Democratic Primary Thread (New Poll - January)

Democratic Primary Thread (New Poll - January)

  • Joe Biden

    Votes: 4 5.8%
  • Bernie Sanders

    Votes: 14 20.3%
  • Elizabeth Warren

    Votes: 5 7.2%
  • Pete Buttigieg

    Votes: 16 23.2%
  • Andrew Yang

    Votes: 7 10.1%
  • Amy Klobuchar

    Votes: 5 7.2%
  • Mike Bloomberg

    Votes: 6 8.7%
  • Other (i.e. an unlisted candidate)

    Votes: 12 17.4%

  • Total voters
    69

GATTACA!

It's about to get gross
Messages
15,108
Reaction score
12,945
Biden’s VP pick will be really important. It needs to be someone relatively young, broadly popular and not-divisive among Dems, probably helps to be a woman and/or nonwhite. And someone you could see carrying the torch in 2024. I’d bet Kamala Harris, maybe Klobuchar, perhaps Mayor Pete or Beto or Stacey Abrams (since they need jobs anyway). Maybe Deval Patrick, if you want a former Massachusetts Governor who worked for Bain Capital. At least he’s a Dem.

Yang ticks every box. Young, POC, political outsider, progressive. He had the highest net favorability in the race, and polled the best against Trump pulling independents and former Trump voters. He made no enemies along the way. Also Biden likes him.
 
Last edited:

gkIrish

Greek God
Messages
13,184
Reaction score
1,004
Key word being “losing.”

Also, none of those people were actual Republicans. Mitt Romney was the Republican nominee for President against the most popular Democrat of his generation (and Joe Biden!). And while he was a typically-moderate Republican Governor of Massachusetts and is admirably disgusted with Trump, he is still and has always been a Republican, with the voting record to match. Presumably he’d nominate anti-abortion Supreme Court justices, among many other disqualifying positions for someone asking Democratic voters to put him in the White House.

There are already going to be a lot of butthurt Bernie Bros if Biden wins the nomination. Making Romney VP would play right into their “both parties are the same” hands. He’s also not very popular in the industrial Midwest - or wasn’t in 2012 - where this race likely gets decided. Like Biden, Mitt’s a decent guy, but I’m not sure what he brings to the table to beat Trump aside from maybe a small group of business-class Never Trump Republicans who feel politically homeless right now. What states do they swing? Virginia? Utah? IDK.

Biden’s VP pick will be really important. It needs to be someone relatively young, broadly popular and not-divisive among Dems, probably helps to be a woman and/or nonwhite. And someone you could see carrying the torch in 2024. I’d bet Kamala Harris, maybe Klobuchar, perhaps Mayor Pete or Beto or Stacey Abrams (since they need jobs anyway). Maybe Deval Patrick, if you want a former Massachusetts Governor who worked for Bain Capital. At least he’s a Dem.

You stated "there is no appetite, among actual Democratic voters, for an old, rich, white, moderate Republican in that role" so I showed how there is absolutely no basis for that statement based on historical evidence. I think Democrats want to beat Trump first and foremost so I offered a suggestion of an out-of-the-box candidate that I think would actually help achieve that goal. Romney would bring the independents to Biden's side and people like me who want an excuse not to vote for Trump.

I in no way think it is remotely possible that Romney would be picked so there's no point in discussing it more. I just thought it would be an idea worth exploring for Biden.
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
Being a role model is not the only priority or even the biggest priority. But as I felt about Clinton and his adultery I would prefer a president in office with some moral backbone. You are presuming this isn't a binary choice. It's either Trump or the Democratic nominee. If the Republican nominee wasn't a jackass I would vote for him or her 9 times out of 10 based on policy. But some things are more important.

And yes I did watch the SOTU and thought he did a great job. Not sure how that is related to the other 364 days of his presidency? Anyway this is the last thing I am going to post about Trump in here because it's off-topic. We can debate further when the election gets closer.

