2015 Spring Practice Thread

[ResLife Hero]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>After four practice viewings, a breakdown of Notre Dame's depth chart, including base & sub packages: ($) <a href="http://t.co/tRcfYnyL1b">http://t.co/tRcfYnyL1b</a></p>— Anna Hickey (@AnnaHScout) <a href="https://twitter.com/AnnaHScout/status/582984789306654720">March 31, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[Booslum31]

Every year, the Spring camp thread is the same. First, worry and Denial of talent, then minimizing of video, followed by acceptance of the team, then joy related to 2 secs of video footage, then over exaggeration and proclamation of greatness, followed by retaliation and blame, then anger and hatred. Finally, mob mentality ensues. A ban follows shortly thereafter. There has to be a theory somewhere to explain this.

Laughed aloud! Thank you for that.

 

[Old Man Mike]

This isn't "put up or shut up". We ARE loaded at ALMOST every position, that is true. But IT'S ABOUT QUARTERBACKING. Kelly cannot win a national championship until one of these guys shows consistent game management --- every game, all game. And, in my opinion, this historical lack is not Coach's fault. Surprise incompetencies out of Dayne and Hendrix; "doin' the best I can" out of Tommy; bizarre blow-ups out of Everett --- these things were bad luck [against all odds that none of those guys have been what you need for a championship].

Kelly has been claimed to be a QB guru --- nobody who knows football says that. What they say is that Coach is a great systems organizer and play-caller, who can create excellent foundations for all phases of a football team, understands all phases of play, but if you're talking about "guru-ing", it's wide receivers that he's more likely to be an elite positions coach. [or even positions on the defensive side]. If anyone has let us down, it's been the QB coaches when Kelly hasn't been stuck with doing it himself. Now we seem to have a good one.

Kelly, again just my opinion, could win a National Championship with quite a bit less than we have at some other positions now, if he just had that AA or near-AA quarterback. Maybe Kiel would have become that, maybe not. Maybe Everett WILL become that, or maybe it will be more {inconsistency} of the same. Maybe Malik will become that, who knows? Maybe we'll have to wait for Wimbush. If Everett and Malik DON'T get up to near-AA game management standards, then we don't get to the play-offs, and it's wait for the next QB. Sooner or later one of these guys is BOUND to be the potent QB that he looked like in high school. Our luck on this HAS to turn out better sooner or later. In the meantime, I pray that Kelly stays pounding away at setting the powerful foundations everywhere else, and doesn't get discouraged.

 

[Me2SouthBend]

In terms of overall talent I think thats pretty good but those guys, hopefully, won't be on the field at the same time. We'd need some sort of WDE/speed rusher. We tried Day on the outside last year and thats not his game. He's about quickness off the ball, his lack of length and long speed are not great on the outside. I guess against the run on early downs it could happen but I don't see it.

I agree, just thinking about the push a line like that could generate. Them 4 strong young men.

 

[Luckylucci]

I agree, just thinking about the push a line like that could generate. Them 4 strong young men.

It definitely proves the point that we some real depth on the interior DL this year.

 

[Irish YJ]

This isn't "put up or shut up". We ARE loaded at ALMOST every position, that is true. But IT'S ABOUT QUARTERBACKING. Kelly cannot win a national championship until one of these guys shows consistent game management --- every game, all game. And, in my opinion, this historical lack is not Coach's fault. Surprise incompetencies out of Dayne and Hendrix; "doin' the best I can" out of Tommy; bizarre blow-ups out of Everett --- these things were bad luck [against all odds that none of those guys have been what you need for a championship].

Kelly has been claimed to be a QB guru --- nobody who knows football says that. What they say is that Coach is a great systems organizer and play-caller, who can create excellent foundations for all phases of a football team, understands all phases of play, but if you're talking about "guru-ing", it's wide receivers that he's more likely to be an elite positions coach. [or even positions on the defensive side]. If anyone has let us down, it's been the QB coaches when Kelly hasn't been stuck with doing it himself. Now we seem to have a good one.

