Quarterback Competition Update (4-11-11)

[Irish YJ]

IMO
A - If TR starts, Golson bolts, Hendrix stays, GK starts next year. Painful season.
B - If Golson starts, TR bolts, Hendrix gets back up duty and maybe special reps. GK worked in next year for a Golson/Gunner tandem.
C - If Hendrix starts, whoever doesn't get package reps between TR and Golson bolts, GK starts next year with Golson working on special packages.
D - If Gunner starts, whoever doesn't get package reps or back up duty between TR and Golson bolts.

My prediction.
Golson starts, Hedrix stays, TR bolts unless it's a Golson/TR combo. GK redshirts, and is worked in with Golson next year.

 

[Rhode Irish]

IMO
A - If TR starts, Golson bolts, Hendrix stays, GK starts next year. Painful season.
B - If Golson starts, TR bolts, Hendrix gets back up duty and maybe special reps. GK worked in next year for a Golson/Gunner tandem.
C - If Hendrix starts, whoever doesn't get package reps between TR and Golson bolts, GK starts next year with Golson working on special packages.
D - If Gunner starts, whoever doesn't get package reps or back up duty between TR and Golson bolts.

My prediction.
Golson starts, Hedrix stays, TR bolts unless it's a Golson/TR combo. GK redshirts, and is worked in with Golson next year.

I doubt Rees goes anywhere. Where could he go and play? I'd think trying to win the job back/being ready if they need you at ND would be better than transferring to Toledo or something and sitting out a year and then probably having to battle for the job there anyways.

 

[Irish YJ]

Depends how much passion the kid has to be a starter. He seems like a "baller" to me, and someone who wants to be "the guy". I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but sometime a dream is more important to a kid than a prestigious degree. If he can go be the man at Toledo, and is happy with that, I'm OK.

 

[IrishLion]

Kiel: If Tommy is named starter still has the ability to RS and be a 3/4 year starter. No incentive to transfer. Almost all QBs redshirt their freshman year (Luck, Griffin III, etc.) with very few exceptions (Clausen, Barkley) who don't RS more because of a lack of competence in front of them than anything else.

That's just my whole conjecture on the scenario. I try to put myself in their shoes and think what I would do.

I'll take this opportunity to point out that RGIII started as a true freshman. Tore his ACL a few games into his soph year, and got a medical redshirt I believe. Also, during that Freshman year as a starter, I think he was the second-to-last DI starting QB to throw an interception on the season. I remember seeing a game on ESPN when he was a freshman and hearing that stat, and have been an RGIII fan ever since.

But more on topic, I think the biggest mistake in this whole situation would be BK making a decision that results in Golson tranferring. I understand that BK doesn't control how a player will react, but at the same time it's hard to not see (even through just the spring game) that EG is the most dynamic player that ND has at QB (at least until Kiel has the system mastered). Hendrix can run, but I feel like Golson is a better runner for this offense because he is not a battering ram, and ultimately I think Golson understands that he can use his feet to buy time and still throw the ball, whereas Hendrix uses his feet to take off at the first sign of pressure. If Rees wins the job, I think BK will keep Golson around by giving him the same packages that he gave Hendrix last year, except with way more playing time...

But I also believe that in the end, BK will give EG the keys and let him make plays, even if that means toning down the pace and complexity of the offense a bit. I got the feeling that BK was VERY pleased with Golson after the spring game, but openly challenged him rather than showering him with praise as a way to see how much more Golson can push things before having to name a starter.

 

[Black Irish]

I wouldn't discount the transfer threat but BK shouldn't base his QB starting pick around that, although he needs to keep it in mind. Actually, naming Rees the starter might keep everyone around because they know how easy it should be to take the job from him. But if Kelly starts Hendrix or Golson I think he needs to make a real effort to work the other guy in on a regular basis in order to not risk losing one of them. I'd say Gunnar would stick around no matter what in order to challenge for the starting job after the red shirt comes off. Losing Hendrix or Golson because either one didn't get a real shot would be a concern for me, though.

 

[BobD]

Golson starts.

Hendrix in for some plays to mix it up.

Gunner red shirts it.

Tommy stays to get his degree.

 

[woolybug25]

"Get Used To It"

 

[IrishLion]

Has BK even said anything about making the decision at all, in terms of a timetable? It would be nice to see someone named early obviously, but I wasn't sure if he had actually been quoted on the subject.

