Alabama Freshman Dee Liner posts picture with Wads of Cash

[woolybug25]

Ahh, how is this for "ignoring it"?

Believe it or not, there are kids at virtually every school that go to that school because they believe it can help them go to the next level for football. Numerous recruiting analysts have gone on the record saying so several times. ND is not an exception to that. Nd has had recruits that chose the school, both past and present, because they believed that it was their best opportunity to succeed and go to the next level (NFL), although it happens less frequently at ND than at other places (SEC schools, Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Florida State, Virginia Tech, etc.). It's unfortunate, especially since such a small percentage of scholarship players actually pan out in college, much less make it to the NFL. But I can tell you, that not every Bama player feels that way. There are some that choose Bama because the school will help them succeed not only athletically, but academically as well. I've had classes with numerous Alabama football players, past and present, and have met/become friends with quite a few through those classes, or from mutual friends. I've also worked with a few of them in group projects/in-class/homework assignments. I'll try not to be boring, but I'll give examples, from both my personal experience, through friends of mine, and praise received from members of the coaching staffs regarding academics. And not with walk-ons, but with quality players that are on scholarship.

Cyrus Jones (Freshman in '12-'13)-He is very good friends with my girlfriend's younger sister and I had the good fortune to get to know him a little bit. He's a good student and he wants to play in the NFL, but getting a degree is VERY important to him and his family. He went to a High School that had a very good academic pedigree, and he takes classes very seriously. He went on record a few times saying he wants to go to a school where he will get a quality education. He's a great kid, too.

Anthony Steen (Junior in '12-'13)-He's done well academically, and I worked with him, in addition to others, in a group project for a class that we had together. He would go from mornings working out, to class, to practice, to tutoring, and then to meeting up with our group several times to ensure that our project would receive the highest mark possible. He went above and beyond putting his fair share of work into the group project.

Dont'A Hightower (Bama player 2008-2011)-A big reason why he chose to come back for the 2011 season was so he could get his degree.

Dre Kirkpatrick (Bama player 2009-2011)-Although he left for the NFL a year early, and really wanted to play in the NFL for a long time, he was a very good student, and Saban, and his teammates praised him for that numerous times. Now, he's made some not-so-smart off-the-field decisions since he left Bama, but he did well in the classroom at Bama and took advantage of the academic opportunities that were available to him.

Barrett Jones-Not much needs to be said. He polished off a 4.0 in Accounting in just 3 years. His two brothers are also excellent students, and they put a big emphasis on academics. He would not have gone to Bama if he believed that he wouldn't get a good education that would set him up for a great future in case football didn't work out. Nor would his brothers have elected to come to Bama if they didn't believe that they wouldn't receive an education that would allow them to succeed after graduation.

Vinnie Sunseri (Sophomore in '12-'13)-He's done some work with some friends of mine in their classes for homework/projects. He does well academically and his family values education.

C.J. Mosley (Junior in '12-'13)-He didn't even consider the NFL, despite likely going in the first or second round. He tweeted that he wanted to stay and get a degree, and that he couldn't wait to cross the stage with his diploma in hand. He also went on Jox 94.5 in Birmingham and said that "I wasn't leaving until I got my degree."

Some others: Kellen Williams, Arie & Cyrus Kouandjio (family puts a strong emphasis on education), Ryan Kelly, Austin Shepherd, John Fulton, A.J. McCarron, Geno Smith.

 

[ACamp1900]

So are Barrett Jones and Cyrus Jones stupid?

Yes

 

[irishog77]

So are Barrett Jones and Cyrus Jones stupid?

He said YOU are.

 

[RammerJammer91]

He said YOU are.

Really? I didn't realize that. What I was getting at is those are two kids that have declared multiple times that they wanted to go to a school that would help them reach their full potential academically, as well as athletically. And both families put a very strong emphasis on education. That's not my opinion of them, they've said it before, and in Cyrus' case, will say it again throughout his Bama career if asked about school. I don't see why they would lie multiple times. So, in making those statements, would they both be liars in addition to being idiots?

 

[NDWorld247]

So are Barrett Jones and Cyrus Jones stupid?

Barrett Jones was a legacy recruit. Just sayin'.

