Police State USA

[ACamp1900]

Fun with speculation....

 

[Booslum31]

Don't run from the cops and don't resist arrest. Might be a good idea not to do the crime in the first place...just sayin'

 

[Cackalacky]

Merged into existing Polic State thread. Lets use this one for all the would be police on public crimes. No need to have a billion separate threads.

 

[ACamp1900]

Cack ain't nothin but the white man's dog....

 

[IrishLax]

We'll see what the video shows, but seems like textbook good police work.

 

[Cackalacky]

Cack ain't nothin but the white man's dog....

 

[Bluto]

Don't run from the cops and don't resist arrest. Might be a good idea not to do the crime in the first place...just sayin'

Kind of like Tommy Reese...oh wait...yet he's still alive and even managed to play the following season.

This isn't a commentary on this latest incident rather the dismissive and overly simplistic comments that often follow like the one above.

 

[kmoose]

Kind of like Tommy Reese...oh wait...yet he's still alive and even managed to play the following season.

This isn't a commentary of this latest incident rather the dismissive and overly simplistic comments that often follow like the one above.

The problem is that they (comments) usually follow equally simplistic and predictable comments about the police being at fault for a death.

 

[phgreek]

Kind of like Tommy Reese...oh wait...yet he's still alive and even managed to play the following season.

This isn't a commentary of this latest incident rather the dismissive and overly simplistic comments that often follow like the one above.

So police chase a (possibly) armed guy into the woods...

and he is subdued with pepper spray...

What about any of that seems odd?

To me its odd they took pepper spray to a possible gun fight to be quite honest.

The fact that he died requires further investigation, because who dies from pepper spray?

So yea, I'd want to know the things an autopsy would tell us.

But on the surface this looks like cops used restraint, and did so at great peril to themselves...peril beyond what I'd ask of them.

The comparison to TR is not reasonable. No one said he had a gun, and while what he did was worthy of an ass beating, he was apprehended in the open where officers could see and account for all threats. Had nothing to do with skin color, and it is BS to simply compare outcomes...ie white guy lived, black guy died w/o any other circumstances.

 

[Irish Insanity]

So police chase a (possibly) armed guy into the woods...

and he is subdued with pepper spray...

What about any of that seems odd?

To me its odd they took pepper spray to a possible gun fight to be quite honest.

The fact that he died requires further investigation, because who dies from pepper spray?

So yea, I'd want to know the things an autopsy would tell us.

But on the surface this looks like cops used restraint, and did so at great peril to themselves...peril beyond what I'd ask of them.

The comparison to TR is not reasonable. No one said he had a gun, and while what he did was worthy of an ass beating, he was apprehended in the open where officers could see and account for all threats. Had nothing to do with skin color, and it is BS to simply compare outcomes...ie white guy lived, black guy died w/o any other circumstances.

I agree with your post as a whole.

But seriously? Tommy didn't have a gun. He's got a fucking cannon. Way more dangerous.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

So police chase a (possibly) armed guy into the woods...

and he is subdued with pepper spray...

What about any of that seems odd?

To me its odd they took pepper spray to a possible gun fight to be quite honest.

The fact that he died requires further investigation, because who dies from pepper spray?

So yea, I'd want to know the things an autopsy would tell us.

But on the surface this looks like cops used restraint, and did so at great peril to themselves...peril beyond what I'd ask of them.

The comparison to TR is not reasonable. No one said he had a gun, and while what he did was worthy of an ass beating, he was apprehended in the open where officers could see and account for all threats. Had nothing to do with skin color, and it is BS to simply compare outcomes...ie white guy lived, black guy died w/o any other circumstances.

Yeah. At first glance, this was all reasonable. I reserve the right to change my mind if/when more information comes out, but this doesn't seem to be a "bad cop" issue.

 

[Bluto]

The problem is that they (comments) usually follow equally simplistic and predictable comments about the police being at fault for a death.

I agree to a certain extent. It's pretty clear that the police in many parts of the country have had a history of violent behavior towards certain segments of the population so frankly it's about time they started being held to a higher standard. I think the increased use of body cams and people recording the police is a good start.

 

[Bluto]

So police chase a (possibly) armed guy into the woods...

and he is subdued with pepper spray...

What about any of that seems odd?