 

[DSully1995]

Has BK even said anything about making the decision at all, in terms of a timetable? It would be nice to see someone named early obviously, but I wasn't sure if he had actually been quoted on the subject.

Just about 20 minutes before kick off well know. BK is gonna drag this one out.

 

[IrishLion]

Just about 20 minutes before kick off well know. BK is gonna drag this one out.

Idk, I think he will announce openly when he decides, and there is no way he goes to Ireland without having made a decision.

If it were a huge opponent week one, I understand keeping it hushed up after making the decision so the opponent doesn't know whether to gameplan for pocket passer Rees or one of the more mobile options. However, Navy is a team ND should handle, so I think in this case BK should openly announce it when he decides, and let whoever it is openly take on the starter's role, without any of that "secret, last minute announcement" drama.

 

[Kanye West]

Danny Spond Seriously, I hope it's not turnover tommy.

 

[yankeeND]

Those of you that think there is nothing to do in Indiana have never heard of a game called "Cornhole".

It beats the beach anyday.

Cornhole is great! I had my boards made but I still need to have em painted. I was thinking of doing like ND's endzones just white bordered with the slashes over green.

 

[kmoose]

I'll take this opportunity to point out that RGIII started as a true freshman. Tore his ACL a few games into his soph year, and got a medical redshirt I believe. Also, during that Freshman year as a starter, I think he was the second-to-last DI starting QB to throw an interception on the season. I remember seeing a game on ESPN when he was a freshman and hearing that stat, and have been an RGIII fan ever since.

But more on topic, I think the biggest mistake in this whole situation would be BK making a decision that results in Golson tranferring. I understand that BK doesn't control how a player will react, but at the same time it's hard to not see (even through just the spring game) that EG is the most dynamic player that ND has at QB (at least until Kiel has the system mastered). Hendrix can run, but I feel like Golson is a better runner for this offense because he is not a battering ram, and ultimately I think Golson understands that he can use his feet to buy time and still throw the ball, whereas Hendrix uses his feet to take off at the first sign of pressure. If Rees wins the job, I think BK will keep Golson around by giving him the same packages that he gave Hendrix last year, except with way more playing time...

But I also believe that in the end, BK will give EG the keys and let him make plays, even if that means toning down the pace and complexity of the offense a bit. I got the feeling that BK was VERY pleased with Golson after the spring game, but openly challenged him rather than showering him with praise as a way to see how much more Golson can push things before having to name a starter.

Of course, none of the above means jack, if Golson hasn't solved his problem of putting the ball on the turf so often, in practice.

 

[irishfan]

Has BK even said anything about making the decision at all, in terms of a timetable? It would be nice to see someone named early obviously, but I wasn't sure if he had actually been quoted on the subject.

Didn't he do 10 days before USF last year? Probably about the same timeline for this decision.

 

[Emcee77]

Didn't he do 10 days before USF last year? Probably about the same timeline for this decision.

This. As someone said, I'm sure he'll announce it whenever he decides. I don't think there's any reason we need to keep quiet about it to keep Navy guessing. I expect he'll give the four of them a chance in camp to prove which one deserves it most and make a decision about a week or so before the game.

 

[IrishLax]

I absolutely understand the points other posters were making in favor of taking a good QB every year. I just don't think ND is at the level necessary to keep those QBs on the roster. To keep more than 2-3 highly-regarded QBs on the team at the same time with little separation in eligibility, the team needs to be playing at an elite level, the coach has to establish himself as more than able to handle and support great talent, and the school itself has to be massively appealing. ND is not playing at an elite level currently, BK has not shown that he can handle QBs well at ND, and ND is not appealing in many areas. ND is elite academically, has a gorgeous campus, and a great alumni network. However, South Bend is not a fun town, there aren't too many hot girls, and the weather sucks. The guys that are career backups at USC are good and could probably start for other teams, but they won't mind as much because they're at a decent school, they're surrounded by hot girls, they're a short distance from Los Angeles, they can go to the beach and enjoy fantastic weather.

I want to preface my post here saying I think you're a really good poster, I think this post is well thought out, and I agree with your basic premise that there are a lot of obstacles in ND's current situation to keeping the roster stocked with QBs.... I think there is a realistic chance of any (or all) of our other QBs transferring if Golson wins the job for a myriad of reasons BUT.........

