Everything Soccer

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
In a way I hope it’s just the beginning and that it gets worse,… have the European giants lose all their talent due to stupid money and get a dose of what they’ve been dishing out for the last 20 years. Burn it all down
Once a handful of clubs skirted around FFP and it was found out to be the joke everyone thought, the floodgates opened and UEFA did nothing to stop it. So things were bad as it was, but now this Saudi League is going to likely make it worse.

It is going to burn down regardless if this is the path we're headed on.
 

BabyIrish

Marble Mouth
Messages
2,838
Reaction score
719
The USWNT will be able to win a World Cup if Rose Lavelle can play as many minutes as possible.

That's the post.
If we had Sauerbraun, which would allow a midfield of Lavelle, Ertz and Horan that I would probably agree with you. But Ertz still doesn't look comfortable in the center back spot and the midfield gets exposed too often. I'm not confident that we can even make it to the semi finals to be honest.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
If we had Sauerbraun, which would allow a midfield of Lavelle, Ertz and Horan that I would probably agree with you. But Ertz still doesn't look comfortable in the center back spot and the midfield gets exposed too often. I'm not confident that we can even make it to the semi finals to be honest.
This might be a rash take based on what we've seen so far. The first half last night was terrible, but the match changed when Lavelle came on for the second half. It didn't help that the referee was absolutely terrible, but the most alarming thing has been the lack of finishing. The chances have been there and they should have more than the 4 goals they've scored so far.
 

Pete

Well-known member
Messages
2,376
Reaction score
1,846
Columbus Crew just sold their best player Lucas Zelarayan to the Saudi league for undisclosed cash.

Wonder if Congress will drag Don Garber and Dee Haslam in front of them like they did Jimmy Dunne and PGA Leadership.
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,976
Reaction score
6,465
Ertz has been fine at CB, but she is VITALLY MISSED at defensive mid. Sullivan cannot do that job at this level.

Prior to the tournament one could argue that the US had three players in a best eleven team: Ertz, Sauerbraun, and Dunn. Lavelle and Morgan would be close. Without Becky Sauerbraun at all, and with Julie Ertz misplaced (and no back-up like Abby Dahlkamper), the backline cannot make-up for an always mediocre Naeher and a misplaced Fox, who is better on Dunn's side. (if Krieger were still playing we could have a tougher-minded defensive powerful right back to help shore this up, but she was tossed away too soon also.) We're ripe for goals against. It would not blow my mind to see a loss to Portugal and a romp by Netherlands, which might, I believe, eliminate us. To even be thinking about that shows me something.

Carly Lloyd before she had to become a polite host, said that the team was soft, had no toughness. In the Netherlands game, the only people throwing themselves at the game were Ertz, Horan, Dunn, and Rodman --- the only actually tough players on the pitch (well, Morgan too did what she could under these circumstances.) The former team was generally tough, both in mind and body. i.e. competitive and capable of anger. I absolutely hate some of the happy talk comments by this year's commentators. I still have hope that Ally Wagner will end up telling it as it is as she has done before.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
Yellow Card means Lavelle is out for the next match. Seemed like a harsh call.

Not feeling great.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
Columbus Crew just sold their best player Lucas Zelarayan to the Saudi league for undisclosed cash.

Wonder if Congress will drag Don Garber and Dee Haslam in front of them like they did Jimmy Dunne and PGA Leadership.
Nah. He's a 31 year old Argentinian midfielder. You might see Don have to answer some questions down the road, and I think that's the route that this is going to go. When the twenty something players start leaving for this Saudi league in their primes, that's when people are going to start really worrying.

Saudi transfer deadline is September 20th, so additional deals can go down once the season in Europe begins.

This is just the beginning and assuming the money is real, it's going to be legit for a good time to come. They want a World Cup and they're going to get it one way or another.
 

BabyIrish

Marble Mouth
Messages
2,838
Reaction score
719
Yellow Card means Lavelle is out for the next match. Seemed like a harsh call.

Not feeling great.
We’ve been in trouble as a team since Swanson went down. We’ve been in major trouble as a team since Sauerbraun went down. The most likely outcome for this team is getting rolled by Sweden next match.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
We’ve been in trouble as a team since Swanson went down. We’ve been in major trouble as a team since Sauerbraun went down. The most likely outcome for this team is getting rolled by Sweden next match.
Agreed on the first two sentences. Don't forget Macario, Press and Mewis.

