BVG Fired

[Cackalacky]

SUP Cack.

Yea. I think his firebrand personality is pretty universally applicable, and I don't see anything he is doing that he couldn't do at ND. If ND hires him, I'm taking a life insurance policy out on him though...dude is about to pop something.

Howdy Big Cat.
I think Grantham could do wonders. Though we still would need a HC. Maybe If BK is still around next year he could make a big hire. He needs to do something. I tend to agree that he may in fact be delusional about the state of current affairs. It's hard to fathom the lack of in game adjustments and general conservative head coaching he does against big teams.

 

[Irish YJ]

Brian Kelly of Notre Dame Fighting Irish -- Staffer liked tweet about firing Brian VanGorder

apologies if already posted

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I think BK has already made up his mind that BVG won't be back next year. It's just a matter of when BVG will be released.


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[phgreek]

Howdy Big Cat.
I think Grantham could do wonders. Though we still would need a HC. Maybe If BK is still around next year he could make a big hire. He needs to do something. I tend to agree that he may in fact be delusional about the state of current affairs. It's hard to fathom the lack of in game adjustments and general conservative head coaching he does against big teams.

I think, more than anything, the critical hire for the ND program is the next DC regardless of the HC.

The last two coaches (BK and CW) have shown you can recruit at ND, but neither seemed to be able to keep a consistent defense. Offense will be good for another 2-3 years...need some wins on the defensive recruiting trail, and need to consistently develop some 1st round NFL talent on the Dline to get ND to be a defensive player's destination (or one of them). Would love the next DC to develop an identity as DT U...but at this point I'd take competent.

 

[NDgradstudent]

I think BK has already made up his mind that BVG won't be back next year. It's just a matter of when BVG will be released.

The fact is that we've wasted three years with this garbage. BK evidently can't hire A guys (not named Mike Sanford). He needs to go too.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

The fact is that we've wasted three years with this garbage. BK evidently can't hire A guys (not named Mike Sanford). He needs to go too.

Disagree with your statement about not hiring "A guys" as assistants.

Diaco
Cooks
Denson
Denbrock
Heistand
Ed Werner
Alford


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[Wingman Ray]

Brian Kelly of Notre Dame Fighting Irish -- Staffer liked tweet about firing Brian VanGorder

apologies if already posted

Sad thing is BK still backing BVG. Guy is gonna put one of BKs feet in the grave and all BK can do is talk about young players not grasping it. News flash BK, NONE of your defensive guys get it. Or at least, it sure as heck doesn't show

 

[irishog77]

How do coaches "scout" other up and coming coaches? I know coaches conferences and such are orgies of networking and brown nosing, but how does somebody like Kelly find Tom Herman like Urban Meyer did?

Kelly has limited coaching connections because A) he's been a head coach so long (so not many coaches he encountered working his way up the ranks and B) he has multiple coaches that have been with him for years.

So does his agent help him out with connections? Does ND have any sort professional development liaison?

Most likely, ND's next DC is going to have to be: A) 2016's version of BC's DC from last year (which we will all have to wait and see and let the season play out before we see what defensive unit(s) way over-perform; or B) a position coach from somebody under a good coaching tree like Grantham, Pruitt, or Smart.

I doubt somebody like Shoop (somebody mentioned him earlier from tennessee) would come to ND. It's a lateral move for a DC and not sure it gets him any closer to being a HC (if that's what he ultimately wants to do), especially since he will have moved from penn state to tennessee to ND in 3 consecutive seasons. I doubt somebody from any of the traditional college heavyweights would outright leave their DC position to take ND's position. Maybe so if ND offered A TON of money to somebody like Pruitt was given (twice) or Grantham. But what DC is out there that would even be worth offering $1.5-$2 million, for multiple years, to?

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Sad thing is BK still backing BVG. Guy is gonna put one of BKs feet in the grave and all BK can do is talk about young players not grasping it. News flash BK, NONE of your defensive guys get it. Or at least, it sure as heck doesn't show

I think he is backing up BVG, because he can't throw him under the bus in front of the media.