Kelly, again just my opinion, could win a National Championship with quite a bit less than we have at some other positions now, if he just had that AA or near-AA quarterback. Maybe Kiel would have become that, maybe not. Maybe Everett WILL become that, or maybe it will be more {inconsistency} of the same. Maybe Malik will become that, who knows? Maybe we'll have to wait for Wimbush. If Everett and Malik DON'T get up to near-AA game management standards, then we don't get to the play-offs, and it's wait for the next QB. Sooner or later one of these guys is BOUND to be the potent QB that he looked like in high school. Our luck on this HAS to turn out better sooner or later. In the meantime, I pray that Kelly stays pounding away at setting the powerful foundations everywhere else, and doesn't get discouraged.

I don't disagree with anything you said. At all. What I will say though, is BK is responsible ultimately for recruiting the QB, developing the QBs, and ultimately picking the right QB to start come season opener. One does not have an infinite number of free passes. I don't care if he starts Wimbush if that's his guy, and gives us the best chance for sustained long term success.

What I don't want to go through every year is "bad luck" and excuses why we can't take the next step. You can use that excuse a couple years out of every four year cycle (if you are truly a top program). Right now we're just not in that category although our recruiting classes say we should be.

I think the point is, we have depth (except for S). We have a crazy stacked depth chart at QB. If Golson is not mentally prepared this year, go with MZ. If not MZ, go with .....

 

[Wingman Ray]

I don't disagree with anything you said. At all. What I will say though, is BK is responsible ultimately for recruiting the QB, developing the QBs, and ultimately picking the right QB to start come season opener. One does not have an infinite number of free passes. I don't care if he starts Wimbush if that's his guy, and gives us the best chance for sustained long term success.

What I don't want to go through every year is "bad luck" and excuses why we can't take the next step. You can use that excuse a couple years out of every four year cycle (if you are truly a top program). Right now we're just not in that category although our recruiting classes say we should be.

I think the point is, we have depth (except for S). We have a crazy stacked depth chart at QB. If Golson is not mentally prepared this year, go with MZ. If not MZ, go with .....

Im just saying...if Urban Liar can win a NC beating both Oregon and Bama with a third string, first year player after developing the second string to be competitive and BK cant develop ONE QB in three years of starting to excel....well that to me says it just isnt gonna happen. Golson is better than most college QBs, even if he does try to carry the team too much and makes mistakes. But talent and ability wise, he has to be in the top 10. You have a monster line, 4-5 star running backs entering their third year and a stable of WRs that no one on our schedule, except MAYBE USC can equal. If you cant not only win but dominate with that, then maybe it is time to go back to small fry Cincinnati.

 

[Crazy Balki]

There will always be nuances, but this year BK has the depth (except at S) to get to double digits. Call it depth, or call it talented young bodies, but regardless, he's got enough tools in the bag to reach 10 wins. We saw what Urbie did last year with multiple backups and young kids. Develop them. Get them ready for next man in. Yes we had injuries, but is was as much our struggles with up-tempo teams as it was injuries.

With the coaching turnover,,,, I'll bet we'll all read our fair share of post using new scheme, new leadership, new XXX as an excuse after each and every loss.

I'm still on the BK train, but that will certainly change should we not reach 10 this year.

I can't agree with this. I do agree that we struggled mightily against up-tempo offenses and that needs improvement, which I see happening, slowly but surely. That being said, injuries had A LOT more to do with the failings of the team last year than that. Simply put, you don't just lose 9 of 11 defensive starters and expect to properly adjust to those up-tempo offenses properly, especially since most of those replacements were true freshmen or sophomores. Not only were most physically outmatched, but mentally raw.