I am more hopeful than optimistic right now. I don't know if Sweden rolls them, but they can most certainly be beaten. I don't understand what the style of play is. I think it's get the ball to Sophia Smith and hope she can work to score. There really isn't anything else I can pinpoint that they do or try to do.

I'm not one for wanting manager changes, but if they do get hammered by Sweden, this guy should be gone.
 

NDohio

Well-known member
Messages
5,869
Reaction score
3,060
Agreed on the first two sentences. Don't forget Macario, Press and Mewis.

I am more hopeful than optimistic right now. I don't know if Sweden rolls them, but they can most certainly be beaten. I don't understand what the style of play is. I think it's get the ball to Sophia Smith and hope she can work to score. There really isn't anything else I can pinpoint that they do or try to do.

I'm not one for wanting manager changes, but if they do get hammered by Sweden, this guy should be gone.
I've been trying to figure out if this is the strategy being passed on to the team or if SS is just a selfish player. The first game she had s many opportunities to give the ball up to Rodman and Morgan and she buried her head on the ball and tried to drive it home on her own. It was that way the first half against Netherland as well. Second was totally different and it has been the best half they have played all tournament.
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,976
Reaction score
6,465
Yep. Even Lalas rated us number five in the tournament PREVIOUS to the Portugal match.

As to Smith: she's a gunner. She wants to score herself and does not think pass unless she is forced to. Due to that mindset, she is lousy at passing in the box area, or any passing which requires an instant pass decision. But she scores against certain types of competition.

Because scoring in this sport is so hard, gunners are tolerated --- maybe the stats say even properly valued. I don't know, but the attitude offends everything I believe/feel about team sports. We have recently had another gunner: Carly Lloyd. She also would not pass. But there was a difference between LLoyd and Smith in that Lloyd was physical, would get pissed off, go after it then on defense (defense is optional with Smith), and refuse to lose the game. Maybe it's just the age difference, but Smith for me is just a talented shooter and maybe nothing more.

The Coach realized that he had to get more offense, so he tried his speed player at forward --- unfortunately he picked the wrong player to replace --- Rodman would have given the US a physical defender and someone VERY willing to pass and play her role --- we might note that in the Viet Nam game as in others I see, Smith invades other players territories not always to the positive influence of the offense, but Morgan and Rodman try to cooperate with her anyway. Heath and Rapinoe would do this, but they would fully flip and balance (and PASS to one another.) ... anyway, I think that the coach is also under stress to play certain media darlings and continue Happy Happy thoughts.
 
Last edited:

BabyIrish

Marble Mouth
Messages
2,838
Reaction score
719
Agreed on the first two sentences. Don't forget Macario, Press and Mewis.

I am more hopeful than optimistic right now. I don't know if Sweden rolls them, but they can most certainly be beaten. I don't understand what the style of play is. I think it's get the ball to Sophia Smith and hope she can work to score. There really isn't anything else I can pinpoint that they do or try to do.

I'm not one for wanting manager changes, but if they do get hammered by Sweden, this guy should be gone.
Agreed on the last sentence. If you watch games from 19’ the quality of play is so above what we’re seeing now. I certainly feel that the current players is capable of play at least close to what we saw four years ago. I’m not sold on vlatko as the guy going forward.
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,976
Reaction score
6,465
If we had Becky, and if we had Abby Dahlkamper alongside, then the greatest "6" in the world (maybe by far) could take her correct position and two things would happen: Almost all opponent attacks would be destroyed by Ertz before they became dangerous and Becky would sweep away the rest; and Julie would occasionally charge down the field and ignite some midfield/forward connection (ask yourself how often the current fill-in 6 does that.) We also lack the offense/defensive sparks of Heath, and the occasional offensive brilliance of Press and Pugh-Swanson. THIS TEAM LACKS A LOT. Whether the current coach has faults or not, this is not his fault (other than playing Ertz at 6 anyway and putting some other CB in there, even Emily Sonnett.)
 

SouthSideChiDomer

Well-known member
Messages
1,526
Reaction score
614
If we had Becky, and if we had Abby Dahlkamper alongside, then the greatest "6" in the world (maybe by far) could take her correct position and two things would happen: Almost all opponent attacks would be destroyed by Ertz before they became dangerous and Becky would sweep away the rest; and Julie would occasionally charge down the field and ignite some midfield/forward connection (ask yourself how often the current fill-in 6 does that.) We also lack the offense/defensive sparks of Heath, and the occasional offensive brilliance of Press and Pugh-Swanson. THIS TEAM LACKS A LOT. Whether the current coach has faults or not, this is not his fault (other than playing Ertz at 6 anyway and putting some other CB in there, even Emily Sonnett.)
I disagree. There are changes he could have made that would have put this team in a better position.

