'23 MI QB Dante Moore (Greek Spaghetti Transfer)

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

I volunteer as victim.

You're going to need to get some hotter takes out there.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

I don’t know about this. The more I read this thread the more I start to think it’s next year’s QB recruitment that is more significant. Just like the perennial prediction that ND will win a title in 2-3 years (lol). ND needs to start changing the optics now, bc this recruitment is not going to end well. Notre Dame has to recruit QBs that want in for Notre Dame reasons. When we crush on the field with a QB like that, then we can start pitching for QBs on the 5-star press tour. We have little bargaining power in this situation with Moore because our QBs have stunk for decades now. He holds all the chips. With that said, it would still be great to have Moore in this year’s class, but I think it’s Buchner ride or die back to prominence in ‘22/3. Then Tommy can play the all-in card.

Well, seats will continue to fill up which will simplify things. The only remaining uncommitted QBs in 247's composite top 500 are:

Manning
Moore
Rashada
Lonergan
Johnson
Glenn

 

[GATTACA!]

This is the spiciest recruiting thread on so many levels. There are more conflicts and separate drama arcs than a Spanish soap opera. Someone is gonna murder someone by July.

 

[Irish'15]

I like the idea of getting a 4 star kid better than a 3 star kid when I refer to depth. I've yet to hear a name of a kid that we could easily get.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I don’t know about this. The more I read this thread the more I start to think it’s next year’s QB recruitment that is more significant. Just like the perennial prediction that ND will win a title in 2-3 years (lol). ND needs to start changing the optics now, bc this recruitment is not going to end well. Notre Dame has to recruit QBs that want in for Notre Dame reasons. When we crush on the field with a QB like that, then we can start pitching for QBs on the 5-star press tour. We have little bargaining power in this situation with Moore because our QBs have stunk for decades now. He holds all the chips. With that said, it would still be great to have Moore in this year’s class, but I think it’s Buchner ride or die back to prominence in ‘22/3. Then Tommy can play the all-in card.

This isn't a thing. Jimmy Clausen didn't look at ND in 2006 and think, "Man, the Irish haven't produced a decent draft pick at QB since Rick Mirer. Better try to extract all the value I can from them because I'm holding all the cards. If they don't promise me the world, I'll just go to Tennessee or USC instead."

ND is the bluest of the blue bloods. All it takes is a new coach who can credibly sell the Return to Glory™, which we presently have going for us, and a 5-star QB who wants to cement his place in CFB history. They're not mortgage lenders looking over our paperwork stating, "I really like your trajectory, but the underwriter (my dad) is gonna have to see at least two consecutive years with a QB drafted in the 3rd round or better before I can consider investing in your program."

 

[Irish#1]

point was made on II podcast you have to agree with. If ND lands Moore then basically Moore or Buchner won't finish their careers at ND cos neither of them is gonna wanna be a backup

Then the board goes into another tail spin on how we're screwed and Tommy can't keep a QB.

 

[SoIll]

Wrong

Please enlighten us

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

2022: SO Buchner
2023: JR Buchner
2024: SO Moore

Not sure why that can’t happen.

Because it assumes that a QB with one year of HS experience and two years of college experience will be a first round pick. Otherwise Buchner would probably want to come back for his senior year to improve his draft stock.

If you are Dante, you want to see Buchner either be so good that he is definitely gone after his junior year or bad enough that a freshman can beat out the junior starter.

So its not that it can't happen, but it shouldn't be assumed to happen.

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

Well, seats will continue to fill up which will simplify things. The only remaining uncommitted QBs in 247's composite top 500 are:

Manning
Moore
Rashada
Lonergan
Johnson
Glenn

If we had a strong NIL game we could scoop all these players up.

 

[Dale]

Because it assumes that a QB with one year of HS experience and two years of college experience will be a first round pick. Otherwise Buchner would probably want to come back for his senior year to improve his draft stock.

If you are Dante, you want to see Buchner either be so good that he is definitely gone after his junior year or bad enough that a freshman can beat out the junior starter.

So its not that it can't happen, but it shouldn't be assumed to happen.

This is all true. But I just don’t agree with the notion that well let’s count down the days till Buchner or Moore transfer. My scenario could happen. Moore could sit for 2 years could happen. Heck Buchner could lose to Pyne who then bridges to Moore and Buchner sticks around, like Pyne since he doesn’t have high P5 interest and wants to finish degree. There are multiple scenarios that don’t lock in Moore or Buchner transferring as being matter of fact.

 

[zelezo vlk]

You're going to need to get some hotter takes out there.

Fine. Rees strikes out on Moore in '23 but lands CJ Carr in '24 who ends up taking ND to the promised land, while publicly saying respectful things about the University of Michigan.

 

[Irish'15]

Because it assumes that a QB with one year of HS experience and two years of college experience will be a first round pick. Otherwise Buchner would probably want to come back for his senior year to improve his draft stock.

