Superconferences & Realignment

DomeX2 eNVy

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Changing the discussion a bit - sorry, I have to rant. . .

But to me the real question is "are these really Superconferences?" It is a great buzz term and will pull $billions in tv revenue and marketing, but I don't see how they are so great - they way they are being talked about. To me they are not so much a 16 team superconference as 2 - 8 team conferences equivalent to the Big 8, Pac 8, and SWC of the 1970s. They are smaller conferences that have a partner conference with a 'play in' game to a potential BCS bowl or playoff game. That's kinda cool, but not that great, imo.

People love to list off the incredible schedules a team would have to face, typically listing 8 of the to 10 teams in the conference, but not the bottom 6. For example, looking at the SEC, it already has an imbalance of West v East. Going to the 8+8 model, if a team has 8 conference games, that means they would have 7 divisional's and only 1 cross-division game per year. That means Florida would only play Alabama once every 8 years, while having 7 not-super-tough games to get into the championship round. They could go to 9 conference games, but still you would only see some "conference rivals" every fourth year. Is that what conferences are really about?

So not to just rant, here is a half-baked idea. I would like to see something like 4- 4 team divisions. Each team would play the teams in their division (3) every year to keep the great rivalries persisting. Then each division plays all the teams in another division (4), but that division rotates each year in a three year cycle. And then each team plays 1 game each year in the other two divisions (2) for a 9 game conference schedule. This way each team is guaranteed to play each conference team at least every third year.

The championship game would be the top two teams regardless of division. Ties could be broken via head-to-head; division; or rank (BCS or other) to give some importance to out of conference games and overall schedule. It would also prevent an average team (which might be the 5th best in the conference) coming out of a weak division getting into a championship game undeservingly.

OK, you can all call me stupid now; but I feel better:)
 
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Whiskeyjack

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Those are valid gripes, NDinNV. The SEC is trying to address its divisional imbalance by sending Auburn to the SEC East, and the Pac-12 has considered a 4-pod arrangement like you described.
 

GoldenIsThyFame

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I always perceived the term "super conference" was used because of the size of the conferences that would be created not necessarily them having to contain "super teams."

Could very well be wrong though.
 

tadman95

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The PAC 12 holding off in admitting the Texas and Oklahoma schools definitely put the brakes on for now. I can see the Big East trying to shore up its base but this could drag out for a while.

Texas appears to be in the drivers seat for now.
 

GoldenIsThyFame

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The PAC 12 holding off in admitting the Texas and Oklahoma schools definitely put the brakes on for now. I can see the Big East trying to shore up its base but this could drag out for a while.

Texas appears to be in the drivers seat for now.

Looks like it will be the end of the road for this guy:

Beebe_Blasted_medium.gif
 

IrishLax

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Mengus22 via Twitter:

Not really; it means they all know their hands could be forced at some point and don't want to totally f*ck themselves over if they have to bail. Pitt is a big loss for the conference in terms of football and basketball clout/revenue. Syracuse really isn't a huge loss for basketball as St. John's and other schools will continue to carry the NYC market. For football... let's be serious, they totally suck on the field and don't even really carry much clout in NYC.

So the question becomes... odes adding Villanova and Temple for football get you back the Pennsylvania market? And does adding Army and Navy grab you a large enough TV share from DC to NYC? I think the answer is yes and the Big East will add all four.

With the combination of those teams for TV markets and TCU to make the conference good at football (easily adds more football strength than Pitt/Syracuse leaving subtracts) the conference is in "ok" shape for the time being. The big problem is panic mongerers like WVU and UCONN who are probably trying their butts off right now to get to a "safer" conference.
 

tadman95

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Not really; it means they all know their hands could be forced at some point and don't want to totally f*ck themselves over if they have to bail. Pitt is a big loss for the conference in terms of football and basketball clout/revenue. Syracuse really isn't a huge loss for basketball as St. John's and other schools will continue to carry the NYC market. For football... let's be serious, they totally suck on the field and don't even really carry much clout in NYC.

So the question becomes... odes adding Villanova and Temple for football get you back the Pennsylvania market? And does adding Army and Navy grab you a large enough TV share from DC to NYC? I think the answer is yes and the Big East will add all four.

With the combination of those teams for TV markets and TCU to make the conference good at football (easily adds more football strength than Pitt/Syracuse leaving subtracts) the conference is in "ok" shape for the time being. The big problem is panic mongerers like WVU and UCONN who are probably trying their butts off right now to get to a "safer" conference.

Good post and I think is spot on.
 

Rhode Irish

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Not really; it means they all know their hands could be forced at some point and don't want to totally f*ck themselves over if they have to bail. Pitt is a big loss for the conference in terms of football and basketball clout/revenue. Syracuse really isn't a huge loss for basketball as St. John's and other schools will continue to carry the NYC market. For football... let's be serious, they totally suck on the field and don't even really carry much clout in NYC.

So the question becomes... odes adding Villanova and Temple for football get you back the Pennsylvania market? And does adding Army and Navy grab you a large enough TV share from DC to NYC? I think the answer is yes and the Big East will add all four.

With the combination of those teams for TV markets and TCU to make the conference good at football (easily adds more football strength than Pitt/Syracuse leaving subtracts) the conference is in "ok" shape for the time being. The big problem is panic mongerers like WVU and UCONN who are probably trying their butts off right now to get to a "safer" conference.

