Wake Forest Post Game Thread

[IrishFanJMercy]

Book 76% passing on the year we will do big things with A QB that accurate

 

[Free Manera]

That early fumble was not great.

That looked like a blindside, helmet on ball fumble so that doesn’t bother me a ton. Sometimes those will happen. His speed is really valuable. When he gets loose he is instinctive and fast. He’ll be a player I think.

 

[BeatSC]

I think BW wouldn’t have cemented his job if he got the start today. With that said Book ran the RPO well and made the right reads and is the QB going forward unless he schitts the bed.

VTech had their hype built up against an awful Florida State team. Syracuse is looking like the trap game this year. Good thing we scheduled it in their backyard to help em out.......

 

[T-Boone]

Julian Okwara was the DL play maker today. Someone new steps up each week so far.

 

[NDVirginia19]

I think BW wouldn’t have cemented his job if he got the start today. With that said Book ran the RPO well and made the right reads and is the QB going forward unless he schitts the bed.

VTech had their hype built up against an awful Florida State team. Syracuse is looking like the trap game this year. Good thing we scheduled it in their backyard to help em out.......

That Syracuse game will easily be 75% ND fans

 

[NDVirginia19]

Also, I may have missed this, but why didn't Kraemer start?

 

[BeatSC]

That Syracuse game will easily be 75% ND fans

It better be!

 

[IrishFaninTX]

Also, I may have missed this, but why didn't Kraemer start?

I believe he has an ankle sprain.

 

[ickythump1225]

That Syracuse game will easily be 75% ND fans

Yeah but we're still giving up a home game to travel. I hate that concept.

 

[DONTH8]

Also, I may have missed this, but why didn't Kraemer start?

Twisted ankle

 

[NDVirginia19]

Yeah but we're still giving up a home game to travel. I hate that concept.

You don't have to tell me, I'd much rather have a seventh home game in Syracuse be my last home game as a student than FSU

 

[TheIrishAre#1]

Incredibly impressed with the offense today. Having someone distribute the ball reliably makes such a difference. Although the start was slower than previous outings, to me, it was clear that once the offense clicked, they're going to be much more productive. Very happy with the TEs and WRs overall.

I'd really like to see Wimbush involved in the offense still, even if Book is the starting QB going forward.

 

[phgreek]

so much to be happy about...

my only gripes, and they are just small grips
-2 bad drops, but overall very happy with WR and TE. Still, Book 70+%
-RBs go down to easy
-Gave up too many medium/big runs, and weren't that good on 3rd and long
-3 stupid things killed our first 3 drives. Even with that, we set a road scoring record under BK (prev was 49pts).
-I'll happily take the young mistakes made on D while the starters got a rest.

Yea pretty much...I'll add.

Book sees the field, and makes throws on time, and where they need to be...nuff said about him...

The thing I see with Jones is his vision is still not there yet. He gets tangled up in his own blockers more than I'd like...and he isn't gonna shake too many people in a phone booth so when his feet stop...pretty much game over. Just needs more reps. and more film room with AD.

Great game.

 

[Irish YJ]

Time to eat some crow. i thought the QB switch was a bad idea. And I agree with the announcers that going to Phil instead of BW was a good move and would have been a slap in the face to him today. But Book seems to fit the style of play that the staff wants to use much more than BW.

One other thing to mention is that the WF QB was tough as nails. I don't recall seeing a QB take that many shots and keep on getting up. That kid is going to be sore for a week.

This defense is the real deal. They are very physical. They give up a play or two here and there but for the most part today WF was in 3rd and long.

Very torn on playing BW. Part me wishes they would have worked him in a little, earlier in the game. Part of me is happy that Book went pretty much wire to wire and let no Qs unanswered.

ND even tore up the WF QB's tights. Dude looked like a lady of the night on pay day + tax return day.

More of the playbook opens up with Book in.

This is what I'm so excited about. It was hard for Ds to contain BW's running ability, but it's even harder to contain an O when you have a QB who can get the ball to 10 different receivers, plus a QB who ran for 3 TDs.

I really think BW needs to convert to part time RB.
Book has stronger arm and much better wheels than Rees. Not even close.
Wimbush has really had plenty of chances. Dayne Crist wishes he had as many chances as BW has but BW has had several nice to really good games. USC, NC St and Wake Forest last year.
I think the problem with Wimbush has less to do with accuracy and more to do with poor decision making on the RPOs and flat out missing an open receiver while missing others wide open. I’m sure if we had access to game film like the coaches this would become even more glaringly clear. Hope Wake is a little better than we made them look today.