If you are Dante, you want to see Buchner either be so good that he is definitely gone after his junior year or bad enough that a freshman can beat out the junior starter.

So its not that it can't happen, but it shouldn't be assumed to happen.

The best thing that can happen to ND is Buchner has a lot of success. As of now, Tyler Buchner's chances at becoming a great college quarterback are far greater than anyone at or considering coming to ND. Let us not forget, TB as a true freshman bailed out a now NFL quarterback on multiple occasions last year after not having played football his senior year of high school. Despite some true freshman mistakes at VT, he had 60% passing efficiency on the year. He showed tremendous running ability. There is a clip out there somewhere on youtube where he threw a perfect 55-60 yard pass as a junior in high school and hit his receiver in stride. Sitting him in the bowl game was odd, but who knows. He has all the tools.

 

[Irish4life]

Because it assumes that a QB with one year of HS experience and two years of college experience will be a first round pick. Otherwise Buchner would probably want to come back for his senior year to improve his draft stock.

If you are Dante, you want to see Buchner either be so good that he is definitely gone after his junior year or bad enough that a freshman can beat out the junior starter.

So its not that it can't happen, but it shouldn't be assumed to happen.

I simply don't believe this to be the case. But if it's true that Dante doesn't want to come to ND because Buchner is good, frankly, let him walk. Take a 3.5-4 star ND dreamer with upside and get Sayin/Carr committed in the 24 class immediately.

 

[Irish'15]

I'm not convinced Vizzina is totally off the board. Clemson had the number 1 overall QB (according to Rivals) in last years class. Not saying he doesn't want to compete at Clemson, but I wouldn't lose contact with him. I doubt he plans on sitting for three years.

 

[Armyirish47]

If we don't get Moore we should just punt on this year and hit the portal hard if necessary for a depth QB.

 

[ACamp1900]

This is the spiciest recruiting thread on so many levels. There are more conflicts and separate drama arcs than a Spanish soap opera. Someone is gonna murder someone by July.

If we can turn it into a Mexican soap opera and get some spicy cochinas in here then wins all around.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

Or we could get stuck with Pyne transferring, Buchner not being that good, Angeli not being power 5 quality & we don't land Sayin or Carr who are both very interested in ND. Way too many unknowns which is what makes Moore's recruitment so important.

FIFY.

So...quite a few hypotheticals lol. But okay.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

I simply don't believe this to be the case. But if it's true that Dante doesn't want to come to ND because Buchner is good, frankly, let him walk. Take a 3.5-4 star ND dreamer with upside and get Sayin/Carr committed in the 24 class immediately.

I'm not saying this is what is happening, just that if you are a QB looking for the optimal landing spot, this is what you would want based on the current make up of the ND roster.

On the other hand, this same idea plays into our favor with '24 QBs. If Buchner is awesome and leaves after his junior year, they have a chance to compete for the starting job as a freshman. If they lose out to a '23 QB, then they can transfer right away to somewhere they can start as a sophomore. If Buchner isn't great AND we don't get an elite '23 QB, then they are likely only sitting for a year before taking over with their biggest threat probably being a '25 QB.

 

[notredomer23]

FIFY.

So...quite a few hypotheticals lol. But okay.

So if Buchner isn't good and ND misses on Moore, you're okay essentially waiting until the 2025 season to have a potential competent QB. Got it.

I am a Buchner believer but there are a ton of question marks around him, including if he can stay healthy. If Buchner is good most this discussion is pointless. But he hasn't shown yet he will be.

 

[stlnd01]

I simply don't believe this to be the case. But if it's true that Dante doesn't want to come to ND because Buchner is good, frankly, let him walk. Take a 3.5-4 star ND dreamer with upside and get Sayin/Carr committed in the 24 class immediately.

Most of the other schools Dante is considering have a QB who is at least as good if not better (on paper) than Buchner in their freshman or sophomore classes.
I really doubt he doesn’t come because Buchner. (I suppose it’s possible he leaves if he can’t beat Buchner out but that’s a first world problem).

 

[pumpdog20]

I don't know how good Avery Johnson will or won't be. But I was absolutely in the camp of Vizzina being a stud with my primary reservation being his location and the risk of losing him later, and I thought Jackson Arnold had the highest floor of all of them. We certainly tried to get Arnold but whiffed.

With Dante Moore -- he had the lowest upside and worst underclass film of any of the "5 star" guys ND went after. Does not have a huge arm or great athleticism, you are banking on size + accuracy + polish to make him a top tier QB. And that might work out fine! Sometimes those guys turn out to be Rodgers or Mahomes after a little development. But he's closer to a Josh Rosen than a Cam Newton in terms of having the skills or athletic ability to take over a game by himself.

At least he's not as laughably overrated as Arch Manning.

