Tommy and Carlo suspension, is it fair?

[Chris P. Bacon]

Get a quick vote on this hot topic!

 

[AdmiralBackhand]

I don't speak on behalf of everyone, but the punishments seem fair enough to me. Tommy allegedly assaulted a police officer and Carlo allegedly taunted or threatened one.

 

[nlroma1o]

I think it is a fair punishment. I still beleive Kelly screwed up by not docking Floyd 1 game last fall.

 

[rikkitikki08]

YES ITS FAIR......nothing else to say

 

[goldandblue]

Carlo got screwed... Tommy's punishment is justified.

 

[GBdomer]

this thread will just turn into another pissing match.

 

[Chris P. Bacon]

this thread will just turn into another pissing match.

We need something to keep us busy for the next 30 days. Now we have colors and graphs to 'woo and ahh' over.

 

[SoDakDomer]

Tommy yes, Carlo no.

 

[rtrn2glory]

answer: YES

 

[IrishLion]

Rule Number One in College: Don't Run From The Cops.

Chances are, the cop is going to break up the party and be cool if everyone cooperates and makes his night easier.

Even if the cop decides to be a dick and cite everyone anyway, running only makes things worse. Either you get chased down, or you get away and someone rats you out.

I have heard the stories of South Bend / Indiana police and the way they "target" ND students/players, but running is the absolute dumbest thing you can do, regardless of whether the police are legit or not. They deserve the suspension, it's just crappy timing that the first game happens to be in Ireland.

 

[NDisme]

I dont know if kelly did mess that up with floyd, He made him miss the entire spring practice and game, change basically everything about his lifestyle, saw that he was in a better state of mind when fall camp came around, imo there was no issue. Tommy and carlo did this after spring so the next step is a game suspension. If he susupended themn for most or all of fall camp, they might as well not play anyway

I think it is a fair punishment. I still beleive Kelly screwed up by not docking Floyd 1 game last fall.

 

[tko]

Poor kids,so mistreated

 

[notredomer23]

Carlo got screwed. Either that or tommy deserved longer time

 

[koonja]

I said this earlier. I don't think Carlo got 'screwed'. Honestly, Carlo saying 'my people will get you' is as much of a threat to the police than tiny hands giving them a shot to the jejunum, IMO.

 

[Irishnuke]

Fair for Carlo, Tommy should have got more.

 

[TheTurningPoint]

I definitely think its fair. I hate how some of the peeps on some other boards are saying its not. Like they say timing is everything. Floyd gets a dui after spring, he misses games. Rees/Carlo mess up in spring they miss spring.

Rees should probably get more than 1 game, but the fact that he loses reps is going to be punishment and something that quite frankly he may not get reps again. Kelly is brilliant, in that it essentially gives Golson a 2 game trial. If he can handle it then, barring injury he is the QB of Notre Dame for quite awhile. Golson doesnt produce then you have Rees coming back for a road game vs Mich St. Other than obviously losing games, there aren't many negative scenarios for the TEAM. I think that is key as well for overall success.

In my opinion, Carlo should get to go to Ireland, but not play. But, then again, someone needs to be able to keep Rees company in the bend.

Fair punishment. Doesnt hurt the team. Consequences are there for the individuals.

 

[Rhode Irish]

I definitely think its fair. I hate how some of the peeps on some other boards are saying its not. Like they say timing is everything. Floyd gets a dui after spring, he misses games. Rees/Carlo mess up in spring they miss spring.

Rees should probably get more than 1 game, but the fact that he loses reps is going to be punishment and something that quite frankly he may not get reps again. Kelly is brilliant, in that it essentially gives Golson a 2 game trial. If he can handle it then, barring injury he is the QB of Notre Dame for quite awhile. Golson doesnt produce then you have Rees coming back for a road game vs Mich St. Other than obviously losing games, there aren't many negative scenarios for the TEAM. I think that is key as well for overall success.

In my opinion, Carlo should get to go to Ireland, but not play. But, then again, someone needs to be able to keep Rees company in the bend.

Fair punishment. Doesnt hurt the team. Consequences are there for the individuals.

I agree with all of this.

(You're so much better when you use your words, TP!)

 

[BobD]

It sucks that Coach Kelly has to spend valuable time he could be using to improve the team to handle sh!t like this. It also sucks that the team has to deal with the distraction.

Yes, young men screw up, when they do something childish, they get punished like a child. I keep thinking to myself that this is exactly what my father would have done to me. Not a chance in hell I'd be headed on a fun overseas trip a few months after pulling some crap like that.

They need to take it like men.

 

[TinyT]

Completely fair, perhaps not harsh enough. Floyd was banished for spring and forbidden from participation during the summer voluntary activities.

Stephon Tuitt did not travel with the team, for missing a class.

Rees and Calabrese broke the law, plead guilty, to get reduced charges in Ree's case, and they won't travel with the team for a game. Same punishment as Tuitt, for a totally different indiscretion. Completely lenient, and very inconsistent.

 

[jason_h537]

More than fair. It sucks they won't get to go to Dublin but you have to punished. I still tink Floyd should have been suspended at least a couple games so...

 

[gkIrish]

Here's what confuses me. Maybe someone can explain.

It seems that many of you think Floyd should have been suspended one game. So when you say Carlo and Tommy's punishment was fair, do you

1. View this punishment in a vaccuum and ignore precedent set with Floyd? or
2. Think what Tommy and Carlo did was worse? Or
3. Think Tommy and Carlo's punishment is less severe?

