The end of Net Neutrality?

[wizards8507]

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[IrishLax]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Never forget the amazing editors over at Wikipedia. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NetNeutrality?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#NetNeutrality</a> <a href="https://t.co/gddI6fj2j8">pic.twitter.com/gddI6fj2j8</a></p>— LucidFoxx (@LucidFoxx) <a href="https://twitter.com/LucidFoxx/status/941380744215187457?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 14, 2017</a></blockquote>
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Whose*

 

[wizards8507]

This dumbass wants more regulation to counter these authoritarian times.

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[Henges24]

Damn, there goes my Thursday night ritual of SpankerBankTV. Now I have to pay for it? Wtf is this?!?

RIP to the good times.
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[Shamrock Theories]

This dumbass wants more regulation to counter these authoritarian times.

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I'm sorry, do you actually oppose NN? Or are you just making fun of this guy?

In his defense, the president spends most of his time trying to convince the population that the press can't be trusted. And has fired multiple people who were in a position to hold him accountable.

Just sayin.

 

[wizards8507]

I'm sorry, do you actually oppose NN? Or are you just making fun of this guy?

In his defense, the president spends most of his time trying to convince the population that the press can't be trusted. And has fired multiple people who were in a position to hold him accountable.

Just sayin.

Net neutrality is dumb AF.

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[Henges24]

I'm sorry, do you actually oppose NN? Or are you just making fun of this guy?

In his defense, the president spends most of his time trying to convince the population that the press can't be trusted. And has fired multiple people who were in a position to hold him accountable.

Just sayin.

Banned. Take this BS to the political thread.

 

[Meatloaf]

Net neutrality is dumb AF.

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Why do you think that?

 

[wizards8507]

Why do you think that?

The "big business" versus "the people" angle is bullshit. It's old big business versus new big business. Facebook, Google, and Netflix are lying to people. Those companies want free rides, plain and simple. Net neutrality is a government-mandated transfer of wealth from Comcast to Netflix and Google. The thing that created regional ISP monopolies in the first place is government regulation. The 5G wireless network is going to make this argument obsolete regardless.

Those thoughts are somewhat disjointed but I'm sitting in the theater waiting for Star Wars to start.

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[ulukinatme]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Never forget the amazing editors over at Wikipedia. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NetNeutrality?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#NetNeutrality</a> <a href="https://t.co/gddI6fj2j8">pic.twitter.com/gddI6fj2j8</a></p>— LucidFoxx (@LucidFoxx) <a href="https://twitter.com/LucidFoxx/status/941380744215187457?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 14, 2017</a></blockquote>
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You must spread rep before giving to Cack again.

 

[Henges24]

The "big business" versus "the people" angle is bullshit. It's old big business versus new big business. Facebook, Google, and Netflix are lying to people. Those companies want free rides, plain and simple. Net neutrality is a government-mandated transfer of wealth from Comcast to Netflix and Google. The thing that created regional ISP monopolies in the first place is government regulation. The 5G wireless network is going to make this argument obsolete regardless.

Those thoughts are somewhat disjointed but I'm sitting in the theater waiting for Star Wars to start.

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Hope you enjoy paying triple for that ticket when the next movie comes out.

 

[Irish YJ]

The "big business" versus "the people" angle is bullshit. It's old big business versus new big business. Facebook, Google, and Netflix are lying to people. Those companies want free rides, plain and simple. Net neutrality is a government-mandated transfer of wealth from Comcast to Netflix and Google. The thing that created regional ISP monopolies in the first place is government regulation. The 5G wireless network is going to make this argument obsolete regardless.

Those thoughts are somewhat disjointed but I'm sitting in the theater waiting for Star Wars to start.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

Why should Netflix or Google pay any more for bandwidth than any other company? Why should consumers not be able to access any platform or company if they, and the platform they are seeking are all paying what other consumers and other businesses are paying?

At the end of the day, the cost will be passed down to the consumer for this crap, and will impact competition. I generally hate regs, but this is an area where Obummer got it right.

