Superconferences & Realignment

[Dale]

These seem to be the most prevalent rumors and scuttlebutt out there:

Oklahoma St. and Kansas want to join the B1G. The B1G is kind of meh and those schools don't even qualify academically.

What would not qualify KU academically?

 

[Sea Turtle]

What would not qualify KU academically?

Sorry, OSU wouldn't. Kansas brings basketball but that's all.

 

[BilboBaggins]

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/danwetzel/status/1419799748098236416?s=21[/TWEET]

The non chaos possible results to me are:

1. SEC stops at Texas and OU, Big Ten and ACC hold steady, and Pac 12 adds a Midwest pod. Big 12 leftovers join AAC.

2. SEC stops at Texas and OU, Big Ten, ACC and P-12 hold steady and Big 12 adds from AAC pretending to keep it at “P5”

In either case Fox pushes for a Pac-12 with Big Ten agreement in next TV deal.

That's my prediction.

The Big Ten isn't going to take on a new school for basketball (Kansas) or without a big TV draw (Iowa State). Hell I think it'd be more likely that they go for broke and invite Virginia/Virginia Tech/North Carolina/Duke, and I don't see that happening.

Likewise, the Pac-12 isn't going to take a religious school (TCU, Baylor) and Texas Tech frankly isn't worthy. I can't see them adding a Big 12 team if it's not in Texas.

Look for the hollowed out Big 12 to add UCF, Houston, Boise State, BYU, Cincinnati, etc if they'll come and make the argument that they deserve to be treated as a big boy because while the conference wouldn't be deep, the conference champion would surely be ranked high in most years.

Is this a viable Big 12 solution??

WEST
- Boise State
- BYU
- Kansas
- Kansas State
- UNLV
- Texas Tech
- TCU

EAST
- Baylor
- Cincinnati
- Houston
- Iowa State
- Oklahoma State
- UCF
- West Virginia

And if BYU doesn't come you probably aim for Nevada or a California school.

 

[Dale]

WEST
- Boise State
- BYU
- Kansas
- Kansas State
- UNLV
- Texas Tech
- TCU

EAST
- Baylor
- Cincinnati
- Houston
- Iowa State
- Oklahoma State
- UCF
- West Virginia

And if BYU doesn't come you probably aim for Nevada or a California school.

Decent expansion targets. Couple others like Memphis, San Diego St. Those would be again the non chaos option.

To get back to the fun, I think reality if you’re Big 12 they will at least attempt at luring someone away. No amount of you’ll be our #1 selling will make a SEC team leave. I don’t think ACC either. So can you get a B1G or P-12 school to leave and who? Could you convince Fox that Nebraska is a big ticket and make amends? UC, Memphis, Nebraska, Houston. Those 4 fit perfectly geographically and athletically while worth picking up the phone financially. UCF is the other easy one. For the #14 grab the best football program in Boise? Maybe. Take a lottery ticket on USF like everyone tries to? One option I haven’t seen but how go wild and get someone to pump millions behind Liberty. Or scrap the east coast and say Utah and Colorado find a way out and lean into the Nebraska tradition with some SLC market thrown in.

 

[Ndaccountant]

I think both the Pac12 and remaining Big12 are cooked. I think people are underestimating the role ESPN is implicitly or explicitly playing here. Here are the facts....

• ESPN has lost ~10 million subscribers over the last 5 years....you think it's a coincidence many of the bigger name people have left?
• ESPN just spent hundreds of millions (reportedly $300M annually) to secure SEC game of the week media rights, not including the investment in the SEC network. Plain and simple, ESPN is "all in" on SEC as their overall top-line fees diminish, yet they are allocated more.
• Big Ten TV rights expire in 2023, one year before Pac 12 and 2 years before the Big 12
• There is no "anchor" left in the Big 12 and the Pac 12 Network has been a massive disappointment and is also losing subscribers annually. The Pac 12 is getting far less exposure (not a coincidence they have receded respect nationally) and the amount of cashflow to sink into programs is limited for most of their programs.
• NIL is likely to be tied to exposure and SEC currently has a leg up and that will certainly
• ND contract with NBC is up in 2025

Once UT/OU are gone, what value does the rest of the league bring? You think people are going to tune and watch Okie State play Kansas versus watching Auburn versus Oklahoma? Likewise, the Pac 12 has awful timing and will be picking up the scraps. Their own regional and "national" PAC12 network is about to be downsized or bailed on all together. If you are USC / Oregon and to a lesser extent, UW, you have to wonder if your football program can compete long term within the Pac 12.

