Epstein's Future

Irishnuke

Irishnuke

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11cracker11 said:
I believe the reason Sandberg chose Philly is he felt he would be much closer to the big league role considering Charlie Manual's age. Quade is done, you must not live in Chciago if you think Cubs fans will tolerate him again. The Tribune did a poll and something like 96% of fans wanted Quade fired. He did nothing develop Castro, Barney, Soto and he killed Colvin. He is one and done and he brought down Jim Hendry with him.
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Trying to pick a starting point....Ok here goes. Quade did what he could with the team that he had. He was dealt a horrible hand. Didn't develop Castro? Dude had 207 hits and batted .307 and he's what, 21? Didn't develop Soto? You kidding me? Soto had a good rookie year. That's it. Quade isn't the hitting coach. He's not the reason Colvin can't hit a beach ball. Darwin Barney was a rookie. What did you expect from him? Not his fault that Soriano, Zambrano, Pena, and Fukudome didn't live up to their contracts. He had to deal with injuries to the pitching staff, an aging Dempster that won't best a 4.00 era again, a sh*tty pitching staff, sh*tty closer...list just keeps going on and on. Quade did what he could with what he had. I doubt Sandberg would have done any better.

As for fan's opinions, well, I hate to say this being a Cubs fan...we have some of the dumbest fans in professional sports. I'm not singling any of you out, but if you've sat in the bleachers at Wrigley, you know what I'm talking about. People go to Wrigley for the atmosphere, beer, and to party. Some go to watch the games but it's getting fewer and fewer.

Anyone who expected the Cubs to be compete for a playoff spot this year needs a reality check. How quickly are Cubs fans going to turn on Epstein when he doesn't win a World Series next year? I love my Cubs more than anything (even ND), but we need to let Epstein and Quade do their jobs. Not going to win a WS next year. A lot of work needs to be done and a lot of people need to go, but it's not going to happen overnight. This is definitely a step in the right direction though.
 
NDdomer2

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Irishnuke (i would quote you but it was lengthy)....Quade was dealt an ugly hand, I agree. I thought they didn't hire Sandberg to keep the fan base from turning on a Wrigley legend. I don't think the cubs could have won the WS, no way, no how. But, the biggest thing with the Cubs is the amount of money we are spending compared the games we are winning. Cubs fans aren't stupid in thinking with our payroll we should be competing for the playoffs. I for one don't have high expectations for the next season, but agree that this is the step in the right direction that was desperately needed!
 
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11cracker11

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Irishnuke said:
Trying to pick a starting point....Ok here goes. Quade did what he could with the team that he had. He was dealt a horrible hand. Didn't develop Castro? Dude had 207 hits and batted .307 and he's what, 21? Didn't develop Soto? You kidding me? Soto had a good rookie year. That's it. Quade isn't the hitting coach. He's not the reason Colvin can't hit a beach ball. Darwin Barney was a rookie. What did you expect from him? Not his fault that Soriano, Zambrano, Pena, and Fukudome didn't live up to their contracts. He had to deal with injuries to the pitching staff, an aging Dempster that won't best a 4.00 era again, a sh*tty pitching staff, sh*tty closer...list just keeps going on and on. Quade did what he could with what he had. I doubt Sandberg would have done any better.

As for fan's opinions, well, I hate to say this being a Cubs fan...we have some of the dumbest fans in professional sports. I'm not singling any of you out, but if you've sat in the bleachers at Wrigley, you know what I'm talking about. People go to Wrigley for the atmosphere, beer, and to party. Some go to watch the games but it's getting fewer and fewer.

Anyone who expected the Cubs to be compete for a playoff spot this year needs a reality check. How quickly are Cubs fans going to turn on Epstein when he doesn't win a World Series next year? I love my Cubs more than anything (even ND), but we need to let Epstein and Quade do their jobs. Not going to win a WS next year. A lot of work needs to be done and a lot of people need to go, but it's not going to happen overnight. This is definitely a step in the right direction though.
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Starlin Castro is by far our best overall player. However, how many errors did he commit? I believe a league leading 29. I saw very little improvement in his footwork until the last month of the season. Even worse, his head isn't always in the game. For example, grabbing seeds out of his back pocket with his back turned while a pitch is being thrown on a nationally televised game. That's what I mean develop, you know his weaknesses, not his obvious strengths(hitting). Geo Soto was RoY in 2008. 2010 stats .280/.393/.497 2011 stats .228/.310/.411. I would say hitting .280 with a .393 on base and .497 slugging is pretty good almost .900 OPS, I guess that isn't very good to you. Tyler Colvin hit 20 home runs last year, comes in this year and he gets to play 1-2 times a week. What is he blocked by Fukudome in the last yr of a contract or maybe 36 yr old Soriano? Let the kid play everyday rotating all 3 OF positions and give him a chance. I don't think you really know what your talking about, what real Cubs fan sits in the Bleachers? Why is Darwin Barney batting 2nd when his OBP is .313, that's where an 8 hitter should hit. He never took enough pitches or walked enough to be a top of the order hitter. But your guy Quade kept running him out there.

