Congress Vs Washington Redskins

[irishff1014]

Members of Congress urge Washington Redskins to change name - ESPN

First of Congress has enough to be dealing with to have their nose in sports.

2nd if i was Snyder when i said i wasn't changing the name and Congress finally goes high to enforce a name change because they will. I would tell tell i will change the name as well as location.

 

[IrishRugger2013]

Members of Congress urge Washington Redskins to change name - ESPN

First of Congress has enough to be dealing with to have their nose in sports.

2nd if i was Snyder when i said i wasn't changing the name and Congress finally goes high to enforce a name change because they will. I would tell tell i will change the name as well as location.

I would be pissed if they changed the name. Glad Snyder refuses to change it, he's finally doing some good for the Skins

 

[A Pac]

This is the kind of stuff that pisses me off. As a Cleveland Indians fan, I see no reason to change the name. Redskin fans should be no different. If they were called the Cleveland Savages or Washington Feather Heads they would have a point. However Indians and Redskins aren't offensive to me. Of course, I'm not Native American. I have heard several people with Native blood that find the sport team names as a sign of respect and homage to their culture. Politicians need to realize that changing the names of sports teams isn't going to erase the horrible history of how Native Americans were treated in this country.

 

[chicago51]

Redskin:

An offensive and derogatory term refering to native americans. Comes from when the government paid for each 'indian' one killed. Instead of carrying the bodies they would take the scalps to prove they had murdered a native american.

Urban Dictionary: redskin

Are there any native American posters on IE? I would like to get their take on weather or not they find this offensive. Maybe they don't in which case keep the name.

Personally I feel that if Redskin is offensive they should change their name. I don't think this should be forced on them by the government. I would rather see public pressure force the change. I got no problem with members of Congress sending letters. Writing a letter is harmless (unless you're one of those nuts that sticks ricin in the envelope) but I think it would be overreaching if the government forced the change.

 

[NDFan4Life]

Just another example of the government overstepping their bounds.

 

[FearTheBeard]

Politicians need to realize that changing the names of sports teams isn't going to erase the horrible history of how Native Americans were treated in this country.

Personally I feel that if Redskin is offensive they should change their name. I don't think this should be forced on them by the government. I would rather see public pressure force the change. I got no problem with members of Congress sending letters. Writing a letter is harmless (unless you're one of those nuts that sticks ricin in the envelope) but I think it would be overreaching if the government forced the change.

This. It doesnt change the past any, and if it actually is offensive then i think it should be up to those organizations to make the change not forced by government. If its offensive and they refuse to change then that is their choice as an organization to lose support from native americans. If pressured to change by fans and they dont then fans can stop supporting them and they will just lose business. Just my opinion here

 

[RDU Irish]

I didn't really need more proof that Congress is full of power drunk morons. STFU and mind your own business.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Personally, I find Wolverine offensive. Or.... at least the smell offensive.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Couple things:

1. This really isn't "Congress vs. the Redskins." Lots of people, including just about everyone that isn't a sports fan, thinks it is ridiculous that there is a team named the Redskins. And you have to admit, if there was a new team there would be no possible way they would try to name it the Redskins.

2. Having said that, I part company from a lot of my usual company on issues like this. I don't really want to see traditional teams change their names. I don't really have a great reason for feeling that way, other than that I like tradition and its just a name. But I do also understand why it is offensive, and I don't think people who don't like it should be criticized. They're really probably right, I'm just willing to be wrong in this case.

 

[EddytoNow]

The term "Redskins" is racist and offensive. The tradition of the Washington football team's use of the nickname "Redskins" not withstanding, it needs to be changed. This country has forced change in the past when it was the right thing to do, often against massive opposition. There are a number of other racist terms that refer to specific ethnic or racial groups. But I don't see any of those racist words being used as the nickname of a sports team.
This country is responsbile for the near-genocide of the Native American population. In many cases we have stolen their land, their culture, and their language. Do we have to continue to perpetuate racist stereotypes with words like "Redskins"? I would hope that someday we can move beyond the use of offensive words when referring to those who may be different than ourselves.
If the owner of the Washington football team wants to secede from the District of Columbia, I think he should be reminded that secession has been tried before.