 

[Woneone]

The "big business" versus "the people" angle is bullshit. It's old big business versus new big business. Facebook, Google, and Netflix are lying to people. Those companies want free rides, plain and simple. Net neutrality is a government-mandated transfer of wealth from Comcast to Netflix and Google. The thing that created regional ISP monopolies in the first place is government regulation. The 5G wireless network is going to make this argument obsolete regardless.

Those thoughts are somewhat disjointed but I'm sitting in the theater waiting for Star Wars to start.

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The technology behind 5G basically hands itself to carriers creating network slices for "privileged" usage. 5G will not solve the restriction and filtering of data that crosses over it's backbone, no matter how much faster it is. Much of the abuse before NN was not solely due to bandwidth issues, but fighting with other companies due to competition between applications. 5G doesn't change that either.

Let's see if these carriers actually speed up the implementation of 5G now that NN is removed, since they've complained that this was something that was slowing it down. My guess is no.

 

[ACamp1900]

I'll wait and see but it is fascinating to see the reactions to this... I'll say that much.

 

[Cackalacky]

You must spread rep before giving to Cack again.

I love you too.

 

[Cackalacky]

Damn, there goes my Thursday night ritual of SpankerBankTV. Now I have to pay for it? Wtf is this?!?

RIP to the good times.
<iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/xT9KVB2MTGwg6FltPa" width="380" height="258" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://giphy.com/gifs/filmeditor-comedy-judd-apatow-xT9KVB2MTGwg6FltPa"></a></p>

Supplemental income from sperm banks for men just took a major hit.

 

[Meatloaf]

The technology behind 5G basically hands itself to carriers creating network slices for "privileged" usage. 5G will not solve the restriction and filtering of data that crosses over it's backbone, no matter how much faster it is. Much of the abuse before NN was not solely due to bandwidth issues, but fighting with other companies due to competition between applications. 5G doesn't change that either.

Let's see if these carriers actually speed up the implementation of 5G now that NN is removed, since they've complained that this was something that was slowing it down. My guess is no.

Don't forget that they're also preempting states from enacting their own net neutrality laws:

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...crap-plans-for-their-own-net-neutrality-laws/

Textbook big government.

 

[loomis41973]

Why should Netflix or Google pay any more for bandwidth than any other company? Why should consumers not be able to access any platform or company if they, and the platform they are seeking are all paying what other consumers and other businesses are paying?

At the end of the day, the cost will be passed down to the consumer for this crap, and will impact competition. I generally hate regs, but this is an area where Obummer got it right.

Obummer? Got it right?

 

[phgreek]

Why should Netflix or Google pay any more for bandwidth than any other company? Why should consumers not be able to access any platform or company if they, and the platform they are seeking are all paying what other consumers and other businesses are paying?

At the end of the day, the cost will be passed down to the consumer for this crap, and will impact competition. I generally hate regs, but this is an area where Obummer got it right.

Yea...the state of the market place makes me think this will not result in cheaper, better, more access and build out. If it were 20 years ago...sure. But the behemoths have been allowed to form...so treating it like a national utility is the right move here, IMHO. Unless the Gov is willing to break up some of the big players...and reset the market, then do this. IMHO, you actually have to have enough diversity in entities where overt and implied collusion isn't a natural occurrence...seems poised for a shit show to me.

 

[wizards8507]

Why should Netflix or Google pay any more for bandwidth than any other company?

Why do I get a 35% discount on Disney merchandise? Why do Home Depot contractor club members get 5% off their purchases? Why do gas stations occasionally charge extra if you pay with a credit card? Why is my property tax bill higher than my neighbor's?

Lots of fucking reasons. What business are any of those things to the government?

The reality is, Netflix is too big and will only get bigger when 4K becomes standard. If you don't let Comcast charge them a premium to fund bandwidth expansion, then EVERYONE'S speeds go to shit.

 

[phgreek]

Why do I get a 35% discount on Disney merchandise? Why do Home Depot contractor club members get 5% off their purchases? Why do gas stations occasionally charge extra if you pay with a credit card? Why is my property tax bill higher than my neighbor's?

Lots of fucking reasons. What business are any of those things to the government?