The ACC isn't in a good spot either, really. Their TV deal is widely known as one of the worst and significantly lags both the Big 10 and the SEC. In 2020 FY, ACC had the lowest distribution to teams of the P5. So if you are, say, Florida State, Clemson, Miami, etc. you are looking over your shoulder and wondering if you can survive until 2036 when all the other schools in region have significantly more resources (hint, nope). Something major needs to happen with the ACC or they will end up like Big 12.

Big 10 meanwhile, is sitting in a nice spot all things considered. Their payouts are strong and the Big10 network remains viable. But, the gap to the SEC has shrunk financially and will continue to do so when Texas and OU join while the product on the field worsens as well from a conference standpoint. Ohio State has to be looking at the rest of the league and wondering if their perch at the top alongside Alabama is sustainable long term. They have picked off quite a bit of talent from Texas and the UT/OU news figures to make it harder to maintain that pipeline.

Who know where this goes next, but I have this suspicion that something else is afoot but ND is the piece to make it work. Here are some wild ideas to consider...

1) ND / ACC / Big 10 Merger - Very unlikely, but this could be the end point many years from now so just go it now?
2) ACC / Big Ten / ND announce a new arrangement for some wort of ACC / Big 10 challenge each year with exclusive rights from one provider
3) We see bigger schools test the independence waters (USC?) and wait out the inevitable 40-50 team super league that breaks from the NCAA
4) ND partners with a few select schools (additional independents?) to strike a richer TV rights deal with Amazon or Apple, aided in part by enhanced NIL for the players and guaranteed scheduling.
5) Clemson/FSU/Miami bails on the ACC and it dissolves, forcing ND into the Big 10 or SEC (most likely SEC).

I have this nagging feeling that Clemson is going to jettison out of the ACC and ND is going to have a really hard decision to make,

 

[ShamrockOnHelmet]

Since we are playing fantasy conferences…

what if Swarbrick went agro AF, talked NBC and/or Fox into paying double what SEC is getting, and decided to spearhead a new 20 team National Ultra conference with Clemson as anchors. They could blow up the PAC 12 with the lure of real money, get some like minded religious/private schools together, lure some of the unhappy schools from big boy conferences (Nebraska/ATM)…. Just spitballing

Washington
Cal
Stanford
USC
UCLA
BYU
Colorado
TCU
Baylor
Nebraska

ND
Miami
Clemson
Syracuse
Virginia Tech
Georgia Tech
ATM
Vandy
USF
UCF

 

[Irish#1]

Lot's of good thoughts guys. Wetzel could be wrong, but I doubt it. I can't see any reason for OSU to leave the B1G, unless the SEC crowns them king and provides major inducements and that's not going to happen. UT & OU will still be in the Big XII for a few more years, so a lot can change between now and then. Not sure how this plays out, but I have a suspicion that when it all shakes out Savvy Jack will end up doing something none of us saw coming.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Lot's of good thoughts guys. Wetzel could be wrong, but I doubt it. I can't see any reason for OSU to leave the B1G, unless the SEC crowns them king and provides major inducements and that's not going to happen. UT & OU will still be in the Big XII for a few more years, so a lot can change between now and then. Not sure how this plays out, but I have a suspicion that when it all shakes out Savvy Jack will end up doing something none of us saw coming.

I saw a report that UT and OU are aiming to play in the SEC as early as 2022.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I think both the Pac12 and remaining Big12 are cooked. I think people are underestimating the role ESPN is implicitly or explicitly playing here. Here are the facts....

• ESPN has lost ~10 million subscribers over the last 5 years....you think it's a coincidence many of the bigger name people have left?
• ESPN just spent hundreds of millions (reportedly $300M annually) to secure SEC game of the week media rights, not including the investment in the SEC network. Plain and simple, ESPN is "all in" on SEC as their overall top-line fees diminish, yet they are allocated more.
• Big Ten TV rights expire in 2023, one year before Pac 12 and 2 years before the Big 12
• There is no "anchor" left in the Big 12 and the Pac 12 Network has been a massive disappointment and is also losing subscribers annually. The Pac 12 is getting far less exposure (not a coincidence they have receded respect nationally) and the amount of cashflow to sink into programs is limited for most of their programs.
• NIL is likely to be tied to exposure and SEC currently has a leg up and that will certainly
• ND contract with NBC is up in 2025

Once UT/OU are gone, what value does the rest of the league bring? You think people are going to tune and watch Okie State play Kansas versus watching Auburn versus Oklahoma? Likewise, the Pac 12 has awful timing and will be picking up the scraps. Their own regional and "national" PAC12 network is about to be downsized or bailed on all together. If you are USC / Oregon and to a lesser extent, UW, you have to wonder if your football program can compete long term within the Pac 12.