 

[GowerND11]

Fighting Irish gives me visions of drunk Irish men fighting outside of a pub. CHANGE THE NAME!

 

[In Lou I Trust]

Keep the name. This world is becoming filled with politically correct pussies.

 

[Black Irish]

Keep the name. This world is becoming filled with politically correct pussies.

Maybe that can be their new name.

 

[dre1919]

I'm ok with the NFL keeping the name Redskins, a blatantly racist name (really no way around that) as long as they put two things in:

1. A franchise in Mississippi called the "Jackson Blackskins"
2. A franchise in Iowa called the "Iowa City Crackers".

It's absolutely the same thing, absolutely racist (and even more so because they are in Washington DC...how many times does the US Government have to screw over Native Americans?). It wouldn't even be that bad if the just changed it to "Washington Indians" as "Indian" isn't remotely as offensive. But, simply describing by the color of their skin is ridiculous.

 

[chicago51]

Not sure I would say this is Congress vs the Redskins. It is not like there is some legistlative proposal on the table.

If members of Congress want to write letters and put public pressure on them to change, the name because they as American citizens feel it is offensive fine with me. There of pletty of Americans that are not in Congress that have wrote letters asking the franchise to change their name.

Now if Congress actually passed a law that forced the changed and showed up with a swat team and army tanks at Dan Snyder's estate then I would have an issue.

I got no problem with members of Congress using their prestigue draw attention to an issue but ultimately the Redskins are a privately owned business.

Although I have to say a bunch of army tanks showing up on Dan Snyder's door step would be funny to see.

 

[phgreek]

This is difficult because the part that I do not have a clear understanding of is how MOST native americans feel about it. It seems to me we do not normally hear from those who are not offended or even like it.

I am largely of Irish heritage..."Fightin Irish" was intended to be derogatory in its application to the boys from South Bend ...yet I would physically harm someone if its use ever came under scrutiny. Are there such Native Americans who've found a sense of pride and tradition in "Indians", "Redskins"...I don't know...but before Congress burns time on this, I'd have a few other things higher on the list...and no, no they can't really do two things WELL at the same time.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Keep the name. This world is becoming filled with politically correct pussies.

Lou, I don't know if you read my post or not, but while I don't want to see the name changed because of tradition I do think it is wrong to criticize people who are offended by it because it clearly can be offensive. Being "not racist" isn't always the same as being politically correct.

 

[GowerND11]

I do feel like we are getting too politically correct in today's world. Soon we will have to get rid of all Native American names (Even those, like Seminoles, who's tribes like it) and might as well stop using any human reference. Good bye to Fighting Irish, Cavaliers, Warriors, Knights, etc. Can't offend anyone. Keep it strictly to animals, plants, and objects.

I jest of course about the last part, but there is some part of me feels that all could happen down the road...

 

[Bluto]

File this under "I'm not racist but...". Every Native American I've ever meet or known thinks this stuff is in fact offensive. As for those citing tradition how about the thousands of years of culture names like the "Redskins" pisses on and mocks? If the franchise was owned and operated by a tribe it would be a much different conversation.

 

[Kanye West]

It's racist and if they change it then cool, if not whatever. I'm not a Native American.

 

[Rhode Irish]

I do feel like we are getting too politically correct in today's world. Soon we will have to get rid of all Native American names (Even those, like Seminoles, who's tribes like it) and might as well stop using any human reference. Good bye to Fighting Irish, Cavaliers, Warriors, Knights, etc. Can't offend anyone. Keep it strictly to animals, plants, and objects.

I jest of course about the last part, but there is some part of me feels that all could happen down the road...

I think reasonable people can largely agree on what types of names are offensive and what ones aren't. If you want to take an extreme and unreasonable position (born of the same logic as "gay marriage will lead to men marrying farm animals"), that is your prerogative. But be prepared to be upset by everything for the rest of your life.

 

[GoIrish41]

I do feel like we are getting too politically correct in today's world. Soon we will have to get rid of all Native American names (Even those, like Seminoles, who's tribes like it) and might as well stop using any human reference. Good bye to Fighting Irish, Cavaliers, Warriors, Knights, etc. Can't offend anyone. Keep it strictly to animals, plants, and objects.