There are two points I want to touch on:

1. The idea that "South Bend isn't fun" or in general the list of factors you give, in my opinion, have almost absolutely nothing at all to with whether someone chooses to transfer or not. If you're miserable, for whatever reason, you'll transfer.... but the VAST majority of the kids on any team won't fall into that group/have already transferred if they do fall into that category. Most football players and athletes in general I knew at ND, simply put, had the time of their lives in college and wouldn't trade it for the world.... for every emotionally ill-equipped kid like Aaron Lynch there are 10 that love life. I can't think of a single friend of mine who I could classify as "unhappy" at ND. I knew one kid from Boston my frosh year who transferred out to BC because he didn't like it but that's it. I'm not saying everyone is 100% happy 100% of the time or anything stupid like that.... or that everyone loves the winter...... but I'm saying the vast majority of people attending ND are thoroughly enjoying their time there and the primary reason is almost always related to something sports oriented not school/fun/social life oriented. I can give real life examples if you want of people and the transfer process (at ND and at other schools) but this post is already long and rather rambling.

2. The thing about the team playing at an elite level to keep kids on the roster isn't really accurate. If you're a 5 kid and you're not playing then you're likely to transfer. Period. Winning a NC on the bench is not enough. Usually kids will stick around behind elite talent at their position because they both respect the person ahead of them and assume they will get their shot. That's why 4 kids at Stanford stuck around behind Luck... because they expected him to leave a year earlier than he actually did and because they knew they'd have a chance to earn a spot. The single biggest driver in a kid transferring is getting passed up by somebody in their class or the class behind them... and especially at positions like QB where only one guy gets on the field. Because as soon as that happens, you know you are f*cked and if you put any value on going pro you basically have to make a move. That's why Kyle Prater, despite USC being the NC favorite this year, got the heck out of dodge... he got passed up by frosh Marquis Lee and said "eff that noise, I'm going to a school where no receivers are close to my level."

 

[IrishLax]

I'll take this opportunity to point out that RGIII started as a true freshman. Tore his ACL a few games into his soph year, and got a medical redshirt I believe. Also, during that Freshman year as a starter, I think he was the second-to-last DI starting QB to throw an interception on the season. I remember seeing a game on ESPN when he was a freshman and hearing that stat, and have been an RGIII fan ever since.

But more on topic, I think the biggest mistake in this whole situation would be BK making a decision that results in Golson tranferring. I understand that BK doesn't control how a player will react, but at the same time it's hard to not see (even through just the spring game) that EG is the most dynamic player that ND has at QB (at least until Kiel has the system mastered). Hendrix can run, but I feel like Golson is a better runner for this offense because he is not a battering ram, and ultimately I think Golson understands that he can use his feet to buy time and still throw the ball, whereas Hendrix uses his feet to take off at the first sign of pressure. If Rees wins the job, I think BK will keep Golson around by giving him the same packages that he gave Hendrix last year, except with way more playing time...

But I also believe that in the end, BK will give EG the keys and let him make plays, even if that means toning down the pace and complexity of the offense a bit. I got the feeling that BK was VERY pleased with Golson after the spring game, but openly challenged him rather than showering him with praise as a way to see how much more Golson can push things before having to name a starter.

Gah! I knew he missed a year and made a bad assumption that he took a RS his frosh season. Never really paid attention to Baylor. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[woolybug25]

Gah! I knew he missed a year and made a bad assumption that he took a RS his frosh season. Never really paid attention to Baylor. Thanks for pointing that out.

I read earlier today that two of last year's top 10 games from a tv rating standpoint were Baylor games. Just an interesting factiod. I guess a player like RGIII has a way to get people to pay attention.

 

[NDinL.A.]

I absolutely understand the points other posters were making in favor of taking a good QB every year. I just don't think ND is at the level necessary to keep those QBs on the roster. To keep more than 2-3 highly-regarded QBs on the team at the same time with little separation in eligibility, the team needs to be playing at an elite level, the coach has to establish himself as more than able to handle and support great talent, and the school itself has to be massively appealing. ND is not playing at an elite level currently, BK has not shown that he can handle QBs well at ND, and ND is not appealing in many areas. ND is elite academically, has a gorgeous campus, and a great alumni network. However, South Bend is not a fun town, there aren't too many hot girls, and the weather sucks. The guys that are career backups at USC are good and could probably start for other teams, but they won't mind as much because they're at a decent school, they're surrounded by hot girls, they're a short distance from Los Angeles, they can go to the beach and enjoy fantastic weather.