The ACC isn't in a good spot either, really. Their TV deal is widely known as one of the worst and significantly lags both the Big 10 and the SEC. In 2020 FY, ACC had the lowest distribution to teams of the P5. So if you are, say, Florida State, Clemson, Miami, etc. you are looking over your shoulder and wondering if you can survive until 2036 when all the other schools in region have significantly more resources (hint, nope). Something major needs to happen with the ACC or they will end up like Big 12.

Big 10 meanwhile, is sitting in a nice spot all things considered. Their payouts are strong and the Big10 network remains viable. But, the gap to the SEC has shrunk financially and will continue to do so when Texas and OU join while the product on the field worsens as well from a conference standpoint. Ohio State has to be looking at the rest of the league and wondering if their perch at the top alongside Alabama is sustainable long term. They have picked off quite a bit of talent from Texas and the UT/OU news figures to make it harder to maintain that pipeline.

Who know where this goes next, but I have this suspicion that something else is afoot but ND is the piece to make it work. Here are some wild ideas to consider...

1) ND / ACC / Big 10 Merger - Very unlikely, but this could be the end point many years from now so just go it now?
2) ACC / Big Ten / ND announce a new arrangement for some wort of ACC / Big 10 challenge each year with exclusive rights from one provider
3) We see bigger schools test the independence waters (USC?) and wait out the inevitable 40-50 team super league that breaks from the NCAA
4) ND partners with a few select schools (additional independents?) to strike a richer TV rights deal with Amazon or Apple, aided in part by enhanced NIL for the players and guaranteed scheduling.
5) Clemson/FSU/Miami bails on the ACC and it dissolves, forcing ND into the Big 10 or SEC (most likely SEC).

I have this nagging feeling that Clemson is going to jettison out of the ACC and ND is going to have a really hard decision to make,

This is where I'm at. In terms of National presence and revenue generation, I think ND must be apart of the conversation with the other Power 5 football elites. If they go the Ivy League route....goodby NBC.

 

[Irish#1]

I saw a report that UT and OU are aiming to play in the SEC as early as 2022.

They say they are committed through the end of their agreement, but who knows? There may be some behind the door negotiations where they pay an early exit fee?

From CBS Sports

Texas and Oklahoma have officially begun their transition from the Big 12 to the SEC. The two schools announced Monday they will not renew their grant of rights agreement with the Big 12, though they plan to "honor their existing ... agreements" through the 2024-25 term.

 

[B1G20]

With the latest move of UT/OU, the SEC is preparing to break away from the NCAA, which of course was tipped off by the NIL ruling. As of now, I think another conference needs to make a really bold move to create a product that can compete with what the SEC is trying to build (which won't be easy). If the B10 doesn't try to counter this, I feel like every other conference slowly bleeds out while the SEC wins 9 out of the next 10 national titles.

The problem with depending on the ACC here long term is that #1, their membership is currently underpaid relative to the B1G/SEC, so they're likely to be vulnerable at some time in the next decade or so. #2, if consolidation continues longer term, there's no question in my mind that the next SEC targets will come from the ACC - UNC/Duke/UVA/Va Tech/Clemson/FSU/Miami would all have appeal. This is likely longer term though because the members of the ACC are locked into their current TV deal through 2035 - I don't see either the B1G or SEC poaching anyone from the ACC anytime soon. That said, I think the B10 has to respond to this move by the SEC.

The P12 and B10 align closely academically, long history between the two conferences. The current P12 media rights deal expires in 2023 and it's a mess. The top of the P12 is currently underpaid due largely to the bottom half of the conference not having fan bases that care much about watching college football in addition to the time zone issues. If the B10 partnered with the top schools in the P12 it fixes a number of problems - it gives the top members of the P12 conference distributions that help them compete in this new CFB landscape that's forming AND gives the P12 schools access to games in better time slots for CST/EST games.