What Urbie did last year wasn't all that impressive. He had an embarrassment of riches at QB with 3 guys who had the talent and ability to run his offense. I don't think anyone here would be complaining if we had to start Zaire or DeShone Kizer in 2015. Outside of that, his team remains pretty much in tact. That's almost the complete opposite of what happened to Kelly and ND. We lost everybody minus the QB, not to mention that half of the starters that did stay in were combating nagging injuries as well.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Im just saying...if Urban Liar can win a NC beating both Oregon and Bama with a third string, first year player after developing the second string to be competitive and BK cant develop ONE QB in three years of starting to excel....well that to me says it just isnt gonna happen. Golson is better than most college QBs, even if he does try to carry the team too much and makes mistakes. But talent and ability wise, he has to be in the top 10. You have a monster line, 4-5 star running backs entering their third year and a stable of WRs that no one on our schedule, except MAYBE USC can equal. If you cant not only win but dominate with that, then maybe it is time to go back to small fry Cincinnati.

Okay, let's look at this realistically for a second. Being the QB at Ohio State and being the QB at ND are two entirely different things. There's a lot more expected of you as a passer at ND, whereas Ohio State is much more reliant on the run game. Not to mention, they had a pretty dominant offensive line and tandem of dynamite backs to rely on, whereas our makeshift unit was constantly shifting personnel throughout the season. That's never a good thing. Golson's problem wasn't passing the ball. He had a few bad passes that got picked off, but a few of those were on the receiver for running a bad route or just flat out dropping the ball/bobbling it, or getting the ball tipped at the line. Golson's main issue was with the ball in his hands, or in this case, OUT of his hands. If he can practice better ball security, then he will be MASSIVELY better. It also helps that his QB coaching is a substantially upgrade with Sanford in for LaFleur.

 

[Irish YJ]

I can't agree with this. I do agree that we struggled mightily against up-tempo offenses and that needs improvement, which I see happening, slowly but surely. That being said, injuries had A LOT more to do with the failings of the team last year than that. Simply put, you don't just lose 9 of 11 defensive starters and expect to properly adjust to those up-tempo offenses properly, especially since most of those replacements were true freshmen or sophomores. Not only were most physically outmatched, but mentally raw.

What Urbie did last year wasn't all that impressive. He had an embarrassment of riches at QB with 3 guys who had the talent and ability to run his offense. I don't think anyone here would be complaining if we had to start Zaire or DeShone Kizer in 2015. Outside of that, his team remains pretty much in tact. That's almost the complete opposite of what happened to Kelly and ND. We lost everybody minus the QB, not to mention that half of the starters that did stay in were combating nagging injuries as well.

And you have that right.... Let's agree it was a combination of injury, coaching (prep, development, gameplan), and fast tempo Os. We can debate the % of blame, but all three IMO where huge factors.

 

[KPENN]

I can't agree with this. I do agree that we struggled mightily against up-tempo offenses and that needs improvement, which I see happening, slowly but surely. That being said, injuries had A LOT more to do with the failings of the team last year than that. Simply put, you don't just lose 9 of 11 defensive starters and expect to properly adjust to those up-tempo offenses properly, especially since most of those replacements were true freshmen or sophomores. Not only were most physically outmatched, but mentally raw.

What Urbie did last year wasn't all that impressive. He had an embarrassment of riches at QB with 3 guys who had the talent and ability to run his offense. I don't think anyone here would be complaining if we had to start Zaire or DeShone Kizer in 2015. Outside of that, his team remains pretty much in tact. That's almost the complete opposite of what happened to Kelly and ND. We lost everybody minus the QB, not to mention that half of the starters that did stay in were combating nagging injuries as well.

Wait, are you saying people would feel comfortable with Kizer starting? I don't want to put words in your mouth, so i'm asking

 

[Crazy Balki]

Wait, are you saying people would feel comfortable with Kizer starting? I don't want to put words in your mouth, so i'm asking

I think we'd be pleasantly surprised. I'm willing to bet 100% of us would rather have Golson or Zaire, but if the scenario presented itself, and Kizer was forced into the starting role, and the rest of the team remained in-tact, I'm pretty sure are potential as a team wouldn't drop, and if so, the drop would be minuscule. That's essentially what Urban Meyer had at his disposal at OSU last year.

 

[irishandy]

Good God Tillery looks like an upper classman in that last practice video.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Interesting to see Ishaq on campus? What does that portend?

(Especially with the need for a strengthened pass rush not seeming to be met, yet.)