I think it's both (accuracy and decisions). But I'm all for finding anyway to get BW on the field be it WR or RB. He could be a boss without being a QB. I just hope they try and make the change soon so that they keep him involved, and his head on straight.

I guess we'll see how Book does against the better defenses we face, but I've been saying he's a better QB than Wimbush for over a year. I actually feel more optimistic about this year... watch it all crash and burn, next week.

I liked that Ruhland got his first start. Man, did he look lost on his early pulls, though.

Stanford will definitely be a bigger test, but I don't think it will crash and burn. Shaw's O game planning job just got a lot harder after Books big day today.

I was against the move to Book but was dead ass wrong. Reminded me of what happened to the Browns Thursday. All the sudden the offense looked on rhythm and the ball was getting out quick. Next week will be the real test but at least now I think we have a realistic chance of scoring enough against Stanford to win.

I'm really happy for the WRs and TEs.. they have to be jazzed about the increased opportunity that comes with Book. I think the OL is happier as well having someone make quick and accurate reads. Their job got a lot easier.

 

[Irish YJ]

Yea pretty much...I'll add.

Book sees the field, and makes throws on time, and where they need to be...nuff said about him...

The thing I see with Jones is his vision is still not there yet. He gets tangled up in his own blockers more than I'd like...and he isn't gonna shake too many people in a phone booth so when his feet stop...pretty much game over. Just needs more reps. and more film room with AD.

Great game.

I think we're at Jone's ceiling. And that's OK. He's productive enough even without the ability to bounce. His job will get easier if Book stays productive passing. Armstrong, can improve IMO. He's doing a great job given the conversion, and will only get better. He runs too upright and goes down easier when hit, but he does create better space than Jones. I think he can improve, and will.

 

[Mavericknyc1980]

That Syracuse game will easily be 75% ND fans

I’ll be there. Love it when they come to Ny

 

[zelezo vlk]

Julian Okwara was the DL play maker today. Someone new steps up each week so far.

Dude loves playing in NC

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[IrishLax]

1. I think people need to pump the breaks about the offense. Wake has a terrible D, they gave up 400+ yards to each of the bad teams they played. They gave up 500+ and 50 points to Boston College. I picked ND to win big today because Wake gets shredded by everyone. Book was not asked to throw the ball downfield today. I haven’t watched it back, but I don’t remember him throwing a ball 20+ yards down the field in the air and having it completed unless that one to Claypool went over 20 yards. You can beat a team like Wake by getting the ball to playmakers in space, I don’t know if you can beat a good defense without the ability to push the ball vertically down the field. We’ll know soon, because the hardest team left on the schedule with BY FAR the best DBs we will see the rest of the year is coming to town next week.

2. This game illustrated why the scheme with Wimbush was so stupid, and what Book does so well. Someone (on broadcast?) compared Book to McSorely and that’s incredibly stupid. Wimbush is closer to McSorely than Book is. McSorely is inaccurate and relies on making big vertical plays with his arm plus plays with his legs to move the ball downfield. Book is about timing, accuracy, efficiency. To focus on Wimbush for a second, look how Kevin Sunmlin is ruining Khalil Tate. Tate was Heisman caliber under Rich Rodriguez... but in a different scheme and he’s garbage. That’s what our coaches did with Wimbush... instead of putting in a scheme tailored to him they routinely asked him to do stuff he can’t do, and rarely asked him to do the things he excelled at.

3. Everything they did wrong with Wimbush they did right today with Book. That was a textbook job of tailoring an offense to someone’s skills. And Book is DAMN GOOD at the quick passing game... he has great timing and great touch on his throws. He can run a “Tommy Rees” style offense but with a bigger arm, better accuracy, and a ton more mobility. His ability to get the ball out on schedule also does a LOT for the OL in pass protection. I was extremely encouraged both by the game plan and how Book executed it even after a rough start.

4. Defense was good again. I think they’re very solid when they can get pressure on the QB. Big test next week with Stanford’s OL and skill position talent and that game will prove if they’re “for real.”

5. Special teams best game of the season by far.

 

[Circa]

I don’t know why this is funny to me. Old Dominion ... cannot be good in the slightest.

Zero fear of Virginia Tech now.

Well BSU almost pulled an odu on us. Can Not overlook anyone these days or you’ll find yourself embarrassed.
It’s amazing the reality of a football game is just that. You can lose.

Quoting Brian Kelly “It’s only a game!”