If you honestly believe the Cubs would not have been better with Sandberg you have no idea what being a leader means. This team would have played hard everyday, up and down the lineup, if not they would have been benched. Young guys would have gotten a chance if the record warranted it, and I guarantee you Sandberg would not have had a nickname for every one of his employees, oh I'm sorry, I mean players. I guess you are one of the 4% of Cub fans that wants Quade back.
 
Irishnuke

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Colvin had 206 at-bats and hit .150. Why should he have been playing? Because he hit 20 home runs last year? As terrible as Soriano and Fukudome were, they weren't as bad as Colvin. Like it or not, he's not the future of the Cubs. Soto's 2010 stats were good. 2011 weren't. That's Quade's fault? He wasn't supposed to develop Castro's hitting but was Soto's? Hmm..ok. Quade also kicked Zambrano off the team and benched Castro after he turned his back on the field...exactly what your hero would have done. I loved Sandberg as a player too, but my loyalty is with the Cubs, not number 23. But hey, he wouldn't have given his players nicknames so clearly he's the better choice.

You say what real Cubs fan sits in the bleachers? What real Cubs fan "boycotts Wrigley" because they were upset with who was hired as coach? How many Irish fans boycotted Notre Dame because they wanted someone other than Kelly? None.
 
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11cracker11

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Irishnuke said:
Colvin had 206 at-bats and hit .150. Why should he have been playing? Because he hit 20 home runs last year? As terrible as Soriano and Fukudome were, they weren't as bad as Colvin. Like it or not, he's not the future of the Cubs. Soto's 2010 stats were good. 2011 weren't. That's Quade's fault? He wasn't supposed to develop Castro's hitting but was Soto's? Hmm..ok. Quade also kicked Zambrano off the team and benched Castro after he turned his back on the field...exactly what your hero would have done. I loved Sandberg as a player too, but my loyalty is with the Cubs, not number 23. But hey, he wouldn't have given his players nicknames so clearly he's the better choice.

You say what real Cubs fan sits in the bleachers? What real Cubs fan "boycotts Wrigley" because they were upset with who was hired as coach? How many Irish fans boycotted Notre Dame because they wanted someone other than Kelly? None.
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Real easy to hit .150 when you don't play regularly, especially for a young guy, after having a good season last year. It was an effective vote of no confidence. Quade did nothing to develop Castro's hitting, he hit .300 as a 20 year old last year so obviously he could already hit. He needed to improve in the field and I didn't see it until late in the season. Yeah Quade benched Castro, our best player, but never said anything about Soriano dogging it out of the batter's box or even worse Cadillac trotting it and ending up with a single off the wall. Sorry, I wasn't going to give to Jim Hendry or the Ricketts family my money after they hired Mike Quade over Sandberg, a Hall of Famer, who rode buses and managed in the minor leagues for 4 seasons with success at every level. And you want to know why nobody boycotted Notre Dame after hiring Kelly? He was 12-0 at Cincinnati and the BCS coach of the year, plus he had only BCS Top 10 school with grad rate above 70%, who the **** else do you want them to sign??? I still rooted for the Cubs, but I didn't spend any of my money there and I have the feeling, based on attendance, that many others stayed away as well. It is lemmings like you who accept what Quade and the Cubs put on the field this year, which was an absolute disgrace, unless you're a coed from Lincoln Park working on your tan.
 
NDdomer2

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Chicago Cubs chairman Tom Ricketts will hit his first home run when he finalizes hire of Theo Epstein - ESPN Chicago

You can't fire the players, but you can fire the manager and coaches, and that's a crucial decision Epstein has to make.

Bobby Dernier and Pat Listach could stay, I suppose, but the new manager needs better coaches. Ivan DeJesus can do anything in the organization, but he can't coach third base anymore. A new pitching coach is vital. Quade got shafted when Larry Rothschild bolted for the Yankees.

A new manager can't have a new pitching coach. As a young Cubs pitcher said to me late in the season, Rothschild's replacement, Mark Riggins, did as much as he could, but "He's just not Larry, you know."

Epstein needs to figure out if Carlos Pena and Aramis Ramirez are still options at first and third -- the team needs someone to hit with power -- and he's got to spin off Marlon Byrd for a hitter with more pop.

He also might want to trade Geovany Soto and Carlos Marmol, two pieces who could bring back valuable returns. Then, of course, there's the Carlos Zambrano situation. I'm guessing Zambrano and his agent deliver an ultimatum: Trade him to Florida or keep him or release him.
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B

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Epstein's a Cub!