Just my opinion, but I'll take policy over personality any day. And Joe might be seen as a nicer guy, but that's just image. He's as shallow and corrupt as any politician out there. He's pure status quo. Klobuchar and Yang seemed like the the most honest/morale/sincere out of the bunch to me. There's a whole lot I hate about Trump, but I've very happy with where we are on the issues. And if kids are looking to politicians for role models, that's simply bad because politicians suck for the most part.
 
K

koonja

Guest
His SOTU was ABOUT the other 364 days of presidency. Are you talking about his "presentation"? I hope not. I couldn't care less about how someone presents something, I care about the underlying impact his/her policy has had.

- Record low unimployment
- Record low unimployment for Blacks and Hispanics
- 7 million new jobs created (occupied predominately by women).
- 10 Million moved off of welfare and food stamps
- Economy and investment are thriving (and low-wage-earners are benefiting 3X as much as the upper class as a result)
- Our military is stronger than ever
- Our foreign policy is bringing jobs back to the states
- Money is being reinvested in "hot spots" (I forget the term he used, but going back into high density, low income communities to improve quality of life).
- Combating Drug costs and healthcare premiums and actually making a difference.
- 47% increase in wealth for the bottom half of American households.
- Protecting us from China by fighting back and blocking them out.

These are off of the top of my head, there are more if I looked this up. So yeah, those 364 days have been well spent.

Let's pray to God we get another ~1,000 of those days.
 
Last edited:

Wild Bill

Well-known member
Messages
5,519
Reaction score
3,266
Yang ticks every box. Young, POC, political outsider, progressive. He had the highest net favorability in the race, and polled the best against Trump pulling independents and former Trump voters. He made no enemies along the way. Also Biden likes him.

Agree with most of this but he's too much of an outsider and I doubt the establishment trusts him enough to toe the line. I'm not so sure Yang would agree either. I'm sure he has better shit to do than prance around the WH with Biden.

I think Buttgieg could be the pick - owned by the establishment, fake midwest appeal, his sexuality can be used to appeal to progressives, experience as VP will be used to groom him into a 2024/2028 contender, gets his funding from the same place Obama got his.
 
Last edited:

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Bloomberg drops out, endorsing Biden.

If reports of Bloomberg spending $500 mil on his campaign, Trump has been estimated to be worth $3.5 billion by Forbes. https://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#3cb9ddb62899. Astounding amount of money Bloomberg dumped into a Presidential campaign with promises of more.
 
Last edited:

stlnd01

Was away. Now returned.
Messages
13,386
Reaction score
10,247
You stated "there is no appetite, among actual Democratic voters, for an old, rich, white, moderate Republican in that role" so I showed how there is absolutely no basis for that statement based on historical evidence. I think Democrats want to beat Trump first and foremost so I offered a suggestion of an out-of-the-box candidate that I think would actually help achieve that goal. Romney would bring the independents to Biden's side and people like me who want an excuse not to vote for Trump.

I in no way think it is remotely possible that Romney would be picked so there's no point in discussing it more. I just thought it would be an idea worth exploring for Biden.

Fair. Sorry if I went off. I’ve just had a lot of conversations with Republican friends lately who seem to think the Democrats should nominate someone THEY like (Bloomberg, for instance), when I tend to think it’s more important for the Democrats to nominate someone DEMOCRATS like.

Also, in this case (assuming Biden wins) they already have an older moderate white man with theoretical crossover appeal on the ticket. They need someone who can energize turnout and offer a bridge to the future more than they need to win over some further small slice of what’s remaining of the middle.
 
Last edited:

ACamp1900

Counting my ‘bet against ND’ winnings
Messages
48,948
Reaction score
11,230
Fair. Sorry if I went off. I’ve just had a lot of conversations with Republican friends lately who seem to think the Democrats should nominate someone THEY like (Bloomberg, for instance), when I tend to think it’s more important for the Democrats to nominate someone DEMOCRATS like.