Yeah, see the problem with your post is...well, it's just wrong. Lax beat me to the punch, but I'll add that USC has had tons of transfers over the years, and there school has everything you listed and more. And yet they have had more transfers than ND the past 10 years. There's a long list of guys that transferred from there, even before and after they allowed guys to transfer free of penalty as part of their sanctions. Including the sanction years, off the top of my head, there's guys like Moore, Jackson, Hazelton, Moody, Campbell, Patrick "Birdy" Hall, (edit: Amir Carlisle) etc. Seriously, that's just off the top of my head. There's PLENTY more.

So, sorry dude, I just can't get with that post. Guys know what they're getting into when they get to ND, and while you'll have the occasional kid that can't hack it, most kids transfer for the same reasons they transfer from USC and Bama and everywhere else, even thought those schools supposedly have all those things better than ND...

 

[woolybug25]

Yeah, see the problem with your post is...well, it's just wrong. Lax beat me to the punch, but I'll add that USC has had tons of transfers over the years, and there school has everything you listed and more. And yet they have had more transfers than ND the past 10 years. There's a long list of guys that transferred from there, even before and after they allowed guys to transfer free of penalty as part of their sanctions. Including the sanction years, off the top of my head, there's guys like Moore, Jackson, Hazelton, Moody, Campbell, Patrick Byrd, etc. Seriously, that's just off the top of my head. There's PLENTY more.

So, sorry dude, I just can't get with that post. Guys know what they're getting into when they get to ND, and while you'll have the occasional kid that can't hack it, most kids transfer for the same reasons they transfer from USC and Bama and everywhere else, even thought those schools supposedly have all those things better than ND...

I'm surprised that you and LAX both forgot about USC's biggest transfer.... Amir Carlisle.

 

[Riddickulous]

I'm surprised that you and LAX both forgot about USC's biggest transfer.... Amir Carlisle.

He was listing off pre-sanction transfers.

 

[woolybug25]

He was listing off pre-sanction transfers.

LAX never mentioned sanctions and Hollywood wrote:

There's a long list of guys that transferred from there, even before and after they allowed guys to transfer free of penalty as part of their sanctions. Including the sanction years, off the top of my head, there's guys like Moore, Jackson, Hazelton, Moody, Campbell, Patrick Byrd, etc. Seriously, that's just off the top of my head. There's PLENTY more.

 

[returnofthemack]

Yeah, see the problem with your post is...well, it's just wrong. Lax beat me to the punch, but I'll add that USC has had tons of transfers over the years, and there school has everything you listed and more. And yet they have had more transfers than ND the past 10 years. There's a long list of guys that transferred from there, even before and after they allowed guys to transfer free of penalty as part of their sanctions. Including the sanction years, off the top of my head, there's guys like Moore, Jackson, Hazelton, Moody, Campbell, Patrick Byrd, etc. Seriously, that's just off the top of my head. There's PLENTY more.

So, sorry dude, I just can't get with that post. Guys know what they're getting into when they get to ND, and while you'll have the occasional kid that can't hack it, most kids transfer for the same reasons they transfer from USC and Bama and everywhere else, even thought those schools supposedly have all those things better than ND...

I want to preface my post here saying I think you're a really good poster, I think this post is well thought out, and I agree with your basic premise that there are a lot of obstacles in ND's current situation to keeping the roster stocked with QBs.... I think there is a realistic chance of any (or all) of our other QBs transferring if Golson wins the job for a myriad of reasons BUT.........

There are two points I want to touch on:

1. The idea that "South Bend isn't fun" or in general the list of factors you give, in my opinion, have almost absolutely nothing at all to with whether someone chooses to transfer or not. If you're miserable, for whatever reason, you'll transfer.... but the VAST majority of the kids on any team won't fall into that group/have already transferred if they do fall into that category. Most football players and athletes in general I knew at ND, simply put, had the time of their lives in college and wouldn't trade it for the world.... for every emotionally ill-equipped kid like Aaron Lynch there are 10 that love life. I can't think of a single friend of mine who I could classify as "unhappy" at ND. I knew one kid from Boston my frosh year who transferred out to BC because he didn't like it but that's it. I'm not saying everyone is 100% happy 100% of the time or anything stupid like that.... or that everyone loves the winter...... but I'm saying the vast majority of people attending ND are thoroughly enjoying their time there and the primary reason is almost always related to something sports oriented not school/fun/social life oriented. I can give real life examples if you want of people and the transfer process (at ND and at other schools) but this post is already long and rather rambling.

