Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

Brian Kelly Revisited


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Irish4Life09

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I disagree that recruiting has been lackluster.

The 2017 class is pretty damn good.

The Majority of the best players and certainly the most athletic players on the current team are sophomores and freshman.

Not sure how you can say recruiting has been lackluster recently.

Oh and not to mention the 2018 class is sick.


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I don't mind you disagreeing, however the fact is that our recruiting classes have consistently been dropping each of the last 3-4 years.
What I probably should have also added is that our training of these athletes is lackluster as well, mostly on the defensive side.
It's not really deniable though that we havn't produced the recruiting of athletes of the defensive side. One of the reasons for this is our DC literally does not recruit, and that is just amazing to me. How does a DC have a job, when half of the job is recruiting, and he doesnt do it? Just my 2 cents.
 

kmoose

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I don't mind you disagreeing, however the fact is that our recruiting classes have consistently been dropping each of the last 3-4 years.

The fact is that our recruiting has been up and down, but up and down within a VERY ACCEPTABLE range.

According to 247, since that's what the kids seem to think is the gospel truth, these days.......

ND was:

5th in 2013
11th in 2014
6th in 2015
15th in 2016
6th(so far) in 2017

5 straight years in the top 15, with three of those in the top 10, is not really what I would consider "lackluster".
 
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koonja

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Our recruiting is fine, and I'm as objective as they come in regards to the program and not giving them more credit than is due. There are a couple of positions (S, DE) that are not great, but what team besides OSU and Bama doesn't have at least one position they've missed on. This is all shitty coaching IMO /
 

NDRock

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So 10-3 is a season to aspire to? That is still sitting home from the playoffs all day long.

ND lost so much talent from last year? Good teams rebuild talent. Great teams just reload. ND loses and has a bare cupboard because ND cant develop year to year.

Never said that's what to aspire to but it's what I expected after watching Kelly's teams for six years.
 

JT_IRISH

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BVG should have been fired after the Stanford game and we should have parked a Brinks truck outside of Pat Narduzzi's house...
 

Irish Insanity

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So 10-3 is a season to aspire to? That is still sitting home from the playoffs all day long.

ND lost so much talent from last year? Good teams rebuild talent. Great teams just reload. ND loses and has a bare cupboard because ND cant develop year to year.

10 wins should be the floor, every single year.

Our 2013 class was top 5. BK's pre-2013 record: 28-11. BK's 2013-present record: 28-14 (27-12 before this season). Lack of talent is not the issue.

Spot on.

Top 20 recruiting every yea doesn't get you national championship team. Does it get you New Year six games some seasons? Yes. Does it get you playoffs every few years? Maybe.

If you want national championship teams you need to be in top 10 recruiting every year. And top 5 recruiting half the time.

Is it fair to say your end of year ranking should equal the average of your previous 3 years recruiting ranks? Because, to me, when we are almost always below that it's a coaching issue. Not talent.
 

arahop

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Listening to BK on his weekly interview blow sunshine up everones asshole about the defense is beyond ridiculous. Time to fold the cards in on Kelly. Enter the contract extension rebuttal as reasoning to why it won't happen. 24 million to an endowment In the Billions is nothing. Save me the argument that that's what seperates us from " football factories" as the reason ND won't pay it. Past mistakes with contract extensions ala Weis amd now BK is not solid reasoning to not buy BKS contract out. Im not saying fire BK right this minute. There needs to be a plan in place.Lets hope Savvy Jack is as smart as has been assumed . He shouldnt waste any more weeks seeing how this ship can be righted. It can't. BK is the best we have had since Holtz, I acknowledge that. We will continue in football purgatory as long as BK is our coacoach. Hell, maybe the administration will keep us there.
 

Irish#1

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Listening to BK on his weekly interview blow sunshine up everones asshole about the defense is beyond ridiculous. Time to fold the cards in on Kelly. Enter the contract extension rebuttal as reasoning to why it won't happen. 24 million to an endowment In the Billions is nothing. Save me the argument that that's what seperates us from " football factories" as the reason ND won't pay it. Past mistakes with contract extensions ala Weis amd now BK is not solid reasoning to not buy BKS contract out. Im not saying fire BK right this minute. There needs to be a plan in place.Lets hope Savvy Jack is as smart as has been assumed . He shouldnt waste any more weeks seeing how this ship can be righted. It can't. BK is the best we have had since Holtz, I acknowledge that. We will continue in football purgatory as long as BK is our coacoach. Hell, maybe the administration will keep us there.

Swarbrick sees those scores and the record. I wouldn't be surprised if he has a list of possible HC's that he updates annually just to be ready.
 

Whiskeyjack

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Listen to Dan Wetzel of Yahoo Sports! explain why ND fans should still count themselves lucky to have Brian Kelly on the Rakes Report podcast.
 

ulukinatme

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Listen to Dan Wetzel of Yahoo Sports! explain why ND fans should still count themselves lucky to have Brian Kelly on the Rakes Report podcast.

Some good points in there from an unbiased source. I think he's wrong about Herman coming to ND...not because he wouldn't, I just think Herman is going to take a position elsewhere first. Probably LSU/USC.
 