Need to think of Indys, tarians and such too I would think, at least to a certain degree... I've been a registered member of either party in my life and have been indy for some time. I abstained from the last Presidential portion of the ballot and may do so again. I will say though, if the left puts Sanders out there I'm voting Trump and would do so 20 times if I could... not sure that outweighs your point, but food for thought.
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
One more tidbit for the Board to engage on:

How Progressive are America’s Cities? (Harvard Political)

The first section:
This past August, the presidential candidates and Congressional leaders of the Democratic Party met in San Francisco for the summer meeting of the Democratic National Committee. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) laid out her bold legislative agenda, while candidates vying for the nomination shared their own progressive policy platforms. They spoke of the need to transition to a universal health care system and advocated for the rights of marginalized communities. They pushed for reform of a society that, to them, is heavily skewed toward the wealthy and touted the importance of a more progressive tax code and other measures to promote greater equality.

San Francisco, in particular, seems like a fitting place for this convention. Part of Pelosi’s district, San Francisco has developed a reputation as one of the liberal hubs of the country. The city last had a Republican mayor in 1964 and has voted for the Democratic candidate in every presidential election since 1956. This Democratic dominance was evident in 2016, as Hillary Clinton received 85 percent of the vote in San Francisco County compared to the 9 percent that went to President Donald Trump.

However, outside the walls of the Hilton Hotel in Union Square, where the DNC meeting was held, the ugly reality of living conditions in San Francisco becomes apparent. Even in the tourism center of the city, some of the nearly 10,000 homeless residents of San Francisco dwell on the streets. Despite being one of the most liberal cities in America, San Francisco has fallen victim to the growing socio-economic inequality that is strongly condemned by the progressive wing of the Democratic Party. Housing prices have become too expensive for working people to afford, forcing them to reside on the sidewalks. The result is a city that functions only for the wealthy — the antithesis of the progressive agenda.

This disconnect, however, is not limited to San Francisco. Other traditionally liberal cities, such as New York and Boston, have also been unable to contain the accelerating divide between the very rich and the very poor. While inequality continues to impact the underprivileged communities of these cities, local governments have made efforts to make their cities more inclusive, just, and reflective of progressive values. With these contrasting perspectives, the question remains: Just how progressive are America’s cities?
 

stlnd01

Was away. Now returned.
Messages
13,386
Reaction score
10,247
Need to think of Indys, tarians and such too I would think, at least to a certain degree... I've been a registered member of either party in my life and have been indy for some time. I abstained from the last Presidential portion of the ballot and may do so again. I will say though, if the left puts Sanders out there I'm voting Trump and would do so 20 times if I could... not sure that outweighs your point, but food for thought.

I get it on Sanders. How about Biden?
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
Need to think of Indys, tarians and such too I would think, at least to a certain degree... I've been a registered member of either party in my life and have been indy for some time. I abstained from the last Presidential portion of the ballot and may do so again. I will say though, if the left puts Sanders out there I'm voting Trump and would do so 20 times if I could... not sure that outweighs your point, but food for thought.

Agreed. While I think the dem's need to pick someone they like, they also need to pick someone that will help bring in the most votes. That could mean trying to win Bernie's progressive fans by choosing someone like Warren, or picking someone very moderate to grab INDs and existing Trump voters. Somebody like Harris imo is a bad choice. I doubt she resonates with either of those areas, and doesn't do much in swing states. Kobuchar and Warren are the two I think would help. Yang too.
 

gkIrish

Greek God
Messages
13,184
Reaction score
1,004
Fair. Sorry if I went off. I’ve just had a lot of conversations with Republican friends lately who seem to think the Democrats should nominate someone THEY like (Bloomberg, for instance), when I tend to think it’s more important for the Democrats to nominate someone DEMOCRATS like.

Also, in this case (assuming Biden wins) they already have an older moderate white man with theoretical crossover appeal on the ticket. They need someone who can energize turnout and offer a bridge to the future more than they need to win over some further small slice of what’s remaining of the middle.

I think increased voter turnout among Democrats generated by enthusiasm for a certain candidate or VP is offset by the increased turnout on the Republican side who are energized to beat that candidate. Let's say Warren was picked as the VP to try to generate progressive turnout. Well there are plenty of Republicans who hate progressive ideas who will show up to prevent a progressive from taking office.

