too tight for his comfort, and 2). Everett is probably still not seeing some of the field because of his height. If he was 6'5", he'd probably be pulling the trigger "on time" almost every play.

So, even though Steve Elmer has trouble running-on-balance backwards [it's actually the ZMart dancer-shuffle he lacks], the "pressure" is not all his fault by a long shot. For example: in the third quarter of the Purdue game, we got a "classic" example of this Cup-and-collapse situation. Both DEs speed-rushed wide. Ronnie was fast enough to push his guy a little extra wide, but Everett saw double trouble from his right with both Steve's DE and a blitzer who was Folston's responsibility. Everett stepped into the gap created by Stanley running his guy wider than the DE wanted. Elmer's man was knocked off-balance by Steve and awkwardly dove [unsuccessfully] at Golson. Folston, who had made initial contact with the blitzer as he was supposed to, then decided to become a spectator, while his man kept hustling and sacked Everett. Elmer saw this happening and tried to clean up Folston's garbage, but it was too late. Because he was closest man to the tackler, doubtless everyone gave him the blame.

I overdid this play analysis to try to make the point that without a total eraser like ZMart [once in a decade folks] to void the outside of one half of the field, this team must have everyone operating at high levels and working till the play is over. And the particular play detailed above shows how the RBs MUST be on the job for this to work. The other thing that I believe Hiestand is seeing is that we can't survive against power with Hanratty and Hegarty at the guards. We are not stoning the DTs consistently enough. Maybe we can go with one of them, since then [usually] the center can help [as every team does against us] but the center can't help against BOTH DTs.
 

ResLife Hero

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Grading Notre Dame at the Bye: Defense - Vangorder's troops receive high marks. Time for a fist pump. <a href="http://t.co/HO39zfeikH">http://t.co/HO39zfeikH</a></p>— UHND.com (@uhnd) <a href="https://twitter.com/uhnd/status/513032461706469376">September 19, 2014</a></blockquote>
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Whiskeyjack

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Wonderfully ironic. Coming into the season, we were all worried about the defense, but very confident in the OL. Now, three games into the season, it's the exact opposite.
 

BGIF

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Wonderfully ironic. Coming into the season, we were all worried about the defense, but very confident in the OL. Now, three games into the season, it's the exact opposite.


Maybe VanGorder should be running the offense.
 

Voltaire

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Could not agree more. Also, what happened to the mythical "aggressive, high tempo, fast" offense? Lol SO thankful for Golson.

In fairness, this does accurately describe the general demeanor of the offensive coaching staff when they are frantically signaling in the play call with five seconds left on the play clock.
 

Booslum31

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In fairness, this does accurately describe the general demeanor of the offensive coaching staff when they are frantically signaling in the play call with five seconds left on the play clock.

Do you mean like when we couldn't get our first play off against Michigan?
 

Domina Nostra

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Sounds like the OL is getting shuffled. Personally, I kind of like it better, since I am a Heggarty and Lombard fan.

LT: Stanley-- doing fine
LG: Martin--will benefit from not having to get out of his stance
C: Heggarty--plays to his strengths, since he is more of a finess/technician type
RG: Elmer--"Coach, I just want to maul someone" "I know, Elmer, I know..."
RT: Lombard--Hopefully won't take the same beating against speed guys

The only thing I don't like about it is that Lombard always seems to be injured. If Lombard goes out, does Elmer slide right back out, or is he going to be a true OG from here on out? If he is a guard, does McGlinchy come in? Nelson?
 
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Bogtrotter07

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Wonderfully ironic. Coming into the season, we were all worried about the defense, but very confident in the OL. Now, three games into the season, it's the exact opposite.

That is exactly why I am not worried about the offensive line, yet!

Sounds like the OL is getting shuffled. Personally, I kind of like it better, since I am a Heggarty and Lombard fan.

LT: Stanley-- doing fine
LG: Martin--will benefit from not having to get out of his stance
C: Heggarty--plays to his strengths, since he is more of a finess/technician type
RG: Elmer--"Coach, I just want to maul someone" "I know, Elmer, I know..."
RT: Lombard--Hopefully won't take the same beating against speed guys

The only thing I don't like about it is that Lombard always seems to be injured. If Lombard goes out, does Elmer slide right back out, or is he going to be a true OG from here on out? If he is a guard, does McGlinchy come in? Nelson?

