SEC Bag Men

[IrishLion]

Presented for discussion:

Meet the Bag Man: How to buy college football players, in the words of a man who delivers the money - SBNation.com

 

[IrishLion]

"Hey, how'd he get that ride? His uncle bought it. How did his uncle buy it? Paid cash. Paid cash, how'd he do that? Shit, we don't know, but here's the receipt where he paid cash, and now y'all ain't got shit. Go tell the NCAA you think we're cheating because this kid's uncle bought him a used Tahoe in cash, you racist."

This is unbelievable. I knew this stuff happened, but not like this. Maybe I'm just naive?

 

[Black Irish]

Just when you think you're getting too cyncial...

 

[Huntr]

Just read that. Nothing surprising at all in there. And while that was an SEC guy, it happens around every program to some degree.

Stuff like that makes me hate college athletics, as a taxpayer, when everyone's focus is more on sports than education. I mean, I love college football, but I like my paycheck more. One of the worst parts of living here in SEC land.

 

[IrishLax]

Amazing article. Why there needs to be the Olympic Model.

 

[IrishLion]

Think of how often we hear about a recruit cancelling a visit at the last minute... I know we aren't up against the SEC at all times, but how often do you think this might be the case:

"The bag men associated with certain schools pay potential signees one-time bonus payments not to visit a rival school that's offered a scholarship. The going rate is stated to be $2,500. This has become a popular tactic in recent years, as the recruiting process has become more publicized."

 

[dublinirish]

some great points there.

kids getting bonuses for not visiting other schools - how many times does a kid say on the eve of a visit "oh im not going now something came up with my family"

Importance of "basket-weaving classes" for student athletes - they will become gym teachers/HS FB coaches and feed back new players into the program

 

[ResLife Hero]

The only thing that surprises me is the amount of cash offered for stuff like not visiting other schools. I played with a kid in AAU who we all knew got a car to go somewhere (extremely similar to the whole "uncle got cash" anecdote in the article), but I wouldn't have expected $2,500 to stay at home.

 

[phork]

Just read that. Nothing surprising at all in there. And while that was an SEC guy, it happens around every program to some degree.

Stuff like that makes me hate college athletics, as a taxpayer, when everyone's focus is more on sports than education. I mean, I love college football, but I like my paycheck more. One of the worst parts of living here in SEC land.

If you think big time college athletics has been about the student for the last 30 years or more, you need to re-evalute the difference between what you believe and what you see.

I don't want to ruin the ending for this book for you. But the bad guys win, everytime.

 

[ndfi78]

That is shameful

 

[irishfan]

Only thing that surprised me was the payments for not visiting another school (you'd think a recruit with half a brain could make a lot of money doing this--just flirt with every school), but it makes sense.

And as the "bag man" noted, paying players isn't going to stop this in the slightest. These guys will just pay them more on top of it.

Not really sure there is any easy solution to stopping this, just makes me wonder how big it is outside the SEC

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Importance of "basket-weaving classes" for student athletes - they will become gym teachers/HS FB coaches and feed back new players into the program

That was the most damning part. Here's the full quote:

College majors like Exercise Science and General Education have long been assailed by critics as crip-course degrees, but shadow boosters see them as a vital way to perpetuate the cycle. If a player finishes out his eligibility and has no feasible future in the pros, he might return home and become a nearby high school coach. It doesn't matter if it's junior high or seven-on-seven camps; each means a new brand ambassador for the program.

"You win the gym teachers, and you can go a long way. That's why all those basket-weaving degrees are so important, because we need 'em on both ends. You need 'em to keep the kids qualified, and you need 'em to produce guys who can go back and coach and teach and help us."

They're intentionally undermining the most significant part of a player's compensation package in the hopes of generating some vague recruiting advantage in the future. Total exploitation.

 

[IrishLax]

Only thing that surprised me was the payments for not visiting another school (you'd think a recruit with half a brain could make a lot of money doing this--just flirt with every school), but it makes sense.

And as the "bag man" noted, paying players isn't going to stop this in the slightest. These guys will just pay them more on top of it.

Not really sure there is any easy solution to stopping this, just makes me wonder how big it is outside the SEC

I, personally, don't think it's half as big outside the south (you better believe that Clemson, UNC, etc. are well known to do this kind of the thing and they're not SEC... but still south).

For bag men to be a big factor it has to involve:
1. Financially destitute players who NEED the $500 or $2000 for whatever reason... or financially greedy players/families that WANT the $$.
2. Bag men as described with easy access to both the program and player (i.e. it's much easier to pull this off locally).
3. Coordination from the top down so that the right players are getting the correct money from the right people. You need a complicit coach/administration.

When you look at who ND usually lands as prospects, it's no coincidence that they're often from private school or with strong families or affluent. We land our fair share of guys from rough backgrounds, but not many of them relative to other places.

