'14 IL LB Nile Sykes (Indiana Transfer)

clashmore_mike

clashmore_mike

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johnnycando said:
Not gonna lie: this shit makes me want to stop following Notre Dame football.

I like my grandfathers football team.

But I hate the direction administration is choosing to go nowadays.

My heart is blue and gold. But my brain says the Cubs have the place taken where the Irish are headed.
Click to expand...

Bye Felicia
 
B

Buster Bluth

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johnnycando said:
Not gonna lie: this shit makes me want to stop following Notre Dame football.

I like my grandfathers football team.

But I hate the direction administration is choosing to go nowadays.

My heart is blue and gold. But my brain says the Cubs have the place taken where the Irish are headed.
Click to expand...

johnnycantdo
 
johnnycando

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clashmore_mike said:
Bye Felicia
Click to expand...

Am I leaving you fucktard? No.

I was here before you.

But you can't help but feel contempt.

You think Lou's studs would have made it today!? No.

I can't touch what you did as the Lep amigo, but don't disregard my fanhood because you have a ND degree.

To stay competitive, I truly feel we'll need exceptions.
 
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J

JTLA

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Hypotheticals

Hypotheticals

Consider three hypothetical situations:

1. Brian Kelly is told by the administration that he can only offer scholarships to students it considers academically highly likely to gain admission.

2. Brian Kelly is told by the administration that he can only accept an LOI from students it considers academically highly likely to gain admission.

3. Brian Kelly has convinced the administration to allow him the discretion to pursue students he considers value members of the football program who might be less than highly likely to gain admission.

With option 3, he wins some and loses some vs never being able to pursue any of them. Occasionally, the situation gets murky because it's really not in the university's best interest to comment when things go south for a prospective student.

I have a hard time believing anything else is likely going on here.
 
tko

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Why the fkn hate towards johnny? GFY, he's on of the good guys.
 
stlnd01

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JTLA said:
3. Brian Kelly has convinced the administration to allow him the discretion to pursue students he considers value members of the football program who might be less than highly likely to gain admission.

With option 3, he wins some and loses some vs never being able to pursue any of them. Occasionally, the situation gets murky because it's really not in the university's best interest to comment when things go south for a prospective student.

I have a hard time believing anything else is likely going on here.
Click to expand...

This one.
There has to be some give and take going on here. At his own/swarbrick's urging, Kelly got enough leeway to get some of these kids in the door, with Admissions' conditional approval. Hence Sykes, Tee, the Isiah McKenzie situation. Some of these work out fine and we never hear a peep. Others, well...
But I'd be very surprised if Kelly is being blindsided by any of this. He knew the rules when he took the job and has gradually re-shaped as he can. But that only goes so far. You push the envelope but know you won't win them all. And quite possible Sykes didn't hold up his end of whatever deal was agreed to.
 
B

Bogtrotter07

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Again. No one has any idea what happened.

Anyone else think that with MB's commitment tonight as they were both Core6 guys, it may not be what some have postulated?
 
clashmore_mike

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johnnycando said:
Am I leaving you fucktard? No.

I was here before you.

But you can't help but feel contempt.

You think Lou's studs would have made it today!? No.

I can't touch what you did as the Lep amigo, but don't disregard my fanhood because you have a ND degree.

To stay competitive, I truly feel we'll need exceptions.
Click to expand...

LOL you serious bro? I was joking.
 
wizards8507

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JTLA said:
Consider three hypothetical situations:

1. Brian Kelly is told by the administration that he can only offer scholarships to students it considers academically highly likely to gain admission.

2. Brian Kelly is told by the administration that he can only accept an LOI from students it considers academically highly likely to gain admission.

3. Brian Kelly has convinced the administration to allow him the discretion to pursue students he considers value members of the football program who might be less than highly likely to gain admission.

With option 3, he wins some and loses some vs never being able to pursue any of them. Occasionally, the situation gets murky because it's really not in the university's best interest to comment when things go south for a prospective student.

I have a hard time believing anything else is likely going on here.
Click to expand...

I was a student during the Weis years and there were A LOT of academically questionable students then, too. People act like BK's requests are small potatoes but, based on some of the kids who got in under the "strict" system, I can only imagine how far out there the "lenient" system he's pushing for is.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
 
arahop

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wizards8507 said:
I was a student during the Weis years and there were A LOT of academically questionable students then, too. People act like BK's requests are small potatoes but, based on some of the kids who got in under the "strict" system, I can only imagine how far out there the "lenient" system he's pushing for is.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...

If we ever want to win a title again... That is exactly what will be necessary. It won't devalue your degree too much don't worry.
 
TheTurningPoint

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First and foremost I am not claiming to know all.