 

[irishfan]

1. I think people need to pump the breaks about the offense. Wake has a terrible D, they gave up 400+ yards to each of the bad teams they played. They gave up 500+ and 50 points to Boston College. I picked ND to win big today because Wake gets shredded by everyone. Book was not asked to throw the ball downfield today. I haven’t watched it back, but I don’t remember him throwing a ball 20+ yards down the field in the air and having it completed unless that one to Claypool went over 20 yards. You can beat a team like Wake by getting the ball to playmakers in space, I don’t know if you can beat a good defense without the ability to push the ball vertically down the field. We’ll know soon, because the hardest team left on the schedule with BY FAR the best DBs we will see the rest of the year is coming to town next week.

2. This game illustrated why the scheme with Wimbush was so stupid, and what Book does so well. Someone (on broadcast?) compared Book to McSorely and that’s incredibly stupid. Wimbush is closer to McSorely than Book is. McSorely is inaccurate and relies on making big vertical plays with his arm plus plays with his legs to move the ball downfield. Book is about timing, accuracy, efficiency. To focus on Wimbush for a second, look how Kevin Sunmlin is ruining Khalil Tate. Tate was Heisman caliber under Rich Rodriguez... but in a different scheme and he’s garbage. That’s what our coaches did with Wimbush... instead of putting in a scheme tailored to him they routinely asked him to do stuff he can’t do, and rarely asked him to do the things he excelled at.

3. Everything they did wrong with Wimbush they did right today with Book. That was a textbook job of tailoring an offense to someone’s skills. And Book is DAMN GOOD at the quick passing game... he has great timing and great touch on his throws. He can run a “Tommy Rees” style offense but with a bigger arm, better accuracy, and a ton more mobility. His ability to get the ball out on schedule also does a LOT for the OL in pass protection. I was extremely encouraged both by the game plan and how Book executed it even after a rough start.

4. Defense was good again. I think they’re very solid when they can get pressure on the QB. Big test next week with Stanford’s OL and skill position talent and that game will prove if they’re “for real.”

5. Special teams best game of the season by far.

LOL if I remember correctly the announcers were agreeing with BK saying Book was similar to McSorely. I agree they aren’t very similar. Might be an odd reference but he reminds me a little of Ben Mauk at Cincy who BK had there.

 

[Circa]

More of the playbook opens up with Book in.

Is it me over thinking what people don’t understand about zone read and rpo offenses? Or do a lot of people not understand it?

 

[dmort]

ESPN puts ND's playoff chances at 14%. This is the real reason behind the QB switch. Kelly probably gets a bonus to get to the play offs. The team is showing that they are gelling after barely beating their previous two opponents.

 

[Irish YJ]

1. I think people need to pump the breaks about the offense. Wake has a terrible D, they gave up 400+ yards to each of the bad teams they played. They gave up 500+ and 50 points to Boston College. I picked ND to win big today because Wake gets shredded by everyone. Book was not asked to throw the ball downfield today. I haven’t watched it back, but I don’t remember him throwing a ball 20+ yards down the field in the air and having it completed unless that one to Claypool went over 20 yards. You can beat a team like Wake by getting the ball to playmakers in space, I don’t know if you can beat a good defense without the ability to push the ball vertically down the field. We’ll know soon, because the hardest team left on the schedule with BY FAR the best DBs we will see the rest of the year is coming to town next week.

2. This game illustrated why the scheme with Wimbush was so stupid, and what Book does so well. Someone (on broadcast?) compared Book to McSorely and that’s incredibly stupid. Wimbush is closer to McSorely than Book is. McSorely is inaccurate and relies on making big vertical plays with his arm plus plays with his legs to move the ball downfield. Book is about timing, accuracy, efficiency. To focus on Wimbush for a second, look how Kevin Sunmlin is ruining Khalil Tate. Tate was Heisman caliber under Rich Rodriguez... but in a different scheme and he’s garbage. That’s what our coaches did with Wimbush... instead of putting in a scheme tailored to him they routinely asked him to do stuff he can’t do, and rarely asked him to do the things he excelled at.

3. Everything they did wrong with Wimbush they did right today with Book. That was a textbook job of tailoring an offense to someone’s skills. And Book is DAMN GOOD at the quick passing game... he has great timing and great touch on his throws. He can run a “Tommy Rees” style offense but with a bigger arm, better accuracy, and a ton more mobility. His ability to get the ball out on schedule also does a LOT for the OL in pass protection. I was extremely encouraged both by the game plan and how Book executed it even after a rough start.

4. Defense was good again. I think they’re very solid when they can get pressure on the QB. Big test next week with Stanford’s OL and skill position talent and that game will prove if they’re “for real.”