2. The thing about the team playing at an elite level to keep kids on the roster isn't really accurate. If you're a 5 kid and you're not playing then you're likely to transfer. Period. Winning a NC on the bench is not enough. Usually kids will stick around behind elite talent at their position because they both respect the person ahead of them and assume they will get their shot. That's why 4 kids at Stanford stuck around behind Luck... because they expected him to leave a year earlier than he actually did and because they knew they'd have a chance to earn a spot. The single biggest driver in a kid transferring is getting passed up by somebody in their class or the class behind them... and especially at positions like QB where only one guy gets on the field. Because as soon as that happens, you know you are f*cked and if you put any value on going pro you basically have to make a move. That's why Kyle Prater, despite USC being the NC favorite this year, got the heck out of dodge... he got passed up by frosh Marquis Lee and said "eff that noise, I'm going to a school where no receivers are close to my level."

You guys are definitely right. I guess what I was trying to say was that the factors I listed would make a player second-guess their decision to transfer. Obviously if the only impetus for transfer was climate or women, the player has messed-up priorities. However, I do think it is easier for a player to accept a backup role at USC than at a school like ND for the factors I mentioned above. As you said, if the player has the drive and is passed up by a supposedly lesser player, they'll transfer regardless. But for a slightly less motivated player, those factors could keep them at their school.

I read a post earlier today saying, "you make your own fun". I agree with this. If you can't find a group of friends that you can form lifelong memories with at ND, especially with the close-knit dorm communities, there's probably something wrong with you. I had the time of my life at ND and the friends I made there will be in my heart forever. Sure I wasn't a fan of the weather, but it's gorgeous in the fall and spring, and at least there are some fantastic snowball fights in the winter. The food is better at our dining hall than pretty much any other school, and while some of the bars are kind of sketchy, you'll never have to pay more than $5 cover and it's who you're with more than where you're at.

 

[NDinL.A.]

He was listing off pre-sanction transfers.

Nah, I definitely missed that one LOL...

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

More from Mr. Newman...

Notre Dame grad says quarterbacks endure 'magnified' pressure - News-Sentinel.com

“Dayne was telling Tommy that even if they are saying that you are the No. 1 guy,” Newman said, “that's what they told me. It's not good for your program if you can't put stock into what the coaches say.”

“Tommy has made mistakes,” Newman said. “They were stupid mistakes and he should be punished for those. But I've got to go to bat for Tommy. Interceptions are going to be thrown no matter who the quarterback is. Those are going to happen, and honestly, they happen a lot more when the coaches are chewing you out for throwing that first one.”

Newman watched freshman Gunner Kiel work in the weight room this past spring, and he was impressed with the youngster. He called sophomore Everett Golson “the most talented human being I've seen on a football field ever.” As for Andrew Hendrix, Newman wonders what will happen with his career.

“Andrew is too talented and too smart of a guy,” Newman said. “He really cares about the school and the degree that he is getting there. (Each of) These guys belong at Notre Dame. There is a certain air to Notre Dame students that demands excellence. I'm not a big fan of transferring from Notre Dame before you get your degree. But I can't see all four of those guys (staying).”

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

"Interceptions are going to be thrown no matter who the quarterback is."

It's okay, guys. Those horrible turnovers Tommy makes every game were going to happen even if Tom Brady was at QB. What a stupid quote.

 

[tadman95]

Eh, this is his fifteen minutes of fame. I doubt anyone but us diehards even care.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Brandon has little future as a Quarterback coach.

 

[Chamellion]

He called sophomore Everett Golson “the most talented human being I've seen on a football field ever.”

Fan Of this. He played with clausen, Tate, Floyd, te'o

 

[rikkitikki08]

Indiana is awesome. Like anywhere else, its what you make of it. I live in California but catch myself missing Indiana almost everyday.

My wife thinks it funny that I keep my Indiana 317 area code on my cell phone.

Thats because the 317 area code is one of the greatest area codes in all of the land....NAPTOWN WHAT!

Also back on topic, i believe its golson job to lose