Some of you are overthinking the program. Some of you are oblivious to how a program is run. Some of you are underthinking it.

1. Notre Dame is an academic institution that takes academics seriously from the JimmyMacs to Everett Golsons to Max Redfields. It doesnt matter who you are or what you have done, academics are first. That is quite evident in the Davaris Daniels and Golson situations in the last year.

2. The whole "exception card" thing is overplayed. Are players getting denied, yes. Are there a ton of players getting denied, no. Do some players have different requirements once they get to campus than others, yes. Brian Kelly is getting the kids he wants into school, and I dont think you can discount that. The player that signs with Notre Dame understands the "contract" details of what he needs to accomplish to be part and stay part of the Notre Dame Football program. If that doesnt happen, then you have various scenarios.

3. There have been players that have been signed that understand they will be on academic probation from the moment they step foot on campus in June. Those kids have choice to accept that and come to Notre Dame, or choose a different school. So by coming to Notre Dame, they are aware of what is expected of them to play football, and its 100% on them to do that.

4. Im sure that most of you have gone to college or experienced the college application process. You apply to school and wait on that school to review your transcripts and then you get a letter in the mail that tells you if you have been accepted or not.

When someone is being recruited as a student athlete, the requirements are more relaxed. So Redfields acceptance process is going to be different than JimmyMacs. Redfield will have a certain criteria he needs to meet to be able to accept and sign the scholarship, while JimmyMac has much tougher time getting accepted.

At the time of acceptance you are accepted based on the current body of work. So if a kid commits in the summer, fall, winter, or spring, that means he has done the things he has needed or in process of doing the things he needs to do to gain acceptance to the school.

Then when you graduate you send your final transcripts, test scores, and whatever to prove you graduated. I mean lets be honest a college isnt going to stay true to their word if you never graduated much less the NCAA.

For example sake, lets take Isaiah McKenzie. It was clear he needed to do a lot of classwork to qualify for Notre Dame. He committed and Notre Dame couldnt accept it bc he had yet to qualify with gpa and test scores. So in this case, he would have needed to reach a certain gpa and test score before Notre Dame could officially say yes. McKenzie worked his ass off and made the qualifying grades and scores to get into Notre Dame. But it was made quite clear that it also hinged on him maintaining that level of academic success in the spring to be able to report to Notre Dame in June.

So back to gaining acceptance. A player has signed with Notre Dame, but needs to maintain his academics through the spring. Notre Dame can obviously keep tabs on that players grades, but nothing is official to the end of the school year. Typically its end of May or the early part of June. Notre Dame players report in June. So finalizing everything probably takes a week or so, then getting everything out to the schools takes who knows how long.

There will be kids with senioritis or just mess up academically causing them to slip below that baseline set by the school. Now the pending the school policies in place, determines if a kid can be accepted or not.

In Notre Dame's case, some kids are then put on academics probation when they are arrived. Some kids might have to retake a test (think Tee Shepard). So if a kid gets a chance to retake a test to qualify and they get that score, then everything is kosher. If they dont then once again its on the schools policies.

5. In the case of a kid not making the grades during his spring semester....both the kid and admissions are at a cross roads. Obviously the school doesnt want to deny a kid a scholarship for working hard, but those requirements are in place and much lower than the requirements for JimmyMac. The player obviously wants to come to that school, but hasnt lived up to his part of the agreement. You can blame the kid for not living up to his part, you can blame the school for accepting the LOI before he qualified. I think both are at fault, but its also a situation that neither can plan for.

6. With Notre Dame having higher requirements than most schools, this situation can happen every now and then. In my personal opinion, I think that they may need to tweak some stuff so a Tee Shepard doesnt happen again, bc it hurts the kid by putting him in tough spot to find a school in a short time, and obviously hurts the program. Notre Dame has to turn away a kid already on campus and gets Notre Dame and those are dime a dozen.

7. In the situation of Nile Sykes, I dont want to comment because his future is still up in the air. But, I hope that this addressed some of the concerns and differences that were brought up recently in this thread
 
anarin

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IrishTP said:
First and foremost I am not claiming to know all.

1. Notre Dame is an academic institution that takes academics seriously from the JimmyMacs to Everett Golsons to Max Redfields.
Click to expand...

But the real question is, which of these three is taking a naked lap? :)
 
irishog77

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So JimmyMac got kicked out of school...but can still play footbaw this fall for ND?
 
I

IrishFaninTX

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IrishTP said:
First and foremost I am not claiming to know all.

Some of you are overthinking the program. Some of you are oblivious to how a program is run. Some of you are underthinking it.

1. Notre Dame is an academic institution that takes academics seriously from the JimmyMacs to Everett Golsons to Max Redfields. It doesnt matter who you are or what you have done, academics are first. That is quite evident in the Davaris Daniels and Golson situations in the last year.

