BK stays at ND

[ND4LIFE]

But you don't know for certain the motivation for those actions - i.e. program changes/assistant pay raises.

Maybe there is a little more than meets the eye here.

Agreed, but neither do you. That is the reason there is doubt. If we knew his intentions there would be fact and therefore no reason for concern or doubt! I do like your innocent until proven guilty mentality though.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

That goes both ways. I agree that we would have expected to hear more from reporters etc if there was some "meat" to the story, but I also think that we would have heard more/sooner from the University if there is no story. I'm not sure silence points either direction because there is incentive for somebody to speak up either way.

See Lax's post above. The University remains silent because it's not a monolithic entity; there's internal conflict involved here. I'd bet it's between Kelly/ Swarbrick and the BoT. The kinds of changes Kelly wants for the program would require approval from the very top, and they won't be easy to get. I think that's part of the reason this "crisis" was manufactured; to generate a sense of urgency so this stuff can get wrapped up in time for it to make a difference.

 

[chicago51]

Probably look to leave. Would you blame him? If we're not going to pay him what he wants, give him the money to retain his assistants, and commit to being a program serious about football then he has no reason to stay.

Simply put, the BoT and other people over Swarbick's head have a longstanding history of not giving a crap about the football team and/or working actively against it. The good news is that Jenkins appears to be a far cry from other presidents who did not have football's best interests at heart and so stuff should get done.

But yeah... all the people like Haugh (and hundreds of others) saying "He was going to get paid anyways! This isn't necessary!" have absolutely no idea how complex and difficult it is to wrangle millions of dollars a year and programmatic changes from people who don't feel like they need to pay it or make the changes to keep winning. Most of these people in charge of the money are completely clueless to how the metagame of college football is played.

What do folks think BK will do if ND meets him but only meets him half way? Say they pay him and his assistants (with multi year deals) but don't change the standards then what?

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

ND Football is straight cray.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Kray, like Reginald.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

ND Football is straight cray.

Seriously. You could probably write a compelling drama about all the backroom politicking that's been going on.

 

[wizards8507]

Most of these people in charge of the money are completely clueless to how the metagame of college football is played.

No disrepect intended as I'm new around here, but are you an alum or just a football fan? I completely understand what you're saying regarding the football program, but at what cost to the University? For example, I'm sure we could get a lot more "talented" recruits if ND just wasn't so stubbornly Catholic or if we offered a "General Studies" major, but that's not what the University is about. What's the point of building a winning program if you have to sacrifice who you are to get there?

 

[rikkitikki08]

This thread was strange, on one hand we had people who thought logically and waited it out and on the other hand we had the the sky is falling people. Actually the more i think about it, thats about every thread on this site.


I still believe Kelly is coming back, ESPN is the tmz of sporting news

 

[IrishLion]

I wonder if BK is asking for field turf and a jumbotron as well. No italics.

 

[Irish#1]

What's killing me is that we are hearing nothing from the University. Nothing from Swarbrick. Nothing from the assistants. At this critical time I'd think they would be saying something to their fans, but more importantly to the recruits. Maybe they have a message for the recruits that we aren't hearing.

Swarbrick won't say anything public until something is finalized, whether that is BK staying or leaving. Coaches won't because BK is still their boss and they aren't interested in creating a riff.

 

[Grahambo]

How many more times do people need to hear its a negotiating tactic before they realize that some posters like Whiskey, Lax, NDinLA, BGIF, TP, occasionally Wooly and seldom Bogtrotter know what they are talking about?

As soon as word got out that he is seeking raises for his staff to avoid poaching, admissions adjustments, and an extension for himself; that should have been enough.

How or where the "interview" took place is now irrelevant. BK knows what he needs to win. Its plausible and within the realm of possibility that he and his agent chalked up the idea after the game seeing as how the team lacks quality depth. Maybe after he discovered AQM was gonna be ineligible. Maybe he knew all year. Thats all irrelevant. I worked intelligence for years and an idea like this is calculated and certainly doable.

He's a head coach who understands politics. He wins everywhere for a reason: he knows what he's doing.

 

[rikkitikki08]

I wonder if BK is asking for field turf and a jumbotron as well. No italics.

Field turf is going to happen anyways, And i support it but i am so against the jumbotron is ridiculous. I love the old feel of the two high school looking scoreboards, it just makes it feel old school and i love that.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

No disrepect intended as I'm new around here, but are you an alum or just a football fan? I completely understand what you're saying regarding the football program, but at what cost to the University? For example, I'm sure we could get a lot more "talented" recruits if ND just wasn't so stubbornly Catholic or if we offered a "General Studies" major, but that's not what the University is about. What's the point of building a winning program if you have to sacrifice who you are to get there?

He's not only an alum, but a former Irish student athlete. He's absolutely right about how our BoT of works.

