'13 DC ATH Devin Butler (Notre Dame Signed LOI)

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Grahambo

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Would definitely like a better shuttle but overall, not bad at all. That can be worked on though. Nice vertical.

Edit: what the hell is powerball?
 
STLDomer

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Power Ball is a test of strength

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rocket66

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25th is pretty damn good overall. He finished much higher than several other cb's ranked considerably higher than him.
 
woolybug25

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NDPhilly said:
37 inch vert is very good.
Click to expand...

The vert drill was b.s. I watched it on tv and the camera view was always down low and in front, giving the allusion of higher verts. There were 5-6 kids that recorded well over 40in verticals. Which is ironic since most of the NBA players dont have 40 inch standing verticals...

Iman Shumpert - 36.5
vince carter - 36
Nate Robinson - 35
Derrick Rose - 34.5
jason richardson - 32.5
blake griffin - 32
D Wade - 31.5
dwight howard - 30.5
OJ Mayo - 30.5
Devin Harris - 30.5
Corey Brewer - 30.5
russell westbrook - 30
John Wall - 30
Evan Turner - 27.5
Ty Lawson - 29
tyreke evans - 28.5
Taj Gibson - 25.5

*The best vertical at this year's NBA combine was 38 inches by Harrison Barnes.

NFL Players
Tim Tebow - 38.5
Jimmy Graham(former basketball player) - 38
Andrew luck - 36
Tyson Alualu - 35.5
Donald Stephenson(OT, 2010 draft, 6ft 5 1/2, 312lb) - 35.5
Lydon Murtha - 35.5
Jake Locker - 35
Christian Ponder - 34
Mark Sanchez - 32.5
Brian Hoyer - 32
Matt Khalil - 30
Stephen Schilling - 30

All numbers are standing vert numbers because that's what they were doing at the Opening. So as you can see, the Opening's measurement process for the vert is quite flawed.
 
Walter White

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woolybug25 said:
The vert drill was b.s. I watched it on tv and the camera view was always down low and in front, giving the allusion of higher verts. There were 5-6 kids that recorded well over 40in verticals. Which is ironic since most of the NBA players dont have 40 inch standing verticals...

Iman Shumpert - 36.5
vince carter - 36
Nate Robinson - 35
Derrick Rose - 34.5
jason richardson - 32.5
blake griffin - 32
D Wade - 31.5
dwight howard - 30.5
OJ Mayo - 30.5
Devin Harris - 30.5
Corey Brewer - 30.5
russell westbrook - 30
John Wall - 30
Evan Turner - 27.5
Ty Lawson - 29
tyreke evans - 28.5
Taj Gibson - 25.5

*The best vertical at this year's NBA combine was 38 inches by Harrison Barnes.

NFL Players
Tim Tebow - 38.5
Jimmy Graham(former basketball player) - 38
Andrew luck - 36
Tyson Alualu - 35.5
Donald Stephenson(OT, 2010 draft, 6ft 5 1/2, 312lb) - 35.5
Lydon Murtha - 35.5
Jake Locker - 35
Christian Ponder - 34
Mark Sanchez - 32.5
Brian Hoyer - 32
Matt Khalil - 30
Stephen Schilling - 30

All numbers are standing vert numbers because that's what they were doing at the Opening. So as you can see, the Opening's measurement process for the vert is quite flawed.
Click to expand...

You said you watched it on T.V. so could you be more specific on how you think they were measuring wrong? The only thing I could think on how they messed up is if they were allowing the players to take a step into their jump. The numbers don't seem that crazy to me especially because shorter people tend to have more leverage and explosion for this kind of exercise.
 
woolybug25

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Walter White said:
You said you watched it on T.V. so could you be more specific on how you think they were measuring wrong? The only thing I could think on how they messed up is if they were allowing the players to take a step into their jump. The numbers don't seem that crazy to me especially because shorter people tend to have more leverage and explosion for this kind of exercise.
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They literally had a guy looking at it and saying what the height was. This was a standing vertical jump, which means they jump with two feet from a stationary position. As I said, according to the Opening scores, these prospects scored significantly better than the NFL combine numbers.

Furthermore, the combine vertical jump is measured like this at the NFL combine:

comp01_vertJump.jpg


At the Opening, they literally stood in front of a board with inches measured out and a guy eye balled how far up it the kids jumped or its recorded by the pad they jump on. Either way, it was completely inaccurate.
 
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Walter White

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woolybug25 said:
They literally had a guy looking at it and saying what the height was. This was a standing vertical jump, which means they jump with two feet from a stationary position. As I said, according to the Opening scores, these prospects scored significantly better than the NFL combine numbers.

Furthermore, the combine vertical jump is measured like this at the NFL combine:

comp01_vertJump.jpg


At the Opening, they literally stood in front of a board with inches measured out and a guy eye balled how far up it the kids jumped or its recorded by the pad they jump on. Either way, it was completely inaccurate.
Click to expand...

You are correct. That is a really stupid way to measure that. The players looked very goofy and nonathletic trying to do that drill.
 
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Socaldomer4212

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Long time lurker first time poster here. Not sure if anyone noticed but they aren't eyeballing the verticals. The players are standing on a jump pad, which is why Jerry Rice comes over to look at the pad after they've jumped, so he can see what the machine measured.