This had to have been the harshest eval of a 5* QB I've ever read... kidding of course... maybe.

 

[stlnd01]

point was made on II podcast you have to agree with. If ND lands Moore then basically Moore or Buchner won't finish their careers at ND cos neither of them is gonna wanna be a backup

To be fair only like three Notre Dame QBs in the last 20 years have finished their careers as QBs at Notre Dame.

 

[Blazers46]

To be fair only like three Notre Dame QBs in the last 20 years have finished their careers as QBs at Notre Dame.

Wow... is that a real stat? Rees, Kizer, Book, Claussen?

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

So if Buchner isn't good and ND misses on Moore, you're okay essentially waiting until the 2025 season to have a potential competent QB. Got it.

I am a Buchner believer but there are a ton of question marks around him, including if he can stay healthy. If Buchner is good most this discussion is pointless. But he hasn't shown yet he will be.

What exactly do you mean by "competent?" Book was competent. Heck, Wimbush was "competent." Are you talking elite? Only a handful of programs have an elite QB. UGA didn't, and they won a natty. Sure, it's easier with an elite QB, if only they grew on trees. It's also "unknown" that Moore will actually pan out.

We don't know what Buchner's ceiling is. You're saying that if we don't get Moore, this program is in shambles (IF Buchner is a bust). You're also assuming Angeli, Pyne or an unknown (transfer, '23 recruit not named Moore) can't keep the floor of this program elevated in the event we do land one of Sayin/Carr.

We can play this unknown game all day; this recruitment is not the end-all-be-all some of you are making it out to be. I want Moore as bad as anyone on this board, our program would certainly be better for it, but I'm not going to meltdown if it falls through. One door closes, another one opens.

 

[Irish4life]

I don't know how good Avery Johnson will or won't be. But I was absolutely in the camp of Vizzina being a stud with my primary reservation being his location and the risk of losing him later, and I thought Jackson Arnold had the highest floor of all of them. We certainly tried to get Arnold but whiffed.

With Dante Moore -- he had the lowest upside and worst underclass film of any of the "5 star" guys ND went after. Does not have a huge arm or great athleticism, you are banking on size + accuracy + polish to make him a top tier QB. And that might work out fine! Sometimes those guys turn out to be Rodgers or Mahomes after a little development. But he's closer to a Josh Rosen than a Cam Newton in terms of having the skills or athletic ability to take over a game by himself.

At least he's not as laughably overrated as Arch Manning.

He's CJ Stroud 2.0

 

[Kingbish01]

Wow... is that a real stat? Rees, Kizer, Book, Claussen?

I looked and it's true, but I feel like it's a BK problem more than an ND problem.

 

[notredomer23]

We don't know what Buchner's ceiling is. You're saying that if we don't get Moore, this program is in shambles (IF Buchner is a bust). You're also assuming Angeli, Pyne or an unknown (transfer, '23 recruit not named Moore) can't keep the floor of this program elevated in the event we do land one of Sayin/Carr.

We can play this unknown game all day; this recruitment is not the end-all-be-all some of you are making it out to be. I want Moore as bad as anyone on this board, our program would certainly be better for it, but I'm not going to meltdown if it falls through. One door closes, another one opens.

The point is ND isn't getting to the next level that we want them to if they miss on Moore. Angeli isn't gonna cut it. Buchner might. Even if they get Moore, he might suck. They need to get top 100 caliber QB every year. If they are lucky over a 5 year span, a couple of them end up panning out.

 

[stlnd01]

Wow... is that a real stat? Rees, Kizer, Book, Claussen?

Exhausted four years of eligibility, to be clear. So not Clausen or Kizer. But yeah Rees, Book, Quinn. And Evan Sharpley!
Everyone else for a long time either transferred or switched positions.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

The point is ND isn't getting to the next level that we want them to if they miss on Moore. Angeli isn't gonna cut it. Buchner might. Even if they get Moore, he might suck. They need to get top 100 caliber QB every year. If they are lucky over a 5 year span, a couple of them end up panning out.

Lol. Oh, is that all? Can we get a top 10 EDGE rusher every year just as icing on the cake? Sprinkle in a Kyle Hamilton every 4 years just for fun?

Point being, that's not a realistic expectation. How many top 100 QBs want to commit to a school that just sigend a top 100 QB each year prior to that? This isn't NCAA 14's dynasty mode where QBs don't transfer and you have a 99 overall player waiting in the wings as a RS JR.

 

[notredomer23]

Lol. Oh, is that all? Can we get a top 10 EDGE rusher every year just as icing on the cake? Sprinkle in a Kyle Hamilton every 4 years just for fun?

A top 100 level QB means they’re a top 15 or so QB. Not a super tall ask. If you want ND to compete for championships, that’s what it takes. If you’re okay with what they’ve been doing for the last 5 years, that’s fine. Be fine with the Angelis of the world.