 

[woolybug25]

I think we'd be pleasantly surprised. I'm willing to bet 100% of us would rather have Golson or Zaire, but if the scenario presented itself, and Kizer was forced into the starting role, and the rest of the team remained in-tact, I'm pretty sure are potential as a team wouldn't drop, and if so, the drop would be minuscule. That's essentially what Urban Meyer had at his disposal at OSU last year.

With great trepidation, I must admit... I actually agree with this...

Of course that is all premised with an assumption that BK would lean on the run game, protect his QB with play calling and our defense shaped up to what I think it can be. If all those things were intact, then I honestly believe that Kizer could perform to the level we would need him to play. The kid seemingly has all of the physical tools, time in the system and was pretty well ranked as a recruit. I certainly have no desire to see him this year with the potential of Golson/Ziare.... But it's not like we would be handing the ball to a true freshman Tommy Rees.

 

[NDdomer2]

Could we play a conference championship game, then have a couple weeks to prepare for a playoff game and perform well with Kizer. Yeah. Could we go half a season with him right now? I've not seen enough of him, nor do I think he's had the reps for that.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

With great trepidation, I must admit... I actually agree with this...

Of course that is all premised with an assumption that BK would lean on the run game, protect his QB with play calling and our defense shaped up to what I think it can be. If all those things were intact, then I honestly believe that Kizer could perform to the level we would need him to play. The kid seemingly has all of the physical tools, time in the system and was pretty well ranked as a recruit. I certainly have no desire to see him this year with the potential of Golson/Ziare.... But it's not like we would be handing the ball to a true freshman Tommy Rees.

100% the bolded. And to be perfectly honest, BK should be doing that to a certain extent regardless of which QB is playing.

Golson - slightly protected
Zaire - protected
Kizer - more protected

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Headed out to campus for media availability with Irish offensive assistants. Curious to hear from Sanford, Denbrock, Denson, etc. on spring.</p>— Irish Illustrated (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/583252740215693312">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[IrishLion]

But IT'S ABOUT QUARTERBACKING. Kelly cannot win a national championship until one of these guys shows consistent game management --- every game, all game. And, in my opinion, this historical lack is not Coach's fault. Surprise incompetencies out of Dayne and Hendrix; "doin' the best I can" out of Tommy; bizarre blow-ups out of Everett --- these things were bad luck [against all odds that none of those guys have been what you need for a championship].

Kelly has been claimed to be a QB guru --- nobody who knows football says that. What they say is that Coach is a great systems organizer and play-caller, who can create excellent foundations for all phases of a football team, understands all phases of play, but if you're talking about "guru-ing", it's wide receivers that he's more likely to be an elite positions coach. [or even positions on the defensive side]. If anyone has let us down, it's been the QB coaches when Kelly hasn't been stuck with doing it himself. Now we seem to have a good one.

Dayne and Hendrix not developing was not on Kelly, I will agree with that. But Golson's blowups? I can't give Kelly a pass on that. It's his job to get his QB ready, or to protect his QB at the very least during the game. When Golson was self-destructing, Kelly had no answers aside from "keep slinging it I guess" until the USC game, when it was apparent that Golson was not all there, at which point he inserted Zaire. Of course, Kelly maybe thought that "keep slinging it" was the only way to play considering the state of his defense, but part of "It's all about quarterbacking" also means protecting your quarterback (and the rest of the team, in a sense) with playcalling. Had BK quit being so stubborn and gone to a run-centered offense earlier in the season, this QB competition would be much more interesting right now. So far, IMO, BK has at times botched the Golson/Zaire situation.

As for the QB guru? Plenty of people who know football have said that Kelly is a QB guru, and I agree with them. There is no other way to explain the production he got out of 5/6 different QB's at Cincinnati, or from LeFevour before that at CMU. If you say it's the system and the playcalling, and not that he's a "guru," then we are opening up the idea that Kelly is currently failing in terms of his system and his playcalling at ND.