I still believe strongly that Elmer at left and Martin at right guard, (if indeed the coaches deem changes need be made), would make for a stronger and more cohesive unit. I think that Martin can combo block and slip off to the second level better than any one on the offensive line, (a weakness of Lombard last year that he overcame), and that Elmer has the incredible leg drive that ND has used so successfully with Watt and Elmer last year. I think that Stanley and Elmer has synergy, and potential, much as a young Martin and Watt. Lombard was a pretty good right tackle in '12, especially as a run blocker, with his leg drive. And Hegarty and Martin is as good of a center - right guard combination as anyone, save Martin and Lombard. But it is close. And allows for advantages that allow more to occupy positions that play to the top five's current strong suits.

Knock on wood!
It also allows Hanratty and McGlinchey to be the next men in at the guard and tackle positions. If Hegarty goes down, Martin goes back to center, and Hanratty comes in. As he does if either Elmer or Martin go down. McGlinchey is set to go in for either tackle, or if need be play right if the coaches want to move Lombard over to left for an injured Stanley. I promise I will never mention any of this again!

Is this line an opinion, or has this been confirmed?

Tom Mendoza tweeted about two rumored moves (switches it seemed), not about any positions on a future depth chart. After that the rumors that swirled, took on a life of their own. No official word has been made, of course. A couple of us see more than a simple Martin trade with Hegarty and Elmer with Lombard. An example of someone else who thinks as I have supposed above is NDdomer2, who is a really smart, witty, urbane, good looking guy, who just about knows everything. And there are others. Mostly high IQ, kind of guys.
 
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irishfan

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One thing to consider with Lombard is that moving him to RT allows him to avoid a lot of the "muck" by being in the center of things on the line. He stayed healthy the whole season in 2012 at RT I believe.
 

Luckylucci

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Per Jake Brown who posted some details of an interview he did with Frank Buncom. They're telling recruits Baratti is done that's why we're going after more safeties. I know this is pretty well known but this is the first it being publicly stated by anybody. I would assume we hear something on this, this week from BK.
 

Emcee77

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So why would Baratti be done but not Hounshell? Different injuries? Don't remember the details other than that they were shoulder injuries.
 

Luckylucci

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So why would Baratti be done but not Hounshell? Different injuries? Don't remember the details other than that they were shoulder injuries.

Not sure about details but 3 shoulder surgeries is quite a bit to come back from.
 

NDohio

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Per Jake Brown who posted some details of an interview he did with Frank Buncom. They're telling recruits Baratti is done that's why we're going after more safeties. I know this is pretty well known but this is the first it being publicly stated by anybody. I would assume we hear something on this, this week from BK.

Hate to hear this. Not surprising but still hate it.
 
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Bogtrotter07

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Baratti has had four shoulder injuries. With the joint. Hounshell's problems have been muscular, with the labrum. Totally different thing. Every time Baratti lays on the wood his arm (Humerus) pops out of his shoulder.

There is only so many times this can be repaired and there are major vascular and nerve considerations, as in monkeying around with this kind of injury can do irreparable damage to either.

I am no expert and probably have a shaky understanding, but I believe this somewhat represents the situation.
 

Emcee77

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Baratti has had four shoulder injuries. With the joint. Hounshell's problems have been muscular, with the labrum. Totally different thing. Every time Baratti lays on the wood his arm (Humerus) pops out of his shoulder.

There is only so many times this can be repaired and there are major vascular and nerve considerations, as in monkeying around with this kind of injury can do irreparable damage to either.

I am no expert and probably have a shaky understanding, but I believe this somewhat represents the situation.

Ah, you are probably right, Bogs. I do recall now that Hounshell's issue was the labrum. Thanks.
 
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Bogtrotter07

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Ah, you are probably right, Bogs. I do recall now that Hounshell's issue was the labrum. Thanks.

Right? Hell, I am just glad I didn't spell labrum wrong again!

Word for the wise : Don't ever end that word with an "ia" and expect anyone to take you seriously!
 

Domina Nostra

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One thing to consider with Lombard is that moving him to RT allows him to avoid a lot of the "muck" by being in the center of things on the line. He stayed healthy the whole season in 2012 at RT I believe.