Like actually developing a backup to Ertz at the 6. Coffey has looked good for a couple years and Howell had the hype and is finally putting it together this year. He gave each of them 1 camp I believe. Or he could have built a system that wasn't reliant on a world class destroyer locking down the entire middle of the field.

He could have developed an actual second striker instead of inviting Hatch to camps consistently only to leave her off the roster. Mia Fishel was dominant on the youth teams where she played with Rodman and Smith, was the Golden Boot winner in Liga MX Femenil, and just recently had a high price (for the women's game) transfer to Chelsea, but again, only got one camp.

Or he could have identified that this team lacked width in the attack and found a Heath replacement, with Purce being an incredible option to be the person holding that position and threatening fullbacks on the end line.

And maybe the most confusing part of all of this, why keep playing Alana Cook if he knew he didn't want her actually playing in the World Cup? Why not try to work Davidson back into the team so we had a second CB that actually plays CB right now and allow Ertz to play the position he obviously needed her to fill?
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
If we had Becky, and if we had Abby Dahlkamper alongside, then the greatest "6" in the world (maybe by far) could take her correct position and two things would happen: Almost all opponent attacks would be destroyed by Ertz before they became dangerous and Becky would sweep away the rest; and Julie would occasionally charge down the field and ignite some midfield/forward connection (ask yourself how often the current fill-in 6 does that.) We also lack the offense/defensive sparks of Heath, and the occasional offensive brilliance of Press and Pugh-Swanson. THIS TEAM LACKS A LOT. Whether the current coach has faults or not, this is not his fault (other than playing Ertz at 6 anyway and putting some other CB in there, even Emily Sonnett.)
Two things can be true at the same time. They are missing players due to injury but tactically they are lacking options that could be helping them in the interim.

In addition, and this was evident against Vietnam and Netherlands, the lack of finishing in front of goal is the reason they barely squeaked into the knockout round.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
Morocco in, Germany out. Germany doesn't make the knockout round for the first time ever.

This makes me breathe easier for the USWNT. Germany would gladly take a shot going off the post right now.

Onto the knockout stage.
 

BabyIrish

Marble Mouth
Messages
2,838
Reaction score
719
I disagree. There are changes he could have made that would have put this team in a better position.

Like actually developing a backup to Ertz at the 6. Coffey has looked good for a couple years and Howell had the hype and is finally putting it together this year. He gave each of them 1 camp I believe. Or he could have built a system that wasn't reliant on a world class destroyer locking down the entire middle of the field.

He could have developed an actual second striker instead of inviting Hatch to camps consistently only to leave her off the roster. Mia Fishel was dominant on the youth teams where she played with Rodman and Smith, was the Golden Boot winner in Liga MX Femenil, and just recently had a high price (for the women's game) transfer to Chelsea, but again, only got one camp.

Or he could have identified that this team lacked width in the attack and found a Heath replacement, with Purce being an incredible option to be the person holding that position and threatening fullbacks on the end line.

And maybe the most confusing part of all of this, why keep playing Alana Cook if he knew he didn't want her actually playing in the World Cup? Why not try to work Davidson back into the team so we had a second CB that actually plays CB right now and allow Ertz to play the position he obviously needed her to fill?
Absolutely to all of this. He had two years to try and figure out a 6 with Ertz out for pregnancy but he failed to do so. Then he had to beg her to come back just months before the World Cup began. The player development the last four years has been sorely lacking in my opinion.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
Absolutely to all of this. He had two years to try and figure out a 6 with Ertz out for pregnancy but he failed to do so. Then he had to beg her to come back just months before the World Cup began. The player development the last four years has been sorely lacking in my opinion.
Playing out of position in addition to coming back early from maternity.

It isn't ideal. As much as I admire her grit for giving it a go, they could have had another plan in place if there were depth in the pipeline.
 

Katzenboyer

Well-known member
Messages
1,924
Reaction score
3,184
Absolutely to all of this. He had two years to try and figure out a 6 with Ertz out for pregnancy but he failed to do so. Then he had to beg her to come back just months before the World Cup began. The player development the last four years has been sorely lacking in my opinion.