Side note, I was actually convinced T Town Tommy was Jones' dad until I remembered he said he went to college at WKU, not Alabama.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

Right, there's a difference between (1) choosing the most prestigious university possible, and (2) choosing the university at which you feel you are most likely to academically succeed.

Since Alabama players usually get offers from all over the country, #1 isn't too likely. But #2 certainly is possible.

 

[woolybug25]

Really? I didn't realize that. What I was getting at is those are two kids that have declared multiple times that they wanted to go to a school that would help them reach their full potential academically, as well as athletically. And both families put a very strong emphasis on education. That's not my opinion of them, they've said it before, and in Cyrus' case, will say it again throughout his Bama career if asked about school. I don't see why they would lie multiple times. So, in making those statements, would they both be liars in addition to being idiots?

Ho dense are you? No one ever claimed that the recruits didn't say that. But obviously that isn't the truth if they went to a school that graduates 50-60% of their players, have most of them major in "general studies" and don't rank in the top 50 nationally in any program.

Again... no one is saying the players didn't say that they care about academics, we are just all telling you that you are a complete fool if you believe it.

 

[ACamp1900]

Did someone in this thread actually imply Dont'A Hightower cares about education??? LOL…

SOMEONE ROLL THE DAMN FOOTAGE!!!

 

[NDWorld247]

Alabama defensive lineman signee Darius Paige cleared to enroll | al.com

Alabama Signee Robert Foster Still Working to Qualify Academically

Reps to anyone that can find quotes from either of these scholars on how much they value education or how getting their degree is important. I would do it myself but I have to run to practice.

 

[ACamp1900]

I had a far too long winded PM from someone telling me how Hightower is a Rhodes Scholar, does charitable work to save puppies and is highly educated…

I would have bought it had I never once seen the guy interviewed… someone that values education, he is not.

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

Do yourself a favor and scroll through the pictures here.. hysterical.
Reuben Foster, Alabama football recruit, sleeps in class

 

[ACamp1900]

When did I say he was a Rhodes Scholar? Never. Funny how you have nothing better to do than lie. I'm not even challenging you or anything, I'm just telling you about how a player came back, In Part, because he wanted to get his degree. Stop lying, and tell the truth.

He sure told me....

 

[IrishinTN]

Fer crying out loud. The dude obviously just got his scholarship money and is ready to walk it over to the Registrar. Duh. That is how scholarships work, right?

 

[Junkhead]

Don't feed the trolls. Or idiots.

 

[dublinirish]

Lol we get some good ones on here! Rammer makes BruinSteve sound like Noam Chompsky

 

[NDinL.A.]

Almost ALL recruits say they are looking at academics first. Guys who can't spell their own name say that. It's what they're supposed to say. Some mean it. The majority do not. They get on campus and take forever to declare a major and then they declare the easiest major possible. They also put very little effort into their studies and try t get others (tutors, girls) to their work for them. Or they simply don't do the work, knowing that everything will be taken care of. Even ND has had some dudes like that (but nothing like most other powerhouses).

Here's an example of what a recruit being recruited by Michigan said, about 7 years ago. He was being recruited by Lloyd Carr but ended up playing for DickRod:

"I'm looking for a school with strong academics," (he) said. "The school's environment or the football program doesn't really matter.

"I want to a school where I feel comfortable with the coaches, teachers and the student-body."

And upon committing, his uncle said:

"What did it for him was Shari Acho. Oh my goodness, she is excellent. I was talking to him about it and said there are all resources available for you to graduate and get an education and that's what we're looking at. You couldn't ask for anything more."

Sounds great right? However, this kid went to my alma mater. He played for the same deadbeat coach that me and my buddies played for. My buddies still were tight with some of the coaches, so back in '06 we went out with them, and they told us just how much the kid HATED school and did everything possible to make himself ineligible, but the old coach knew how to keep him above water. Kid was incredibly talented, but lazy on the field and especially off of it. Literally did no work in the classroom.

Long story short, he played for DickRod as a freshman in the first few games, and then never was heard from again. Eventually got kicked off the team. They said it was a violation of team rules, but the word out here was that he never went to class on top of being a bad teammate.