The other thing is that Elmer is not a long-term OG, according to projections. Next year he has to beat out Stanley, McGlinchy, Nelson, and Bars... I think one of those guys will have developed by that point such that they are one of the best 5.

I still believe strongly that Elmer at left and Martin at right guard, (if indeed the coaches deem changes need be made), would make for a stronger and more cohesive unit. I think that Martin can combo block and slip off to the second level better than any one on the offensive line, (a weakness of Lombard last year that he overcame), and that Elmer has the incredible leg drive that ND has used so successfully with Watt and Elmer last year. I think that Stanley and Elmer has synergy, and potential, much as a young Martin and Watt. Lombard was a pretty good right tackle in '12, especially as a run blocker, with his leg drive. And Hegarty and Martin is as good of a center - right guard combination as anyone, save Martin and Lombard. But it is close. And allows for advantages that allow more to occupy positions that play to the top five's current strong suits.

It also allows Hanratty and McGlinchey to be the next men in at the guard and tackle positions. If Hegarty goes down, Martin goes back to center, and Hanratty comes in. As he does if either Elmer or Martin go down. McGlinchey is set to go in for either tackle, or if need be play right if the coaches want to move Lombard over to left for an injured Stanley.

Good points!

LT- Stanley/McGlinchy
LG- Elmer/Hanratty
C- Heggarty/Martin
RG- Martin/Hanratty
RT- Lombard/McGlinchy
 

Luckylucci

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The other thing is that Elmer is not a long-term OG, according to projections. Next year he has to beat out Stanley, McGlinchy, Nelson, and Bars... I think one of those guys will have developed by that point such that they are one of the best 5.



Good points!

LT- Stanley/McGlinchy
LG- Elmer/Hanratty
C- Heggarty/Martin
RG- Martin/Hanratty
RT- Lombard/McGlinchy

Sampson posted this morning that this is what he's hearing but hasn't heard any distinction yet on which Guard spot Elmer and Martin will move to. This seems most likely, IMO.
 
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Me2SouthBend

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Sampson posted this morning that this is what he's hearing but hasn't heard any distinction yet on which Guard spot Elmer and Martin will move to. This seems most likely, IMO.

Did I miss something? Is N Martin being/been moved to Guard? He is the teams best Center, why would he not remain there?
 

IrishLion

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Did I miss something? Is N Martin being/been moved to Guard? He is the teams best Center, why would he not remain there?

I actually don't think there was any drop-off at all last season when Hegarty took over at center for Martin.
 

Old Man Mike

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NMart began his training at guard. He is particularly suited to guard as he has the mauler's attitude and the competitor's "never quit." He was originally put into the center slot because we didn't have another healthy high-quality lineman. He struggled with the techniques to begin with but, thankfully, was a fast learner.

Matt Hegarty wasn't ready then due to his seemingly serious head injury troubles [which also thankfully went away]. By the time that NMart got dinged last year, Matt had regained his full strength, and with better mobility [though not quite equal power] put in a good job as NMart's replacement.

Still, to begin camp, Hiestand and Kelly wanted NMart's experience there to anchor the young line. It is not NMart's "failure" [in my opinion] that is causing this rethinking process, but the relative inefficiency of Matt and Connor to consistently stone the opposition DTs, which causes pocket shrinkage, which in turn gives Everett happy feet.

Whether these shifts happen or not, the theory behind them seems to be that if we get the DTs stoned at the line-of-scrimmage, with the nimble Hegarty picking up the trash, the thing which bothers Everett most will generally be solved. Because, if the RB does his job of picking up the correct blitzer, then Everett can handle the speedrush DE by himself, as he enjoys doing anyway, and as the opposing DCs hate seeing him do.

The placement of the OLine power at the guards therefore would/might in theory defeat Everett's pocket-presence weaknesses and play to his strengths. Even if this happens, and works, it will still be a priority for Bryant to actually block the proper blitzer, and Folston to not only make contact but stay with it until the play's over. For all the Cam haters out there, who can't see for some reason why Coach, running a pass-emphasized offense, wants an RB he can count on to block the correct person effectively ... well, meditate a bit more. {and quit underrating what McDaniel is doing for us each week.}
 
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