Sep 21 | Michigan State

pkt77242

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One thing I do not understand is not having the QB under center and having the RB closer to the LOS on 3rd and 1. If you only need 1 yard, it makes a lot more sense to quickly hit a hole created by your best two linemen, or wherever you see that you're dominating the most.

I would say on average in the pistol the RB is 6-8 yards from the line of scrimmage. In a standard single back formation with the QB under center the RB is 5-7 yards from the line of scrimmage. That isn't the reason we can't get the 1 yard. It is because our O-line can't get enough of a push.
 

GoIrish41

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Honestly they're not losing much when they're passing and only need one yard. There is still a ton of field to cover.

I don't even mind that they are passing. They are just completely letting the other team know that they are passing and not making them honor the run (which would make the passing game easier, I expect)
 

returnofthemack

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That doesn't bother me one bit, what bothered me was the lack of short routes in those situations.

Exactly. It seemed like every time we needed 1-3 yards to convert, we'd go to empty-set and bomb it downfield. Sure, there's nothing wrong with doing that once or twice, but that was constant throughout the game. I understand their DBs were playing very physically, but it's 3 yards! Why take the chance, just have some good short routes.
 

ulukinatme

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I'm also not surprised we were throwing on 3rd and 1. We tried running the ball in these situations a few times, and we weren't really getting a push. It's hard running the ball on teams when they're stacking the box. It opened up one on one matchups on the outside, which is why we were slinging it deep so much. I would have liked to see a RB in those situations though, or have Amir line up in the slot and maybe throw something out to the flat to get the 1st.

While Tommy didn't have a great game, he was careful with the ball yesterday and that was the difference. On the long passes he missed he kept it long and over the MSU defense as opposed to short. That may have been the difference, as MSU's "trick play" again ended up biting them in the butt for a 2nd straight year. The INT off the flea flicker set us up for the winning TD, huge turn of events for us.

I was disappointed with some of the fans calling in to the ND radio show as I was driving back from the game. A few were calling to bench Tommy, saying "Isn't this a good time to put Hendrix in?" Give me a break, this just seemed ridiculous. Hendrix only brings a somewhat more mobile option. That wouldn't have helped yesterday with MSU loading the box. Jack Nolan and Reggie Brooks pointed this out as well. They acknowledged that Tommy didn't have a great game, but that he still provides the best option at QB at this time. That was a tough defense that we faced yesterday, and all MSU was really giving us was the deep stuff on the outside. Passes over the middle weren't really open, and neither was the running game.
 

IrishLion

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While Tommy didn't have a great game, he was careful with the ball yesterday and that was the difference. On the long passes he missed he kept it long and over the MSU defense as opposed to short. That may have been the difference, as MSU's "trick play" again ended up biting them in the butt for a 2nd straight year. The INT off the flea flicker set us up for the winning TD, huge turn of events for us.

So much this. 2011 Tommy throws 2+ INTs by shorting the ball with that gameplan. Of course, there were a few throws where he was TOO careful in putting the ball long, and a few throws that he simply missed. But for the most part, it looked like he was willing to overshoot rather than throw an INT, which was nice to see.
 

dublinirish

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<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/Pkm0l2-9qrU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

irish1958

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I'm also not surprised we were throwing on 3rd and 1. We tried running the ball in these situations a few times, and we weren't really getting a push. It's hard running the ball on teams when they're stacking the box. It opened up one on one matchups on the outside, which is why we were slinging it deep so much. I would have liked to see a RB in those situations though, or have Amir line up in the slot and maybe throw something out to the flat to get the 1st.

While Tommy didn't have a great game, he was careful with the ball yesterday and that was the difference. On the long passes he missed he kept it long and over the MSU defense as opposed to short. That may have been the difference, as MSU's "trick play" again ended up biting them in the butt for a 2nd straight year. The INT off the flea flicker set us up for the winning TD, huge turn of events for us.

I was disappointed with some of the fans calling in to the ND radio show as I was driving back from the game. A few were calling to bench Tommy, saying "Isn't this a good time to put Hendrix in?" Give me a break, this just seemed ridiculous. Hendrix only brings a somewhat more mobile option. That wouldn't have helped yesterday with MSU loading the box. Jack Nolan and Reggie Brooks pointed this out as well. They acknowledged that Tommy didn't have a great game, but that he still provides the best option at QB at this time. That was a tough defense that we faced yesterday, and all MSU was really giving us was the deep stuff on the outside. Passes over the middle weren't really open, and neither was the running game.

Well, on at least one of those 3rd and short, Amir was wide open about ten yards downfield and TR threw long and incomplete. Also, not having something open over the middle short is often a function of the play called. You have five receivers; if three are retained to block and two are sent long there will be nobody to throw to short unless the play breaks down and the QB extends the play long enough to let somebody break open short.
 

Irish#1

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Some observations........

1. The pistol isn't the best set to run from in a short yardage situation. The depth of RB is about the same, but sitting behind the QB, he cannot get a good look at the defensive positions until he's getting the ball. The RB also comes out of their stance a little slower because they're waiting on the ball more.

2. I agree we went deep too many times on short yardage situations.

3. Also noticed when we started running the jet sweep motion, we were able to run the ball more effectively. That motion forced one defender to move out of the box and also made the D think about moving laterally instead of straight ahead.

4. MSU was sitting on the bubble screen. Last night, the Steeles ran the bubble screen then went back to it, but this time, Big Ben faked the throw and the WR blocking took off down the sideline and was wide open. I hope Kelly happened to catch that last night. I can see that working for us.
 

dublinirish

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4. MSU was sitting on the bubble screen. Last night, the Steeles ran the bubble screen then went back to it, but this time, Big Ben faked the throw and the WR blocking took off down the sideline and was wide open. I hope Kelly happened to catch that last night. I can see that working for us.

Been saying this all season man, it does not make sense to have a play in your playbook that does not have a counter to said play attached to it. On the bright side Dan Smith got a pass thrown to him, that was huge lol
 

PANDFAN

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>I was embarrassed how quiet we ND fans were yesterday. Disappointing display of support for our team.</p>— Chris Salvi (@CSalvi24) <a href="https://twitter.com/CSalvi24/statuses/381870800250212352">September 22, 2013</a></blockquote>
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TheSunIsRising

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>I was embarrassed how quiet we ND fans were yesterday. Disappointing display of support for our team.</p>— Chris Salvi (@CSalvi24) <a href="https://twitter.com/CSalvi24/statuses/381870800250212352">September 22, 2013</a></blockquote>
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I gather that Chris doesn't venture into the game day threads. Far from quiet
 

returnofthemack

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The game was boring as hell. If the students are bored and not cheering, the rest of the stadium sure as hell isn't.
 

Irish Houstonian

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This was the highest rated game on Saturday. That doesn't say a whole-lot, but it did beat Tennessee-Florida, and all of the time-slots filled with the combined regional games.
 
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