General team info

[irish2018]

development of quarterback play at notre dame

development of quarterback play at notre dame

we have seen many lads regress from freshman year

are we recruiting the position properly ?
and/or lack of development once they hit campus?

 

[Irish YJ]

Sorry - Conflated your post with so many before it (not from you) that have nothing but excuses for Wimbush and can't acknowledge he is not a good QB who has had plenty of time to develop. You are fair in pointing out his many of his limitations however I think he is a good athlete - not exceptional. Exaggerating his athleticism is creeping up my list of pet peeves.

I don't see the high ceiling others see. I see someone serviceable in defeating over-matched opponents. For quality opponents I think he is easily schemed for and shut down. I also don't think he gets the most out of his teammates - some might call that leadership. Wreaks of the Malik Zaire love affair that IMO held this team back vs. giving the reigns to the guy in the NFL now.

I think he's an exceptional athlete, and I'll battle you all day on that lol.

Once he's in the open field, he's as good as anybody... QB, RB, WR, or otherwise, IMO.

If you define "exceptional athlete" by being a lights out runner from the QB position, then I would agree he's exceptional based solely on his running skills. If you mix in any of the passing traits, then not so much.

His lack of passing skills really hurt the team, but his running can really help.... sucks...
I've said it before, I'd be OK with a true 2-QB system (which I normally hate) because of his running ability. But, I'd at least like to see what Book can do in a normal starting situation. I don't think you have to be a freakish runner to be successful as an ND QB. And Book was more than adequate based on his HS stats.

 

[NDdomer2]

If you define "exceptional athlete" by being a lights out runner from the QB position, then I would agree he's exceptional based solely on his running skills. If you mix in any of the passing traits, then not so much.

His lack of passing skills really hurt the team, but his running can really help.... sucks...
I've said it before, I'd be OK with a true 2-QB system (which I normally hate) because of his running ability. But, I'd at least like to see what Book can do in a normal starting situation. I don't think you have to be a freakish runner to be successful as an ND QB. And Book was more than adequate based on his HS stats.

Does being an exceptional athlete require ball throwing?

I guess Jaylon Smith was just an athlete...

 

[Irish YJ]

Does being an exceptional athlete require ball throwing?

I guess Jaylon Smith was just an athlete...

Like I said, it's based on how you define it. Is it just speed? Vertical? Mix of those and stats? Justin Brent for example was an incredible athlete in terms of physical traits. So were a lot of others that never saw the field. One could say that every scholarship commit on our team is an exceptional athlete in a way. Seriously asking... how should it be defined?

 

[NDdomer2]

Like I said, it's based on how you define it. Is it just speed? Vertical? Mix of those and stats? Justin Brent for example was an incredible athlete in terms of physical traits. So were a lot of others that never saw the field. One could say that every scholarship commit on our team is an exceptional athlete in a way. Seriously asking... how should it be defined?

Well I dont know the perfect answer but I don't think proficiency of throwing the football is in my definition. Otherwise ONLY quarterbacks would ever qualify, and the world has too many exceptional athletes to say that.

If throwing the football is included, I guess the entire NBA, NHL, MLB, and Olympians are all below exceptional as athletes.

 

[Irish YJ]

Well I dont know the perfect answer but I don't think proficiency of throwing the football is in my definition. Otherwise ONLY quarterbacks would ever qualify, and the world has too many exceptional athletes to say that.

If throwing the football is included, I guess the entire NBA, NHL, MLB, and Olympians are all below exceptional as athletes.

I'm curious to see how good BW would be as a RB. Would he still be freakish, or just like any other RB?

What I'm getting at, is that I struggle with the definition. Is it general (measurables), or is it based on position requirements? Jaylon for instance had great measurables, but also had great production/stats based on his position.

 

[NDdomer2]

I'm curious to see how good BW would be as a RB. Would he still be freakish, or just like any other RB?