I'm of the opinion that the only way something like this would work is if the B1G absorbed the entire top of the P12, so it would require the B10 to go to 20 for this to work. The P12's three most valuable properties are currently USC/Oregon/Washington without question, I'm unsure what the next two would be, probably UCLA #4? Here would be my recommend divisions in a 20 team B1G:

Great Lakes
Ohio State
Michigan
Michigan State
Purdue
Indiana

Great Plains
Wisconsin
Nebraska
Iowa
Minnesota
Illinois

Atlantic
Penn State
Notre Dame
Rutgers
Maryland
Northwestern

Pacific
Oregon
USC
Washington
UCLA
(Pick your 5th)

9 conference games - you play everyone in your division, then everyone in another division that rotates every year, so you play everyone in the conference home/home every 6 years. No convoluted crossovers - CCG ends up never being a rematch.

Honestly, if something like this doesn't happen, I don't see how, eventually, every helmet school isn't forced to submit to the SEC at it's terms in order to play football at the highest level. There needs to be a counter to the SEC's most recent move. The above is a true coast to coast national conference. If ND isn't interested, the B10 still needs to make the move but probably finish up with two P12 schools, then ND would probably be SEC bound once the SEC decided to expand beyond 16, and likely grab additional members from the ACC, killing it at some point in the future.

I think this UT/OU move is the biggest move in college football history and it's going to cause a lot of dominos to fall.

 

[Irish#1]

This is where I'm at. In terms of National presence and revenue generation, I think ND must be apart of the conversation with the other Power 5 football elites. If they go the Ivy League route....goodby NBC.

And goodbye ND FB. Can you do polls on this new site? I'd like to see a poll with some questions.

If ND were to join the Ivy League would you:
1. Continue to follow ND as passionately as you do today?
2. Continue to follow with moderate interest?
3. Just check the scores?
4. Find a new team to root for?
5. Lose most interest in CFB?

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

WV puts out a full page advert:
https://footballscoop.com/news/west-virginia-shane-lyons-statement-open-for-business-big-12-acc

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

They say they are committed through the end of their agreement, but who knows? There may be some behind the door negotiations where they pay an early exit fee?

From CBS Sports

They're saying that because they don't want to be accused of a breach of contract.

I suspect they're hoping realignment dismantles the remainder of the Big XII so they don't have worry about payouts to the conference. For the same reason, the rest of the Big XII has all the incentives to keep it together and fill out the conference with AAC and Mountain West teams.

 

[Dale]

The thing I’d be careful of is this assumption that ESPN keeps bumping up the # on payout. SEC schools make 45 million per year at the moment. Adding Texas and Oklahoma 100% will increase that. But at some point there’d have to be a theoretical cap to where ESPN says you know Miami you guys are great but we don’t see the #s resulting in X increase at this point. To top the Big Ten revenue distribution alone we are talking a billion dollar deal with 16 teams. Who is worth making that a 1.25 billion dollar deal because nobody is getting invited in unless the money is going up.

 

[GowerND11]

And goodbye ND FB. Can you do polls on this new site? I'd like to see a poll with some questions.

If ND were to join the Ivy League would you:
1. Continue to follow ND as passionately as you do today?
2. Continue to follow with moderate interest?
3. Just check the scores?
4. Find a new team to root for?
5. Lose most interest in CFB?

I think it would be a combination of 1, 2, and 5. I would certainly TRY to follow ND as passionately as I do today, but feel it would be hard to, so I'd end with moderate following/interest. Overall I would lose interest in CFB as a whole because ND wouldn't be part of this gross Super League that chased the dollars.

 

[NorthDakota]

And goodbye ND FB. Can you do polls on this new site? I'd like to see a poll with some questions.

If ND were to join the Ivy League would you:
1. Continue to follow ND as passionately as you do today?
2. Continue to follow with moderate interest?
3. Just check the scores?
4. Find a new team to root for?
5. Lose most interest in CFB?

3/5. I'm sorry but the Ivy League is boring.

 

[T Town Tommy]

IMO CFB will end up with some sort of two conferences with X number of teams. The B1G and SEC. Divisions based on geographic locations to try and preserve the regional aspect of the sport. The PAC 12 and ACC can’t sit still and expect to remain viable. I can see the B1G getting most of the PAC 12 while the SEC gets most of the ACC. Playoffs look similar to the NFL. As far as ND… their tv contract will not be enough to keep the Irish on even par with the top teams in the two conferences. That leaves the university to have to make a decision on just how much football is important to them. If I am Jack, I am probably calling the ACC to join now and then decide later which of the two super conferences best fit the Irish’s needs.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Lets just redraw the Mason Dixon line and have a North v South.