I jest of course about the last part, but there is some part of me feels that all could happen down the road...

I'd be on the fence if we were talking about the Atlanta "Braves" because, even though it is a bit racist it still has a positive conotation. But the word redskin was created as a slight to an entire race of people. It is a racial slur. I find it comical that people are making the assertion that it is political correctness gone too far when someone suggests that a team should change their name from a word that was intented to be offensive. Think of any racial slur you can think of and put it after "Washington", then draw a cartoonish version of that race of people and plop it on the side of their helmet. Whatever race you are, might that be offensive to you?

 

[NDWorld247]

Some interesting 'facts':

George Preston Marshall, probably the most racist team owner in the history of professional sports, brought the NFL to Boston in 1932 and nicknamed his team the Braves after the MLB team he shared a stadium with.

The next year, Marshall changed the name to Redskins in "honor" of his Native American head coach, Lone Star Dietz. Dietz was the HC for two years before being fired. Dietz's Native American heritage was investigated by the FBI in 1918 due to claims he misrepresented himself to dodge the WWI draft.

The Redskins moved to Washington after the 1936 season and Marshall would later come under fire for his refusal to hire African American players, hence his reputation as the most racist professional sports team owner.

This is a tough one for me. I'm a traditionalist and having lived in the DMV for a few years understand the passion Redskins fans (mostly non-Native Americans) have for their team. On the other hand, offensive Native American nicknames (mostly college) have been changed throughout the country due to public pressure, mostly from Native American groups. If Native American groups stand up and want it changed, they should change it. Some of these Congressmen represent NA groups, but I question if they are doing this because of pressure from their constituents or their own beliefs/policital gain.

 

[GoIrish41]

Some interesting 'facts':

George Preston Marshall, probably the most racist team owner in the history of professional sports, brought the NFL to Boston in 1932 and nicknamed his team the Braves after the MLB team he shared a stadium with.

The next year, Marshall changed the name to Redskins in "honor" of his Native American head coach, Lone Star Dietz. Dietz was the HC for two years before being fired. Dietz's Native American heritage was investigated by the FBI in 1918 due to claims he misrepresented himself to dodge the WWI draft.

The Redskins moved to Washington after the 1936 season and Marshall would later come under fire for his refusal to hire African American players, hence his reputation as the most racist professional sports team owner.

This is a tough one for me. I'm a traditionalist and having lived in the DMV for a few years understand the passion Redskins fans (mostly non-Native Americans) have for their team. On the other hand, offensive Native American nicknames (mostly college) have been changed throughout the country due to public pressure, mostly from Native American groups. If Native American groups stand up and want it changed, they should change it. Some of these Congressmen represent NA groups, but I question if they are doing this because of pressure from their constituents or their own beliefs/policital gain.

Good post.

A couple of comments.

1) You lived in the Department of Motor Vehicles for a few years?

2) I don't think that it has to be Native Americans to stand up in protest. And, I don't think that you necessarily have to be Native American to be offended by the obvious racial slur. I embrace those of different races recognizing the insensitivity of the name and standing up. At the same time, I think the Congress should be focused on a couple of things higher up on the priority list. Perhaps they are doing it in reverence of the new Mass. Senator?

 

[phgreek]

File this under "I'm not racist but...". Every Native American I've ever meet or known thinks this stuff is in fact offensive. As for those citing tradition how about the thousands of years of culture names like the "Redskins" pisses on and mocks? If the franchise was owned and operated by a tribe it would be a much different conversation.

it is racist in that it is an epithet regarding skin color, and was meant to be derogatory in its origin...not sure anyone serious could argue...

Your issue is, its offensive because the Washington Franchise uses the epithet "redskin" and regardless of their intent, its gotta go...because your anecdotal evidence says it is offensive to native americans

BUT somehow it might be ok if the exact same circumstances were in place, but the owner was native american...Dude, this sounds like a refrain of "racial epithets are ok if used inside the race itself?"

You are either okay with the outward intent surrounding the use of "redskin" or you are not..."Who", uses it (based on race) can't be an acceptable determinant here....Your sensibilities might be more comfortable with a Native American using "Redskin" but its is no more right than Dan Snyder using it in the present application.