2. The whole "exception card" thing is overplayed. Are players getting denied, yes. Are there a ton of players getting denied, no. Do some players have different requirements once they get to campus than others, yes. Brian Kelly is getting the kids he wants into school, and I dont think you can discount that. The player that signs with Notre Dame understands the "contract" details of what he needs to accomplish to be part and stay part of the Notre Dame Football program. If that doesnt happen, then you have various scenarios.

3. There have been players that have been signed that understand they will be on academic probation from the moment they step foot on campus in June. Those kids have choice to accept that and come to Notre Dame, or choose a different school. So by coming to Notre Dame, they are aware of what is expected of them to play football, and its 100% on them to do that.

4. Im sure that most of you have gone to college or experienced the college application process. You apply to school and wait on that school to review your transcripts and then you get a letter in the mail that tells you if you have been accepted or not.

When someone is being recruited as a student athlete, the requirements are more relaxed. So Redfields acceptance process is going to be different than JimmyMacs. Redfield will have a certain criteria he needs to meet to be able to accept and sign the scholarship, while JimmyMac has much tougher time getting accepted.

At the time of acceptance you are accepted based on the current body of work. So if a kid commits in the summer, fall, winter, or spring, that means he has done the things he has needed or in process of doing the things he needs to do to gain acceptance to the school.

Then when you graduate you send your final transcripts, test scores, and whatever to prove you graduated. I mean lets be honest a college isnt going to stay true to their word if you never graduated much less the NCAA.

For example sake, lets take Isaiah McKenzie. It was clear he needed to do a lot of classwork to qualify for Notre Dame. He committed and Notre Dame couldnt accept it bc he had yet to qualify with gpa and test scores. So in this case, he would have needed to reach a certain gpa and test score before Notre Dame could officially say yes. McKenzie worked his ass off and made the qualifying grades and scores to get into Notre Dame. But it was made quite clear that it also hinged on him maintaining that level of academic success in the spring to be able to report to Notre Dame in June.

So back to gaining acceptance. A player has signed with Notre Dame, but needs to maintain his academics through the spring. Notre Dame can obviously keep tabs on that players grades, but nothing is official to the end of the school year. Typically its end of May or the early part of June. Notre Dame players report in June. So finalizing everything probably takes a week or so, then getting everything out to the schools takes who knows how long.

There will be kids with senioritis or just mess up academically causing them to slip below that baseline set by the school. Now the pending the school policies in place, determines if a kid can be accepted or not.

In Notre Dame's case, some kids are then put on academics probation when they are arrived. Some kids might have to retake a test (think Tee Shepard). So if a kid gets a chance to retake a test to qualify and they get that score, then everything is kosher. If they dont then once again its on the schools policies.

5. In the case of a kid not making the grades during his spring semester....both the kid and admissions are at a cross roads. Obviously the school doesnt want to deny a kid a scholarship for working hard, but those requirements are in place and much lower than the requirements for JimmyMac. The player obviously wants to come to that school, but hasnt lived up to his part of the agreement. You can blame the kid for not living up to his part, you can blame the school for accepting the LOI before he qualified. I think both are at fault, but its also a situation that neither can plan for.

6. With Notre Dame having higher requirements than most schools, this situation can happen every now and then. In my personal opinion, I think that they may need to tweak some stuff so a Tee Shepard doesnt happen again, bc it hurts the kid by putting him in tough spot to find a school in a short time, and obviously hurts the program. Notre Dame has to turn away a kid already on campus and gets Notre Dame and those are dime a dozen.

7. In the situation of Nile Sykes, I dont want to comment because his future is still up in the air. But, I hope that this addressed some of the concerns and differences that were brought up recently in this thread
Click to expand...

I completely agree with every single thing you have pointed out. I love ND football but I don't believe the players for any sport should get better treatment or exceptions over the regular student body. Why should someone who busted his butt in the classroom have different requirements (and have to probably pay some or all of his tuition) than someone who just happens to be a superb athlete, most of it God-given talent, and oh btw gets to go to school for free, too? Everyone wants to blame the schools for not doing this or that but what about the parents? If a parent stays on top of their kids studies then there should never be any surprises. We have a rule in our house that if our daughter doesn't make A/B honor roll every 6 weeks then she goes on probation and if it happens a 2nd time she doesn't play soccer the next year. So far she has never gotten a C. She has her priorities and wants to play college soccer but knows no grades, no play. I will be doing my due diligence, as well, to make sure she has every credit she needs for any school she desires, I will know the required GPA for each school, and the minimum score she will need on her SAT or ACT. Some parents don't care but then they better not get upset at schools when their kid doesn't have what he needs to go to college or go to a good college.
 
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