Kelly could call him out and say the defensive coach needs to coach better and tweak the scheme. Kelly not saying something along those lines is the head scratcher.

I still think the way Kelly looked at BVG and chewed him out lay night, that Kelly will fire him soon.


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[IrishLax]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

 

[Junkhead]

We held them under 40pts at home????

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

I would like BVG to be fired tomorrow and Elliot to be named interim def coordinator for he rest of the season.


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[IrishLax]

So after looking at it more and more I think we should go hard after Mike Tressel from Michigan State. Co-DC making only $400k/year. Offer $1mil/year and promotion and he'd probably take it... have him run the Dantonio/Narduzzi Cover 3 as the base defense and call it a day.

 

[BeatSC]

I would like BVG to be fired tomorrow and Elliot to be named interim def coordinator for he rest of the season.


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Ditto

 

[Irish4Life09]

So after looking at it more and more I think we should go hard after Mike Tressel from Michigan State. Co-DC making only $400k/year. Offer $1mil/year and promotion and he'd probably take it... have him run the Dantonio/Narduzzi Cover 3 as the base defense and call it a day.

Sounds good to me

 

[IrishLax]

Ditto

Elliot can't do it. Health problems. The only guys around the program that can step in would be Hudson or maybe Elston. Hudson's defenses in his career have really underwhelmed so I don't see how he'd be able to put a superior product on the field.

 

[Calabrese's People]

So after looking at it more and more I think we should go hard after Mike Tressel from Michigan State. Co-DC making only $400k/year. Offer $1mil/year and promotion and he'd probably take it... have him run the Dantonio/Narduzzi Cover 3 as the base defense and call it a day.

Remove Booker & BVG. Add Mike Tressell (DC) and Mike Elko (Ass. HC & Safeties Coach). Let Sanford take over OC. Denbrock (WR & Special Teams Co-Ordinator).

In my perfect world.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Two words:

Dave Aranda

 

[ulukinatme]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

Exactly. I think the most telling thing is the fact we punted on that last possession Saturday. I honestly don't think it was because we trusted our defense to get the stop, I think BK was putting pressure on BVG and setting up a scapegoat. "I stood up for you after Texas. Get this stop, or you're a dead man walking." When we gave up the first down, he looked right at VanGordor. Obviously I'm reading into it a bit, and maybe that's not the case at all, but I really don't see a scenario where we legitimately lean on this defense to provide a stop in a big game when the chips are on the table. I'm going to trust the offense to provide a big play.

 

[Irish Insanity]

Sad thing is BK still backing BVG. Guy is gonna put one of BKs feet in the grave and all BK can do is talk about young players not grasping it. News flash BK, NONE of your defensive guys get it. Or at least, it sure as heck doesn't show

Here's another News Flash. Maybe it's not about the players 'grasping it.' Maybe his D just flat out sucks.

 

[CrystalHead]

Exactly. I think the most telling thing is the fact we punted on that last possession Saturday. I honestly don't think it was because we trusted our defense to get the stop, I think BK was putting pressure on BVG and setting up a scapegoat. "I stood up for you after Texas. Get this stop, or you're a dead man walking." When we gave up the first down, he looked right at VanGordor. Obviously I'm reading into it a bit, and maybe that's not the case at all, but I really don't see a scenario where we legitimately lean on this defense to provide a stop in a big game when the chips are on the table. I'm going to trust the offense to provide a big play.

I agree whole heartedly on your last statement. Why would you trust a defense that Dantonio didn't respect. 4th and 1 in his own territory early in the game and he didn't hesitate to go for it. He did it one other time too. Both successful! I personally believe Kelly has a problem with Kizer. 2 close games and he took the ball out of the hands of arguably the best QB in the country. This is the only thing I've agreed with Doug Flute about when he said Kizer is checking out of every play and doing what he wants to do. He is attacking the defense with his arm and taking it to the MSU defense.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

After finishing 37th and 69th, under BVG in his first two years at ND, the defense is hovering at 104 through three games this year. If this isn't a collapse, I don't know what is.