IMO there is only one answer and that is for the CFB to go to a NFL stlye layout and playoff format. Literally no one has a problem with the way the NFL determines its playoff teams. Create a series of divisions and play 12 games. Winners move on into seeded playoff format.

 

[Irish#1]

The thing I’d be careful of is this assumption that ESPN keeps bumping up the # on payout. SEC schools make 45 million per year at the moment. Adding Texas and Oklahoma 100% will increase that. But at some point there’d have to be a theoretical cap to where ESPN says you know Miami you guys are great but we don’t see the #s resulting in X increase at this point. To top the Big Ten revenue distribution alone we are talking a billion dollar deal with 16 teams. Who is worth making that a 1.25 billion dollar deal because nobody is getting invited in unless the money is going up.

Agree. While it's a lot of money, there's only so much to go around and only so much interest in CFB. ESPN can't afford to overpay. They would need to have a pretty good idea what that number is and not screw things up like they have the last 5-7 years.

IMO CFB will end up with some sort of two conferences with X number of teams. The B1G and SEC. Divisions based on geographic locations to try and preserve the regional aspect of the sport. The PAC 12 and ACC can’t sit still and expect to remain viable. I can see the B1G getting most of the PAC 12 while the SEC gets most of the ACC. Playoffs look similar to the NFL. As far as ND… their tv contract will not be enough to keep the Irish on even par with the top teams in the two conferences. That leaves the university to have to make a decision on just how much football is important to them. If I am Jack, I am probably calling the ACC to join now and then decide later which of the two super conferences best fit the Irish’s needs.

From an article on The Athletic.

But Notre Dame has long made the calculation that the financial gap between independence and conference membership is not significant enough to sacrifice the prestige, freedom and ownership that comes with being able to call its own shot. (Swarbrick told the South Bend Tribune last week that “we were as challenged financially as any school in the country” because of COVID-19, but it’s hard to see that lone year dictating the football program’s future identity.)

 

[GowerND11]

Lets just redraw the Mason Dixon line and have a North v South.

IMO there is only one answer and that is for the CFB to go to a NFL stlye layout and playoff format. Literally no one has a problem with the way the NFL determines its playoff teams. Create a series of divisions and play 12 games. Winners move on into seeded playoff format.

Bleck!

See you're right that no one has a problem with it... for the NFL. It just sucks seeing this stuff being talked about for CFB. The whole thing that makes CFB enjoyable to me is that it ISN'T the NFL. The more CFB looks like the NFL, the more it becomes not what made it special.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

And goodbye ND FB. Can you do polls on this new site? I'd like to see a poll with some questions.

If ND were to join the Ivy League would you:
1. Continue to follow ND as passionately as you do today?
2. Continue to follow with moderate interest?
3. Just check the scores?
4. Find a new team to root for?
5. Lose most interest in CFB?

No one is excited about the prospect of ND joining a new Ivy League. We all want to have our cake (maintain the student-athlete ideal, not let the tail (NDFB) wag the proverbial dog (UND), etc.) and eat it too (compete for national championships). But it's clear that those two goals are in conflict, and we may have to choose one over the other soon. Either way, it's bad news for the program.

 

[RDU Irish]

What is this narrow minded idea that we have to affiliate based on academics? Sure there is something to say about the culture of institutions getting along better in theory but Vanderbilt lives in the SEC for crying out loud. I don't really care if ND is in conference with Virginia and UNC versus Memphis and UCF. Hell, UNC makes a living out of shit classes for athletes, many of whom can't read. Measure these school by their lowest common denominator and UNC is worse than the SEC.

I imagine a huge point of unspoken concern in AD offices is Olympic sports. You think Illinois wants to send their softball and volleyball teams to USC regularly?

 

[GATTACA!]

Lets just redraw the Mason Dixon line and have a North v South.

IMO there is only one answer and that is for the CFB to go to a NFL stlye layout and playoff format. Literally no one has a problem with the way the NFL determines its playoff teams. Create a series of divisions and play 12 games. Winners move on into seeded playoff format.

I prefer the CFB model to the NFL playoffs. Part of the charm and interest in CFB is the debate and subjective nature of rankings. Going to a normal W/L seeding is a sure fire way to guarantee people stop caring about games that don't involve their team or someone in their division.

As a Browns fan I couldn't care less about LAR vs GB, DEN vs TB, etc.