5. Special teams best game of the season by far.

Agree pretty much on everything. Not sure though we need a FULL pump on the breaks on the O though. Maybe a cautiously optimistic tap on the breaks. I agree there are concerns with the vertical game, but I think we had the same concern with BW... just a bit different. It's not like BW was lighting up the long game. When he did throw long, I don't recall to many long balls catching the WRs in stride. Not all, but most seemed to be 50/50 balls. I think Book is capable of the same (just not as long) in terms of tossing 50/50 balls. I think the bigger problem is not having a burner to run under the long ball. If we did, I think Book would be pretty decent in throwing over the coverage. I'd love to see Lenzy make an appearance on a few go routes...

Stanford does concern me a bit. Frankly though, I would have more concern if we were going into the game without the switch. Stanford has the athletes on D to win 50/50 balls, so not sure I would have relied on that anyway. If Book can keep the OL happy by making quick short and middle reads, with an occasion 15-30 yarder, I think that will be enough to get by Stanford. My bigger concern is about our D. It's their first true test IMO.

 

[IrishLax]

ESPN puts ND's playoff chances at 14%. This is the real reason behind the QB switch. Kelly probably gets a bonus to get to the play offs. The team is showing that they are gelling after barely beating their previous two opponents.

Every single coach gets a bonus for making the playoffs or big bowl games, and every single coach is motivated by trying to win a championship.

 

[Irish YJ]

Every single coach gets a bonus for making the playoffs or big bowl games, and every single coach is motivated by trying to win a championship.

You play to win the game... and make a bunch of money.

 

[Irish YJ]

ND made the IN/OUT on ESPN...

GameDay Final How Old Dominion pulled off the year's most shocking upset over Virginia Tech

IN: Using a second QB

Notre Dame's offense found its groove after Brian Kelly benched Brandon Wimbush in favor of Ian Book, who torched Wake Forest for 368 yards and five touchdowns. Miami's offense took off with N'Kosi Perry replacing Malik Rosier, too. Perry completed 14 of his first 15 throws while leading the Canes to a 31-17 win over FIU. And while Clemson certainly hasn't officially turned the page on Kelly Bryant, it was Trevor Lawrence who looked sharp, tossing four TD throws in a win over Georgia Tech.

 

[aaronb]

Great performance today. Good call by Kelly. Book was a baller. It was fun.

Time to get ready for Stanford.

Better late than never...Should have been apparent since LSU Bowl game.

 

[phgreek]

I think we're at Jone's ceiling. And that's OK. He's productive enough even without the ability to bounce. His job will get easier if Book stays productive passing. Armstrong, can improve IMO. He's doing a great job given the conversion, and will only get better. He runs too upright and goes down easier when hit, but he does create better space than Jones. I think he can improve, and will.

Jones doesn't have to be Jerome Bettis...but he could be a little more like him.

I see this vision issue in kids who get a new offense/coach. They run the play as if the lines from the playbook are traced on the field. They do it because they are stressed/scared. When they are stressed and scared, their field of vision narrows...and they just put their head down and go...damn the torpedos kinda deal. When they calm down, and stop stressing, they start to get a wider field of view, and become more instinctive runners. They become football players again...

Now Jones isn't THAT bad...but he seems to have a little of it. I think by season's end he'll be more instinctive. But he isn't ever running away from people like Josh Adams, so the most you get is a 20 yardish chunk from him when he hits one. So yea, I agree about his ceiling. Just want to see him turn that 0 gain to 4-6 yards...and those are there more often than not when he runs up a lineman's ass....

Armstrong... is already pretty instinctual, and he can break off some runs. Agreed on upright style...easier to knock over a bottle than a stein.

 

[Irish YJ]

Jones doesn't have to be Jerome Bettis...but he could be a little more like him.

I see this vision issue in kids who get a new offense/coach. They run the play as if the lines from the playbook are traced on the field. They do it because they are stressed/scared. When they are stressed and scared, their field of vision narrows...and they just put their head down and go...damn the torpedos kinda deal. When they calm down, and stop stressing, they start to get a wider field of view, and become more instinctive runners. They become football players again...

Now Jones isn't THAT bad...but he seems to have a little of it. I think by season's end he'll be more instinctive. But he isn't ever running away from people like Josh Adams, so the most you get is a 20 yardish chunk from him when he hits one. So yea, I agree about his ceiling. Just want to see him turn that 0 gain to 4-6 yards...and those are there more often than not when he runs up a lineman's ass....

Armstrong... is already pretty instinctual, and he can break off some runs. Agreed on upright style...easier to knock over a bottle than a stein.