It seems to me that one of the above must be true. IMO those of you in the first category are operating under the wrong framework. To me, fairness is a relative analysis unless there is no precedent, i.e. PSU. To think this punishment is fair without comparing it to the only precedent available (Floyd) is inappropriate. Those in the third category I just disagree with and so do most D1 football players I would wager. Just my opinion.

Edit: added 3rd category

 

[ndcoltsfan2010]

I honestly think the punishment is fair. They both could have gotten more, but I think their punishments are just about right.

 

[ClausentoTate]

I once got caught underage at a party at Purdue, all the cops did was say everyone needs to leave.

I once got caught underage at a party at ND, the cops came in with a battering ram.

True story.

 

[Chris P. Bacon]

I said this earlier. I don't think Carlo got 'screwed'. Honestly, Carlo saying 'my people will get you' is as much of a threat to the police than tiny hands giving them a shot to the jejunum, IMO.

Completely agree, and there continues to be speculation that Tommy really did physically attack the cop, though in the report and the courthouse hearing and ruling there was no such evidence. Carlo verbally threatening a cop and Tommy running from one and getting caught can be viewed as Carlo getting a lesser punishment then he deserved, and Tommy getting exactly what he deserved.

 

[irishfanjho15]

I once got caught underage at a party at Purdue, all the cops did was say everyone needs to leave.

I once got caught underage at a party at ND, the cops came in with a battering ram.

True story.

"Tommy, this is the police. Drop the football before someone gets hurt and you throw it to the other team."

 

[jason_h537]

Here's what confuses me. Maybe someone can explain.

It seems that many of you think Floyd should have been suspended one game. So when you say Carlo and Tommy's punishment was fair, do you

1. View this punishment in a vaccuum and ignore precedent set with Floyd? or
2. Think what Tommy and Carlo did was worse? Or
3. Think Tommy and Carlo's punishment is less severe?

It seems to me that one of the above must be true. IMO those of you in the first category are operating under the wrong framework. To me, fairness is a relative analysis unless there is no precedent, i.e. PSU. To think this punishment is fair without comparing it to the only precedent available (Floyd) is inappropriate. Those in the third category I just disagree with and so do most D1 football players I would wager. Just my opinion.

Edit: added 3rd category

I have heard conflicting reports on the Tommy Carlo thing. I think one game is fair. 2 or 3 games, might be much but still would be OK with it. I think it is just as bad, if not less than Floyd. Flloyd was driving drunk. He not only put his life in danger but his careless behavior put at risk everyone on the road. He should have sat 3 games. Tommy and Carlo were stupid, but Floyd could have killed someone.

 

[ulukinatme]

I said this earlier. I don't think Carlo got 'screwed'. Honestly, Carlo saying 'my people will get you' is as much of a threat to the police than tiny hands giving them a shot to the jejunum, IMO.

This. Tommy probably could have gotten a 2nd game at least, but in any case I don't think either punishment was too harsh.

 

[pumpdog20]

Fair for Carlo, Tommy should have got more.

I agree with this.

 

[phgreek]

Thought it was fair in that less would be a farce.

Fortuna seemed to think there was disparity...calling Floyd's DUI "a far more eggregious matter"...Fortuna clearly leaves out the motivations behind conduct, and inexplicably misses the seriousness of grappling with police????




Michel Floyd's lack of judgment is a totally different animal. Lets not mince words...Mike was a dumb A$$ for what he did...Mike may have an alcohol issue...however, his was a passive afront to law/authority. His did not threaten/intend harm in a manner in which self-preservation was the motivation. He did indeed endanger active participants...and arguably some in other vehicles (although thats arguable), but those in the vehicle get some responsibility too. He did not act on an unwilling participant in self-preservation. ie he didn't hit and run someone, or run over a cop to get away. When you punish a lack of judgment like Mike's, you tend to look at the conduct, the motivations, and the hint the kid takes responsibility IMMEDIATELY... Mike Floyd seemed to take responsibility from the moment he was stoppped. So indeed DUI is far worse on its face than underaged consumption...but its what happened after the conduct was discovered by law enforcement that turns the tables for me.

Mr. Rees and Mr. Calibrese took reckless actions in an active afront to authority. The bigger issue to me was the motivation for their actions...they tried to get themselves out of a Jam by eluding/evading, battering, then threatening law enforcement. The motivation was totally selfish, and the resultant behavior put their own interest above all others...they went beyond bad judgment here...their response was dishonorable...and clearly crosses the line. These guys acted like you'd expect entitled brats to act. When you punish this kind of conduct, you look to figuratively land a couple jabs on the nose to get someone's attention, and also teach. I think suspension is but one of the jabs these boys have gotten/will get from BK.

Point is...to me these infractions are so, so different from Floyd.

In response to those who think Rees and Calabrese got off light...maybe. However, I trust BK to do right by the university and the kid. Neither Rees nor Calabrese, in my opinion, was slated to change the team's fortunes by themselves. Each, in my opinion, will be relagated to 2nd tier role players by Navy anyway...not because of their trouble...but by rising talent that limits their importance. I think BK expects that to be the case...So its hard for me to see BK's punishment as totally football-motivated. I think its more severe than Floyd for the reasons I stated, but not as severe as one might think because he knows these two, and understands how to get them squared away as young men w/o destroying them...and isn't that the goal?

 

[UlsterScot21]

Hell yes it's fair!

Hell yes it's fair!

The punishment these two received was definitely fair, if anything it was maybe a little easy. They both know all too well what is expected of them, especially with being leaders. Absolutely no excuse for there actions. I applaud Kelly for the suspensions!