There was a great article put out by Yahoo this week about why the USWNT has fallen behind in the development department the last four years. Long story short - too many players are rewarded at the youth level for being flat out better athletes than other players, and the tactical players are weeded out and/or aren't being given the same chances the "stronger" players are given due to the youth programs' focus on winning, rather than developing world class players. (As an example, Dan Wetzel pointed to Rose Lavelle, who wasn't developed/noticed by the US development program and didn't really get on anybody's radar until she was at Wisconsin).

In terms of this year's team, there's just absolutely no one who can hold the ball and develop play from the midfield. Horan stands around too much, is too easily marked, and doesn't dictate play. While she's a great attacker, she's absolutely not a 10 and shouldn't be put in that position.

The coach has also failed the team. If there's a strength for the USWNT, it's their athletic ability and size. But the coach refuses to press, refuses to focus more on a counter-based/longball strategy, and continues to insist on a slow buildup of play that this team is simply not equipped to perform well as constructed. He should not be the coach for much longer, IMO.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
There was a great article put out by Yahoo this week about why the USWNT has fallen behind in the development department the last four years. Long story short - too many players are rewarded at the youth level for being flat out better athletes than other players, and the tactical players are weeded out and/or aren't being given the same chances the "stronger" players are given due to the youth programs' focus on winning, rather than developing world class players. (As an example, Dan Wetzel pointed to Rose Lavelle, who wasn't developed/noticed by the US development program and didn't really get on anybody's radar until she was at Wisconsin).

In terms of this year's team, there's just absolutely no one who can hold the ball and develop play from the midfield. Horan stands around too much, is too easily marked, and doesn't dictate play. While she's a great attacker, she's absolutely not a 10 and shouldn't be put in that position.

The coach has also failed the team. If there's a strength for the USWNT, it's their athletic ability and size. But the coach refuses to press, refuses to focus more on a counter-based/longball strategy, and continues to insist on a slow buildup of play that this team is simply not equipped to perform well as constructed. He should not be the coach for much longer, IMO.
There is a good amount of truth to this based on my relative experience and how youth clubs are being run in the Chicago area.

My 8 year old daughter is playing club and this is exactly what we're seeing across the board. The bigger, more athletic girls run roughshod over everyone right now. Then when they get to be middle school and high school aged, it's time to play soccer and the results don't come.

My wife played Division I and coaches varsity HS. I have two brother in laws who played in college and coach. Our daughter is small but she's technically advanced so she played with the 2014 team even though she was born in 2015. Most of these kids get the ball, put their heads down and try to go to goal. My daughter is a very good passer, presses and defends well without the ball; and reads the field exceptionally well for her age (their words in their assessment back in May), but they don't really care about any of that.
 

SouthSideChiDomer

Well-known member
Messages
1,526
Reaction score
614
There was a great article put out by Yahoo this week about why the USWNT has fallen behind in the development department the last four years. Long story short - too many players are rewarded at the youth level for being flat out better athletes than other players, and the tactical players are weeded out and/or aren't being given the same chances the "stronger" players are given due to the youth programs' focus on winning, rather than developing world class players. (As an example, Dan Wetzel pointed to Rose Lavelle, who wasn't developed/noticed by the US development program and didn't really get on anybody's radar until she was at Wisconsin).

In terms of this year's team, there's just absolutely no one who can hold the ball and develop play from the midfield. Horan stands around too much, is too easily marked, and doesn't dictate play. While she's a great attacker, she's absolutely not a 10 and shouldn't be put in that position.

The coach has also failed the team. If there's a strength for the USWNT, it's their athletic ability and size. But the coach refuses to press, refuses to focus more on a counter-based/longball strategy, and continues to insist on a slow buildup of play that this team is simply not equipped to perform well as constructed. He should not be the coach for much longer, IMO.
Italicized is the most annoying part of this tournament for me. Like, yes, our player development needs work. And we have been hit with injuries. And the team is unbalanced. But we would still probably be playing better if we let our players play how they like to play, how they are used to playing, and how they played to maximize their strengths for back to back world cup winners. What's funny too is that the system we used would probably be even more effective now that there are 5 subs allowed, so we could keep more players fresh longer and bring in even more speed later in games.