Epstein's a Cub!

Gone from Boston. ESPN
 
Rhode Irish

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I don't think Theo can bring in Tito Francona, politcally, but Tito's right hand man, DeMarlo Hale, might be a candidate in Chicago. A lot of people around the Red Sox want the Sox to hire him, but since he was in the clubhouse this September I don't think they can do that.

Sidenote on the Sox: would not be shocked to see Dale Sveum become the next manager in Boston. Was with the team's 3rd base coach under Tito when the team won the World Series in 2004. As could only happen in Boston, Sveum was actually an unpopular third base coach (got a few guys thrown out at home), but he is their kind of guy. He's my dark horse candidate.
 
NDinFL

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So,

I wonder if Theo (who is now with the CUBS) will try and get to Ryno before St. Louis does...
 
Irishnuke

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Nope. ESPN reported that Epstein contacted Ryno to let him know he's not a candidate.
 
Rhode Irish

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NDinFL said:
So,

I wonder if Theo (who is now with the CUBS) will try and get to Ryno before St. Louis does...
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Yes. I was just assuming that anyone reading this thread knew that Theo was with the Cubs and that I was saying the Cubs should consider bringing in DeMarlo Hale. I brought up the Red Sox because I am a Sox fan and would have liked to see Hale hired here, but that doesn't seem possible in light of September. In light of that, and since Theo knows Hale well, and because Sandberg is not a candidate, I think Hale is someone to watch in connection to the Cubs managerial job.
 
chgocub23

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Nd1 I didn't realize you posted here in Epstein's thread so I apologize for putting in the other one. You broke the news on here so I give you the credit.
 
irishtrain

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My first reaction to LaRussa retiring was----I'll bet he got a call from Theo.
 
NDinFL

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Rhode Irish said:
Yes. I was just assuming that anyone reading this thread knew that Theo was with the Cubs and that I was saying the Cubs should consider bringing in DeMarlo Hale. I brought up the Red Sox because I am a Sox fan and would have liked to see Hale hired here, but that doesn't seem possible in light of September. In light of that, and since Theo knows Hale well, and because Sandberg is not a candidate, I think Hale is someone to watch in connection to the Cubs managerial job.
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It was meant tongue-in-cheek

No worries amigo
 
Rhode Irish

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Rhode Irish said:
I don't think Theo can bring in Tito Francona, politcally, but Tito's right hand man, DeMarlo Hale, might be a candidate in Chicago. A lot of people around the Red Sox want the Sox to hire him, but since he was in the clubhouse this September I don't think they can do that.

Sidenote on the Sox: would not be shocked to see Dale Sveum become the next manager in Boston. Was with the team's 3rd base coach under Tito when the team won the World Series in 2004. As could only happen in Boston, Sveum was actually an unpopular third base coach (got a few guys thrown out at home), but he is their kind of guy. He's my dark horse candidate.
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Following up on my post from yesterday, from Gordon Edes article on Sveum today on ESPNBoston.com:

BOSTON -- It's impossible to consider Dale Sveum's candidacy to be the next manager of the Boston Red Sox without first acknowledging that he was not just another third-base coach during his two seasons in Boston (2004 and 2005).

In a city famous for shredding its third-base coaches, ever since former Boston Globe columnist Mike Barnicle wrote that if Sox coach Rene Lachemann had been an air traffic controller at Logan Airport, Boston Harbor would have been littered with fuselage, Sveum's notoriety may have eclipsed them all.

How many third-base coaches of World Series-bound teams hear boos when introduced at home before a postseason game? Most get ignored, or are lucky to hear polite applause.

How many third-base coaches are the subject of a profile in the Sunday magazine of that city's biggest newspaper? Sveum was, with the headline, "He's Safe … For Now."

How many third-base coaches start getting second-guessed in their first weeks on the job after an often inattentive Manny Ramirez proves to have better judgment than the coach, stopping at third while the coach was waving him home on a throw that would have caught Ramirez not by inches but by yards?

How many third-base coaches provoke rants that last two weeks by sending a runner (Dave Roberts) who gets thrown out at the plate by Tampa Bay's Rocco Baldelli with no outs in the ninth and the Sox down a run in Tropicana Field, then a week later at Fenway Park sends two more runners to their demise -- on back-to-back plays! -- again cut down at the plate by Baldelli?
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Boston is a weird place.
 
NDinFL

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Rhode Irish said:
Following up on my post from yesterday, from Gordon Edes article on Sveum today on ESPNBoston.com:



Boston is a weird place.
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Yep,

now back to Theo Epstein's future with the Cubs.

I think (I believe it's been stated before) that he dumps a few of the big contracts.

Guys like: Ramirez, Soriano, and Zambrano
 
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