I never knew a player who admitted to taking money, but I also never asked. I have heard stories though of guys and what they were offered on SEC visits. It's crazy, and the ones who didn't expect that to be the norm because they didn't grow up in that world didn't know what to do really when presented with it in such a "no big deal" manner.

I think it's time to go Olympic Model and get all of this above board.

 

[Huntr]

If you think big time college athletics has been about the student for the last 30 years or more, you need to re-evalute the difference between what you believe and what you see.

I don't want to ruin the ending for this book for you. But the bad guys win, everytime.

No, I'm well-acquainted with reality. My complaint is that so few seem to care when it's on our own dime.

 

[Rack Em]

That is shameful

To say its shameful is to insinuate that the SEC had any morals to begin with.

 

[Luckylucci]

That was the most damning part. Here's the full quote:



They're intentionally undermining the most significant part of a player's compensation package in the hopes of generating some vague recruiting advantage in the future. Total exploitation.

Yea, thats f-ing sick.

 

[Huntr]

They're intentionally undermining the most significant part of a player's compensation package in the hopes of generating some vague recruiting advantage in the future. Total exploitation.

Yep and

I think it's time to go Olympic Model and get all of this above board.

Yep.

 

[koonja]

If they do the Olympic Model, I hope the NCAA runs it. For instance, if a car company wanted Golson to do a commercial, Golson and a rep from the car company would sit down with an NCAA member, who would basically formalize everything and basically be legal/advisory for the athlete.

It'd be awful if you could just strike deals wherever, whenever. Everything should go through NCAA.

 

[IrishLion]

If they do the Olympic Model, I hope the NCAA runs it. For instance, if a car company wanted Golson to do a commercial, Golson and a rep from the car company would sit down with an NCAA member, who would basically formalize everything and basically be legal/advisory for the athlete.

It'd be awful if you could just strike deals wherever, whenever. Everything should go through NCAA.

I agree that things would need to be "formalized" with centralized representation of some sort of entity, but it wouldn't be the NCAA I don't think.

 

[Southside Sully]

This article drives me nuts because its true.. I was in Fort Myers 2 weeks ago, not far from Cape Coral, Aaron Lynch's home.. The cab driver who drove me from the airport pretty much said everyone knows about it, and no one cares, People get stuff under the table all the time in the south.. This shows how much balls they have to be so blatant to even do this article.. Arrogance that hopefully gets some of these dudes caught.

 

[ACamp1900]

I love the sec fanboy comments, "but, but, but, Notre Dame does it too!!!"

ah, yeah, not really.

 

[greyhammer90]

I'd bet my house that the school they're talking about is Ole Miss.

 

[ACamp1900]

This whole thing stinks to all hell and gone so bad... It's hard to imagine things just continuing as they are for much longer across the board...

 

[ResLife Hero]

We obviously can't say with confidence that it never happens, but when I look around at other major programs, I can't name one that's likely cleaner than ours. ND players live in a bubble.

I'd put Stanford in the same bucket, but agree. We may not be 100% clean given the number of wealthy alumni we have, but I have to believe we're one of the cleanest out there.

 

[ND NYC]

read article and watched interview.

anyone else feel this guy (and his editor) thinks he just wrote all the presients men ala woodward and bernstein?

i mean, nothing he has "uncovered" here is really new to me. is it to you?

and truth be told, it could be all made up. i dont think it is- i think they guy is legit with real sources.

but that interview of those 2 at end of article made me chuckle; very smug to mel, its like they think they are reporting on watergate or something.

tell me something i dont know....or at least didnt suspect has beeen going on for the last 100 years.

 

[IrishLion]

I like DomerInAtlanta's comment on the story:

"Reading this, all I could picture is a bunch of NDNation types running around the upper midwest trying to hand cash to anyone that looked like a fullback.

Fire Kelly."

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I'd put Stanford in the same bucket, but agree. We may not be 100% clean given the number of wealthy alumni we have, but I have to believe we're one of the cleanest out there.

Given the abundant circumstantial evidence that Stanford players are crazy juiced, I'm still confident we're the cleanest, but there's probably not much in the way of bagman activity in Palo Alto.

 

[returnofthemack]

I wouldn't be so quick to throw stones. As this bag man said, sometimes you have to give money to recruits that you know won't come to your school. Sure ND lands plenty of players that have families that don't need any extra money, but there are some I've been suspicious of. As far as players getting in trouble, there are some crazy stories if you know the right people. And as far as classes go, FTT, Sociology, and the like aren't exactly Kinesiology or General Studies, but they're not very difficult and not very conducive to a real-life job.

 

[eNDzone]

Is ND involved in this activity from the top down?Is it accepted behavior in the midwest? Does everyone just expect ND to be constantly paying players in one way or another? I don't think so. You would have to be blind not to realize that the SEC isn't the dirtiest conference in the nation.

 

[Irish#1]

I like how he kept referencing Mama, Grandma or an Uncle. Kind of assuming every kid in the south that gets recruited doesn't know who his daddy is. Or is that who they primarily prey upon? lol