What I'm getting at, is that I struggle with the definition. Is it general (measurables), or is it based on position requirements? Jaylon for instance had great measurables, but also had great production/stats based on his position.

To each their own to be defined but I feel like IL was just talking as a general offensive player completely taking position out of it, what can he do with ball in hand.

As far as strictly a RB, you're going to get into splitting hairs again. I think majority of IE would tell you Dex > Adams as athlete but one got the workload and the other didn't.

Or is Sproles the better athlete than say Gurley?

Tom Brady vs Lamar Jackson?

it's all subjective and always will be.

 

[stlnd01]

I’d be surprised if Wimbush is an exceptional running back. Yes he’s fast, but his talent as a runner is in improvisation, which suits a QB more than a receive-the-handoff RB. Also he’s not built to be a primary RB.

As for athletic skills, Wimbush has a big arm. Much stronger downfield than Book (at least what we saw of Book last year). Just doesn’t see the field and/or make his reads well enough, and the accuracy issues which may or may not be related. I still hope he can get through it, because he has the highest ceiling. But at this point I’d understand if they want to change things up.

 

[Irish YJ]

I’d be surprised if Wimbush is an exceptional running back. Yes he’s fast, but his talent as a runner is in improvisation, which suits a QB more than a receive-the-handoff RB. Also he’s not built to be a primary RB.

As for athletic skills, Wimbush has a big arm. Much stronger downfield than Book (at least what we saw of Book last year). Just doesn’t see the field and/or make his reads well enough, and the accuracy issues which may or may not be related. I still hope he can get through it, because he has the highest ceiling. But at this point I’d understand if they want to change things up.

Very close to the same height/weight as Josh Adams per the roster.

Wimbush has a rocket for an arm, just no guidance system..... Man can not live on 50/50 balls alone.

 

[RDU Irish]

If he is so exceptional an athlete he is better served making a splash at RB/WR now rather than later. Terrelle Pryor or Arnaz Battle or Antwaan Randle El or Braxton Miller come to mind. If he is exceptional he will be impossible to keep off the field in that capacity. I just don't see him on QUITE the same level as those guys athletically. Splitting hairs but that is the difference b/w good/very good athlete and exceptional, IMO.

As a QB - he is a senior, he has had plenty of time to develop. Just isn't there. Russell Wilson he is not (better athletic comp than Cam Newton or Lamar Jackson).

 

[calvegas04]

USA today has ND vs UFC in the Fiesta bowl.... a big nope from me on that one

 

[Dizzyphil]

sh!t


https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...bars-ruled-out-for-season-with-a-knee-injury/

 

[Dizzyphil]

This tweet.............




<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wins over current AP Top 25 teams<br>SEC: 4<br>Notre Dame: 2<br>Pac-12: 2<br>Big 10: 2<br>Big 12: 1<br>BYU: 1<br>Conference USA: 1<br>ACC: 0</p>— Pete Sampson (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/1046561098902773760?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[IrishFanJMercy]

I honestly don’t see this team losing two games left on the schedule that means a two loss ND team should be in a major bowl game worst case

 

[stlnd01]

I honestly don’t see this team losing two games left on the schedule that means a two loss ND team should be in a major bowl game worst case

We'll see. Things have a history of going haywire for this program come November. But I agree right now 10-2 feels more like a floor than a ceiling. And 10-2 should put us in an NY6 bowl.

 

[NDMIA]

ESPN FPI Projected Opponent Win Chance by Percentage

10/6 @VT 35.4%
11/24 @USC 33.5%
11/17 vs Syracuse 21.7%
11/3 @Northwestern 19.5%
11/10 FSU 8.3%
10/13 Pitt 4.0%
10/27 vs Navy 3.2%

Luckily the VT game comes with Pitt, BYE, and Navy in the three weeks afterwards so it can be a time to build up backup roles, get injuries healed, and get the team revved up for November. FSU, Cuse, and USC in three consecutive weeks will be a fun test. It’ll be interesting to see if the changes implemented in conditioning and training regimens will have an affect on the late season finish. I think ND has a solid shot at the playoffs this year!