Bottom line...don't listen to the words, look at the actions. If a guy like Barrett Jones says he cares about education, then goes out and gets a REAL degree with a solid GPA from Alabama, then I believe him. But for the most part, those dudes in the SEC are out for the NFL, and the coaches don't give a crap about them getting a meaningful degree.

Hey, it works for them, but just embrace it...don't act like most of these kids pick Alabama for their eduction lol.

 

[NDhoosier]

Different situation.

I dont think so, I believe you are just dismissing it because you have nothing to say.

Both parties are equally guilty. period.

 

[dublinirish]

Liner is transferring to arkansas state

 

[NDinMich]

Liner is transferring to arkansas state

Any pics of Liner showing off the cents ASU threw his way?

 

[Irish YJ]

 

[Crazy Balki]

Liner is transferring to arkansas state

Is it snowing in Alabama? There have been reports of an avalanche within the Tuscaloosa city limits. Good lord, I know they're deep, like deep deep, but how much more of this can they take?

 

[Bishop2b5]

Is it snowing in Alabama? There have been reports of an avalanche within the Tuscaloosa city limits. Good lord, I know they're deep, like deep deep, but how much more of this can they take?

Transfers haven't really been an issue. Liner never progressed up the depth chart or saw significant playing time and it's been known for some time he was transferring. To the best of my recollection, all the transfers the past few years have been guys who weren't likely to make the 2-deep and were leaving for more playing time somewhere else, or guys who had gotten in trouble and needed a fresh start.

What's hurting us right now are injuries and knuckleheads. In the span of a week, we've lost (at least temporarily) a RB and WR to knee injuries, a RB to behavior issues, and a DL to a bad choice in behavior or girlfriends. Talent and depth offset some attrition, but geez. When it rains it pours. Definitely not a good week in T-Town.

 

[Legacy]

Transfers haven't really been an issue. Liner never progressed up the depth chart or saw significant playing time and it's been known for some time he was transferring. To the best of my recollection, all the transfers the past few years have been guys who weren't likely to make the 2-deep and were leaving for more playing time somewhere else, or guys who had gotten in trouble and needed a fresh start.

What's hurting us right now are injuries and knuckleheads. In the span of a week, we've lost (at least temporarily) a RB and WR to knee injuries, a RB to behavior issues, and a DL to a bad choice in behavior or girlfriends. Talent and depth offset some attrition, but geez. When it rains it pours. Definitely not a good week in T-Town.

This pretty well sums up why Saban oversigns.

This is the standard he sets for continuing your education at Alabama past a couple of years - stay clean and make the two deep.

Two ACL tears and two last straw disciplinary issues to an outsider do not seem to be much of a deviation from the norm.

Alabama is now down to eighty-five scholarship players plus the two walkons given scholarships and a greyshirt.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Transfers haven't really been an issue. Liner never progressed up the depth chart or saw significant playing time and it's been known for some time he was transferring. To the best of my recollection, all the transfers the past few years have been guys who weren't likely to make the 2-deep and were leaving for more playing time somewhere else, or guys who had gotten in trouble and needed a fresh start.

What's hurting us right now are injuries and knuckleheads. In the span of a week, we've lost (at least temporarily) a RB and WR to knee injuries, a RB to behavior issues, and a DL to a bad choice in behavior or girlfriends. Talent and depth offset some attrition, but geez. When it rains it pours. Definitely not a good week in T-Town.

Wasn't Liner in like his 2nd year? This seems to be the downside to oversign and all of Alabama's recruiting success. Recruits that are highly ranked can't develop like they should be because there's a massive influx of talent around them. Not to mention, recruiting 5-stars (a lot of them) is a tricky ordeal, because a lot of them have huge egos and that gives them less hunger and grit than somebody that say Michigan State and ND to an extent recruits. High-potential 3-4 star guys that are hungry to compete. Kinda makes me appreciate Kelly's methods of recruiting that much more.

 

[Bishop2b5]

Wasn't Liner in like his 2nd year? This seems to be the downside to oversign and all of Alabama's recruiting success. Recruits that are highly ranked can't develop like they should be because there's a massive influx of talent around them. Not to mention, recruiting 5-stars (a lot of them) is a tricky ordeal, because a lot of them have huge egos and that gives them less hunger and grit than somebody that say Michigan State and ND to an extent recruits. High-potential 3-4 star guys that are hungry to compete. Kinda makes me appreciate Kelly's methods of recruiting that much more.