I think the point we tend to miss is that we often foist our sensibilities on someone because they "SHOULD" be offended...when, for their own reasons, aren't.

On its face, if you were to ask me, I'd say call your team something else, but I'll stop short of forcing someone to rename their team unless you could convince me the majority of Native Americans are offended/demeaned.

I'm ok either way ...so long as whatever is decided represents the sentiments of the Majority of Native American people as apposed to the sensibilities of those outside the issue.

And Congress should GTFO ...just because it isn't a legislative issue doesn't mean it isn't a distraction...a distraction for the kid in the class who has yet to do his primary work.

 

[NDWorld247]

Good post.

A couple of comments.

1) You lived in the Department of Motor Vehicles for a few years?

2) I don't think that it has to be Native Americans to stand up in protest. And, I don't think that you necessarily have to be Native American to be offended by the obvious racial slur. I embrace those of different races recognizing the insensitivity of the name and standing up. At the same time, I think the Congress should be focused on a couple of things higher up on the priority list. Perhaps they are doing it in reverence of the new Mass. Senator?

DMV = DC, Maryland, Virginia. It's a common term for those that live in the region.

Good point. I am white and get offended when people use racial slurs for pretty much all races/nationalities. However, Redskins doesn't offend me the same way it does other slurs. Maybe because I have never heard anyone use it in a derogatory way. In fact, I have never personally heard someone use a racial slur to describe a Native American. Doesn't make it right or justified, or mean it doesn't happen, just my personal experience.

 

[BobD]

The term redskin is offensive to native Americans, so the name should be changed IMHO.

I would suggest they take on a new dual name. The Republicans when they're losing and Democrats when they're winning

Actually they could call themselves the Washington Weasels and everyone would know where they got the name.

 

[dshans]

Just to feed the fire –

From the Dartmouth College website:
The first Dartmouth College intercollegiate athletic contest, a baseball game, was played in 1866.
Starting in the 1920s sportswriters began to regularly use the nickname "Indians" in their coverage of Dartmouth's football team as it achieved a position of national prominence. The usage was grounded in reference to the College's founding mission in 1769 - the education of American Indian youth in the region.
For about 50 years thereafter, the nickname "Indians," though never officially adopted by the College, was used actively and interchangeably with "the Green," "Big Green" and "Hanoverians"... The Indian symbol also appeared on uniforms of athletic teams during this period.
In 1972, Dartmouth renewed its commitment to the education of Native Americans. Recognizing the adverse effects of use of the Indian symbol upon the College's Native American Program and its students, an ad hoc committee of the Dartmouth Alumni Council encouraged reduction in use of the symbol. In 1974, the College's Board of Trustees stated that "use of the (Indian) symbol in any form to be inconsistent with present institutional and academic objectives of the College in advancing Native American education."
By the mid-1970s the Indian symbol, which had never been formally adopted by a College governing body, was discontinued.

From The Washington Post, 6/13/2012
Voters in North Dakota delivered a strong rebuke of their state university’s divisive “Fighting Sioux” nickname on Tuesday, voting more than two-to-one to allow for it to be phased out.

The move could lead to a further review of such American Indian-themed mascots — including from pro sports teams like the Washington Redskins.
Supporters of the University of North Dakota’s mascot have pushed for it to stay even as the NCAA has threatened sanctions that include a ban on holding postseason games in their facilities and even forfeit if they don the nickname or logo in postseason play.

 

[RyCo1983]

The term redskin is offensive to native Americans, so the name should be changed IMHO.

I would suggest they take on a new dual name. The Republicans when they're losing and Democrats when they're winning

Actually they could call themselves the Washington Weasels and everyone would know where they got the name.

It is offensive to Native Americans and should certainly be changed.

Now Bob...let's not start another silly political thread...we've got enough of those already.

 

[In Lou I Trust]

I guess I just don't feel like it's too offensive and Native American is a sizeable part of my racial makeup; my grandpa was full blood Sac Indian. I have a hard time taking "verbal racism" (as in the use of slurs) seriously these days. It's difficult when it's so nonchalantly used in the everyday vocabulary of many races as, what seems to be, a term of endearment anymore. Native American history is very important to me and I personally like the idea that so many sports teams, in my eyes, pay homage to it.