That's why I think the VP needs to be someone who can bring independents and moderates on board.
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
I think increased voter turnout among Democrats generated by enthusiasm for a certain candidate or VP is offset by the increased turnout on the Republican side who are energized to beat that candidate. Let's say Warren was picked as the VP to try to generate progressive turnout. Well there are plenty of Republicans who hate progressive ideas who will show up to prevent a progressive from taking office.

That's why I think the VP needs to be someone who can bring independents and moderates on board.

Doesn't Biden already check that box? He's the most moderate status quo guy out there.
 

stlnd01

Was away. Now returned.
Messages
13,386
Reaction score
10,247
I think increased voter turnout among Democrats generated by enthusiasm for a certain candidate or VP is offset by the increased turnout on the Republican side who are energized to beat that candidate. Let's say Warren was picked as the VP to try to generate progressive turnout. Well there are plenty of Republicans who hate progressive ideas who will show up to prevent a progressive from taking office.

That's why I think the VP needs to be someone who can bring independents and moderates on board.

Of course, there’s a long-running debate over how much the VP even matters when it comes to driving votes FOR a ticket, let alone AGAINST it. I’d be curious to see any research on that.
Though I think one could argue, given Biden’s advanced age, that his VP pick will matter more than most (not just if he were to die but as a presumptive leading Dem going forward). We’ll see.

Yang’s an interesting idea. Not typical, obvs, but an extremely likable guy.
 

BGIF

Varsity Club
Messages
43,946
Reaction score
2,922
Bloomberg drops out, endorsing Biden.

If reports of Bloomberg spending $500 mil on his campaign, Trump has been estimated to be worth $3.5 billion by Forbes. https://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#3cb9ddb62899. Astounding amount of money Bloomberg dumped into a Presidential campaign with promises of more.

it's 3.5 Billion

Yeah, BUT ... that's only if Bloomberg blew $500 mil on his campaign. IF he did not that Trump is worth something else per Legacy's highlighted IF statement.
 

BGIF

Varsity Club
Messages
43,946
Reaction score
2,922
The pundits and millionaire Bernie Sanders are raving about Bloomberg spending "exorbitant" sums of money on his campaign. It strikes me that Mike has the premier prerequisite for a member of Congress, SPEND! In the words of Republican Senator Dirksen more that half a century ago,

A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real money.


The problem is Bloomberg only spent a 1/2 a billion and he did it with HIS money. Congress, both houses; both parties, makes a point of spending OTHER PEOPLE'S money.
 

ACamp1900

Counting my ‘bet against ND’ winnings
Messages
48,948
Reaction score
11,230
The problem is Bloomberg only spent a 1/2 a billion and he did it with HIS money. Congress, both houses; both parties, makes a point of spending OTHER PEOPLE'S money.

I caught that with some of the criticism of Bloomberg... "Do they realize what they are saying???... It's bad if someone spends an insane amount of their own money, but it's okay if you spend an insane amount or someone else's???"
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Yeah, BUT ... that's only if Bloomberg blew $500 mil on his campaign. IF he did not that Trump is worth something else per Legacy's highlighted IF statement.

No. Bloomberg's reported campaign spending is independent of Trump's net worth. That you may comment the net worth article or take it as fact due to the Forbes link with extensive documentation.

Should Bloomberg not have spent that much, he's going to spend it on the 2020 campaigns. This is about money in politics.

As far as Trump net worth, it's long been recognized that Trump would inflate his by tacking on over $4 billion in "brand value". He wanted to get onto the Forbes 400, while deflating his companies worth for taxes. He's also whined he is losing $2-5 Billion by being President. We all know he will fight as far as SCOTUS to keep his tax records from being revealed.

For 2019, Forbes has Trump at $3.1 Billion on their F400, putting him at 275th. In the past he has sued the writers of such articles. His tax returns listed $1.2 billion of losses on his tax filings from 1985 to 1994. He preserved some of his assets by declaring bankruptcies six times.