Whiskeyjack

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Some good points in there from an unbiased source. I think he's wrong about Herman coming to ND...not because he wouldn't, I just think Herman is going to take a position elsewhere first. Probably LSU/USC.

I liked his point about Herman not having accomplished anything that Kelly hadn't done as well prior to coming to ND.
 

gkIrish

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I liked his point about Herman not having accomplished anything that Kelly hadn't done as well prior to coming to ND.

I think his success at a big program like Ohio St., albeit as a coordinator, makes him much different than Kelly.

You could argue that winning a championship as an OC/QB coach at OSU with backup QBs is more impressive than anything BK had done prior to ND.

Not saying I agree with that but it's not an unreasonable position.
 

Bishop2b5

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ANY coaching hire, other than Nick or Urban, is a crapshoot. A guy can be enormously successful at a small school or even at a top 20 type program and be a bust when he moves up to a top 10 program. Every place is different and involves different circumstances. Even guys who are the best OC or DC in the country at a top 5 school are often busts when they sit behind the big desk.

I know you guys are frustrated with Kelly and I don't blame you. I'd want a change too. No matter who you get, though, there's about a 50/50 chance they'll do no better.
 

gkIrish

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NDgradstudent

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I liked his point about Herman not having accomplished anything that Kelly hadn't done as well prior to coming to ND.

Kelly won a NY6 bowl at UC? Herman won one in his first year at Houston.

Herman is also in Mensa. Like most CFB coaches Kelly is probably smart, but no Mensa member, he.

We'll have to see how Herman does vs. Louisville, but he looks pretty good to me.
 

Neutered's Pal

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Kelly helped turn the ship. He was the best that would come to ND at the time. He just cannot make the leap into the upper echelon of coaching. Now, other potential coaches see talent can be recruited to ND and possibly look at the situation more favorably. Is 8-5 with the occasional 10-win season good enough for him to keep his job? Only time will tell.
 

ulukinatme

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Kelly helped turn the ship. He was the best that would come to ND at the time. He just cannot make the leap into the upper echelon of coaching. Now, other potential coaches see talent can be recruited to ND and possibly look at the situation more favorably. Is 8-5 with the occasional 10-win season good enough for him to keep his job? Only time will tell.

Is this a sock? Suspicious username is suspicious :laugh:
 
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ANY coaching hire, other than Nick or Urban, is a crapshoot. A guy can be enormously successful at a small school or even at a top 20 type program and be a bust when he moves up to a top 10 program. Every place is different and involves different circumstances. Even guys who are the best OC or DC in the country at a top 5 school are often busts when they sit behind the big desk.

I know you guys are frustrated with Kelly and I don't blame you. I'd want a change too. No matter who you get, though, there's about a 50/50 chance they'll do no better.

This is a tough one as you are right about predicting future success. What people were excited by for Kelly was his performance at Cincinatti.

He took 3 star guys and got outsized performance from them. When they faced a really good team they would usually get beaten, but that was to be expected given their overall level of talent. I think people felt he would be able to get the same outperformance with 4 star talent at ND which would translate to almost yearly contention.

But what happened is he is still losing to the really good teams, and worse fairly frequently to teams with less overall talent. His success at Cincy has not translated. And as people see the flaws, and the lack of continued growth away from them , the frustration of not getting what they expected grows.

It's fair to say, based upon past performance, that the coaches and not the players are the main problem. The talent is there to be better with a coaching staff that knows how to maximize it. People now realize that this is not that staff, and now that we have recruiting pipelines people want to upgrade the coaching to match.
 
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koonja

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Didn't Kelly really only have 1 good year at Cinci? Weren't the other years ok? Smells like his time at ND.
 

zelezo vlk

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Didn't Kelly really only have 1 good year at Cinci? Weren't the other years ok? Smells like his time at ND.
2007: 10-3
2008: 11-3
2009: 12-0

Two straight BCS bowls.

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NDRock

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Didn't Kelly really only have 1 good year at Cinci? Weren't the other years ok? Smells like his time at ND.

His last two years he won the Big East both years. Went 11-2 in 08' (lost in the Orange Bowl) and 12-0 in 09' (Lost in the Sugar Bowl though he didn't coach). Guy did a great job at Cinci.
 

RDU Irish

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Head coach Brian Kelly taking a more active role in Notre Dame's defense | Notre Dame Insider Football | ndinsider.com
I don't even know what to think about some of things Kelly says herein. I just don't even have words to express my lack of understanding.

Trust but verify BK. WTF has BVG shown us that merited trust in the first place is a bit mind boggling but how in the hell do you look at last season's defense and punt on getting involved in the defensive game plan heading into this year? One thing if you have Greg Mattison holding down the DC position for a number of years with solid results - another thing to ignore that shitshow defensive finish from last year for an entire off-season.

As much as I just hope to God this is posturing - I also look at the Texas game and wonder how any staff could get together and collectively think that was a good idea. 1) Kelly was involved then endorsed and now saving face by claiming ignorance, 2) BVG was given the keys and Kelly focuses on the QB (lack of) decision. EVEN IF #2 was the situation - how do you not see in practice and scrimmages WTF is going on over there enough to know you have a serious problem?
 
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