As an ND fan I'll tune into basically any top 25 matchup or for any game involving a team ranked higher than ND.

 

[T Town Tommy]

But Notre Dame has long made the calculation that the financial gap between independence and conference membership is not significant enough to sacrifice the prestige, freedom and ownership that comes with being able to call its own shot. (Swarbrick told the South Bend Tribune last week that “we were as challenged financially as any school in the country” because of COVID-19, but it’s hard to see that lone year dictating the football program’s future identity.)

The Irish already lose money on their tv deal versus conference payouts. If the movement is towards two super conferences much like the NFL, the flexibility the Irish covets goes out the window unless they are willing to pony up tremendous amounts of $$ to sustain the football program. The SEC is looking at $1.3 billion by 2025 just by adding Texas and Oklahoma. Add in more top shelf schools and that money increases even more. If the Irish want to stay independent then they will have to spend their way silly to do so.

edit: guess I need to spend some more time out here learning the new layout.

 

[RDU Irish]

It's not just the extra money to the SEC - taking top brands out of the Big12 takes a disproportionate value away from that conference. ISU/KSU/OKST football has an exponential drop in value if they lose OU/Texas from their schedule whereas OU/Texas can replace those teams with just about anyone to retain at least equal value.

 

[NDRock]

What is this narrow minded idea that we have to affiliate based on academics? Sure there is something to say about the culture of institutions getting along better in theory but Vanderbilt lives in the SEC for crying out loud. I don't really care if ND is in conference with Virginia and UNC versus Memphis and UCF. Hell, UNC makes a living out of shit classes for athletes, many of whom can't read. Measure these school by their lowest common denominator and UNC is worse than the SEC.

I imagine a huge point of unspoken concern in AD offices is Olympic sports. You think Illinois wants to send their softball and volleyball teams to USC regularly?

True. Maybe just stay in regional conferences for Olympic sports and treat football (possibly basketball) completely different. It really is in a class by itself.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I prefer the CFB model to the NFL playoffs. Part of the charm and interest in CFB is the debate and subjective nature of rankings. Going to a normal W/L seeding is a sure fire way to guarantee people stop caring about games that don't involve their team or someone in their division.

As a Browns fan I couldn't care less about LAR vs GB, DEN vs TB, etc.

As an ND fan I'll tune into basically any top 25 matchup or for any game involving a team ranked higher than ND.

I agree on your prefrences and its mine as well but traditions and rivalries are playing second and third fiddle to revenue and tv contracts. I have said it for many years even through the BCS, the only fair way to determine a CFB national champion is to have a NFL style setup. NO need fora BCS, No need for a selection committee. Allow promotion and relegation would be super fun but ultimately and simply...everyone in a divison plays each other head to head. WInners move on. Losers do whatever.

 

[Irish#1]

But Notre Dame has long made the calculation that the financial gap between independence and conference membership is not significant enough to sacrifice the prestige, freedom and ownership that comes with being able to call its own shot. (Swarbrick told the South Bend Tribune last week that “we were as challenged financially as any school in the country” because of COVID-19, but it’s hard to see that lone year dictating the football program’s future identity.)

The Irish already lose money on their tv deal versus conference payouts. If the movement is towards two super conferences much like the NFL, the flexibility the Irish covets goes out the window unless they are willing to pony up tremendous amounts of $$ to sustain the football program. The SEC is looking at $1.3 billion by 2025 just by adding Texas and Oklahoma. Add in more top shelf schools and that money increases even more. If the Irish want to stay independent then they will have to spend their way silly to do so.

edit: guess I need to spend some more time out here learning the new layout.

Assuming UT & OU go to the SEC, when you look outside of the SEC and B1G, what are the top shelf schools that really bring cache? ND, Clemson, USC and FSU? Maybe Oregon and Miami, so there's not a lot to choose from. You could start a decent conference with those teams, then add some bottom feeders to fill it out.

 

[pumpdog20]

And goodbye ND FB. Can you do polls on this new site? I'd like to see a poll with some questions.

If ND were to join the Ivy League would you:
1. Continue to follow ND as passionately as you do today?
2. Continue to follow with moderate interest?
3. Just check the scores?
4. Find a new team to root for?
5. Lose most interest in CFB?

4 - a waste of a lot of time and money caring about the football team.

I was never smart enough, and I damn sure could never afford going to ND. I play along with the "yay, it's also a really good school too", but I couldn't care less. Join the army, don't die, and go to night school can also give you a comfortable life as well.