To me its odd they took pepper spray to a possible gun fight to be quite honest.

The fact that he died requires further investigation, because who dies from pepper spray?

So yea, I'd want to know the things an autopsy would tell us.

But on the surface this looks like cops used restraint, and did so at great peril to themselves...peril beyond what I'd ask of them.

The comparison to TR is not reasonable. No one said he had a gun, and while what he did was worthy of an ass beating, he was apprehended in the open where officers could see and account for all threats. Had nothing to do with skin color, and it is BS to simply compare outcomes...ie white guy lived, black guy died w/o any other circumstances.

A guy is dead after being apprehended by the police. From my perspective that should allways seem a bit odd. What I was taking issue with was the poster whom I quoted and his rediculous commentary that implied that if you listen to the cops and the end result will be A. If not you deserve B.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Pepper spray and tear gas - Medic Wiki

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), exposure to riot control agents causes:

Eyes: excessive tearing, burning, blurred vision, redness
Nose: runny nose, burning, swelling
Mouth: burning, irritation, difficulty swallowing, drooling
Lungs: chest tightness, coughing, choking sensation, noisy breathing (wheezing), shortness of breath
Skin: burns, rash
Other: nausea and vomiting

According to my experience (after marching around in a room full of said gas with a mask on and then being required under lawful order to remove the mask) any such debilitating agent's affects are subject to quantity of substance, and area of containment. In other words a small amount sprayed in a close area is a lot more than a huge quantity sprayed in an open area with a breeze.

I was always interested in finding out how bad the medical effects were because they had beaucoup corpsmen and medical resources available, and the best information I received was gas, plus body compression equal bad results. In other words, gassing an individual, then pinning them down and applying pressure that doesn't allow the person to breathe and expel the agent is what leads to the worst medical results. Maybe someone else could add to this, or clarify further what I have said.

But getting back to this latest situation; shiit happens. It is a thin blue line precisely because of the numbers involved. There are fewer police and more perpetrators, and the decisions that an officer makes usually involves life or death, and also usually has to be made in split seconds.

That being said, we have no idea what happened in this situation. But one thing we can know is that it is mindlessly naïve to think that any person who is subject to the complaint of being unlawfully armed, and has warrants for his arrest, is going to comply with the first officer on the scene. It ain't going to happen.

So speculation is great, as in a waste of time. This could be anything from a person with an unknown heart condition, (there was a great athlete from Toledo, with a full ride locked in at tOSU, who was playing pickup basketball with some friends that dropped dead of a massive coronary, days before his high school graduation,) to something untoward. We may as well wait until the investigation concludes. I find it a bit smarmy to count the "color" of the officers involved.

 

[BGIF]

According to my experience (after marching around in a room full of said gas with a mask on and then being required under lawful order to remove the mask) any such debilitating agent's affects are subject to quantity of substance, and area of containment. In other words a small amount sprayed in a close area is a lot more than a huge quantity sprayed in an open area with a breeze.

...

Sounds like my Basic Training with CS in the last millennium.

Trainees who had recent Upper Respiratory Infections, URIs, were marched into the confined room with the gas but were ordered NOT to remove their gas mask when the others did as the CS could aggravate compromised respiratory systems.

 

[BGIF]

... I find it a bit smarmy to count the "color" of the officers involved.

I read 4 or 5 news clips before making the O.P. Only one article mentioned the number of cops involved and noted their diversity. As it was only in one article, I assumed it was in reply to a reporter's question about the composition of the responders not part of the PD statement. I looked but didn't find a transcript.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

I read 4 or 5 news clips before making the O.P. Only one article mentioned the number of cops involved and noted their diversity. As it was only in one article, I assumed it was in reply to a reporter's question about the composition of the responders not part of the PD statement. I looked but didn't find a transcript.

That is it! It is exactly how reporters sell stories, and create cesspool conditions around tragic events. Would love to see that guy's article! (No mater what the situation, the loss of human life makes it a tragic situation.) Instead, the mechanism rolls to our baser thoughts and beliefs. I figured since someone posted it in the thread, it has all ready been blanketed and broadcast by the media.

(As always, if my comment were directed at an IE poster, I would let them know.)

 

[kmoose]

I agree to a certain extent. It's pretty clear that the police in many parts of the country have had a history of violent behavior towards certain segments of the population so frankly it's about time they started being held to a higher standard. I think the increased use of body cams and people recording the police is a good start.