The reality is, Netflix is too big and will only get bigger when 4K becomes standard. If you don't let Comcast charge them a premium to fund bandwidth expansion, then EVERYONE'S speeds go to shit.

So...I have directly hired utility companies to expand electrical service to where it wasn't...it didn't make sense for the Electric company to roll the bones, so I funded it...something wrong with Netflix doing the same? Clearly I oversimplify some but thats how things work with utilities...sometimes you need to internalize the risk to attain the service you need to grow.

 

[wizards8507]

So...I have directly hired utility companies to expand electrical service to where it wasn't...it didn't make sense for the Electric company to roll the bones, so I funded it...something wrong with Netflix doing the same? Clearly I oversimplify some but thats how things work with utilities...sometimes you need to internalize the risk to attain the service you need to grow.

That's kind of my point. Netflix SHOULD be fronting some capital. With NN in place, why should they?

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[Cackalacky]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Hey, <a href="https://twitter.com/AjitPaiFCC?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@AjitPaiFCC</a>, today my mom would have turned 71. But she didn't. Because she died in March of 2016. Can you please take the time to explain to me how she made three separate comments in support of ending <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NetNeutrality?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#NetNeutrality</a> more than a year after she died?<br><br>cc: <a href="https://twitter.com/SeanAstin?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@SeanAstin</a> <a href="https://t.co/VtdLaB0eGp">pic.twitter.com/VtdLaB0eGp</a></p>— Mackenzie Astin (@MackenzieAstin) <a href="https://twitter.com/MackenzieAstin/status/941459382864437248?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 15, 2017</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[phgreek]

That's kind of my point. Netflix SHOULD be fronting some capital. With NN in place, why should they?

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...To me Netflix will eventually suffer (with everyone else) and be forced to deal with the bandwidth issue to keep their business growing, which results in relief to the existing infrastructure. However, If they can pay more for priority, and not feel it, the impetus to build out / expand falls on the "utility". To me the business model for the utility part is kinda settled, so changing that risks the basic service. If you risk the basic service, you may as well get to trust busting up front. JMHO though.

 

[MNIrishman]

That's kind of my point. Netflix SHOULD be fronting some capital. With NN in place, why should they?

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I'm, um, not really sure you understand how companies like Netflix deliver content to their customers. Netflix and Google pay a TON to have their content available at high speeds. The infrastructure and special connections are substantial and the cost isn't cheap. NN isn't about that. It's about "last mile" connections to people's houses.

So under NN, you pay for your bandwidth and you use it now you see fit. Netflix, YouTube, hosting your own consulting website, whatever. Without NN, Comcast can hold Netflix hostage and throttle their content through the connection you already paid for unless Netflix pays extra to keep that from happening. That's total BS because Netflix already pays for their content on their end, you pay for bandwidth on your end, and Comcast gets to double dip.

Not sure how that sounds appealing unless you're a shill for a giant media conglomerate.

 

[Irish YJ]

Why do I get a 35% discount on Disney merchandise? Why do Home Depot contractor club members get 5% off their purchases? Why do gas stations occasionally charge extra if you pay with a credit card? Why is my property tax bill higher than my neighbor's?

Lots of fucking reasons. What business are any of those things to the government?

The reality is, Netflix is too big and will only get bigger when 4K becomes standard. If you don't let Comcast charge them a premium to fund bandwidth expansion, then EVERYONE'S speeds go to shit.

But Netflix PAYS for the bandwidth that they use and have access too. And consumers PAY for the bandwidth they use and have access to. Netflix closed all of its data centers down early last year and pay for cloud access via Amazon data centers. Amazon/Netflix buys access circuits from the carriers (multiple, redundant). They pay for any and all bandwidth (actually likely overpay as their circuits are bigger than actual data flow thru).