But that's Obama's fault and Trump's predictable response is "I'm being treated for unfairly."
 
Last edited:

gkIrish

Greek God
Messages
13,184
Reaction score
1,004
Doesn't Biden already check that box? He's the most moderate status quo guy out there.

Not saying he isn't. But he isn't really going to do well in the Midwest so I don't think it would be a bad idea to nominate a moderate Midwesterner as his VP and double down on independents. Klobuchar makes a lot of sense the more I think about it.

The one thing I definitely don't think he needs is someone who is going to help get the black vote. He already does really well with that demographic already.
 
K

koonja

Guest
Not saying he isn't. But he isn't really going to do well in the Midwest so I don't think it would be a bad idea to nominate a moderate Midwesterner as his VP and double down on independents. Klobuchar makes a lot of sense the more I think about it.

The one thing I definitely don't think he needs is someone who is going to help get the black vote. He already does really well with that demographic already.

You seem to really know your politics, so I'm generally curious to hear your response on this. I moved it over as to not muck up this thread, but I want you to see it:

https://www.irishenvy.com/forums/showthread.php?t=312499&page=565
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
Not saying he isn't. But he isn't really going to do well in the Midwest so I don't think it would be a bad idea to nominate a moderate Midwesterner as his VP and double down on independents. Klobuchar makes a lot of sense the more I think about it.

The one thing I definitely don't think he needs is someone who is going to help get the black vote. He already does really well with that demographic already.

I agree on your last point, that's why I said either Amy or Liz. Both bring women, one brings progressive, one helps MW.
 

ulukinatme

Carr for QB 2026!
Messages
31,521
Reaction score
17,400
qg6wmgrhqnk41.png


From the comments:

In the brilliant words of Phillip J Fry, "Don't blame me, I forgot to vote"

Seriously... What the fuck is fucking wrong with you people??? Lower turnout than 2016 for 18-29 year olds in practically every fucking contest!!! Come the fuck on! Just for a couple of hours, a couple of days a year, can you put down your fucking meme machines and fucking engage???

Can somebody please make every profile on Tinder, etc. a “GO-VOTE” graphic on voting days? Splash it across every clip on Pornhub? Make millennial tropes auto-correct to “GO-VOTE!” just two days a year every 2 years?
 

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,605
Reaction score
20,081
qg6wmgrhqnk41.png


From the comments:

Seriously... What the fuck is fucking wrong with you people??? Lower turnout than 2016 for 18-29 year olds in practically every fucking contest!!! Come the fuck on! Just for a couple of hours, a couple of days a year, can you put down your fucking meme machines and fucking engage???

Can somebody please make every profile on Tinder, etc. a “GO-VOTE” graphic on voting days? Splash it across every clip on Pornhub? Make millennial tropes auto-correct to “GO-VOTE!” just two days a year every 2 years?

Only "woke" when it's convenient for them?

Looks like Bernie was able to salvage Cali.
 

IrishLax

Something Witty
Staff member
Messages
37,545
Reaction score
28,995
Warren dropping per reports.
No word on who she'll endorse.

It's being reported that she's basically trying to sell her endorsement to either Biden or Bernie. Angling for VP or best offer. Bernie should absolutely jump on the opportunity to tab her as VP, because her support may make him competitive in the remaining states and he seems dead in the water if it goes the other direction.
 

ab2cmiller

Troublemaker in training
Messages
11,453
Reaction score
8,532
It's being reported that she's basically trying to sell her endorsement to either Biden or Bernie. Angling for VP or best offer. Bernie should absolutely jump on the opportunity to tab her as VP, because her support may make him competitive in the remaining states and he seems dead in the water if it goes the other direction.

Warren being Warren
 

IrishLax

Something Witty
Staff member
Messages
37,545
Reaction score
28,995
Warren being Warren

If I were in her shoes and carrying 10-15% of the vote in my back pocket, I'd probably be doing the same thing haha... she is a valuable asset, that's for sure.

Going to be very weird seeing only two people on stage for the final* debate on 3/15.
 
Top