As for the bolded, that is going to take drastic action by the federation to change. As Charlie Munger said, show me the incentive and I'll show you the outcome. Right now there is no incentive for youth coaches to invest in developing players and every incentive for them to invest in recruiting the best players. In other countries, the vast professional landscape incentivizes developing player for multiple reasons: helping the team win and get promoted, selling players, and solidarity payments/training compensation. Our youth system has none of this. Its decades away from any chance at the first, and the second would require the federation going against some of its most powerful members, including both MLS and youth teams. And in the absence of that, other profit schemes have arisen. The problem then is that even something like the implementation of solidarity payments/training compensation and a development of the domestic transfer market, there still might be a better, safer, and more immediate profit opportunity keeping things the way they are versus changing to a developmental mindset. I think a realistic best case scenario would see a parallel structure of new clubs focused on development. The hard part would be keeping them afloat with limited profit opportunities in the short term when their competitors have greater opportunities in the old model.
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,976
Reaction score
6,465
I agree with the disagreeing with me on my "much too nice" comment on the coach. I actually DO hate his approach to coaching this team.
My wording stunk --- I was floundering with the issue of all the injuries as being not his fault. MANY disagreements by me on much of his other moves. Apologies for being a poor communicator on this and thanks for all you guys clarifying.
 

Fbolt

I've been around
Messages
6,932
Reaction score
2,254
Wanted a "W" but not upset. Rapinoe and Smith both choked on PKs, huh....
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,976
Reaction score
6,465
Andronoski put in two people that I called for after the second game (Rodman and Sonnett --- because they are physical and will not back down from contact.) Both played well. I'm still on the Dump Smith train, but she did play better until the PK choke. Some folks apparently got in her a$$ about not playing defense and not passing, as she changed both of that. These two changed behaviors allowed more connectivity to the mid-field and Morgan (playing as she is stuck doing with this team a false 9), and we applied some pressure on both sides of the field.

There is, however, still no real firepower nor over-all "strength" on this team. There was a moment when the camera panned across the bench. I don't think that my eyes landed on a single player that I thought could elevate the team by toughness or elite talent (I eliminate Lavelle from the remark as she was ineligible; and I sadly eliminate Rapinoe since I think she actually can't go for more than ten minutes anymore.) Think of that team three years ago --- Rapinoe, Lloyd, Morgan, Heath, Press, Sauerbrunn, Ertz, Sonnett, Dunn, Krieger, the strong older Black striker who was so dependable --- I don't mean Williams --- even OHara was a STRONG willed veteran. Can anyone imagine that bunch not getting totally pissed off and demanding better of one another in rough times? Going down today's bench was looking at young girls not women.

Lalas said something honest before the game: after the childish goofy Rah-Rah Number 1 Team in the World crap, he said --- if the US loses this game it will be the end of an era. That might just be correct.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
There is a reason why they were attempting to do something that has never been done before. Winning three in a row is a 12 year span and if the margins had been slightly tilted in their favor they'd have been going for four considering how close 2011 in Germany really was. The amount of injuries going into this was going to be a serious factor and it absolutely proved that. Did the rest of the world catch up a little bit? Yes, they did, which is great for the sport and women's sport in general.

Smith and Rodman have a few more cups in them. In four years Lavelle will be 32. Maybe USA and Mexico host in 2027. Restack the deck and go again.
 

Blazers46

Adjectives: wise/brilliant/handsome.
Messages
8,107
Reaction score
5,459
There is a reason why they were attempting to do something that has never been done before. Winning three in a row is a 12 year span and if the margins had been slightly tilted in their favor they'd have been going for four considering how close 2011 in Germany really was. The amount of injuries going into this was going to be a serious factor and it absolutely proved that. Did the rest of the world catch up a little bit? Yes, they did, which is great for the sport and women's sport in general.

Smith and Rodman have a few more cups in them. In four years Lavelle will be 32. Maybe USA and Mexico host in 2027. Restack the deck and go again.
They played well. I thought they had it then the PK gods intervened. Goalie had a good round in that PK and was millimeters from having a potential historic save after scoring on a PK herself.
 

Jiggafini19Deux

Minister of Delayed Gratification
Messages
13,485
Reaction score
14,225
They allowed 2 shots on goal through four games. The question becomes what to do going forward in the midfield and up front.

Mal Swanson was in fantastic form when she got injured. I don't know if her presence makes a difference with what we saw over four matches in the tournament, but it was one of multiple injuries that thinned this roster out too much for them to accomplish something that has never been done before.
 

calvegas04

Well-known member
Messages
11,881
Reaction score
8,468
The US women should get stronger by subtraction. They didn't look impressive this WC by any means.
 
Top