He 100% is a WR guru, though I would amend that to "pass-catcher guru." Cincinnati had an embarrassment at riches at the position from 2007-2009, and it wasn't because they were recruiting superstars. He's continued that trend with pass-catchers at ND... he gets the most out of guys with huge potential (Floyd, Eifert, Jones to an extent), and is currently proving it again with "his guys" in Fuller, Brown and Robinson. Fuller is a star despite his limitations, and Brown and Robinson could break out at any moment, IF Kelly can get back to his QB-Whisperer ways.

 

[ND NYC]

random thought/question:

Will our QBs still be looking to the sideline for a play as the clock ticks down to 8...7...6..5...4...3...2... all season long or do we think we can actually run some tempo on offense this year?
do we even want to run tempo?
thinking better to do all we can to keep D off the field and fresh with long sustained drives, not the quick strikes.
however, Kelly philosophy so far at ND has been to score fast and "outscore not outdefend" opponents.

like the lsu game model for clock management and play calling but over course of a season not sure Kelly can help himself. remember the scorpion and the frog...

 

[ResLife Hero]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Taking the grind outside. 18 days until <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NDBlueGold?src=hash">#NDBlueGold</a> <a href="http://t.co/9b0AqgDf71">pic.twitter.com/9b0AqgDf71</a></p>— Notre Dame Football (@NDFootball) <a href="https://twitter.com/NDFootball/status/583264706372235264">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Autry Denson on what Greg Bryant can do to get a bigger role in the offense this fall: "Just be Greg."</p>— Irish Illustrated (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/583266423071444992">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Denson say Prosise is getting more looks running downhill. WR cross-training at RB. <a href="http://t.co/YbDB7WIJYG">pic.twitter.com/YbDB7WIJYG</a></p>— Nick Ironside (@nironside247) <a href="https://twitter.com/nironside247/status/583266195027181569">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/autrydenson">@autrydenson</a> says the next step for Tarean Folston is building on his mental game.</p>— Nick Ironside (@nironside247) <a href="https://twitter.com/nironside247/status/583265813194489856">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Scott Booker asked if <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> signee C.J. Sanders (<a href="https://twitter.com/TheLifeofCeej">@TheLifeofCeej</a>) can help as a returner. "Yeah. Have you seen his high school film?"</p>— Tyler James (@TJamesNDI) <a href="https://twitter.com/TJamesNDI/status/583270704281440257">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Mike Sanford on the QB competition dynamics: "let's be competitive but not combative."</p>— Irish Illustrated (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/583276316864151553">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[ResLife Hero]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> OL coach Harry Hiestand on if he had any say in Jerry Tillery moving to DL: "Yeah. I said, 'No.' "</p>— Matt Fortuna (@Matt_Fortuna) <a href="https://twitter.com/Matt_Fortuna/status/583280488925777920">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[GoIrish41]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> OL coach Harry Hiestand on if he had any say in Jerry Tillery moving to DL: "Yeah. I said, 'No.' "</p>— Matt Fortuna (@Matt_Fortuna) <a href="https://twitter.com/Matt_Fortuna/status/583280488925777920">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

lol

 

[GoIrish41]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Mike Sanford on the QB competition dynamics: "let's be competitive but not combative."</p>— Irish Illustrated (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/583276316864151553">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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is there a rift building? That quote is curious.

 

[BeauBenken]

is there a rift building? That quote is curious.

Pretty sure he's just speaking in general.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

is there a rift building? That quote is curious.

lol

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Tracking practice statistics is something Mike Sanford started doing at Stanford to create game-like reps. <a href="http://t.co/mnTriwD4lt">pic.twitter.com/mnTriwD4lt</a></p>— Nick Ironside (@nironside247) <a href="https://twitter.com/nironside247/status/583299501856665600">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/CoachSanfordND">@CoachSanfordND</a> says GA's are calculating Golson/Zaire completions, drops, pass efficiency rating, competion %, TD/INT ratio in practices.</p>— Nick Ironside (@nironside247) <a href="https://twitter.com/nironside247/status/583299290799284225">April 1, 2015</a></blockquote>
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