When I commented earlier about small gripes, and one of them was the RBs going down to easy, the above is what I was talking about. It seems like Jones had blinders on, and instead of bouncing JUST A TINY BIT, he'd run straight into the defender (and sometimes his OL) instead of shifting with the potential of a bounce. Armstrong I think will learn. He went down a few times via soft arm tackles, but at least he's as you say, instinctual enough to cut or bounce. I think he'll learn, get much tougher as the position gets normalized, and be pretty exciting in time.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

1. I think people need to pump the breaks about the offense. Wake has a terrible D, they gave up 400+ yards to each of the bad teams they played. They gave up 500+ and 50 points to Boston College. I picked ND to win big today because Wake gets shredded by everyone. Book was not asked to throw the ball downfield today. I haven’t watched it back, but I don’t remember him throwing a ball 20+ yards down the field in the air and having it completed unless that one to Claypool went over 20 yards. You can beat a team like Wake by getting the ball to playmakers in space, I don’t know if you can beat a good defense without the ability to push the ball vertically down the field. We’ll know soon, because the hardest team left on the schedule with BY FAR the best DBs we will see the rest of the year is coming to town next week.

2. This game illustrated why the scheme with Wimbush was so stupid, and what Book does so well. Someone (on broadcast?) compared Book to McSorely and that’s incredibly stupid. Wimbush is closer to McSorely than Book is. McSorely is inaccurate and relies on making big vertical plays with his arm plus plays with his legs to move the ball downfield. Book is about timing, accuracy, efficiency. To focus on Wimbush for a second, look how Kevin Sunmlin is ruining Khalil Tate. Tate was Heisman caliber under Rich Rodriguez... but in a different scheme and he’s garbage. That’s what our coaches did with Wimbush... instead of putting in a scheme tailored to him they routinely asked him to do stuff he can’t do, and rarely asked him to do the things he excelled at.

3. Everything they did wrong with Wimbush they did right today with Book. That was a textbook job of tailoring an offense to someone’s skills. And Book is DAMN GOOD at the quick passing game... he has great timing and great touch on his throws. He can run a “Tommy Rees” style offense but with a bigger arm, better accuracy, and a ton more mobility. His ability to get the ball out on schedule also does a LOT for the OL in pass protection. I was extremely encouraged both by the game plan and how Book executed it even after a rough start.

4. Defense was good again. I think they’re very solid when they can get pressure on the QB. Big test next week with Stanford’s OL and skill position talent and that game will prove if they’re “for real.”

5. Special teams best game of the season by far.

Jeeeeeez Debbie Downer. Only joking.

I think it does need to be made very clear that the Wake Forest defense is horrid. Wake Forest will be the worst defense Notre Dame faces all year. They are ranked 100 something in total defense nationally.

Saying that the offense looked like a total different animal compared to the previous two weeks. Book is so accurate with short to mid range passing game. I mean BW couldn’t consistently hit WR screens. Book stunningly is actually able to complete these passes and put the ball in a place that allows the receiver to immediately get upfield. It also needs to be pointed out how quickly Book processes information and gets the ball out of his hands. ABC/ESPN broadcast had a clock on a few of Books drop backs and then release of the ball, he was getting the ball out of his hands in less than 2 seconds! It also cannot be states enough the excellent decision making by Book whether it was a read option or an RPO or if it was tucking the ball and running or throwing the ball out of bounds; Book for the majority of the time made the correct choice. And Book did have a handful of completed passes 20+ yards down the field in the air. I would not worry about Book throwing the long ball. Just thinking about 4th qtr against LSU in the bowl game he threw a dime on a 20+ yard deep-in route to Finke, he dropped a ball in a bucket deep down the left sideline to Boykin on the second to last drive and then there was the long throw down the right sideline to Boykin for the game winning touchdown. Let’s face it the game plan for this game was focused on short to intermediate routes, which was working all day.

The most important aspect Book brought was the energy that lifted the level of play and lifted the confidence of his teammates. It seemed like the WR’s and TE’s were crisper and played with more energy than the last two games. The OL seemed more cohesive and confident than they have played all year.

Notre Dame is 4-0 and it seems they have a QB who could take them to the playoffs. Stanford played an overtime game tonight. they have to now travel back home, go to classes and do home work all week, go to practice and watch film all week and then fly halfway around the country for a night game this upcoming Saturday. Go Irish!

LOL if I remember correctly the announcers were agreeing with BK saying Book was similar to McSorely. I agree they aren’t very similar. Might be an odd reference but he reminds me a little of Ben Mauk at Cincy who BK had there.

You are correct it was actually BK who brought up the comparison of Book to McSorely in meetings to the announcers. The announcers were just repeating what BK related to them.



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