If by "a higher standard", you mean that they should drop the "us versus the world" mentality, then I agree. If by "a higher standard", you mean that they should have to wait until someone puts two in their chest or the chest of their partner, before resorting to violence to apprehend a subject; or that they should be expected to be some kind of Bruce Lee or Steven Seagal, and be able to disarm every perp with their superior martial arts skills; or that they should needlessly put themselves in a position of more danger than is normal for their profession; or that they should not enforce the law because of some perceived injustice, then I disagree.

 

[pumpdog20]

Sounds like my Basic Training with CS in the last millennium.

Trainees who had recent Upper Respiratory Infections, URIs, were marched into the confined room with the gas but were ordered NOT to remove their gas mask when the others did as the CS could aggravate compromised respiratory systems.

That part of basic was great, because it was right in the middle (where everyone is sick due to being confined in the barracks). Cleans all the snot out.

 

[pkt77242]

New York City settles Eric Garner case for $5.9 million

 

[Bogtrotter07]

That part of basic was great, because it was right in the middle (where everyone is sick due to being confined in the barracks). Cleans all the snot out.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/1DwMmA0ZLYA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Fun with the Army : You can tell because they said "drill sergeant," the background was not a subtropical paradise, nor was it the "lush rolling hills of Pendleton," and these guys are pussys!

Now for the Misguided Children :

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/0uXUZK6KzdQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mother Green holds her own!

Actually, it is much easier these days. I asked an old acquaintance why and he looked at me and said, "Then they were told it was relatively harmless. And they could get away with fucking up a recruit."

 

[pkt77242]

Officer charged with murder in Ohio motorist's death

 

[ShawneeIrish]

I hope Cincinnati makes it through this without riots. Glad to see a prosecutor who not only seeks an indictment but denounces the cop rather than make excuses for him. Police brutality, the war on drugs, and systemic racism must be addressed and sought to be brought to an end. Much like in S Carolina and Eric Garner in NY (though the shameful prosecutor there did not get an indictment) there is video evidence of a cop committing murder, but how many police shootings of unarmed black men been a similar situation only nothing happened because of lack of video?

 

[IrishLax]

I hope Cincinnati makes it through this without riots. Glad to see a prosecutor who not only seeks an indictment but denounces the cop rather than make excuses for him. Police brutality, the war on drugs, and systemic racism must be addressed and sought to be brought to an end. Much like in S Carolina and Eric Garner in NY (though the shameful prosecutor there did not get an indictment) there is video evidence of a cop committing murder, but how many police shootings of unarmed black men been a similar situation only nothing happened because of lack of video?

Which is why body cams are good for everyone. Let's say the opposite happened and the victim DID try to run the cop over... the video would exonerate the cop and likely prevent civil unrest.

Video helps get justice for all parties.

 

[kmoose]

I hope Cincinnati makes it through this without riots. Glad to see a prosecutor who not only seeks an indictment but denounces the cop rather than make excuses for him. Police brutality, the war on drugs, and systemic racism must be addressed and sought to be brought to an end. Much like in S Carolina and Eric Garner in NY (though the shameful prosecutor there did not get an indictment) there is video evidence of a cop committing murder, but how many police shootings of unarmed black men been a similar situation only nothing happened because of lack of video?

Are you saying that Walmart should be allowed to sell heroin?

 

[Grahambo]

Which is why body cams are good for everyone. Let's say the opposite happened and the victim DID try to run the cop over... the video would exonerate the cop and likely prevent civil unrest.

Video helps get justice for all parties.

Yup.

I've been in the same scenario as that cop and I still can't figure the hell was going through the cop's head. I really can't. A minor situation at best.

 

[Buster Bluth]

Are you saying that Walmart should be allowed to sell heroin?

Wat.

 

[Grahambo]

Wat.

Target to sell LSD.

 

[kmoose]

Wat.

Just trying to gauge what exactly he means by "the war on drugs"....

 

[Cackalacky]

Just trying to gauge what exactly he means by "the war on drugs"....

I assume he meant what everyone means by it. A massively failed policy attempting to reign in drug use which only led to a massive increase in violence and taxpayer money spent that is also disproportionately enforced in minority communities.