Having used both, as a player and coach, I'd say it's the equivalent to the difference between hand timed versus electronic timed 40's. I would also say the margin for error isn't as much as you'd think. Having said that I think the vertical's being tested with the movable pieces is better because it takes more coordination to jump up and swat as opposed to just jumping as high as you can, but it's not unreasonable to think the machine version is too far off. Just my two cents.
 
NDPhilly

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Watching the verts from yesterday now. I think it's may be accurate. They take so sort of picture when they jump.
 
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Socaldomer4212

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Could be. But if you look at their feet none of them are wearing shoes they all wear socks. The picture maybe a secondary way of measuring it much like the NFL uses both hand timed and electric for the 40. Either way, the pad does give a reading based on hang time.
 
woolybug25

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The biggest evidence to me is that they were putting up numbers significantly better than what we see in the NFL combine for the same drill. If it was that accurate of a system, then why isn't the NFL combine using it?

It's just like how we see all of these 4.3 forty times out of seniors in high school, but only see a couple when it comes to the combine.

I guess we'll see when some of these guys post way worse numbers 4 years from now at the combine. If the rest of y'all want to believe fake 40 times and fake verticals, more power to you...
 
B

Bogtrotter07

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woolybug25 said:
The biggest evidence to me is that they were putting up numbers significantly better than what we see in the NFL combine for the same drill. If it was that accurate of a system, then why isn't the NFL combine using it?

It's just like how we see all of these 4.3 forty times out of seniors in high school, but only see a couple when it comes to the combine.

I guess we'll see when some of these guys post way worse numbers 4 years from now at the combine. If the rest of y'all want to believe fake 40 times and fake verticals, more power to you...
Click to expand...

Great post! We all might as well start being honest. It will save a lot of time and energy we could use for future celebrations!

As to the method of testing jumping height, mechanics is king. The difference of course is reaching. When you jump reaching, it is harder than when you jump not reaching, for a number of kinestetic reasons. So it depends on what you want to measure. If you want to measure jumping ability with hands lowered, it is perfect. If however the sport you are gathering data for requires hands to be extended overhead often, while jumping, not so much.

It is no difference than SPArQueler scores. One ohio STATE fan went off on how Mitchell was a much better linebacker than Anzalone. He wasn't. He was able to run a 40 faster and throw a medicine ball farther. Alex ate him up in competition. Playing linebacker.

It depends what you want and are looking for.
 
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connor_in

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Bogtrotter07 said:
Great post! We all might as well start being honest. It will save a lot of time and energy we could use for future celebrations!

As to the method of testing jumping height, mechanics is king. The difference of course is reaching. When you jump reaching, it is harder than when you jump not reaching, for a number of kinestetic reasons. So it depends on what you want to measure. If you want to measure jumping ability with hands lowered, it is perfect. If however the sport you are gathering data for requires hands to be extended overhead often, while jumping, not so much.

It is no difference than SPArQueler scores. One ohio STATE fan went off on how Mitchell was a much better linebacker than Anzalone. He wasn't. He was able to run a 40 faster and throw a medicine ball farther. Alex ate him up in competition. Playing linebacker.

It depends what you want and are looking for.
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^ This...

These are the things the strength and conditioning coaches work on to help improve strength and speed and agility. This can help them in their playmaking. But if someone is a better playmaker, then the fact that he has slightly lower "measurables" is absolutely meaningless. A great example of this we have all see is the guy who is the king of the weight room, but can barely get on the field and is marginal at best when he does.
 
B

Bogtrotter07

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I have not seen him, where is he?

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Domina Nostra

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connor_in said:
^ This...

These are the things the strength and conditioning coaches work on to help improve strength and speed and agility. This can help them in their playmaking. But if someone is a better playmaker, then the fact that he has slightly lower "measurables" is absolutely meaningless. A great example of this we have all see is the guy who is the king of the weight room, but can barely get on the field and is marginal at best when he does.
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Totally OT, but when I get really close to the season I get desperate for anything ND. For example, here is a totally random video of three unrelated, insignificant plays from 2008.

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Old Man Mike

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Jeez... quit with the "putting on more weight" for everybody. This is a general comment as almost every thread has someone saying this. This is no longer 1970s football.

SPEED SPEED that's the game. Butler is already 180.
 
yankeeND

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Hey old man, I agree with the speed portion but unless our DB's are gonna play less physical suddenly I think 10 more lbs would not be out of the question.
 
Whiskeyjack

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Old Man Mike said:
Jeez... quit with the "putting on more weight" for everybody. This is a general comment as almost every thread has someone saying this. This is no longer 1970s football.

SPEED SPEED that's the game. Butler is already 180.
Click to expand...

This is slightly off-topic, but it occurred to me as I read posts from several of our members complaining of the dire lack of talent at CB.

Three of our CBs-- Jackson, Atkinson, and Brown-- have the stature and athleticism to be truly excellent DBs in Diaco's Cover-2 zone. The only question is whether they have the instincts for it.

I know we're lacking in star power at CB, but Kelly's staff has squeezed amazing production out of far less talented players at prior schools. I'm not as concerned about CB as some around here seem to be.
 
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