Liner would've been a true junior this season. He certainly got plenty of opportunity, but never seemed to progress much beyond where he was when he first came into the program. All the 5-stars don't seem to hold a truly talented or hard-working player back. About half our guys who've gone on to be All-Americans or high NFL picks were relatively low-ranked recruits. We've had several true freshmen who started, low-ranked recruits who blossomed into superstars, and guys who've been patient and worked their way into the starting lineup only after 3 or 4 years. We've even had a walk-on who didn't get a single D1 scholarship offer, yet became an All-American and is doing well in the NFL. The opportunity is there, regardless of stars.

Whether it's at Bama or anywhere else, some kids have pretty much peaked at 18 and will never get much better while others will be vastly better a couple of years later. It's why some 5-stars never get any better and break into the 2-deep while some 3-stars who barely get an offer end up being 1st round draft picks.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Liner would've been a true junior this season. He certainly got plenty of opportunity, but never seemed to progress much beyond where he was when he first came into the program. All the 5-stars don't seem to hold a truly talented or hard-working player back. About half our guys who've gone on to be All-Americans or high NFL picks were relatively low-ranked recruits. We've had several true freshmen who started, low-ranked recruits who blossomed into superstars, and guys who've been patient and worked their way into the starting lineup only after 3 or 4 years. We've even had a walk-on who didn't get a single D1 scholarship offer, yet became an All-American and is doing well in the NFL. The opportunity is there, regardless of stars.

Whether it's at Bama or anywhere else, some kids have pretty much peaked at 18 and will never get much better while others will be vastly better a couple of years later. It's why some 5-stars never get any better and break into the 2-deep while some 3-stars who barely get an offer end up being 1st round draft picks.

Saban used to embody that kind of perspective, and it yielded great results. Don't get me wrong, he's always recruited well, but take that 2012 team for instance. ND will actually have more talent, star-wise than that team. Saban needs to find hungrier players on a consistent basis. Just jamming 4-5 star players left and right isn't going to yield the results you'd expect. It's all about fitting a need with a player that fits the atmosphere of the school and team.

There also seems to be a difference between the 3-stars Kelly used to recruit in 2010-12 and the 3-stars he recruits now. They're higher ceiling guys that may not have reached their peak or just haven't gotten the publicity others received, but they have a ton of potential. I didn't see that in a lot of the 2010-12 3-star guys we recruited.

 

[pumpdog20]

Flashing cash? No big deal. The real travesty is the use of the "N" word.

 

[johnnycando]

Flashing cash? No big deal. The real travesty is the use of the "N" word.

Flew right over my head...

Brief synopsis?

 

[ACamp1900]

Flew right over my head...

Brief synopsis?

Re read the first post in the thread...

 

[Bishop2b5]

Saban used to embody that kind of perspective, and it yielded great results. Don't get me wrong, he's always recruited well, but take that 2012 team for instance. ND will actually have more talent, star-wise than that team. Saban needs to find hungrier players on a consistent basis. Just jamming 4-5 star players left and right isn't going to yield the results you'd expect. It's all about fitting a need with a player that fits the atmosphere of the school and team.

There also seems to be a difference between the 3-stars Kelly used to recruit in 2010-12 and the 3-stars he recruits now. They're higher ceiling guys that may not have reached their peak or just haven't gotten the publicity others received, but they have a ton of potential. I didn't see that in a lot of the 2010-12 3-star guys we recruited.

I agree with you. You make some good points. Just signing kids because they're highly rated and thinking you can just jam them into the system absolutely doesn't work. That happened to Bobby Bowden near the end... he started letting Scout and Rivals do his recruiting analysis for him and ended up with some teams high on talent and low on character and desire. Saban needs to get back to finding more of those 3- and 4-star kids who feel they have something to prove and will out-hit, outwork, and out-desire anybody else.

Kelly is doing a good job and building something at ND. His approach may take longer and frustrate you guys sometimes, but you're getting there for sure.