 

[Valpodoc85]

Seems like the academic grind always starts to bite late October early November. Just a bit worried about the Northwestern game. Not missing sleep worried, but will be happy on November 4th.

 

[IrishFanJMercy]

Biggest thing going forward is praying the team stays injury free. Let's get out of this next weekend without any significant injuries and then Pitt should be an easy game. Then we get a bye week to rest our guys

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

Biggest thing going forward is praying the team stays injury free. Let's get out of this next weekend without any significant injuries and then Pitt should be an easy game. Then we get a bye week to rest our guys

It's like you've never watched a Notre Dame v. Pitt game before....WTH, man.

 

[ulukinatme]

It's like you've never watched a Notre Dame v. Pitt game before....WTH, man.

This. Pitt SHOULD be an easy game, but it rarely is.

2015: 42-30 ND Win (Although in this case it was two late Pitt TDs that made it somewhat close.
2013: 28-21 Pitt Win
2012: 29-26 ND Win Overtime. This was the game we should have lost, but the refs bailed us out.
2011: 15-12 ND Win.
2010: 23-17 ND Win.
2009: 27-22 Pitt Win.
2008: 36-33 Pitt Win Overtime
2005: 42-21 ND Win
2004: 41-38 Pitt Win
2003: 20-14 ND Win.

So, over the last 15 years of Pitt games we've beaten them by more than one score twice: 2015 and Weis' first game in 2005. What's more, Pitt has pulled out the win 4 out of the 10 games. Bottom line, they will probably come strapped in and will play us tough, this is never a gimmie.

 

[Irish Insanity]

This tweet.............




<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wins over current AP Top 25 teams<br>SEC: 4<br>Notre Dame: 2<br>Pac-12: 2<br>Big 10: 2<br>Big 12: 1<br>BYU: 1<br>Conference USA: 1<br>ACC: 0</p>— Pete Sampson (@PeteSampson_) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteSampson_/status/1046561098902773760?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Our 2 wins are against top 15 teams as well. I believe the SEC only has 2 total wins in the top 15.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

This. Pitt SHOULD be an easy game, but it rarely is.

2015: 42-30 ND Win (Although in this case it was two late Pitt TDs that made it somewhat close.
2013: 28-21 Pitt Win
2012: 29-26 ND Win Overtime. This was the game we should have lost, but the refs bailed us out.
2011: 15-12 ND Win.
2010: 23-17 ND Win.
2009: 27-22 Pitt Win.
2008: 36-33 Pitt Win Overtime
2005: 42-21 ND Win
2004: 41-38 Pitt Win
2003: 20-14 ND Win.

So, over the last 15 years of Pitt games we've beaten them by more than one score twice: 2015 and Weis' first game in 2005. What's more, Pitt has pulled out the win 4 out of the 10 games. Bottom line, they will probably come strapped in and will play us tough, this is never a gimmie.

I understand the historical perspective, but this is the best ND team I've seen in my lifetime (I'm 33). Given there may have been teams that were better offensively when Weis went to back to back BCS Games, but I'm not even sure they were better offensively. The moral of my story is that this team is good in all phases, and I legit never thought I'd say that about ST.

 

[RDU Irish]

IMO:
Top 25 Offense (now)
Top 10 Defense
Top 25 Special Teams

How many teams are Top 25 in all three phases of the game? Don't discount special teams - top notch punter and a reliable FG kicker with range are easily taken for granted.

 

[ulukinatme]

I understand the historical perspective, but this is the best ND team I've seen in my lifetime (I'm 33). Given there may have been teams that were better offensively when Weis went to back to back BCS Games, but I'm not even sure they were better offensively. The moral of my story is that this team is good in all phases, and I legit never thought I'd say that about ST.

Someone said the same thing back in 2012, and that Irish team was pretty good too. Moral of the story is never count Pitt as an easy win, my only solace is that game isn't in November this time.