And we're not talking about selling out to become a football factory. It's entirely possible to field a consistently competitive football team while holding true to ND's values. But it will require further concessions from the BoT first on things like admission for borderline recruits (like AQM), etc.

 

[rikkitikki08]

How many more times do people need to hear its a negotiating tactic before they realize that some posters like Whiskey, Lax, NDinLA, BGIF, TP, occasionally Wooly and seldom Bogtrotter know what they are talking about?

As soon as word got out that he is seeking raises for his staff to avoid poaching, admissions adjustments, and an extension for himself; that should have been enough.

How or where the "interview" took place is now irrelevant. BK knows what he needs to win. Its plausible and within the realm of possibility that he and his agent chalked up the idea after the game seeing as how the team lacks quality depth. Maybe after he discovered AQM was gonna be ineligible. Maybe he knew all year. Thats all irrelevant. I worked intelligence for years and an idea like this is calculated and certainly doable.

He's a head coach who understands politics. He wins everywhere for a reason: he knows what he's doing.

I agree 110% and have had the same outlook since all of this started. Some people and this is no knock against them are just short minded and cant look at the larger picture

 

[IrishLax]

His actions leave doubt. I don't go on a date when I am solidly committed to my Wife!

Solidly: firm, hard, or compact in substance: solid ground.

Committed: to bind or obligate, as by pledge or assurance; pledge: to commit oneself to a promise; to be committed to a course of action.

You do if you're trying to leverage your wife to step her game up. Maybe you have zero intention of doing anything with your young attractive co-worker but grabbing lunch and you're playing for the power position with your wife. Maybe you'd like her to go to the gym more. Or you're negotiating for more BJs. The possibilities are endless if she's a little jealous.

#analogies

 

[PANDFAN]

You do if you're trying to leverage your wife to step her game up. Maybe you have zero intention of doing anything with your young attractive co-worker but grabbing lunch and you're playing for the power position with your wife. Maybe you'd like her to go to the gym more. Or you're negotiating for more BJs. The possibilities are endless if she's a little jealous.

#analogies

 

[wizards8507]

He's not only an alum, but a former Irish student athlete. He's absolutely right about how our BoT of works.

I don't doubt his knowledge about how the BoT works. I'm questioning the automatic assumption that the BoT is wrong for trying to protect the academic integrity of the school.

EDIT: Reading your edited post, I have no problem if the only discussions they're having about academic standards are cases of borderline or "special circumstance" kids, but I'm not on board with full-spectrum lowering of standards.

 

[Irish#1]

When this "story" was first broken by reporters who share the same agent as BK, it was mysteriously short on details-- where, when and how BK interviewed with the Eagles. Now, several days later, those details still aren't forth-coming. If this was a real interview with serious interest from both sides (and not simply "mutual interest" claimed by Trace Armstrong) there would be a lot more to report on.

Right after the story broke, many here commented on how strange it would be for BK to leave ND like this, right after the NCG. We speculated that this may simply be a common negotiating tactic aimed at getting BK an extension and his assistants significant raises. Since then, we've read several reports to that effect, and not a single one substantiating the NFL interest other than paranoid hand-waving about BK being a "climber", etc.

You're the one who's taking an obviously self-interested leak by BK's agent at face value. Read between the lines.

Plus we would be hearing something from the local Philly media. Stuff like this leaks like a bucket with holes when it comes to NFL teams.

 

[PraetorianND]

How many more times do people need to hear its a negotiating tactic before they realize that some posters like Whiskey, Lax, NDinLA, BGIF, TP, occasionally Wooly and seldom Bogtrotter know what they are talking about?

As soon as word got out that he is seeking raises for his staff to avoid poaching, admissions adjustments, and an extension for himself; that should have been enough.

How or where the "interview" took place is now irrelevant. BK knows what he needs to win. Its plausible and within the realm of possibility that he and his agent chalked up the idea after the game seeing as how the team lacks quality depth. Maybe after he discovered AQM was gonna be ineligible. Maybe he knew all year. Thats all irrelevant. I worked intelligence for years and an idea like this is calculated and certainly doable.

He's a head coach who understands politics. He wins everywhere for a reason: he knows what he's doing.

Correct and LOL!

 

[Irish#1]

How many more times do people need to hear its a negotiating tactic before they realize that some posters like Whiskey, Lax, NDinLA, BGIF, TP, occasionally Wooly and seldom Bogtrotter know what they are talking about?

As soon as word got out that he is seeking raises for his staff to avoid poaching, admissions adjustments, and an extension for himself; that should have been enough.

How or where the "interview" took place is now irrelevant. BK knows what he needs to win. Its plausible and within the realm of possibility that he and his agent chalked up the idea after the game seeing as how the team lacks quality depth. Maybe after he discovered AQM was gonna be ineligible. Maybe he knew all year. Thats all irrelevant. I worked intelligence for years and an idea like this is calculated and certainly doable.