I worked for the largest US carrier in the US for 16 years. You know Disney, I know telecom/data. Here's the deal. Companies buy data/access from the carriers. T1s, T3s, GigE (1Gig, 100Gig, etc.), etc.. The carriers don't build out to fulfill data capacity based on what companies actually buy. They build out typically what they believe customers will actually use. For instance, the company I worked for post my telecom days paid for a Gig. That was a lot back then. They never used it to full capacity (maybe 20% on average), nor did 95% of the other customers in the area. So for arguments sake, they (the carriers) sold 200G worth of speed for business park, but the actual local network was only built to handle 100G. They still are collecting 200G worth of revenue, but can't actually deliver on 200G. Netflix, and their customers are actually using what they paid for. They are not getting a free ride or screwing anyone else. It's the carriers, who have over sold/subscribed their networks that causes slowness, not the super users. The super users actually pay for the bandwidth access they have.

 

[Irish YJ]

I'm, um, not really sure you understand how companies like Netflix deliver content to their customers. Netflix and Google pay a TON to have their content available at high speeds. The infrastructure and special connections are substantial and the cost isn't cheap. NN isn't about that. It's about "last mile" connections to people's houses.

So under NN, you pay for your bandwidth and you use it now you see fit. Netflix, YouTube, hosting your own consulting website, whatever. Without NN, Comcast can hold Netflix hostage and throttle their content through the connection you already paid for unless Netflix pays extra to keep that from happening. That's total BS because Netflix already pays for their content on their end, you pay for bandwidth on your end, and Comcast gets to double dip.

Not sure how that sounds appealing unless you're a shill for a giant media conglomerate.

Wiz knows Daffy and Donald, not Data.

 

[wizards8507]

I'm, um, not really sure you understand how companies like Netflix deliver content to their customers. Netflix and Google pay a TON to have their content available at high speeds. The infrastructure and special connections are substantial and the cost isn't cheap. NN isn't about that. It's about "last mile" connections to people's houses.

So under NN, you pay for your bandwidth and you use it now you see fit. Netflix, YouTube, hosting your own consulting website, whatever. Without NN, Comcast can hold Netflix hostage and throttle their content through the connection you already paid for unless Netflix pays extra to keep that from happening. That's total BS because Netflix already pays for their content on their end, you pay for bandwidth on your end, and Comcast gets to double dip.

Not sure how that sounds appealing unless you're a shill for a giant media conglomerate.

LMAO. I don't know what you think I do for a living but I build financial projections for streaming video. I'm intimately familiar with the likes of Akamai, Level3, EdgeCast, etc. When I talk about infrastructure, I'm not talking about encoders. I'm talking about fiber and copper.

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[wizards8507]

Wiz knows Daffy and Donald, not Data.

But Netflix PAYS for the bandwidth that they use and have access too. And consumers PAY for the bandwidth they use and have access to. Netflix closed all of its data centers down early last year and pay for cloud access via Amazon data centers. Amazon/Netflix buys access circuits from the carriers (multiple, redundant). They pay for any and all bandwidth (actually likely overpay as their circuits are bigger than actual data flow thru).

I worked for the largest US carrier in the US for 16 years. You know Disney, I know telecom/data. Here's the deal. Companies buy data/access from the carriers. T1s, T3s, GigE (1Gig, 100Gig, etc.), etc.. The carriers don't build out to fulfill data capacity based on what companies actually buy. They build out typically what they believe customers will actually use. For instance, the company I worked for post my telecom days paid for a Gig. That was a lot back then. They never used it to full capacity (maybe 20% on average), nor did 95% of the other customers in the area. So for arguments sake, they (the carriers) sold 200G worth of speed for business park, but the actual local network was only built to handle 100G. They still are collecting 200G worth of revenue, but can't actually deliver on 200G. Netflix, and their customers are actually using what they paid for. They are not getting a free ride or screwing anyone else. It's the carriers, who have over sold/subscribed their networks that causes slowness, not the super users. The super users actually pay for the bandwidth access they have.

You guys are outkicking your coverage here. Google "BAMTech" and you'll know what I do. It's exactly this.

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[Irish YJ]

LMAO. I don't know what you think I do for a living but I build financial projections for streaming video. I'm intimately familiar with the likes of Akamai, Level3, EdgeCast, etc. When I talk about infrastructure, I'm not talking about encoders. I'm talking about fiber and copper.

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So do you understand building forecast for carrier build out as it pertains to actual usage and sales forecasts? Well that's what I supported.