I mean this with all the respect in the world.

Now I am hearing, and I can't provide detail now, that there are some real behind the scenes 'issues' coming up. You can read that as discord above the player level if you want. Remember, most of these guys have real history with Kelly that goes way back. I hope I don't say anything out of turn, but some recruits missed some time with the coaches over the weekend because of some issues needing resolution.

Doesn't seem like we did badly with recruits, all things considered. But there weren't the resources, to give some of the kids the attention they deserved. What is the point of a weekend like this when all you do is put a recruit in a holding pattern?

 

[stlnd01]

What's Ed Orgeron up to these days? I'd take him as interim DC tomorrow.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Here's another News Flash. Maybe it's not about the players 'grasping it.' Maybe his D just flat out sucks.

I isn't about whether players grasp it.

Forget about it with the 'flat out sucks.'

The problem with BVG's defense is that there is a 'How To Defeat Brian VanGorder's Defense' guide on the internet.

Everybody can force his safeties off of the deep ball and work over his corners when they have to decide between covering deep and taking the man to the inside.

The shit about Coleman was smokescreen. No corner can play BVG's defense, witness Cole Luke this weekend!

 

[BoredIrish]

BK and his loyalty to his assistants has become a real negative to the performance of this team. I understand and even appreciate the sentiment... but if you want to play with the big boys, you have to be a little bit ruthless.

I think part of the reason we got BVG to begin with is because BK didnt want to replace his existing assistants. You cant hire a top notch DC and not give him free reign to hire his own position coaches. BVG agreed to slot in and keep guys like Elston on board.

If BK wants to keep Elston on board as his recruiting co-ordinator, I think he needs to move him to the offense and let him coach TE's. This defense, in spite of having decent talent, is just too weak mentally and fundamentally to not wipe the slate clean, bring in a top notch DC and let him hire his own positional coaches.

 

[stlnd01]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

Yep. I don't know what people want Kelly to be saying about BVG (unless it's "he gone," of course). Read between the lines just a little and it's quite clear. But right now you need someone to replace him and they haven't figured that out yet.

 

[Ndaccountant]

Guys, you can't NOT back BVG unless you are going to fire him now. Otherwise you have an internal collapse.

Look what happened with Manny Diaz. Full throated support right up to the moment where he got axed.

Unless you're going to bring in Bob Elliot as a relief pitcher and quit on the development (lol) of the young guys in this current scheme, you have to support BVG. You can't get up there and say "well, three years in the scheme obviously doesn't work but I've got to stick with this guy for the rest of the year."

Yep. Bed is made for the 2016 season. BVG will most likely stay the rest of the year, unless the fire gets too hot for BK that he literally has to do it. We aren't there yet.

 

[Ndaccountant]

Exactly. I think the most telling thing is the fact we punted on that last possession Saturday. I honestly don't think it was because we trusted our defense to get the stop, I think BK was putting pressure on BVG and setting up a scapegoat. "I stood up for you after Texas. Get this stop, or you're a dead man walking." When we gave up the first down, he looked right at VanGordor. Obviously I'm reading into it a bit, and maybe that's not the case at all, but I really don't see a scenario where we legitimately lean on this defense to provide a stop in a big game when the chips are on the table. I'm going to trust the offense to provide a big play.

That last play was laughingly horrid. Just an embarrassingly blown coverage that everyone in the stadium saw after the first three steps of the back pedal.

 

[PANDFAN]

something to consider---BK has NEVER fired any assistants while at ND

 

[Irish#1]

I think BK has already made up his mind that BVG won't be back next year. It's just a matter of when BVG will be released.


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I agree. The exchange on the sideline spoke volumes for me. BK isn't going to announce after a game that he is disappointed in BVG or he is thinking about letting him go. That is all going to happen behind the scenes.

I wonder if BVG thinks he has a schematic advantage on defense? lol