Army and Navy will be so outmatched on the basketball side of things that Providence may actually be able to look competitive by comparison.

Good post. I think you're thinking along the right lines, but UConn and WVU trying to get seats closest to the exit is a serious problem. In the everything-is-connected world of college sports conference realignment, the Big East owes its continuing existence to Texas and Oklahoma not joining the Pac. I don't feel like that issue has been resolved for anything more than the immediate short term, and therefore the Big East cannot feel totally comfortable or secure right now.
 

Whiskeyjack

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CBSSports via Twitter:

Officials: UConn not committed to staying in Big East - LINK

Mengus22 via Twitter:

Herbst blowing off meeting gave it away. RT @CBSSports Officials: UConn not committed to staying in Big East
 
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OU is claiming that its primary goal was Big10 reform all along, and it was using the threat of bolting for the Pac-12 as leverage.

The Pac-12 only released its statement that it won't be expanding until after Oklahoma and Okie State notified it that they wouldn't be applying for membership.

This situation is far from stable, and everyone's still unhappy with the status quo.

But by the Pac-12 denying their membership, Oklahoma basically loses their leveraging power. Now they have even less leverage now unless some other conference is willing to take them.
 

Whiskeyjack

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But by the Pac-12 denying their membership, Oklahoma basically loses their leveraging power. Now they have even less leverage now unless some other conference is willing to take them.

No one's telling the truth here. Don't take anything you read in that statement at face value.
 
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If that is true, OU is full of ****. Halfway in the door until Texas' Longhorn Network and tv revenue sharing did not fall through. The Big12 and Big East commissioners are full of crap too. They are probably upset now because they have to get off their fat a$$es and do some work now just to keep the conference together.

As for ND and the rest of the country, we can breathe a small, albeit short sigh of relief for now. I still think that there will be more schools panicking so they do not get left out, mainly teams like UConn, Baylor, Kansas, KState, and West Virginia.
 
G

Grahambo

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Rhode Irish;548480[B said:
]Army and Navy will be so outmatched on the basketball side of things that Providence may actually be able to look competitive by comparison.
[/B]
Good post. I think you're thinking along the right lines, but UConn and WVU trying to get seats closest to the exit is a serious problem. In the everything-is-connected world of college sports conference realignment, the Big East owes its continuing existence to Texas and Oklahoma not joining the Pac. I don't feel like that issue has been resolved for anything more than the immediate short term, and therefore the Big East cannot feel totally comfortable or secure right now.

They were only going to be admitted as football only members.
 

ohara831

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Clemson is not leaving the ACC. They are more than happy that Pitt and Syracuse are coming as that just provides them with another team in their half of the ACC they can beat up on. That, and they dont want to pay $20 mil to leave.
 

Whiskeyjack

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Yahoo!'s Matt Hinton (Dr. Saturday) gives his take on the "OU to Pac-12 as Giant Bluff" theory here.
 

IrishGiant

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Right, the full 4 year ride and degree is completely worthless. Woe is them.

One game on network TV covers every full ride on the team. Lets face it, the college's make off like bandits. I got a degree too, but you still gotta work when you get out.
 

ShamrockOnHelmet

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One game on network TV covers every full ride on the team. Lets face it, the college's make off like bandits. I got a degree too, but you still gotta work when you get out.

They do, but don't get on here and act like the kids are getting raped. They get a full ride and an education. Thats their compensation, and its perfectly legitimate. If they hate the "evil administrators" of colleges so bad, they don't have to go. Sorry, not feeling bad for them. I had to pay every dime of my undergrad and grad degrees.
 

Old Man Mike

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Actually, many business enterprises pay entry-level employees peanuts. Some work environments are also dangerous [ex.Mining and most heavy industry], which some folks use as an argument for more athlete pay. The degree that the athlete gets [if they bother] provides far more upward advancement potential than most jobs by far. So, even though I don't revel in all things money-oriented [by a long shot] I have never seen the "slave labor" salary argument here. I COULD see a small added stipend to balance the fact that athletes are denied by pragmatic time stress any opportunity for "summer" supplemental employment nowadays, as this has become a twelve month training affair.
 

DuffHouse12

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i disagree with almost everything that guy says. a 4 team playoff would ensure superconferences. why? because the SEC Champ would go every year, leaving the rest of the country to mix and match trying to create another conference powerful enough to send their champ every year. although the rules would not specifically say "Automatic Qualifier" the landscape would ultimately end up producing those conferences to get a champion that the playoffs just could not say no to.
 

Whiskeyjack

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i disagree with almost everything that guy says. a 4 team playoff would ensure superconferences. why? because the SEC Champ would go every year, leaving the rest of the country to mix and match trying to create another conference powerful enough to send their champ every year. although the rules would not specifically say "Automatic Qualifier" the landscape would ultimately end up producing those conferences to get a champion that the playoffs just could not say no to.

Do you work for the BCS? Honest question here. Your blinkered devotion to a universally despised system baffles me.

Clearly, recent SEC success means that such will continue unbroken ad infinitum unless the other 5 AQ conferences form a sort of Voltron to defeat it.

Money drives CFB, and the economics of the BCS are terrible. A playoff would likely generate an extra $1 billion for the participating programs. It'll happen one way or another; either as a way to avoid superconferences, or as a result of superconferences.
 
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