 

[ACamp1900]

There were some great teams in the early 1990s... This 'feels' like the best team in the Kelly era though for sure.

 

[notredomer23]

This. Pitt SHOULD be an easy game, but it rarely is.

2015: 42-30 ND Win (Although in this case it was two late Pitt TDs that made it somewhat close. 8 wins
2013: 28-21 Pitt Win 7 wins
2012: 29-26 ND Win Overtime. This was the game we should have lost, but the refs bailed us out. 6 wins
2011: 15-12 ND Win. 6 wins
2010: 23-17 ND Win. 8 wins
2009: 27-22 Pitt Win. 10 wins
2008: 36-33 Pitt Win Overtime 9 wins
2005: 42-21 ND Win 5 wins
2004: 41-38 Pitt Win 8 wins
2003: 20-14 ND Win. 8 wins

So, over the last 15 years of Pitt games we've beaten them by more than one score twice: 2015 and Weis' first game in 2005. What's more, Pitt has pulled out the win 4 out of the 10 games. Bottom line, they will probably come strapped in and will play us tough, this is never a gimmie.

They've played us close historically or beaten us, but any time they've done that, they've been at least a .500 team. This season, they are looking like a 4 win team, at best. They are really bad.

 

[stlnd01]

Brett McMurphy picks us to make the playoffs. First I’ve seen that from a major writer, I think.

https://watchstadium.com/news/brett...k-5-10-01-2018/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Stewart Mandel now has us in the Peach against... Kentucky. If we win would that count as beating an SEC team, or nah?

 

[GowerND11]

Brett McMurphy picks us to make the playoffs. First I’ve seen that from a major writer, I think.

https://watchstadium.com/news/brett...k-5-10-01-2018/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Stewart Mandel now has us in the Peach against... Kentucky. If we win would that count as beating an SEC team, or nah?

Wouldn't that just be ND's luck? We (fans) have been begging for a favorable NY6 game for how long, and we finally get it... against Kentucky. No not, Iowa or Wisconsin, not a Pac-12 team we can move the ball against that is generally usually decent, but we match up against. Nope... Kentucky.

 

[irish2018]

I think this 2018 team is better than the 2012 team already
And the 2018 team could improve from here as well.
QB, Offensive productivity, depth on both sides of the ball are the drivers.

 

[RDU Irish]

I think this 2018 team is better than the 2012 team already
And the 2018 team could improve from here as well.
QB, Offensive productivity, depth on both sides of the ball are the drivers.

2012 Top tacklers in order:
Manti (senior)
Zeke Motta (senior)
Bennett Jackson (junior)
Fox (senior)
Russell (frosh)
Shembo (junior)
Nix (junior)
Farley (soph)
Calabrese (senior)
Tuitt (soph)
KLM (5th)
Spond (junior)
Day (frosh)
Williams, Ishaq (soph)
Grace (soph)
Springmann (soph)
Councell (soph)
Moore (junior)
Shumate (frosh)
Slaughter (5th injured three games in)

I think Farley emerged due to Slaughter's injury - that was a near disaster. Behind Jackson/Russell we didn't have much. LB was cobbled together - outside of Manti who would even be on our two deep now? OLB - Shembo and Ishaq driving the pass rush with Councell and Spond playing out of necessity as much as anything? Love Nix/KLM/Tuitt but Kona was spelling Nix and freshman Day with soph Springmann to spell KLM/Tuitt.


Love/Pride/Vaughn > Jackson/Russell at worst =
Gilman/Elliott/Coleman/Griffith > Motta/Farley - Slaughter got hurt- who did we even bring in for nickle?
Coney/Tranquill/Bilal > Teo/Foxabrese/Spond/Shembo - is Manti enough to raise the group over what we have now?
Tillery/Bonner/Hayes/Okwara/Kareem > KLM/Nix/Tuitt/Schwenke/Day - at worst =