He's a head coach who understands politics. He wins everywhere for a reason: he knows what he's doing.

Well stated.

 

[aubeirish]

Lots of good points out there. Brian Kelly is the best thing that has happened to ND athletic in a long time. He has brought us back from the ashes. Brought the international spotlight back on ND. Increased the interest in ND by a mile. Swarbrick and Jenkins know the impact this whole season had on the university. They are not stupid. They will give him what he wants. I doubt Kelly is asking for anything that is impossible. He deserves it, and the rest of the staff deserve it. The price is right! Let's do it.

 

[Buster Bluth]

You do if you're trying to leverage your wife to step her game up. Maybe you have zero intention of doing anything with your young attractive co-worker but grabbing lunch and you're playing for the power position with your wife. Maybe you'd like her to go to the gym more. Or you're negotiating for more BJs. The possibilities are endless if she's a little jealous.

#analogies

 

[wizards8507]

Plus we would be hearing something from the local Philly media. Stuff like this leaks like a bucket with holes when it comes to NFL teams.

We are hearing from the Philly media. They were tweeting about it all day yesterday and some of the local folks around here said it was the #1 topic on sports talk all day long.

 

[ND4LIFE]

You do if you're trying to leverage your wife to step her game up. Maybe you have zero intention of doing anything with your young attractive co-worker but grabbing lunch and you're playing for the power position with your wife. Maybe you'd like her to go to the gym more. Or you're negotiating for more BJs. The possibilities are endless if she's a little jealous.

#analogies

LOL! This is the reason I am now addicted to this site. Sadly, this makes some sense to me.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I don't doubt his knowledge about how the BoT works. I'm questioning the automatic assumption that the BoT is wrong for trying to protect the academic integrity of the school.

We're in dangerous territory here, as we're working entirely off assumptions. BK allegedly wants more flexibility with admissions, akin to what Holtz enjoyed. That concession doesn't equate to compromising ND's academic integrity.

Do you think ND would be "selling out" if it had made an exception and admitted AQM? He's technically a borderline recruit, since he's lacking a core class, but I have little doubt he would succeed at ND if admitted. That type of inflexibility with admissions puts us at a significant competitive disadvantage, and asking the BoT to change that is not out of line.

We are hearing from the Philly media. They were tweeting about it all day yesterday and some of the local folks around here said it was the #1 topic on sports talk all day long.

What are we hearing? No details, that's for sure. Just local talk shows addressing the most current compelling rumor.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Plus we would be hearing something from the local Philly media. Stuff like this leaks like a bucket with holes when it comes to NFL teams.

There have been reports from people unaffiliated with Brian Kelly's agent.

I think it's pretty safe to assume that some level of contact has taken place.

 

[wizards8507]

Lots of good points out there. Brian Kelly is the best thing that has happened to ND athletic in a long time. He has brought us back from the ashes. Brought the international spotlight back on ND. Increased the interest in ND by a mile. Swarbrick and Jenkins know the impact this whole season had on the university. They are not stupid. They will give him what he wants. I doubt Kelly is asking for anything that is impossible. He deserves it, and the rest of the staff deserve it. The price is right! Let's do it.

If you're referring to the game in Dublin, that was set up years ago and BK complained HARD about making the trip.

‘‘I love everything about Ireland,’’ Kelly said. ‘‘I’m not a big fan of playing football games in Ireland.’’

 

[PraetorianND]

We are hearing from the Philly media. They were tweeting about it all day yesterday and some of the local folks around here said it was the #1 topic on sports talk all day long.

Regarding Kelly physically travelling to Philly to formally interview and HIM being in direct contact with Philly? I think this is the part that people are disagreeing with. None of this has happened or even been rumored to happen.

 

[IrishLax]

No disrepect intended as I'm new around here, but are you an alum or just a football fan? I completely understand what you're saying regarding the football program, but at what cost to the University? For example, I'm sure we could get a lot more "talented" recruits if ND just wasn't so stubbornly Catholic or if we offered a "General Studies" major, but that's not what the University is about. What's the point of building a winning program if you have to sacrifice who you are to get there?

I do appreciate and respect that you prefaced it with "no disrespect I'm new around here"... and as such will not respond with a GIF or meme.

Alumnus, student athlete, and did a tiny bit of part-time freelance work after I stopped playing with people in our athletic department.

What you're asking in the second half of your post is a complex question that deserves its own thread. It's not up for me to decide where the line is drawn, I'm just reporting that others are saying that BK is pushing for some changes.

 

[Domina Nostra]

...As far as ND ponying up millions and making concessions without being pressured to do so... it just doesn't happen. People, and even institutions, don't give away money or control lightly.

It sounds like Kelly's agent plays harball, and Kelly surely likes it that way, but this is really how these things get done- especially if the changes are substantial.